Geometry: The Frank Kaminsky Thread

[catch20two]

Is there any chance Frank becomes a 20+ppg scorer?

Don't mean he won't be good but don't hold your breath.

[predators]

I'm thinking a Raef Lafrentz type career with moderately better numbers now that teams want to take a lot of threes. I actually can't find Dirk's Wingspan, but I'm assuming it is significantly longer than Franks or he would have gone much higher than 9 and probably in last year's draft. I hate the pick because there just isn't much upside there. At least 2 or 3 players taken after him will have significantly better careers than he does even though he won't be a complete bust. Hopefully once we get on the treadmill; we can start taking home run swings in the teens instead of choking up for a single in the top 10.

[yosemiteben]

Charlotte Hornets ‏@hornets
.@FSKPart3 the only rookie in the league currently averaging a double-double (16.5pts, 10reb)

Yay?

[Hornet Mania]

Is there any chance Frank becomes a 20+ppg scorer?

Seriously doubt it. There are very few 20ppg scorers any given season, it would be a great accomplishment for Kamisnky to be a 15-17ppg scorer. He doesn't create his own shots, he takes advantage when defends help off of him when others are driving to the hoop. Guys who need to be set up usually don't average 20ppg, if he gets up to 15ppg+ in a few years playing within the flow of the offense and makes opponents respect his range that will be a fantastic success for us.

If everything breaks right I see him as a high-end 3rd option low-end 2nd option on a quality team.

[Eoghan]

McRoberts way more athletic, better Passer, better dribbler, and competent defender. Kaminsky is just a much better shooter and taller. Kaminsky will play the Marv role more than the McRoberts role.

[BigSlam]

Is there any chance Frank becomes a 20+ppg scorer?

He'd have to get to the line wayyyyyyyyyy more than he currently does to sniff 20ppg I think.


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[yosemiteben]

McRoberts way more athletic, better Passer, better dribbler, and competent defender.

Before McRoberts showed up in Charlotte at age 25 he'd never averaged more than 2.1 apg (3.4 per 36). Give Frank 3 years of NBA experience and I think he could put up similar passing numbers.

McRoberts had VERY underwhelming combine stats, though he did show up with like 13% body fat at the combine. I think both McRoberts and Kaminsky are relatively unathletic and I wouldn't give McRoberts a real edge in that department, especially not at the same stage in their careers.

On defense for us McRoberts was +3.0 per 100 possession and had a DRPM ranked 41st out of all PFs. I believe there has only been one season in his career where he posted a net negative defensive rating (so one where he helped more than he hurt on that end on a +/- basis). I don't see any reason that Frank can't be at least a slightly below average defender at his position like McRoberts was / is. He's longer and not significantly less athletic, and both seem to be high BBIQ players that know where to be.

[JMAC3]

My expectations are low for Frank...

I think he can be a guy who shoots the ball well from the perimeter (37% from three), decent rebounder, and give us a good 20 minutes per game. Anything more than that I will be thrilled.

[ball teacher]

McRoberts way more athletic, better Passer, better dribbler, and competent defender. Kaminsky is just a much better shooter and taller. Kaminsky will play the Marv role more than the McRoberts role.

I agree David, I do think Kaminsky runs the floor and handles the ball better than some may realize though. But where Kaminsky is gonna help us, is off the pick and pops, it will have defenses confused, either help contain Kemba who will have the speed advantage, but that frees Frank, or you respect Frank and leave opposing defenders to singlehandedly trying to slow Kemba coming off a screen. With Al in the post, Batum on the wing backed up by Lamb, PJ, and Troy, and with MKG being able to hopefully hit some jumpers or beat his man to the rim, we will have a pretty solid offense. Frank will be a big part of that if he can make teams pay off the pop. Mcbob was the playmaking passer, Frank is a scoring weapon, that's how I would point out their differences...David.

[mrknowitall215]

McRoberts way more athletic, better Passer, better dribbler, and competent defender.

Before McRoberts showed up in Charlotte at age 25 he'd never averaged more than 2.1 apg (3.4 per 36). Give Frank 3 years of NBA experience and I think he could put up similar passing numbers.

McRoberts had VERY underwhelming combine stats, though he did show up with like 13% body fat at the combine. I think both McRoberts and Kaminsky are relatively unathletic and I wouldn't give McRoberts a real edge in that department, especially not at the same stage in their careers.

On defense for us McRoberts was +3.0 per 100 possession and had a DRPM ranked 41st out of all PFs. I believe there has only been one season in his career where he posted a net negative defensive rating (so one where he helped more than he hurt on that end on a +/- basis). I don't see any reason that Frank can't be at least a slightly below average defender at his position like McRoberts was / is. He's longer and not significantly less athletic, and both seem to be high BBIQ players that know where to be.

If Kaminsky doesn't surpass McRoberts I will be disappointed in a major way. McRoberts get overrated on this board because he was one of the few competent veteran role players that this team has had over the years, but his raw numbers weren't anything impressive, and should be considered a floor for Kaminsky barring assist percentage

[Mystical Apples]

I don't know why people are so up in arms over Frank's defense right now. He was the 9th pick not the 1st. Everybody picked in that range has some flaws in their game. You're just nitpicking for the sake of it. Right now to me it looks like he can definitely shoot and move. He just needs to get stronger.

Pretty much this. His defense will improve and can see him being at least an average defender in the right system. From what we've seen in SL he's been pretty good. Good positional defender who understands defensive rotations. He has pretty quick feet for a 7 footer and has done well with pnr coverage. He's looked lost at times but a lot of that is from defensive breakdowns on the perimeter and he's definitely not an erasure guy and wasn't drafted to be one. With added strength he'll be fine

[Eoghan]

McRoberts way more athletic, better Passer, better dribbler, and competent defender. Kaminsky is just a much better shooter and taller. Kaminsky will play the Marv role more than the McRoberts role.

I agree David, I do think Kaminsky runs the floor and handles the ball better than some may realize though. But where Kaminsky is gonna help us, is off the pick and pops, it will have defenses confused, either help contain Kemba who will have the speed advantage, but that frees Frank, or you respect Frank and leave opposing defenders to singlehandedly trying to slow Kemba coming off a screen. With Al in the post, Batum on the wing backed up by Lamb, PJ, and Troy, and with MKG being able to hopefully hit some jumpers or beat his man to the rim, we will have a pretty solid offense. Frank will be a big part of that if he can make teams pay off the pop. Mcbob was the playmaking passer, Frank is a scoring weapon, that's how I would point out their differences...David.

I agree that Frank is a much better scorer which is why they differ greatly. Kaminsky is a shooter, McRoberts is a facilitator. I believe we'll have a much improved offense when I see it though. It starts with Kimball taking off his blinders and Al not freezing the ball.

[Mystical Apples]

Is there any chance Frank becomes a 20+ppg scorer?

Sure there's a "chance" but I seriously doubt it. If he turns into the floor spacer hoped/expected teams will alter their defense and rotate in different guys. At that point he would have already impacted the game immensely. Besides, his strength's as an offensive player I doubt would allow him to be a 20 pt scorer that requires heavier volume

[KembaWalker]

Kaminsky would have to be 2nd in the league to ast/to ratio to be as good as McRoberts at passing. yeah no

but he should be a better scorer.

If Ryan Anderson can put up an efficient 16-20 I don't see why Frank couldn't

[Soul Rebel]

Does anyone else see an unpolished Pau Gasol possibly? I know Gasol's defense was always suspect, but he was a match-up nightmare and would make defenders pay if you left him open. I'm trying to recall if Pau was physical in the paint or if I'm confusing with Marc. I thought the knock on Gasol was that he was a soft-euro.

[olive_triangurl]

^ Well I noticed Pau Gasol career averages 9.4rpg and 1.7bpg,
while Marc Gasol career averages 7.9rpg and 1.6bpg.
Marc is known for having way better defense though.
And 2014-15 Pau averaged 11.8rpg and 1.9bpg, but Bulls fans said he was a defensive liability.
BTW I'm currently playing NBA2k15 with this starting five-
C: Marc Gasol
PF: Pau Gasol
SF: Paul George
SG: Michael Jordan
PG: Kemba Walker (splits time with Mo Williams, Mo plays entire 2nd and 4th quarters)

[Mystical Apples]

Does anyone else see an unpolished Pau Gasol possibly? I know Gasol's defense was always suspect, but he was a match-up nightmare and would make defenders pay if you left him open. I'm trying to recall if Pau was physical in the paint or if I'm confusing with Marc. I thought the knock on Gasol was that he was a soft-euro.

I hate comps cause they are usually wrong but his skillset most closely resembles Chris Bosh, the Miami Stretch 4 version from the last couple years. Clearly Bosh is better and Kaminsky won't get there. But the relative strengths and perceived weaknesses are eerily similar. Even similar size, standing reach, confusion about ideal position. The shot / pump fake cadence is the same and both are ball movers and safety valves. Like Bosh, he won't be measured through a box score but how the team does. That will be his value

[MasterIchiro]

Does anyone else see an unpolished Pau Gasol possibly? I know Gasol's defense was always suspect, but he was a match-up nightmare and would make defenders pay if you left him open. I'm trying to recall if Pau was physical in the paint or if I'm confusing with Marc. I thought the knock on Gasol was that he was a soft-euro.

He moves like Pau Gasol, even gathers himself similarly before shooting, but seems to have more range. He doesn't have the post game of Gasol obviously. Frank needs to just keep working on his perimeter game while Cody focuses more on his post game. It's important to develop them both to their strengths. But yeah Pau Gasol popped into my brain when I watched Frank.

[catch20two]

Cody focuses more on his post game.

What post game? Lol

[yasuhara2241]

I get that a lot of us were unhappy including me with the Frank pick but what exactly makes his ceiling so low? His age? But I thought Biz was still getting better at the tender age of 22? Wait!! Frank is only 22 as well. Also can we get off these comparisons. Frank = White bust player or low potential player (Josh McRoberts). We gave a way Vonleh (Bosh) and could have had Justise (Wade). I mean we have no idea who any of these players will turn into.
What I do know thus far. Frank is an amazing shooter. Our problem has been shooting and we have a guy that can shoot. Yes he might not have the potential or athleticism but lets not forget that College Seniors used to come into this league and improve too so might Frank!