Not In The Face - The Jeremy Lin Thread 3 + 1

[phillycheese]

I didn't try very hard.

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400829043
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400874421
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400828561
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400828930

You need to read better - I said "not because they were short handed and he had to but because Lin was playing better".

I gave you four games where Lin played as much as if not more than Kemba. Two of them he was coming off the bench.

In your examples, Lin started = shorthanded. The other two games I think Lin had a combined 1 min more than Kemba and one of them was shorthanded (Miami playoff example) even though Lin was from bench - wow. In the last two examples they were blow outs and Lin had like 1 and 2 min more. But in all cases Kemba got his designated minimum minutes first as the starter - ie none were the 29-22 type but at most 27-26 type.

How many blow out games has Charlotte had this year? Quite a few. But when has Lin's given the opportunity to play more minutes in blow outs? There was so much chatter about Cliff leaving the starters in even when the game was more or less over.

[Lorenzomax7]

do you guys think Goran Dragic is a better ball handlers than Lin?

Hard to say for me w/out watching Dragic every game for 82 games. I'd lean towards yes. Dragic's biggest plus is his amazing footwork and balance, plus I think he might have a quicker first step.

He doesn't have a quicker first step, instead, he is a bit slower than Lin. Morey said Lin is the most explosive guard they ever measured... Dragic was once a Rocket.

[phillycheese]

Look, I am not really quibbing about Kemba getting guaranteed minutes even in blow outs. Just that this is an indication of how this coach allots playing time. So to those that argue Lin will get minutes in Charlotte is not valid unless one assumes there will be injuries to guards. ie if MKG does not get injured will Lin get those minutes that he got? no way. I remember seeing some time played stats and this year was Lin's lowest total, even with all the injuries. So that is pretty clear to me Lin will not get more minutes if everyone comes back. And if I was Charlotte, why do I pay a guy $8-10m per year to play 20-22 min per game?

[kinein]

do you guys think Goran Dragic is a better ball handlers than Lin?

Hard to say for me w/out watching Dragic every game for 82 games. I'd lean towards yes. Dragic's biggest plus is his amazing footwork and balance, plus I think he might have a quicker first step.

He doesn't have a quicker first step, instead, he is a bit slower than Lin. Morey said Lin is the most explosive guard they ever measured... Dragic was once a Rocket.

Indeed, check out the ESPN sports science video on Lin and John Wall.

Also Lin's only person I've seen turn on a dime and chase down D.Rose (before injury) and block a layup from behind, mid-air on DRose in his Prime. Lin's explosively quick he is/was top 3 playoffs in drives to basket because of this.

[kinein]

Anyway, that's my two cents based off watching him this season. If anyone who disagrees with my scouting report wants to debate me on my observations, go ahead, but I doubt I will respond. We'd just be going in circles. Posting a bunch of stats or talking about previous years isn't going to change my mind on him as a player.

Epic post fatlever, I shortened the quote to avoid spamming the board, thoughtful intelligent and insightful. Great read.

[hood30]

Look, I am not really quibbing about Kemba getting guaranteed minutes even in blow outs. Just that this is an indication of how this coach allots playing time. So to those that argue Lin will get minutes in Charlotte is not valid unless one assumes there will be injuries to guards. ie if MKG does not get injured will Lin get those minutes that he got? no way. I remember seeing some time played stats and this year was Lin's lowest total, even with all the injuries. So that is pretty clear to me Lin will not get more minutes if everyone comes back. And if I was Charlotte, why do I pay a guy $8-10m per year to play 20-22 min per game?

One thing we do agree with is the fact that Lin's minutes per game for this year was largely based on injury to MKG and the fact that Lamb had defensive issue that Clifford hated.

If I'm Lin, I wouldn't count on getting lucky again next year as for minutes, specially with MKG being fully healthy and highly regarded + I expect Charlotte to sign a wing player this summer to replace Lamb on the bench and this guy won't have the same problem Lamb had which contributed to Lin getting more minutes.

So before Lin gives Charlotte a discount from his true market value, I hope he sits down with Clifford and discuss his minutes for next year.....I can't fathom Lin would accept a lesser role with less minutes + a huge discount, specially if there are teams out there willing to guaranty more minutes and larger roles with more money.

Does Lin love his teammates so much that he's willing to sacrifice major minutes and money just to be back and have fun with them?..Maybe this is now the most important thing in Lin's career and maybe he no longer cares about testing himself as a player and finding out how good can he be if he's given the chance and proper minutes.

If this is indeed Lin's new priority and he no longer cares about improving as a player which comes with getting as much minutes as possible, than Lin owes it to his millions of fan to let them know that, so that they can move on.

Many Lin fan follows him because they believe in him as a player and feel that if he's given a proper chance to start, he could re-ignite Linsanity..With the Hornets, the possibility of that happening is slim....If Lin no longer wants to test himself, he should make that clear to everyone that supports him.

As a Lin fan, I was a bit troubled listening to him state that he wants to have fun with his teammates and he had a blast this year..Sound like this is his biggest priority now...Man, what happens to wanting to become the best player that you can be and maybe one day becoming a All-Star..That was his dream than..Maybe things have changed..If so, let us know so we can move on.

There's no point for me to follow Lin's career if he has given up on his dream of becoming a top PG in this league and can only see himself as a 15-20 minutes back-up PG that can not break out of this ceiling and start for an NBA team.

[yosemiteben]

Maybe things have changed..If so, let us know so we can move on.

There's no point for me to follow Lin's career if he has given up on his dream of becoming a top PG in this league and can only see himself as a 15-20 minutes back-up PG that can not break out of this ceiling and start for an NBA team.

Wow. I guess I thought Lin fans had a deeper tie to him than that. Is that a representative opinion of a large portion of that fanbase?

[hood30]

Maybe things have changed..If so, let us know so we can move on.

There's no point for me to follow Lin's career if he has given up on his dream of becoming a top PG in this league and can only see himself as a 15-20 minutes back-up PG that can not break out of this ceiling and start for an NBA team.

Wow. I guess I thought Lin fans had a deeper tie to him than that. Is that a representative opinion of a large portion of that fanbase?

I'm only speaking for myself as a Lin fan....I don't follow Lin because he's Asian..I'm not even Asian...I follow Lin because of his under-dog status...He's also a devout Christian so that makes it easy for me to root for him....Also, the fact that he had to fight for everything that he's got....Went un-drafted..couldn't get a scholar-ship at a good Basketball College eventhough he was one of the top High School PG in the state of California......Sometimes, you'd like to see a guy like that get his props and finish first instead of the nice and humble guy always finish last.

Unlike the other stars who all have large egos, Lin sound like a pretty decent dude that you can genuinely root for and not feel bad. It's hard to root for guys like Kobe, Harden, Melo because of their arrogancy and massive egos.

With Lin, there's the Cinderella story that everyone love...The possibility that he could re-emerge as Linsanity....If Lin thinks that is no longer possible, than I'm out...No point in me to follow him if he's totally given up in trying to prove his critics wrong and that he could indeed become a very good PG in this league.

[bws94]

Maybe things have changed..If so, let us know so we can move on.

There's no point for me to follow Lin's career if he has given up on his dream of becoming a top PG in this league and can only see himself as a 15-20 minutes back-up PG that can not break out of this ceiling and start for an NBA team.

Wow. I guess I thought Lin fans had a deeper tie to him than that. Is that a representative opinion of a large portion of that fanbase?

On the net, I think so. "Backup PG" is beneath Lin and when I suggest on popular Lin forums that Lin's game may lend itself to a Ginobili type role (I'm not sure they understand what that is as I'm talking about Ginobili in his prime), they think is almost blasphemous to say that. Starter or nothing is big on Lin-fan sites. Yet, he started on teams already. It's the next new place where all will work out (starting even on a losing team which he will turn into a playoff team) or a reunion with Mike D'Antoni so he can run his own team that is the popular sentiment.

[bws94]

Maybe things have changed..If so, let us know so we can move on.

There's no point for me to follow Lin's career if he has given up on his dream of becoming a top PG in this league and can only see himself as a 15-20 minutes back-up PG that can not break out of this ceiling and start for an NBA team.

Wow. I guess I thought Lin fans had a deeper tie to him than that. Is that a representative opinion of a large portion of that fanbase?

I'm only speaking for myself as a Lin fan....I don't follow Lin because he's Asian..I'm not even Asian...I follow Lin because of his under-dog status...He's also a devout Christian so that makes it easy for me to root for him....Also, the fact that he had to fight for everything that he's got....Went un-drafted..couldn't get a scholar-ship at a good Basketball College eventhough he was one of the top High School PG in the state of California......Sometimes, you'd like to see a guy like that get his props and finish first instead of the nice and humble guy always finish last.

Unlike the other stars who all have large egos, Lin sound like a pretty decent dude that you can genuinely root for and not feel bad. It's hard to root for guys like Kobe, Harden, Melo because of their arrogancy and massive egos.

With Lin, there's the Cinderella story that everyone love...The possibility that he could re-emerge as Linsanity....If Lin thinks that is no longer possible, than I'm out...No point in me to follow him if he's totally given up in trying to prove his critics wrong and that he could indeed become a very good PG in this league.

Linsanity was a "perfect storm" and brief. Maybe the ideas of fans are too lofty? Maybe Lin is an established NBA guard, combo-guard or PG and he's doing quite fine. Sure, he could get on a team more suited to his style, maybe if he is a starting PG, he'd put up better numbers. That's quite possible. But we have to realize as a starter, with all of the great PGs out there, Lin would be considered a B or C level starter. Maybe he could prove people wrong and become a B+ level but he won't be considered an A level starter. As a 6th man, he could be one of the best in the league and in some ways, get more positive press with less pressure on him in that role.

Things evolve and change. It's no longer 2012-2013, it's 2016. Next season is 2016-2017, Lin will be 28, not 23-24, and he may have played himself into a niche of solid 6th man. That's not bad at all. It really doesn't matter if he starts or not for him to make his mark in the playoffs. Heck, Lin was one of the most talked-about Hornets in the playoffs. Yet he came off of the bench. Starting or not isn't the end-all and be-all of everything, it's more minutes on the court and what a player does with them. Many starters are starting because they compliment 2 primary players or stars on the team and that's the only reason they start (Cody Zeller for example) or there is no better alternative.

[hood30]

Maybe things have changed..If so, let us know so we can move on.

There's no point for me to follow Lin's career if he has given up on his dream of becoming a top PG in this league and can only see himself as a 15-20 minutes back-up PG that can not break out of this ceiling and start for an NBA team.

Wow. I guess I thought Lin fans had a deeper tie to him than that. Is that a representative opinion of a large portion of that fanbase?

On the net, I think so. "Backup PG" is beneath Lin and when I suggest on popular Lin forums that Lin's game may lend itself to a Ginobili type role (I'm not sure they understand what that is as I'm talking about Ginobili in his prime), they think is almost blasphemous to say that. Starter or nothing is big on Lin-fan sites. Yet, he started on teams already. It's the next new place where all will work out (starting even on a losing team which he will turn into a playoff team) or a reunion with Mike D'Antoni so he can run his own team that is the popular sentiment.

To be fair to some of these Lin fan, I doubt becoming a ginobili-type of back-up is possible in Charlotte for next year, specially when you consider the fact that Clifford loves to play his starters major minutes..Guys like Kemba/Batum plays heavy minutes in most games...And than, you have MKG coming back next year and he will also be playing 35mpg because he's considered a great defender....So that leaves very little minutes for Lin to do anything meaningful.

So it's perfectly understandable why so many Lin fan are a bit bothered by the Charlotte situation because it really restrict Lin's minutes...unlike a true Ginobily-type of back-up...I don't think Lin will be that next year...I have no problem with that role if Lin gets sufficient minutes consistently but it's not going to happen there....

At the very least, Lin's minutes should not go down from this year and everyone agrees that Lin's minutes will go down next year baring injuries.

[Flip Murray]

Look, I am not really quibbing about Kemba getting guaranteed minutes even in blow outs. Just that this is an indication of how this coach allots playing time. So to those that argue Lin will get minutes in Charlotte is not valid unless one assumes there will be injuries to guards. ie if MKG does not get injured will Lin get those minutes that he got? no way. I remember seeing some time played stats and this year was Lin's lowest total, even with all the injuries. So that is pretty clear to me Lin will not get more minutes if everyone comes back. And if I was Charlotte, why do I pay a guy $8-10m per year to play 20-22 min per game?

One thing we do agree with is the fact that Lin's minutes per game for this year was largely based on injury to MKG and the fact that Lamb had defensive issue that Clifford hated.

If I'm Lin, I wouldn't count on getting lucky again next year as for minutes, specially with MKG being fully healthy and highly regarded + I expect Charlotte to sign a wing player this summer to replace Lamb on the bench and this guy won't have the same problem Lamb had which contributed to Lin getting more minutes.

So before Lin gives Charlotte a discount from his true market value, I hope he sits down with Clifford and discuss his minutes for next year.....I can't fathom Lin would accept a lesser role with less minutes + a huge discount, specially if there are teams out there willing to guaranty more minutes and larger roles with more money.

Does Lin love his teammates so much that he's willing to sacrifice major minutes and money just to be back and have fun with them?..Maybe this is now the most important thing in Lin's career and maybe he no longer cares about testing himself as a player and finding out how good can he be if he's given the chance and proper minutes.

If this is indeed Lin's new priority and he no longer cares about improving as a player which comes with getting as much minutes as possible, than Lin owes it to his millions of fan to let them know that, so that they can move on.

Many Lin fan follows him because they believe in him as a player and feel that if he's given a proper chance to start, he could re-ignite Linsanity..With the Hornets, the possibility of that happening is slim....If Lin no longer wants to test himself, he should make that clear to everyone that supports him.

As a Lin fan, I was a bit troubled listening to him state that he wants to have fun with his teammates and he had a blast this year..Sound like this is his biggest priority now...Man, what happens to wanting to become the best player that you can be and maybe one day becoming a All-Star..That was his dream than..Maybe things have changed..If so, let us know so we can move on.

There's no point for me to follow Lin's career if he has given up on his dream of becoming a top PG in this league and can only see himself as a 15-20 minutes back-up PG that can not break out of this ceiling and start for an NBA team.

I have to say this, and it will probably offend you, but this is one of the most selfish things i've ever read. I fear that some of Lin's fans think that they dictate what his priorities should and should not be.

You would turn on him for this? What a toxic viewpoint. Just step back and put things in perspective. Think about the burden that has been thrust upon him that he has carried so willingly. You don't just Benedict Arnold a guy that has given so much. And I say this regardless of your connection to Lin, whether it be because he is Asian, Christian, or just one of the greatest underdog stories ever.

I'm not saying give up on him being great again. Just don't be so entitled. Lin is more than a player, I get that. But shouldn't that mean you stick with him through thick and thin?

[bws94]

Wow. I guess I thought Lin fans had a deeper tie to him than that. Is that a representative opinion of a large portion of that fanbase?

On the net, I think so. "Backup PG" is beneath Lin and when I suggest on popular Lin forums that Lin's game may lend itself to a Ginobili type role (I'm not sure they understand what that is as I'm talking about Ginobili in his prime), they think is almost blasphemous to say that. Starter or nothing is big on Lin-fan sites. Yet, he started on teams already. It's the next new place where all will work out (starting even on a losing team which he will turn into a playoff team) or a reunion with Mike D'Antoni so he can run his own team that is the popular sentiment.

To be fair to some of these Lin fan, I doubt becoming a ginobili-type of back-up is possible in Charlotte for next year, specially when you consider the fact that Clifford loves to play his starters major minutes..Guys like Kemba/Batum plays heavy minutes in most games...And than, you have MKG coming back next year and he will also be playing 35mpg because he's considered a great defender....So that leaves very little minutes for Lin to do anything meaningful.

So it's perfectly understandable why so many Lin fan are a bit bothered by the Charlotte situation because it really restrict Lin's minutes...unlike a true Ginobily-type of back-up...I don't think Lin will be that next year...I have no problem with that role if Lin gets sufficient minutes consistently but it's not going to happen there....

At the very least, Lin's minutes should not go down from this year and everyone agrees that Lin's minutes will go down next year baring injuries.

It's a legit concern but maybe the notion of Lin getting less minutes isn't right. Cliff had a way of having Lin in when it mattered even when MKG was playing. And some matchups favor a small lineup, where Lin could be used, vs. a big one, where he wouldn't be used. It may all balance out in the end. I think if Lin asks about minutes and Cliff says a similar amount to last year, around 27 per game, that's what he'll end of getting overall.

If I were Lin I'd be much more worried about a mid-season trade than minutes or anything else. And I'd make it known. But that's up to him.

[Roy Tarpley]

I don't think anyone is suggesting doing a Benedict Arnold on anyone. But if the player himself doesn't believe in his own potential, then I think it's hard for fans to be as enthusiastic. The enthusiasm may recede a few notches from Linsanity to Linprettygoodity.

[hood30]

Look, I am not really quibbing about Kemba getting guaranteed minutes even in blow outs. Just that this is an indication of how this coach allots playing time. So to those that argue Lin will get minutes in Charlotte is not valid unless one assumes there will be injuries to guards. ie if MKG does not get injured will Lin get those minutes that he got? no way. I remember seeing some time played stats and this year was Lin's lowest total, even with all the injuries. So that is pretty clear to me Lin will not get more minutes if everyone comes back. And if I was Charlotte, why do I pay a guy $8-10m per year to play 20-22 min per game?

One thing we do agree with is the fact that Lin's minutes per game for this year was largely based on injury to MKG and the fact that Lamb had defensive issue that Clifford hated.

If I'm Lin, I wouldn't count on getting lucky again next year as for minutes, specially with MKG being fully healthy and highly regarded + I expect Charlotte to sign a wing player this summer to replace Lamb on the bench and this guy won't have the same problem Lamb had which contributed to Lin getting more minutes.

So before Lin gives Charlotte a discount from his true market value, I hope he sits down with Clifford and discuss his minutes for next year.....I can't fathom Lin would accept a lesser role with less minutes + a huge discount, specially if there are teams out there willing to guaranty more minutes and larger roles with more money.

Does Lin love his teammates so much that he's willing to sacrifice major minutes and money just to be back and have fun with them?..Maybe this is now the most important thing in Lin's career and maybe he no longer cares about testing himself as a player and finding out how good can he be if he's given the chance and proper minutes.

If this is indeed Lin's new priority and he no longer cares about improving as a player which comes with getting as much minutes as possible, than Lin owes it to his millions of fan to let them know that, so that they can move on.

Many Lin fan follows him because they believe in him as a player and feel that if he's given a proper chance to start, he could re-ignite Linsanity..With the Hornets, the possibility of that happening is slim....If Lin no longer wants to test himself, he should make that clear to everyone that supports him.

As a Lin fan, I was a bit troubled listening to him state that he wants to have fun with his teammates and he had a blast this year..Sound like this is his biggest priority now...Man, what happens to wanting to become the best player that you can be and maybe one day becoming a All-Star..That was his dream than..Maybe things have changed..If so, let us know so we can move on.

There's no point for me to follow Lin's career if he has given up on his dream of becoming a top PG in this league and can only see himself as a 15-20 minutes back-up PG that can not break out of this ceiling and start for an NBA team.

I have to say this, and it will probably offend you, but this is one of the most selfish things i've ever read. I fear that some of Lin's fans think that they dictate what his priorities should and should not be.

You would turn on him for this? What a toxic viewpoint. Just step back and put things in perspective. Think about the burden that has been thrust upon him that he has carried so willingly. You don't just Benedict Arnold a guy that has given so much. And I say this regardless of your connection to Lin, whether it be because he is Asian, Christian, or just one of the greatest underdog stories ever.

I'm not saying give up on him being great again. Just don't be so entitled. Lin is more than a player, I get that. But shouldn't that mean you stick with him through thick and thin?

I could also make the same point about you and you being selfish for wanting a player of Lin's ability to stay on a team that can only offer him 15-20 minutes when he could easily start for more than a few teams.

The problem is not even the amount of minutes he played this year..It's more about the fact that Charlotte will ask him to accept a lesser role and minutes with an healthier squad.....As a Lin fan, that is tough to accept and I'm still not convince Lin will take that eventhough his exit-interview clearly shows he'd like to return as a Hornets next year.

I personally would feel very guilty to ask Lin to play less minutes with a lesser role at a discount...I'd tell Lin to go out there and do Linsanity and I hope you make it as a starter because you deserve it.


I get it that as a Hornets fan, you want the best talent at every position/role, but how about being honest and telling Lin that he's too good to only be playing 15 minutes per game in this league and doing so would be taking advantage of him being a nice guy.....

That may be indeed Lin's biggest problem...He's way too nice for his own good and that usually leads to people taking advantage of you.

This is what annoys many Lin fan...The fact that Lin is clearly good enough to start for teams like Knicks, Nets, Magics, Rockets, Dallas, Bucks, Utah, Sixers but yet, he's expected to accept lesser role and minutes and be happy with it...Lin is arguably better than all these PG that starts on the NBA team I've listed above.

I think Lin comes back if his minutes remains the same since he clearly loves his teammates...I think he bolts if Clifford can not guaranty him the same amount of minutes.

As for me, if Lin has given up on his ability to break out, than I'm given up on him as a player..not as a person...I like the guy because he's a nice and humbled guy, but like a previous poster stated, if he's given up on himself, why should I keep watching since I'm watching him while hoping he can re-ignite Linsanity...There's absolutely no point in me following him anymore.

[BatumtheGlue]

Hood30, you know what mate? Lin has to grow arogancy and some egos, just stop being a nice guy on the court. He'll never be a star if he still has the undedog character. Just say **** off and play the Jamal Crawford's style of play.

[Guitardude]

It's a legit concern but maybe the notion of Lin getting less minutes isn't right. Cliff had a way of having Lin in when it mattered even when MKG was playing. And some matchups favor a small lineup, where Lin could be used, vs. a big one, where he wouldn't be used. It may all balance out in the end. I think if Lin asks about minutes and Cliff says a similar amount to last year, around 27 per game, that's what he'll end of getting overall.

If I were Lin I'd be much more worried about a mid-season trade than minutes or anything else. And I'd make it known. But that's up to him.

You've posted a ton here, and I'm really not sure why you've been continuing to try and sell Lin short and try to convince people his best option is as a backup in Charlotte?

And are you really reading what you're writing? "maybe he won't get fewer minutes", "it may all balance out", and the best one - some matches favor a smaller lineup with Lin over Batum or MKG, lolz. Stop trying to do damage control. The fact of the matter is when MKG came back and after Lee was acquired, Lin's minutes declined and his role on the team diminished SIGNIFICANTLY. Those actions, especially after Lee was acquired, is obviously the team saying, "we don't think you're good enough to start/rely on, Jeremy." Why the F would Lin want to stay on a team that did that, or when the only thing your coach said about you at the end of a 7-game series in which you were at least the 2nd most important player just said, "yeah, he's strong and good at defense."

I've already started to follow Lin much less since he became OK being second fiddle b/c it's too painful to watch his massive potential be wasted and for him to be OK with it. If he stays in Charlotte and the others stay also - MKG, batum, etc. - there's a high chance I'll stop watching completely, but will continue to follow him of course.

[bws94]

Hood30, you know what mate? Lin has to grow arogancy and some egos, just stop being a nice guy on the court. He'll never be a star if he still has the undedog character. Just say **** off and play the Jamal Crawford's style of play.

I think he just has to find a better balance of being a team-player and co-facilitator with bringing a I can get mine whenever I want type of attitude every night.

[Guitardude]

On the net, I think so. "Backup PG" is beneath Lin and when I suggest on popular Lin forums that Lin's game may lend itself to a Ginobili type role

You KEEP saying that, but where is the PROOF? Show me solid data or evidence Lin does better as a bench player than starter, and stop trying to use the eye test or "may blah blah blah" to argue your point. Others have shown SOLID data that Lin produces much more and efficiently as a starter, and gave reasons why. All you have are hypotheticals without any proof. All you're trying to do is further the narrative that Lin is best as a backup, which many of us know are not his ceiling.

[bws94]

It's a legit concern but maybe the notion of Lin getting less minutes isn't right. Cliff had a way of having Lin in when it mattered even when MKG was playing. And some matchups favor a small lineup, where Lin could be used, vs. a big one, where he wouldn't be used. It may all balance out in the end. I think if Lin asks about minutes and Cliff says a similar amount to last year, around 27 per game, that's what he'll end of getting overall.

If I were Lin I'd be much more worried about a mid-season trade than minutes or anything else. And I'd make it known. But that's up to him.

You've posted a ton here, and I'm really not sure why you've been continuing to try and sell Lin short and try to convince people his best option is as a backup in Charlotte?

And are you really reading what you're writing? "maybe he won't get fewer minutes", "it may all balance out", and the best one - some matches favor a smaller lineup with Lin over Batum or MKG, lolz. Stop trying to do damage control. The fact of the matter is when MKG came back and after Lee was acquired, Lin's minutes declined and his role on the team diminished SIGNIFICANTLY. Those actions, especially after Lee was acquired, is obviously the team saying, "we don't think you're good enough to start/rely on, Jeremy." Why the F would Lin want to stay on a team that did that, or when the only thing your coach said about you at the end of a 7-game series in which you were at least the 2nd most important player just said, "yeah, he's strong and good at defense."

I've already started to follow Lin much less since he became OK being second fiddle b/c it's too painful to watch his massive potential be wasted and for him to be OK with it. If he stays in Charlotte and the others stay also - MKG, batum, etc. - there's a high chance I'll stop watching completely, but will continue to follow him of course.

Exactly what people write in Lin forums. Did he get his 27 minutes or not? I read in Lin forums back early in the season, Lamb's going to take Lin's minutes. What happened in the end? Everybody else is going to impact Lin negatively. That's something fans bring always into Lin's discussions. Always, start or nothing else is acceptable. All Lin fans must adhere to this. No, we aren't a monolith regardless of the those that want to make us such.

You aren't even looking at team considerations. Why was Lee used in the starting unit? Why was Lin considered beneficial to be in the 2nd unit? Or Al? What about matchups and such. Is everything based on just Lin? That's not how a coach operates. With Lin's skill-set and the skill-set of others on the team, how is it best to utilize it. That's what the coach cares about. Lin is a team player and Cliff managed a team and it is high-time some fans realize that decisions made aren't to put anyone down, but to try to get the best out of the team possible. Agree or disagreeing is fine, but remember team considerations.