OMFKG! The Michael Kidd-Gilchrist Thread

[Walt Cronkite]

If there was an emoticon where I could throw rotten tomatoes at everyone involved, I'd be posting it.

[Elden Payton]

@Royale.

You are the worst poster on all of Realgm and I'm ashamed our mods haven't erased you from our board, please go back to the spurs board.

Your intent is obvious...you state maybe and then give it no chance to happen, you raise stupid questions and then refuse to answer them yourself, you have been spouting crap for ten pages and it's getting old.

[JMAC3]

I still dislike the pick, because I don't think he's got any chance of being a top 2 pick out of this draft, and that's a problem for a #2 pick in a draft this deep.

Really what makes you think he has no chance of being the second or even best player drafted. In a deep draft that means the talent level is more even so there is a better chance of a guy drafted later having a better career then a few guys drafted ahead of him.

He looks better than Robinson, you dodged a bullet there. In a few years time will be look like a top 3 player in this draft though? I doubt it.

Why who is going to be so much better. MKG is going to be in the league much longer as well just due to him being so much younger then a bunch of guys. In a few years he will be the ages many of these guys are now with a much brighter future.

You drafted this guy #2 overall, not 5 or 6 or 7. The standard is different,

Yeah its harder to live up to the hype of being the number two pick when compared to a guy who is taken 7th because he can still be the 7th best player even if guys taken later then him are better then him because guys taken ahead of him could be worse. When you are taken second overall you have a lot of guys behind you who could be better and only one guy who can fall behind you.

I am very doubtful MKG ends up the 2nd best player in this draft, or even top 3-4, and that's bad for a #2 pick. We'll wait and see of course, but some of the defensive remarks coming out are extremely hypocritical.

Okay congratulations you are doubtful. I thought you weren't psychic so I guess we have nothing to worry about.

If I was a Bobcats fan, I'd be furious if we had the #2 pick in a draft, and got maybe the 5th best player.

Not really because nobody feels confident how players 1-10 will fall.

I don't feel MKG ends up as the #2 player in this draft at all, and I'm not sure he'll finish up in the top 5. That's something to be concerned about, not dismissed by fans chanting MKG's name.

Please Please tell us who you would of picked if you were us. You said that you would of taken Robinson, but then you changed your mind at last minute.

Why dont you wait until 3 years go by, find out who best player is from this draft and then tell us who you would of drafted.

[fatlever]

fellas, lets clean this up a bit. try discussing MKG, but leave the personal stuff out of it.

royale - you are more than welcome to share your opinions here about any of our players, just be mindful of the way your state your opinions. you are coming on to another board to basically tell us that after one summer league game you think our #2 pick was a bad pick because there is no way he will be the 2nd best player. thats fine, you can certainly have that opinion, but you need to tread lightly when making such claims, because there is a fine line between sparking intelligent debate and coming off as a troll. also, realize your opinion has zero basis in fact. none of us have a clue how this draft is going to shake out at this point and to state otherwise, with convinction, is foolish.

i think your opinion would carry more weight if you were able to back up your opinion with reasons as well as listing those who you think were better picks. suggesting we trade down isnt really an alternative. somebody had to be drafted at #2 in this draft by the bobcats or another team. if MKG shouldnt have been #2, then who should have been? if you claim you don't know because you arent a scout, then you should also use that logic to say, you arent a scout so why are you suggesting that MKG cant be the 2nd best player. you cant have it both ways.

to the other bobcats posters in this thread, stick to debating the topic at hand instead of pouring gas on the flames.

also, there is no need to diminish leonard's rookie season to make MKG or kemba look better. leonard had a fine year. he appears to be a solid player and the spurs made a good trade. that being said, i have no doubt that if he was taken by us at 9 and put in the middle of that trainwreck last year, the perception of leonard would probably be very different. where you get drafted is always a factor in a player's success. leonard was drafted into a perfect situation for his skillset and experience level. good for him. that being said, it has no bearing on MKG or his future accomplishments.


thanks.

[Elden Payton]

Well said fats and thanks.

[AnaheimRoyale]

I'm sorry that you think what your Mod said in anyway backed up your remarks, which were clearly erroneous. If you hadn't wasted so much time claiming I had said things I hadn't, you would have had plenty of time to discuss why I feel (note the subjective phrasing) MKG was probably not the best pick. The time wasted here has been by you I'm afraid, even going so far as to accuse me of ignoring you when I didn't reply for 40 minutes.

I quite agree with your mod that it's important to tread carefully, which is why my remarks about MKG have all been careful. It's too early to be sure, and we can't predict the future. These were all points I made too, which seem to have gotten lost in your ridiculous attack posts, erroneously attributing remarks to me I never made, and refusing to retract them repeatedly.

As for MKG, as I said earlier on this thread, he has surprised me with what he's shown so far (in his 1 summer league game), but I don't really see the player he could turn into who would justify his selection. It's not Pippen, that's way too optimistic, for one thing Pippen had huge natural advantages that MKG doesn't (size, reach, big hands, more athleticism, a handle and passing that MKG has shown no indication of). As many scouts and analysts have pointed out, the guys points mostly come off cuts and transition, etc, not from his own creation (something Pippen, a top 25-30 all time player had no trouble with). He's a good defender, but even there we're not talking prime Ron Artest here. He looks alot like Iggy. Maybe a slightly better version of Iggy, but that's still a player who is a borderline all-star most years, while there are other guys in this draft who look like they could become so much more. Drummond could end up a much better player, Lillard already looks as good or better, and if we're going off one summer league game then pick the best single game Lamb or White or Beal or Barnes had, and they looked just as good. Talking about a player "turning into" another one puts people off, but in 99% of cases a player who has a skill set or game that hasn't been historically successful won't be successful. MKG's skill set can be very valuable of course, but I haven't seen the player with his skills who has been a perennial all-star or franchise player. There's as much reason to be concerned about, say, Barnes of course... but he was taken 7th, which makes me think 2 was awfully high for a guy whose ceiling looks pretty similar. Meanwhile Royce White looks simply unbelievable so far, in limited minutes and a limited role.

I hope MKG shows my doubts to be poorly founded, the Bobcats could use some success, and I'm quite sympathetic to their team and franchise. But there are real reasons to be doubtful, and dismissing them with "MKG IS THE 2ND BEST RIGHT NOW!" as I heard some people saying (off one summer game? Really?) should try to be more objective. As a Spurs fan I'm very tough on our guys. I call out Mahinmi and James Anderson as weak picks from us, and those guys were picked in the 20's. Let's wait and see how things look in a few months to start with.

[Dr Positivity]

Anthony Davis hasn't played yet, and based off the summer league I'm alot more impressed with Jeremy Lamb and Royce White... now that's just a bunch of meaningless summer games (and MKG has 1), so it may mean nothing at all, or mean alot, but I don't feel confident MKG ends up as the #2 player in this draft at all, and I'm not sure he'll finish up in the top 5. That's something to be concerned about, not dismissed by fans chanting MKG's name.

Royce White? White is NBA player version of a pretty looking flower that poisons you if you touch it. It's really fun to see a PF passing like that but if he averages less than 10 pts per 36 it's not going to do him a lot of good. Teams can fit a PF who scores and doesn't run an offense 100x better in a starting lineup than a PF who runs an offense but doesn't score

[AnaheimRoyale]

We'll see.

[Dr Positivity]

Also I don't think it's necessarily a failure for the Cats if MKG is 5th best in this class. It just depends how good the class is. I'd put the bar of success or the Bobcats at getting a player who can be one of the 3 best guys on a championship team. I think MKG has the talent to fill one of those spots, he might be #3 of that group and doing some 17/8/3/1.5/1.5 type of stuff but there are much, much worse fates in the draft. I have a pretty strong feeling that if the Bobcats took Robinson 2nd they would've have gotten one of those "worse fates" they were so familiar with pre Rich Cho.

[Elden Payton]

Thanks Mufasa, are you a Rich Cho fan?

[AnaheimRoyale]

I'd put the bar of success or the Bobcats at getting a player who can be one of the 3 best guys on a championship team

If the Bobcats used the 2nd pick on a Lamar Odom/Jason Terry/whoever-the-hell-was-3rd-best-on-the-2006-Heat type player, and Drummond turns into Amare Mutumbo, and/or Lillard turns into Gay Payton, and/or Jeremy Lamb into Reggie Miller, I think it'll be fair to rip the Bobcats GM a new one.

Your standard is impossibly low. Context matters. If they passed on nobody, then fine. If they passed on a bunch of perennial all-stars who are #2 options on a title team or franchise players, then they really messed up. You're basically saying Sam Bowie was a good pick, because he made sense at the time. Or it was ok for the Celtics to pass on Kobe... because they got Antoine Walker.

[AVolumeScorer]

@Royale.

You are the worst poster on all of Realgm

While I disagree with Royale, there's plenty worse on this forum, plenty.

[Dr Positivity]

@ Sik Infant: I think Rich Cho is phenomenal. I wouldn't trust him any less than Sam Presti himself. The only move that's stuck out to me as iffy is picking Kemba last year, but it's not too hard to figure out Cho picked Biyombo and MJ picked Kemba IMO

@ Royale - No, you're right. If there's multiple HOF Olympians in this draft or even an MVP picked below 2 and MKG is Gerald Wallace/RJ level, then yes the Bobcats will have screwed up bad in an all-time way. But if you're willing to go as far to say HOF is on the table for the Lillard, White, Drummond, etc. types, then why not MKG and his Pippen comparison? It's just as much of a reach for those guys to get there as MKG in my opinion. I mean MKG is a physical freak who's one of the youngest players in the draft and has the feel of the game typically worthy of stars. Shouldn't he be put on the shortlist of the "Well crazier things have happened..." superstar breakout list. You're talking about him like he's Harrison Barnes, now there's a guy who should be rightly all out removed from that crazy upside discussion, because Barnes is never going to be athletic enough to take players off the dribble and what he's good at (shooting) is already pretty polished. He's in that 2008 OJ Mayo zone of someone who's basically going to come into the league as what he'll be. MKG is much more like 2008 Russell Westbrook IMO. I'm not saying he's a Westbrook talent but the freakish explosiveness, size, etc. I believed in 08 Westbrook less than 12 MKG in terms of star upside on that note

[AnaheimRoyale]

Call me when Cho has a record that remotely resembles Presti's.

I haven't said I think those guys are hall of famers either, I'm posing a hypothetical scenario, to show how silly the bar for failure you gave was. It was not meant to suggest Drummond would end up as Amare Mutumbo, that couldn't have been more obvious from my comments on him. But I'm not at all sure MKG is going to be more than an Iggy/G-Will type player, and that should worry you, because quite a few guys from this draft could be much moe valuable than that. It remains to be seen if they will be, but I definitely wouldn't be praising this selection anytime soon.

[Dr Positivity]

Well... you're right in that sense, it is possible for the Bobcats to get a top 3 player on a title team (and I mean that as usually just a shorthand way way to say a 17 PER+, 10 mil+ ish type of "noteable starter") and end up with the egg on their face. But looking at a draft that seems like it's full of starters and not superstars it would seem likely to me that a 17/8/1.5/1.5 top 10 SF would make it a pretty good pick

[BigSlam]

Thanks Mufasa, are you a Rich Cho fan?

Who cares? This is a MKG thread. Keep it on track.

All this internet bickering BS is old. It's really old. And 5 pages of it? Really?

[Elden Payton]

Thanks Mufasa, are you a Rich Cho fan?

Who cares? This is a MKG thread. Keep it on track.

All this internet bickering BS is old. It's really old. And 5 pages of it? Really?

He paid us a compliment and I enquired, sorry if derailing but the quality of our GM has merit in terms of drafting ability and the merit of the pick which in this case is in fact MKG.

As for the bickering I was surprised noone had moderated it and I even requested so, fats handled with aplomb and well said and I left it at that.

We ban our own posters for dissent but let a poster derail our threads with trolling for I think the second or third time.

EDIT-Sorry Slam I know I shouldn't but I couldn't let it slide.

[BigSlam]

As for the bickering I was surprised noone had moderated it and I even requested so, fats handled with aplomb and well said and I left it at that.

While we log significant mins on the board we can't be here 24/7 and when we are not here we still expect our board members to be able to hold things down. 5 pages of what went on here is just a waste of everyone's time.

We ban our own posters for dissent but let a poster derail our threads with trolling for I think the second or third time.

How about you let the mods mod and you stick to posting.

[thetrapman]

You guys suck for not doing that trade w/ Cavs.

[ball teacher]

You guys suck for not doing that trade w/ Cavs.

Hey man, you guys could have chosen Barnes, Rivers, Ross, Lamb or Leonard and you chose Waiters. Cant knock Charlotte for that.