Z-Rex: The Cody Zeller Thread

[Red Larrivee]

I literally cannot for the life of me understand how people are saying we did not draft the best player available?

People have a right to question to question his upside fair enough but people cannot seriously be doubting his ability currently, surely?

I would argue that Cody Zeller was the best player in the whole draft fundamentally and I would also argue that he has the highest BBIQ of any player in the draft, he will most likely win ROTY in a race with McLemore imo.

When you have a big as fundamentally sound as Zeller, who has the type of intelligence he has, hustles like a scrub and is an athletic freak then you have a serious baller..in regards to upside also this guy is a worker, he will work, work and work...He's going to get much better.

When I look at Zeller all I can see is CHO!, CHO!, CHO!, CHO!, CHO!

I'm just going to add that DX had Zeller ranked 10th in their Top 100 and Chad Ford didn't have Zeller in his top-10.

Zeller might end up being a solid player, but if the argument is he was the BPA at 4, you have a tough argument to make.

[Elden Payton]

I literally cannot for the life of me understand how people are saying we did not draft the best player available?

People have a right to question to question his upside fair enough but people cannot seriously be doubting his ability currently, surely?

I would argue that Cody Zeller was the best player in the whole draft fundamentally and I would also argue that he has the highest BBIQ of any player in the draft, he will most likely win ROTY in a race with McLemore imo.

When you have a big as fundamentally sound as Zeller, who has the type of intelligence he has, hustles like a scrub and is an athletic freak then you have a serious baller..in regards to upside also this guy is a worker, he will work, work and work...He's going to get much better.

When I look at Zeller all I can see is CHO!, CHO!, CHO!, CHO!, CHO!

I'm just going to add that DX had Zeller ranked 10th in their Top 100 and Chad Ford didn't have Zeller in his top-10.

Zeller might end up being a solid player, but if the argument is he was the BPA at 4, you have a tough argument to make.

All I can read here is salt and saltiness.

DX this and Chad Ford that, use your own head instead of relying on some internet experts and Chad Ford who plainly just sucks azz.

Is there any argument you have about Cody Zeller involving your own thought?

[Red Larrivee]

All I can read here is salt and saltiness.

DX this and Chad Ford that, use your own head instead of relying on some internet experts and a Chad Ford who plainly just sucks azz.

Is there any argument you have about Cody Zeller involving your own thought?

Yes. Besides getting to the free throw line, I don't think he has an elite NBA skill at the moment. He has great intangibles, but defensively he's not very good, he's just a passable rebounder and offensively he can't shoot, struggles against stronger opponents, isn't a natural creator and isn't a go-to scorer.

All the more to him if he proves me wrong. But I had McLemore, Len and Noel as BPA in that order at 4. Zeller wasn't clearly the BPA at 4, in fact, if we're basing it off consensus, he wasn't BPA at all.

But hey, maybe Cho can make Westbrook-magic happen.

[Elden Payton]

All I can read here is salt and saltiness.

DX this and Chad Ford that, use your own head instead of relying on some internet experts and a Chad Ford who plainly just sucks azz.

Is there any argument you have about Cody Zeller involving your own thought?

Yes. Besides getting to the free throw line, I don't think he has an elite NBA skill at the moment. He has great intangibles, but defensively he's not very good, he's just a passable rebounder and offensively he can't shoot, struggles against stronger opponents, isn't a natural creator and isn't a go-to scorer.

All the more to him if he proves me wrong. But I had McLemore, Len and Noel as BPA in that order at 4.

I am a huge McLemore fan and I think he will be in the mix as best player in this draft class but in the grand scheme of things the reality is he has some red flags and 6 GM's passed for a reason.

I would probably have shot myself if we drafted Len and he is like a softer, poor man's Zeller right now and injured to boot.

Noel has more red flags than an airport.

I would love to know what you think the P stands for in BPA because all 3 of the players you listed are upside picks.

[MasterIchiro]

Zeller's value as a top 5 pick hinges on his ability to make a transition to a new position. I'm starting to feel like his stock fell because he was pigeonholed as strictly a center and the mock draft experts and others never operated under the assumption he would be strictly a PF in the NBA.

He has the athleticism to do it but he will have work to do to develop a consistent mid range game.

He certainly seems to have the right attitude and work ethic that you think he would improve upon the major hurdle standing in his way. He needs to really show his shooting ability.

The success of this pick in year one to me hinges on how he performs at PF compared to Bennett at PF.

My guy was McLemore but I'm assuming they have some plan for a starting SG who can spread the floor for MKG and Kemba.

[mrknowitall215]

Cody Zeller displaying this so-called jump shot that he never showcased at Indiana will go a long way in making a case for him actually being BPA where Charlotte drafted him. I believe he will show it off a little, but I'm unsure if he'll ever become as consistent with nailing it despite tough defense the way LaMarcus Aldridge has in his tenure. Time will be telling

[Red Larrivee]

I would probably have shot myself if we drafted Len and he is like a softer, poor man's Zeller right now and injured to boot.

Len isn't a poor man's Zeller. Not even close.

Noel has more red flags than an airport.

Agreed, Noel had flags, but I still think he's a better talent.

I would love to know what you think the P stands for in BPA because all 3 of the players you listed are upside picks.

You're confusing "upside" with "high risk." Noel is the most high risk of the group certainly, but each of the three are better basketball talents than Zeller.

McLemore has a good skillset right now. He's an elite athlete, has good size and of course is a knockdown three-point shooter with his feet set.

[Elden Payton]

Len is a soft finesse player who projects as an offensive big, the reason he's not close to Zeller is he has none of the nous or athleticism that Zeller has.

YOU think he is a better talent but at what? defense and rebounding? that's it? Noel is more like Biyombo than people realise.

Zeller is the better athlete, has the better BBIQ, better fundamentals and is more versatile.

How am I confusing upside with "high risk" Noel is raw, no one was drafting him on how he will be next season, they were drafting him based on how he will be in 5 years.

You are confusing the P in BPA as Potential and not Player, measuring them up with each skill out of 10 then Zeller finishes with the highest score.

You couldn't possibly sell me on McLemore because I was sold on him a long time ago but I have always recognised where his flags are.

[amcoolio]

Len had a few good games in an ACC that is hurting for size.

If you are going to ignore Len's bad games against weaker players, then don't bring up Zeller's.

Nothing about Len says that he'll be better than even Marcin Gortat.

I guess thats why they play the games, right???

This season should be fun.

[TheKingofSting]

Len didn't even make first, second, or third team in his own conference.

[Red Larrivee]

Len is a soft finesse player who projects as an offensive big, the reason he's not close to Zeller is he has none of the nous or athleticism that Zeller has.

Have you watched Len at all? He's very athletic. He wasn't featured as much offensively in Maryland's offense compared to Zeller at Indiana.

YOU think he is a better talent but at what? defense and rebounding? that's it? Noel is more like Biyombo than people realise.

Defense, rebounding, athleticism, activity, mobility, running the floor, finishing. I could go on. Noel is a much better prospect than Biyombo.

Zeller is the better athlete, has the better BBIQ, better fundamentals and is more versatile.

Zeller is not a better athlete than Noel and it's not even close. Please don't give me combine testing results, Noel impacts the game with freak athleticism. Zeller did not play as athletically as he tested at the combine, at Indiana. That's why many were surprised that he tested so well.

How am I confusing upside with "high risk" Noel is raw, no one was drafting him on how he will be next season, they were drafting him based on how he will be in 5 years.

You are confusing the P in BPA as Potential and not Player, measuring them up with each skill out of 10 then Zeller finishes with the highest score.

I know what BPA means and Zeller wasn't BPA at 4. BPA is a mixture of current talent and upside. When you consider both, Zeller would not be taken above the trio already mentioned.

I'm going off what I've seen and it somehow happens that the most reliable draft boards (DX and Chad Ford) agree. Doesn't mean Zeller won't be a productive player and isn't useful, just that he wasn't BPA until proven otherwise.

Len had a few good games in an ACC that is hurting for size.

If you are going to ignore Len's bad games against weaker players, then don't bring up Zeller's.

Nothing about Len says that he'll be better than even Marcin Gortat.

I guess thats why they play the games, right???

This season should be fun.

And nothing about Zeller says he'll be better than Marcin Gortat either. What's your point? I don't understand why there's this notion that Zeller is some sort of sure thing.

[fatlever]

no need to belittle the other players in the draft to make zeller feel better. i love the zeller pick but would have been happy with noel, len and mclemore as well. i really thought len was the pick right up until stern said zeller.

[JMAC3]

Fact is nobody knows if Zeller was BPA. What determines BPA?

Is it the stats they put up in college? because if so that is Zeller.

Is it who is rated highest on mock drafts? because those guys are never wrong.

Is it who has the most potential? because potential is arbitrary and many people do not reach their perceived ceiling.

People assume that just because Zeller put up good stats that he won't be able to improve, whereas a guy like Len, who left a lot to be desired statistically, can improve greater, but in the end will those improvements even lead to what Zeller currently is?

We took a 7 foot WHITE big man. I do not mean to sound biased or anything, but lets be honest the word potential is hardly ever used when it comes to white players, especially Americans.

What makes Zeller have any less potential as the other players? He is still only 20 years old, clearly has one of the best work ethics, and has already shown that he has a hidden jump shot.

Sorry if Zeller was not the "sexy" pick, but hardly ever are the big guys.

[TheKingofSting]

What are some realistic numbers Cody could average as a rookie? Tyler averaged 8 and 6 as a rookie and he is better than him but I also realize whether we bring McBob back or not and whether Cody starts or not they may limit his minutes, nothing Dunlap like but rookies minutes are monitored pretty closely.

I know it is more fun to argue but I'd like to hear some more predictions..

[Elden Payton]

no need to belittle the other players in the draft to make zeller feel better. i love the zeller pick but would have been happy with noel, len and mclemore as well. i really thought len was the pick right up until stern said zeller.

I'm not saying anything I didn't say before the draft.

I didn't want Bennett, Noel or Len but I did want Cody Zeller

[Elden Payton]

What are some realistic numbers Cody could average as a rookie? Tyler averaged 8 and 6 as a rookie and he is better than him but I also realize whether we bring McBob back or not and whether Cody starts or not they may limit his minutes, nothing Dunlap like but rookies minutes are monitored pretty closely.

I know it is more fun to argue but I'd like to hear some more predictions..

I think he will average 15/7/2/1/1 in 32+mpg and win ROY.

[fatlever]

bobcats predictions (assuming a resigned hendo and mcbob and no other major signings)


kemba - 18ppg, 7apg
henderson - 17ppg, 4rpg
kiddgilchrist - 13ppg, 7rpg
zeller - 12ppg, 7rpg
gordon - 10ppg
sessions - 9ppg, 4apg
biyombo - 7ppg, 8rpg
mcrobers - 6ppg, 4rpg
taylor - 6ppg
haywood - 3ppg, 3rpg

next year zeller basically will put up the same points and rebounds as mully, but do it while shooting much better percentages and playing much better defense.

henderson and kemba pick up where the left off last spring (fingers crossed) with kemba's assists going up a tad, both players improving their percentages slightly.

mkg makes a solid jump in points from 9 to 13 due to increased playing time, slightly improved mid-range game and more free-throw attempts

sessions and gordon both see a slight dip in points but are still heavily involved in the rotation.

biyombo makes minor improvements in scoring and rebounding but sees his biggest improvement coming in the form of defensive awareness.

mcroberts plays a key role in leading the 2nd unit

taylor plays well when he gets minutes but is stuck behind hendo, mkg and gordon for now.

[James Gatz]

bobcats predictions (assuming a resigned hendo and mcbob and no other major signings)


kemba - 18ppg, 7apg
henderson - 17ppg, 4rpg
kiddgilchrist - 13ppg, 7rpg
zeller - 12ppg, 7rpg
gordon - 10ppg
sessions - 9ppg, 4apg
biyombo - 7ppg, 8rpg
mcrobers - 6ppg, 4rpg
taylor - 6ppg
haywood - 3ppg, 3rpg

This seems about right. I think Hendo comes back to earth and is around 14-15 ppg though. If Kemba could average like 7.5 apg I would be elated.

[Liver_Pooty]

What are some realistic numbers Cody could average as a rookie? Tyler averaged 8 and 6 as a rookie and he is better than him but I also realize whether we bring McBob back or not and whether Cody starts or not they may limit his minutes, nothing Dunlap like but rookies minutes are monitored pretty closely.

I know it is more fun to argue but I'd like to hear some more predictions..

I think Zeller averages 14.5/7.5

While were at it

Walker - 19/7.5
Henderson - 16.5/4
MKG - 13/7
Biyombo - 8/9

[James Gatz]

Kemba 18.5/6.5
Hendo 15/4
MKG 12/7
Biz 7/9
Zeller 13/7