Signed By Indiana - The Jeremy Lamb Thread

[yosemiteben]

Just looked up Jeremy Lamb's numbers for the month of December and they are TERRIBLE.

He's been terrible at shooting / scoring: 9.7 pts, 36.9% FG, 23.8% 3PT, 55.6% FT, 42.1% TS

He's been terrible at playmaking: 28% USG, 1.2 ast

He's posting a terrible net rating: 89 ORTG, 102 DRTG

Dude is slumping hard.

[fatlever]

Just looked up Jeremy Lamb's numbers for the month of December and they are TERRIBLE.

He's been terrible at shooting / scoring: 9.7 pts, 36.9% FG, 23.8% 3PT, 55.6% FT, 42.1% TS

He's been terrible at playmaking: 28% USG, 1.2 ast

He's posting a terrible net rating: 89 ORTG, 102 DRTG

Dude is slumping hard.

wow, I didn't realize it was THAT bad. Lamb is the bizzaro Kemba, he goes ice cold in December.

[Liver_Pooty]

Just looked up Jeremy Lamb's numbers for the month of December and they are TERRIBLE.

He's been terrible at shooting / scoring: 9.7 pts, 36.9% FG, 23.8% 3PT, 55.6% FT, 42.1% TS

He's been terrible at playmaking: 28% USG, 1.2 ast

He's posting a terrible net rating: 89 ORTG, 102 DRTG

Dude is slumping hard.

That looks like a Nick Young stat line. Horrible

[TTNN]

Just looked up Jeremy Lamb's numbers for the month of December and they are TERRIBLE.

He's been terrible at shooting / scoring: 9.7 pts, 36.9% FG, 23.8% 3PT, 55.6% FT, 42.1% TS

He's been terrible at playmaking: 28% USG, 1.2 ast

He's posting a terrible net rating: 89 ORTG, 102 DRTG

Dude is slumping hard.

I was looking at it too. Somehow his 2pt shooting wasn't change much, his 3pt shooting slump big time. Actually, his 3 was good the first 7 games, but after that, he has always been shooting above 50% for one game, and get low 3pt% in another.

i do feel that play together with starters hurt him. Look at splits of him playing with Kemba, he was shooting 38% 3s without Kemba, and only 26% with Kemba on court with him. Not as dramatic, he got similar split with Batum too.

[DY_nasty]

He's shooting more constested looks now. All the rhythm he had with the bench is gone. He kinda does his own thing once he gets the ball. Where he would just pull up or pass the ball November, now he stops to size up defenders and hesitates to pass allowing the defense to react.

Lamb was playing really smart ball at first but now? Its legit effecting others he's playing with as well because on top of shooting poorly he's either a step behind or not where he's supposed to be entirely for long stretches.

And when he's not actually hitting shots, he's adding very, very little. I'm still clueless as to why he's just blatantly against running out in transition to put pressure on defenses. (No, I'm not, he loves poaching rebounds from the bigs then taking his time up the court lol).

Dude seriously better hope that PJ never cracks 35% and that Troy never learns how to play defense. That contract might be the only thing keeping him on the court.

[sidestep]

Sometimes, too many times, seeing Lamb is like watching a rookie play on a DGAF team. Dude is raw but ultimately it's on the coach for allowing that free-for-all go on so often. Lamb spends so long probing the defense, mostly resulting in nothing more than wasting the shot clock and making the defense even more settled than before. The 2nd unit moves the ball very well, but Lamb is too often the exception.

Cliff should be laying down rules/guidelines for Lamb. First of all: if you don't have an open shot or an obvious driving lane, then pass the ball. Until he gets better at reading defenses and getting a feel for how 5 defenders react to him in space, he should not be trying to create so much for himself.

And when he's not actually hitting shots, he's adding very, very little. I'm still clueless as to why he's just blatantly against running out in transition to put pressure on defenses. (No, I'm not, he loves poaching rebounds from the bigs then taking his time up the court lol).

Another guideline, which is related to DY_nasty's post: outlet passes after a defensive rebound should look for Lin, instead of letting Lamb walk the ball up so much. This should be obvious because the difference between them when it comes to handing transition is night and day.

Lin is excellent in transition, such as pushing the pace, looking for driving lanes for himself, looking ahead for cutters, looking for bigs getting deep post position, pressuring defenses and then finding 3P shooters who are trailing, looking for mismatches to feed the ball, knowing when to slow down into half-court offense, etc.

Lamb does none of these things, especially when he's turtle pacing the ball up, so why does Cliff let him do that so often? It's confounding and plain silly. It used to be, in previous years, that Cliff would restrict who could bring the ball up, like only Kemba, but now it's almost anybody, including Lamb who isn't good at it.

At some pt, the issue is not with Lamb's limitations, which should be clear by now, but that Cliff doesn't try to rein him in.

[BatumtheGlue]

He should stop tries to do too much to create his own shot and play off the ball more. I'd love to see him grows as Redick type of player than Kobe/Harden type and using his energy to plays better on the defensive end.

[BigSlam]

Just looked up Jeremy Lamb's numbers for the month of December and they are TERRIBLE.

He's been terrible at shooting / scoring: 9.7 pts, 36.9% FG, 23.8% 3PT, 55.6% FT, 42.1% TS

He's been terrible at playmaking: 28% USG, 1.2 ast

He's posting a terrible net rating: 89 ORTG, 102 DRTG

Dude is slumping hard.

Yet some posters have the audacity to talk this kid up while stating over and over and over and over again that MKG doesn't have a spot on this team (or even in the NBA).

At least Gilly has his elite defence, huge motor and even bigger heart to fall back on.


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[Joest2003]

This is his first season playing real minutes there will be growing pains like this but it will be worth it in the long run. He still has the highest FG% out of all our guards and even some forwards so let's relax a little bit.

[Joest2003]

Dude seriously better hope that PJ never cracks 35%

This made me laugh lol

[JDR720]

i guess we know who Al was smoking with before his suspension.

[LamarMatic7]

Good write up on Lamb: http://www.nba.com/2015/news/features/steve_aschburner/11/25/charlotte-hornets-jeremy-lamb-putting-himself-in-discussion-for-sixth-man-and-most-improved/

totally besides the point, but I chuckled about this part in the article.

Look, I don't want to give the guy's name but my first year [as an assistant coach] with the Knicks, we had a rookie who was out of the league that year who had 28 one night at Detroit. That is this league.

As if it's impossible for us to look that up, Cliff.

If anyone is wondering, my bust guess is Lavor Postell. He was a rookie in Cliff's first year there, was out of the league after three incomplete seasons with the Knicks and dropped a career-high of 20 points at Detroit in his second year. Seems plausible that Cliff could confuse his rookie year with his sophomore year since their other most inexperienced player was Rick Brunson (former Bobcats assistant/Herc from The Wire look-a-like), who already had three seasons under his belt.

As for Postell, he bounced around some European and South American teams before enlisting in the US Army two years ago. A unique career path..

[LamarMatic7]

He's posting a terrible net rating: 89 ORTG, 102 DRTG

Dude is slumping hard.

Umm... Lamb's ratings are 101.0 - 87.6 in December.

http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612766/onoffcourt/advanced/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&DateFrom=12%2F01%2F2015&sort=NET_RATING&dir=1

I knew that something just wasn't adding up about your post. I mean, we're fresh off the games at Memphis and vs Boston where our bench bailed the starters out. They just should have great net ratings.

[yosemiteben]

He's posting a terrible net rating: 89 ORTG, 102 DRTG

Dude is slumping hard.

Umm... Lamb's ratings are 101.0 - 87.6 in December.

http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612766/onoffcourt/advanced/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&DateFrom=12%2F01%2F2015&sort=NET_RATING&dir=1

I knew that something just wasn't adding up about your post. I mean, we're fresh off the games at Memphis and vs Boston where our bench bailed the starters out. They just should have great net ratings.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/lambje01/splits/2016/

[James Gatz]

Bball ref ORTG and DRTG are inaccurate. It's great for other things but "advanced stats" isn't one of them.

[LamarMatic7]

He's posting a terrible net rating: 89 ORTG, 102 DRTG

Dude is slumping hard.

Umm... Lamb's ratings are 101.0 - 87.6 in December.

http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612766/onoffcourt/advanced/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&DateFrom=12%2F01%2F2015&sort=NET_RATING&dir=1

I knew that something just wasn't adding up about your post. I mean, we're fresh off the games at Memphis and vs Boston where our bench bailed the starters out. They just should have great net ratings.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/lambje01/splits/2016/

oh.. you used BK-Ref. Then it's simply a misunderstanding on my part.

BK-ref's rating is not exactly his net rating, if by net rating one means the plus-minus that a player records while he's on the floor.

BK-Ref's offensive and defensive ratings basically calculate one's offensive or defensive impact per 100 possessions judging by their boxscore stats. So if Lamb is having a bad shooting slump then, yeah, he's bound to have bad offensive production per 100 possessions since it takes his shooting, passing, etc. into account on a per possession basis.

It's kind of like putting a rating to one's personal contributions on both ends of the court.

And, hey, the idea behind it isn't a bad one. But it's just a boxscore stat-based rating. It's hard to say how precisely it rates, let's say..., low-usage rim-runners who have a good FG% on offense or defense in general since it's so hard to value defense based on boxscores.

In this case, these numbers pretty much indicate though that Lamb's having a month where his boxscore numbers aren't good. And I guess there is value to that. It indicates that those bench line-ups have survived despite his inefficiency.

[yosemiteben]

Makes sense, didn't realize they were different. Honestly I kind of like BK Ref's net rating formulation better, since pure +/- is obviously flawed due to improper attribution. Like you said, I like the idea of tying net rating to production.

I think Lamb's defense has improved a bit (pure eyeball test), but I don't think one can look at his terrible offensive efficiency and lack of creating offense for others and say he's been a major net positive on offense lately. Totally agree with your final sentence, that seems to be the situation.

With that said, it's just six games and it's been against elite defenses (except for MEM, they're pretty average), so I'm not all that worried about it. Given how hot he was to kick off the season I'm sure that got some attention from opposing coaches as well, so it wouldn't surprise me if he is a part of game plans of teams we face. My biggest issue is his insistence on going into iso situations, think he needs to move the ball more.

[MasterIchiro]

This is his first season playing real minutes there will be growing pains like this but it will be worth it in the long run. He still has the highest FG% out of all our guards and even some forwards so let's relax a little bit.

Seriously the dude is a scorer. I wouldn't be surprised if Clifford has encouraged him to probe defenses more and try to create his own shot and be more aggressive. It's not his strength. He moves beautifully off the ball but maybe defenses were getting hip to him and sending an extra defender to deny him space or the ball. I think he should go back to doing that and hit more wide open shots before he is asked to create. Get that down first. His three point percentage should be higher. He's trying to do to much so I hope he gets back to the basics.

[UNCNYC]

I think Lamb has been overpaid. He is too raw and not a player that plays within structure. I think cliff knew what he was doing by bringing him off the bench. I think what we see from him is as good as its going to get. I do think PJ will or can improve a bit. I like Lamb on this team but I think he is being overpaid by at least half of what hes getting... but at the same time for us we needed that extra punch...

[LamarMatic7]

I think Lamb has been overpaid. He is too raw and not a player that plays within structure. I think cliff knew what he was doing by bringing him off the bench. I think what we see from him is as good as its going to get. I do think PJ will or can improve a bit. I like Lamb on this team but I think he is being overpaid by at least half of what hes getting... but at the same time for us we needed that extra punch...

Next year, it will be like a $4.9 million per year deal (if we look at it from the prism of the 2014-15 season) when looked at from the percentage of salary cap it takes up. The year after that, it will be even less.

Do you think that's too much?