Don't Be Hurtin' Lin - The Jeremy Lin Thread 2

[fatlever]

JeremyLinForum ‏@jlinforum 56m56 minutes ago

Also keep in mind that CHA fans and media really like Lin.That was not the case last 3 years. So keep it civil and have a bit more patience.

Wise words

Not all Charlotte fans disliked Lin years ago. I've always been a Lin fan. Kemba and Lin are my two favorite guards in the NBA, so it's pretty fun having them both on my favorite team.

I think he meant that Houston and Lakers fans and media didnt like Lin.

[13th Man]

Sounds fun, I'll play.

1) Toronto. Since I am Canadian and can make it to some of these games T.O. also has a large asian population as shown in the epic Knicks buzzer beater game, where the fans cheered louder for him than for their own team LOL.

2)

Pg - Jeremy Lin
Sg - Klay Thompson - deadly shooter to boost Lin's assist #s.
Sf - Andrew Wiggins - Canadian content and potential superstar, can also pull of some highlight reel fast break finishes.
Pf - Tim Duncan - Veteran presence and leadership
C - Ed Davis - low maintenance player with proven chemistry with Lin

3) Thibs - Hard working with a good rep, seems like a straight and honest coach.

Lin would be the 3rd option behind Klay and Wiggins with veteran and future HOFer Timmy just behind Lin. I'm a fan of good character players and and this team satsifies that criteria

[fatlever]

Amazingly Random, but Fun Scenario Question for Lin Fans

Scenario: I am a super wealthy basketball fan from Taiwan. I want to buy an NBA franchise (money is no object) and build a team around Lin that showcases him as a star level player. I am hiring you as my GM and consultant.

1) I want you to first pick a franchise for me to buy. It can be any franchise. I will pay whatever it takes. But I want it to be in a city that would be ideal for Lin.

2) Assemble a team of players to put around Lin. You can pick any players. (assume everyone is a free agent and there is no salary cap). I will pay whatever it takes to put the perfect team around Lin.

3) Pick a coach to coach the team that you assemble

The team you build must be these things:

A) A team with a chance of winning in the playoffs (doesn't have to be a championship team, but must be at least .500)

B) Lin must be a starter.

C) Lin must be no worse than the 2nd/3rd option on offense. I want Lin to be feature on offense and be the primary decision maker and facilitator as well as being one of the top 3 scorers.

So, knowing all of that, give me the franchise, the starting 5 and the coach. Go.

(I did something similar a few years back where I asked Kemba Walker fans to build me a starting 5 that can contend for a championship where Kemba is no worse than the 3rd option on offense)

I think it is fun to see what people come up with.

Fats Re-Creating Linsanity - OK, here goes my attempt. Flame away.

Franchise - Sacramento Kings

I would have said Golden State, but I'd have to break up a dynasty to build this team. Fans there would never forgive me. So I pick the another team in Northern Ca, close to Lin's home, with a high Asian population, but also a franchise that wouldn't kill me for breaking up their team.

Coach - Alvin Gentry

Close enough to D'Antoni, but not completely allergic to defense. He'd still run a ton of pick and roll action for Lin, same way he was used during Linsanity.

Starting 5

PG: Lin
SG: Avery Bradley - good defense, decent enough 3pt shooter, extra ball handler if needed
SF: Kawhi Leonard - leading scorer, best player, lock down defender, but not the kind of alpha scorer that has plagued Lin previously.
PF: Nikola Mirotic - stretch 4
C: Deandre Jordan - perfect pick and roll partner, can finish at rim, defensively helps Lin, doesn't take away too much on offense.

I tried to stay away from the lead alpha dogs like Durant etc so that Lin could still focus on doing what he does best. I wanted a great defensive team, but one that could also shoot 3s and run at a high tempo. Bradley is a questionable decision, but he isn't really a threat to Lin's scoring and he is above average at ball handling, and shooting 3s while being a great defender. This allows Lin the freedom to sometimes not have to check the other team's PG. Team would have trouble with a big backcourt though. Danny Green was another 3/D option, but I already had Leonard, so I decided not to use two Spurs. I also thought about building around Drummond at center rather than Jordan, but figured Drummond would then be higher in the offensive pecking order than Lin (perhaps), so I went with the poor man's Drummond in Jordan.

Team would probably be good enough to challenge for an 8th spot out West (I have that much faith in Leonard). Lin could put up 17/8 on this team pretty easily I think.

[fatlever]

@13th man

Great call with Toronto and also using Wiggins in Toronto. I was very close to using Klay as my leading scorer but went with Leonard instead.

[steady]

But heck the 2nd unit seriously needs some stability and frankly I don't think Batum extending his minutes and playing PG is helping them warm up. look at his turn overs. No doubt Batum does create some great assits, but not off a dribble as a point guard. This 2nd unit has some serious trust issues, cause everyone on it is fighting for their own minutes rather than for each other.

I actually completely disagree, but it's just on the eyeball test and I'm curious to see how the stats bare this out. I feel like running Batum with the second unit gives greater stability because so far Lin and Lamb have not shown to be great at facilitating ball movement (not necessarily their fault). Lately it has seemed like Lin gets jammed up trying to create too much off the dribble, and I personally feel a lot more confident that the ball will be moved intelligently with Batum on the floor, his TOs notwithstanding.

Might be my bias though.

Not like Batum is doing such a great job with the 2nd unit. I rather they suck now that the season is early and learn from their mistakes gel as a unit. growing pains.

I kind of disagree LinIsOK

So far Batum has played with the second unit 4 games. First two games, the second unit (with both Lin and Batum leading them) scored at a pace that would have been 170 points over a full game.

The third game (Mavs game), his time playing with second unit when Lin was in, was pretty brief. Under two minutes in both the 1st and 3rd quarters if I remember right, and pretty poor outcome.

Then in the Spurs game he got some run with Lin and the second unit in the 3rd quarter, but that was a disaster as was much of the 3rd quarter (it's the quarter fatlever is trying to forget )-- so not that informative imo.

I like Batum playing with Lin on second unit because I think they are the two playmakers who are best at operating at a fast ball movement oriented system. And I would really like to see them play together more not less. I would like to see Lin subbed in earlier so there was more overlap with Batum and Kemba.

With Zeller at center, and either Williams or Kaminsky at PF. you could do a real 4 out 1 in, run an explosive fast paced offense. It would be fun to see.

Lin-Lamb-Batum-Kaminsky-Zeller

The closest we have seen to this was Kemba-Lin-Batum-Marvin-Zeller in the Heat game - they were the lineup that brought the team back from the huge deficit.

[spaceballer]

(Warning: Lengthy post. I can be wordy. This might be the only post I have time to make today, so I figured I'd make it count.)

Uh-oh. Lin just tweeted a Bible verse ... After this loss, I don't think the emotion behind this tweet is as positive....

I don't mean to harp on you, but CBS just published a piece yesterday on Lin with these quotes:

“We understand that it's a long year and you gotta have fun,” Lin said. “We want to develop something where we are really close with each other on the court and off the court. That's why we spend a lot of time together and why you see us having a lot of fun and joking around. We really want this to be a great experience.”

“[Charlotte] wants me to go play my game,” Lin said. “That's liberating in a lot of ways.”

It is way too early to act like Lin is unhappy with his role or the team. We are two games removed from the beat down we handed out to Chicago, and we heard all these first person accounts after that game about how great team chemistry and Lin's relationship with his teammates seem to be.

There is way too much of a microscope on Lin IMO.

I'm willing to bet that any disappointment that Lin has is directed at himself, not towards the organization or coaches. Because he's supposed to be the leader of the 2nd unit he probably bears a bit more responsibilty but I have faith that they'll work it out and get past these growing pains. The SA game was a reality check for them.

I agree with this. Also, the CBS interview was prior to the game, while the tweet was after.

Lin will not display any dissatisfaction or frustration towards the team, organization, or past or current teammates. He rooted and cheered for his teammates to succeed even as they took his minutes and starting spots (he was good friends with Toney Douglas, who was closing games over him in Houston because they thought he might provide the needed defense next to the defenseless Harden, and Patrick Beverley, who took his starting spot for the same reason, but Lin often chose to sit next to the two of them on the team plane). To this day, he has never said a critical word about McHale or Byron Scott or Dolan or any of his past teams or teammates. As a matter of fact, when family and friends became partisan on his behalf, he said he had to tell them he didn't want to hear it because he didn't want to bring any negative energy into the Lakers locker room since it would interfere with his job.

He'll just keep the negative emotions bottled up and direct it at himself, while trying to be happy in public and in the locker room. Not just because he's trying to be professional, but because he weirdly thinks that's the Christian thing to do.

He said growing up, his parents weren't concerned about how many points or assists he had after a game, but always asked him how he treated people. They were more concerned with whether he showed respect to his teammates, opponents, coaches, and refs when they were raising him, and that he was acting in a Christian manner, whatever that means.

So he struggles to keep positive in his relationships with people no matter how he feels inside. He roots for his teammates and will never be a locker room cancer, and he's coachable to a fault (and yes, I do mean to a fault, when it comes to things like running that terrible tanking Byron Scott offense). D'Antoni said Lin was a special joy to coach because he executed whatever plays D'Antoni drew up, even clashing with Melo on the court when Melo deviated from D'Antoni's instructions. And no matter what role McHale jerked him back and forth on, Lin tried to adapt and try his best without dissent. He never even raised an angry word during his Lakers situation, even though Boozer, who was moved to the bench on the same day as Lin, angrily and publicly sniped at how Byron sucked at defense compared to Thibs. Lin would never do something like that.

And it's not like the nice guy image is just a PR facade for show (though I'm sure it helps). After the "Chink in the Armor" ESPN flap got an ESPN editor fired, Lin quietly approached the guy to have lunch with him and smooth things over and express regret over his losing his job. Zero press or attempt from Lin's side to capitalize on this to burnish his image. The only reason we found this out was because the fired ESPN guy, months after the lunch, later talked about it and how thankful he was to Lin.

It wasn't an isolated incident. Lin's had interactions like that with the Rockets and Lakers press as well, that we only find out about because the recipients of the gracious gestures are astounded and share them after the fact (with no attempt by Lin's press team to put the stories out there to burnish his image). Like the story the Rockets beat writer shared about how the team went to an outlet Nike store for a shopping spree on a employee discount during a road trip. The Rockets writer couldn't find the shoes he wanted in his size and color and expressed his disappointment to Lin. Later that night, he had a knock on his hotel room, and Lin presented him with the shoes in the right size and color. Lin had called his agent and contacts in order to get a hold of the right shoes. The writer said he was reluctant to share the personal story because it might make him seem biased in his objective reporting, but he felt he had to because no other NBA player had ever gone out of their way to do something nice like that for him and he was amazed at how Lin was a genuine nice guy, even though he knew Lin didn't want the attention. When this Rockets beat writer later retired (I think he moved on to a job in another related sports related field, no longer a reporter), during his farewell tweets to thank people around the NBA and acknowledge his colleagues in the journalist world, Jeremy Lin was one of only 3 players he mentioned by name out of all the long years and multitudes of Rockets players he had the pleasure to cover. During the Rockets Melo recruitment/Lin jersey number flap, I think he even came out of retirement to write a piece favoring Lin or something, unless I'm remembering wrong.

More recently, there were handwritten thank you notes that Lin recently sent out to Lakers beat writers, to thank them for their support and effort in covering a terrible tanking season, that those writers excitedly tweeted images of because they rarely get handwritten thankyou's.

In contrast to the positive attitude he strives for and tries to treat people with (since it's how he thinks God wants him to treat people), Lin just bottles up and directs all the negative stuff at himself and you won't really see a hint of it in his demeanor on or off the court, except for the Bible tweets.

In his Christian testimonials in Taiwan, he's talked about his hardships and how he's relied on his faith to carry him. He's mentioned crying himself to sleep, or not being able to sleep before games or eat or having pre-game anxiety because he was so worried about losing his starting spot or getting his minutes cut, or writing in his diary that he wished he'd never signed a contract or something (and these revelations often come as a surprise to the audience, since you see no signs of these things during the season). That annual Christian testimonial is the only time he lets his guard down, when he's in front of God and being brutally honest, while he's otherwise always diplomatic and polished in his answers to the media with his Harvard education. You see zero hints of those personal struggles during the season in American media or in any of his other interviews or press/fan interactions. Or in his demeanor on or off the court or in the locker room. He just bottles it all up and directs all the negative energy at himself (never at the organization, coaches, fans, or teammates, since he feels that's not the Christian thing to do). The only hints of turmoil you will see during the season are the Bible tweets, which usually correspond to emotional lowpoints.

Even as the Lakers tanking season went on, he never once entertained any questions about leaving the Lakers in the off-season nor said a single negative word about the organization, his coach, or teammates. Just voicing his support and gratefulness for the opportunity and giving his best on and off the court, in both actions and attitude. He's not being disingenuous; he honestly believes it's his Christian duty to live in a way where he treats everyone positively and reflect on his faith, and to push aside any negativity in his interactions with others. It doesn't mean he would stay with the Lakers of course, even though he left the door open to staying and was diplomatic about it. But as the Lakers learned, just because he buries it doesn't mean it's not there. He's never said a single bad thing about Byron Scott and Lakers, and tried to put on positive face through it all. Even talked about the possibility of wanting to stay on, even at the end. But that doesn't mean he won't leave the Lakers after his contract was up.

I don't think that's necessarily the case with the Hornets. The season just began, and the sky isn't falling. But those Bible tweets are red flags and often an indication of trouble. He's surely disappointed with his play or something. When things are good, he tweets cheering on his teammates or thanking god or whatever. When things are bad, and he's bottling negative emotions, he tweets a Bible verse. It's his coping mechanism, to fall back on his faith to weather adversity.

I'm agnostic, but I recognize that the coping mechanism of religion works for him, or else he wouldn't have made it through the odds of undrafted, d-league, not getting basketball scholarships or spots in division 1 schools, etc. without his faith. Someone non-religious might use a different coping mechanism. But for Lin, it's Bible tweets, or he'd explode from bottling up all the negative stuff.

Winning cures all. Let's hope the team goes on a win streak and we don't get more Bible tweets to be alarmed about.

[TinmanZBoy]

Franchise: New York Knicks
Coach: Mike D'antoni
1, Jeremy Lin
2, Iman Shumpert
3, Landry Fields
4, Steve Novak
5, Tyson Chandler

^good words, space//

[Roy Tarpley]

1. Los Angeles Lakers -- Large Asian population and the fans would appreciate the Busses selling the team
2.
PG: Lin
SG: Bradley Beal
SF: Kawhi Leonard
PF: Kenneth Faried
C: DeAndre Jordan

3. Gregg Popovich

[ils411]

Leave out the name calling - Sachmo

[Roy Tarpley]

PG: Lin
SG: Lamb
SF: Williams
PF: Zeller
C: Hawes

Can you come up with a WORSE lineup?!

[ils411]

Amazingly Random, but Fun Scenario Question for Lin Fans

Scenario: I am a super wealthy basketball fan from Taiwan. I want to buy an NBA franchise (money is no object) and build a team around Lin that showcases him as a star level player. I am hiring you as my GM and consultant.

1) I want you to first pick a franchise for me to buy. It can be any franchise. I will pay whatever it takes. But I want it to be in a city that would be ideal for Lin.

2) Assemble a team of players to put around Lin. You can pick any players. (assume everyone is a free agent and there is no salary cap). I will pay whatever it takes to put the perfect team around Lin.

3) Pick a coach to coach the team that you assemble

The team you build must be these things:

A) A team with a chance of winning in the playoffs (doesn't have to be a championship team, but must be at least .500)

B) Lin must be a starter.

C) Lin must be no worse than the 2nd/3rd option on offense. I want Lin to be feature on offense and be the primary decision maker and facilitator as well as being one of the top 3 scorers.

So, knowing all of that, give me the franchise, the starting 5 and the coach. Go.

(I did something similar a few years back where I asked Kemba Walker fans to build me a starting 5 that can contend for a championship where Kemba is no worse than the 3rd option on offense)

I think it is fun to see what people come up with.

There is only 1 right answer here and that is
1. New York Nicks
2. Roster + Coach is the same as when Linsanity broke out less Melo of couse :p lololol!!!!

[TinmanZBoy]

people could be indulged in the internet virtual world... there are a lot of fans who are not active online...so it is false that houston and LA fans don't like lin....
in general, fans like lin no matter where he played... because he played hard, gave his all...
last season, Lin always had louder cheers whenever he was on the court in Staples center, because he played damn better at home court...

[ils411]

@Tinman
Eh, you know what I mean. there are 3 fan bases from where lin hate comes from. Not all of them hate on lin, but the handful who got pissed off with the diehard lin fans sure as hell hope that Lin crash and burns so that they can rub it on the crazy Lin fans' faces.

Also...Tinman and Zboy...well known Lin haters from Clutch... hmmm... :p lol

[anthoang]

Amazingly Random, but Fun Scenario Question for Lin Fans

Scenario: I am a super wealthy basketball fan from Taiwan. I want to buy an NBA franchise (money is no object) and build a team around Lin that showcases him as a star level player. I am hiring you as my GM and consultant.

1) I want you to first pick a franchise for me to buy. It can be any franchise. I will pay whatever it takes. But I want it to be in a city that would be ideal for Lin.

2) Assemble a team of players to put around Lin. You can pick any players. (assume everyone is a free agent and there is no salary cap). I will pay whatever it takes to put the perfect team around Lin.

3) Pick a coach to coach the team that you assemble

The team you build must be these things:

A) A team with a chance of winning in the playoffs (doesn't have to be a championship team, but must be at least .500)

B) Lin must be a starter.

C) Lin must be no worse than the 2nd/3rd option on offense. I want Lin to be feature on offense and be the primary decision maker and facilitator as well as being one of the top 3 scorers.

So, knowing all of that, give me the franchise, the starting 5 and the coach. Go.

(I did something similar a few years back where I asked Kemba Walker fans to build me a starting 5 that can contend for a championship where Kemba is no worse than the 3rd option on offense)

I think it is fun to see what people come up with.

This is easy. Here are some of the players I would sign, Tyson Chandler, Steve Novak, Landry Fields, Jared Jeffries, Iman Shumpert...
But i would not sign the black hole Carmelo Anthony
The coach I would get, D'Antoni.
The city: NY or SF

[TinmanZBoy]

@Tinman
Eh, you know what I mean. there are 3 fan bases from where lin hate comes from. Not all of them hate on lin, but the handful who got pissed off with the diehard lin fans sure as hell hope that Lin crash and burns so that they can rub it on the crazy Lin fans' faces.

Also...Tinman and Zboy...well known Lin haters from Clutch... hmmm... :p lol

lol... you got it

[ils411]

My 2 cents

Lin is not a single player star.

Lin is a team player.

I've noticed that unlike other scrubs who still scrubs away even when playing with better talent ie the starters, Lin also elevates his play along side better talent when used to his strengths.

Lin can make others better by feeding them and at the same time, he can make himself better by feeding from others. Now pair him with a bunch of scrubs who can't do shyet, and he too wont be able to perform simply because he is team oriented and his type of ball is team ball and when the team sucks, he sucks. Notice how he sucks in ISO and 1-on-1 situations.

Just look at the Kemba-Batum-Lin line up. They play really well and when they have it, they really have it. Its like they are all stars. Now, look at Lin's play with the not so talented 2nd unit and he also sucks like them.

That's the problem with lin, his play is too team oriented. that's how he developed his play style. If he opted to concentrate on a me first type, he would be better. But he didnt' and I think its a little to late to change play styles given his age.

That is why he is the most effective as a ball dominant PG. He will find you open plays and open looks and give you good shots as long as the other players know what they are doing which isn't the case with other scrubs who have zero idea on what to do.

[phillycheese]

Team - Toronto Raptors - huge Asian population. Entire country will have his back if he does well.
PG - Lin
SG - Jimmy Butler
SF - Kahwi Leonard
PF - Serge Ibaka
C - E Okafor
Coach - Brad Stevens

Lots of wing defenders to help Lin defensively. Ibaka is the shot blocker to cover for Okafor who will be the low post presence when that is needed. I was thinking Klay over Butler for better shooting, but I like Butler's wanting to be great. Although Ibaka is not known for his rolling, that is because he has been playing with Durant and Russ. I think with Lin, he will learn to roll. Okafor - because I think he wants to prove people wrong who had him drafted higher. The only question is outside shooting, but I think there is enough of that on this team. I wanted a coach that held guys accountable on both ends of the court - guys like Thibs and DAntoni were too one sided. Pops would have been another choice but I felt this team needed a younger voice.

[13th Man]

edited out my comments as I'm not a mod but have reported the offending post.

[fatlever]

Team - Toronto Raptors - huge Asian population. Entire country will have his back if he does well.
PG - Lin
SG - Jimmy Butler
SF - Kahwi Leonard
PF - Serge Ibaka
C - E Okafor
Coach - Brad Stevens

Lots of wing defenders to help Lin defensively. Ibaka is the shot blocker to cover for Okafor who will be the low post presence when that is needed. I was thinking Klay over Butler for better shooting, but I like Butler's wanting to be great. Although Ibaka is not known for his rolling, that is because he has been playing with Durant and Russ. I think with Lin, he will learn to roll. Okafor - because I think he wants to prove people wrong who had him drafted higher. The only question is outside shooting, but I think there is enough of that on this team. I wanted a coach that held guys accountable on both ends of the court - guys like Thibs and DAntoni were too one sided. Pops would have been another choice but I felt this team needed a younger voice.

Now, lets be real... Lin would be at best the 4th option on that offense and many nights the 5th option, depending on Ibaka's jumper. It would be a nice team, no doubt, but I could plug any random PG on to that team and it wouldnt matter much.

[fatlever]

And to all you guys saying the Knicks with the 2012 roster, you guys are no fun