The Ace Bailey Thread

[JMAC3]

Ace Ranks (out of 68 tested)
Lane Agility Drill - 20th
Shuttle - 6th
3/4 Sprint - 12th

Tre Ranks
Lane Agility Drill - 1st
Shuttle - 56th
3/4 Sprint - 49th

VJ Ranks
Lane Agility Drill - 41st
Shuttle - 20th
3/4 Sprint - 28th

[Bassman]

Came across this video of a workout Giannis conducted with Harper and Ace Bailey last year. He’s quite the teacher. Bailey looks great to be so young. He needs more muscle as does everyone in the draft, but I’m really gaining even more favoring to him as our pick (if he drops to 4). I’d take him at 3 and believe the Sixers steal him from us. He’s a good fit for them and can learn a lot from PG.

https://youtu.be/tXbGfHBRx_8?si=DLhNY7jn3DCYF-EG

[Diop]

So I like him a lot as a prospect and would be thrilled to take him, but I feel like a situation like Philly would greatly increase his bust potential.

If they are sticking with Embiid, then Philly is in a must win situation + Philly already has like 3 or 4 established scorers so the ball won't be in Ace's hands much which he kinda needs for his game to stand out. And he is gonna need a lot of room to make mistakes while his game adjust to the NBA.

Speaking of, is anyone else surprised we aren't hearing a load of stories about Philly looking to move on from Embiid this offseason? They are in the perfect to do a soft reset, and Embiid at this point in his career won't bring them anywhere outside of the second round.

Bailey could play the catch n shoot role though couldn't he? could actually be a nice soft entrance for him, put energy on the boards and defense, take the open shots you get. thats all very doable for him.

[JustBuzzin]

Miller/Ace is a filthy young duo to have on the wing as scoring options.

Hopefully Philly takes VJ and it would be a no brainer pick for us with Bailey at #4.

[fatlever]

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[JMAC3]

I really don't care all that much for analytics in college basketball, because it doesn't matter how good the analytics look for Kon, Carter Bryant or Jase Richardson, they aren't going into Washington or Utah and then putting up positive analytic stats on two of the worst teams in the NBA.

I will use the Michael Porter Jr situation, he shot 72% at the rim and 40% from three this year playing with Jokic. Should the Hornets trade for him and expect those same numbers?

Or Wendell Carter? He was 97th% in Def EPM, would he transform our defense or is it because he is surrounded by Franz, Suggs, KCP, Issac, Black, Goga and Paolo.

[fatlever]

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[Diop]

so immature or not, it looks like he always put in some effort on defense.

im starting to feel better about this draft

[JustBuzzin]

His on ball defense is actually legit, he struggles with zones and knowing where to be in the zone. I noticed that a lot. Maybe he needs better coaching on how to play in the zone.

I want Fears, but he doesn't seem like a realistic option. If not Bailey is next on my list.

[Rich4114]

I've come around a little more on Ace, but I can't tell if the kid is a dawg or immature and dumb. I'd want to know that Ace has the ability to get to the rim, draw fouls and stand his ground on defense. The elite shot making is nice, especially when it's the late 4th quarter and you NEED someone who can go get you a bucket when it matters most. Is he Bouknight level of idiocy or is he coachable and willing to expand his game beyond just practicing and taking difficult (low IQ) shots?

[fatlever]

He's clearly a very polarizing prospect. And that was the buzz coming out of Chicago last week. Plow talked about it in the most recent podcast. A lot of teams were turned off by his immaturity and lack of professionalism in the interviews also his lack of self awareness when it came to discussing his strengths and areas of improvement. There were other teams that loved his brash confidence.

The example given was when a team asked him to list two of his strengths and one of his weaknesses. And his response was that he had no weaknesses and he has more than two strengths. I mean that's some eye roll level **** for a lot of people. He didn't mention his defense he only wanted to talk about his offense. And more specifically talking about how he likes to get to his spots for mid range jumpers.

So you do have to ask yourself are the Hornets the best place to nurture and develop this guy. How is he going to feel about potentially being the third option on offense most nights. Or coming off the bench for his rookie year. Or being asked to limit his midrange game. Or being asked to play more of a 3D role. What vets on this team are going to take him Under their wing and teach him the professionalism needed to really flourish.

He is the ultimate risk reward pick for me for this franchise. If he's there at 4 I can't blame anyone for taking him because the ceiling is mouthwatering. But I can't also help think that He never reaches anywhere close to his full potential if he doesn't have the willingness, self awareness and maturity to understand that he will need to change a lot of parts of his game to really be impactful.

i was a hiring manager for 15 years. I probably conducted over 100 interviews during that time almost always with people fresh out of college. Of course I would always ask the layup question of what's one of your biggest strengths that you can bring to an organization and what is one area of improvement, something that you know you need to work on. I honestly didn't give a **** what they said their weakness was as long as it was thoughtful and honest. That was never the point of the question. it was about self awareness and taking ownership. There was nothing worse than managing people who didn't think they made mistakes and never took ownership of their mistakes. That lack of self awareness, or that narcissism or arrogance in people almost always resulted in the type of employees who sucked up 95% of your time with their bs. I would sometimes phrase it in a different way like, tell me a time where you've made a mistake in your life and what did you learn from it. But the worst answer you can give to either one of those questions is to say that you don't have a weakness or to try to frame your weakness as a strength or to say that you can't really think of a time that you made a mistake. That was an immediate no for me in an interview. I realize we're talking about 19 year olds vs 23 years old... And the nba is a job that requires a level of arrogance and confidence that's not needed in an entry level office position... But it always does speak to someone's maturity and their ability to grow when they can recognize they are not perfect and to be able to self identify areas that need work. And also understand how and when and how to make sacrifices for the betterment of the team.

/rant

Bottom line is I get my teams are in love with ace and I get why teams would be not that excited to bring that personality into their locker room. anthony edwards Had a similar personality and he ended up going number one and it worked out well for him except for his off court **** but that's separate. So I'm not saying that it cannot workout for a player or an organization. And there is a certain appeal to having someone with a killer mentality also something I'm not sure this team has had in a long time. But you better be by far the best **** player on the team to act like that.

[Rich4114]

He's clearly a very polarizing prospect. And that was the buzz coming out of Chicago last week. Plow talked about it in the most recent podcast. A lot of teams were turned off by his immaturity and lack of professionalism in the interviews also his lack of self awareness when it came to discussing his strengths and areas of improvement. There were other teams that loved his brash confidence.

The example given was when a team asked him to list two of his strengths and one of his weaknesses. And his response was that he had no weaknesses and he has more than two strengths. I mean that's some eye roll level **** for a lot of people. He didn't mention his defense he only wanted to talk about his offense. And more specifically talking about how he likes to get to his spots for mid range jumpers.

So you do have to ask yourself are the Hornets the best place to nurture and develop this guy. How is he going to feel about potentially being the third option on offense most nights. Or coming off the bench for his rookie year. Or being asked to limit his midrange game. Or being asked to play more of a 3D role. What vets on this team are going to take him Under their wing and teach him the professionalism needed to really flourish.

He is the ultimate risk reward pick for me for this franchise. If he's there at 4 I can't blame anyone for taking him because the ceiling is mouthwatering. But I can't also help think that He never reaches anywhere close to his full potential if he doesn't have the willingness, self awareness and maturity to understand that he will need to change a lot of parts of his game to really be impactful.

i was a hiring manager for 15 years. I probably conducted over 100 interviews during that time almost always with people fresh out of college. Of course I would always ask the layup question of what's one of your biggest strengths that you can bring to an organization and what is one area of improvement, something that you know you need to work on. I honestly didn't give a **** what they said their weakness was as long as it was thoughtful and honest. That was never the point of the question. it was about self awareness and taking ownership. There was nothing worse than managing people who didn't think they made mistakes and never took ownership of their mistakes. That lack of self awareness, or that narcissism or arrogance in people almost always resulted in the type of employees who sucked up 95% of your time with their bs. I would sometimes phrase it in a different way like, tell me a time where you've made a mistake in your life and what did you learn from it. But the worst answer you can give to either one of those questions is to say that you don't have a weakness or to try to frame your weakness as a strength or to say that you can't really think of a time that you made a mistake. That was an immediate no for me in an interview. I realize we're talking about 19 year olds vs 23 years old... And the nba is a job that requires a level of arrogance and confidence that's not needed in an entry level office position... But it always does speak to someone's maturity and their ability to grow when they can recognize they are not perfect and to be able to self identify areas that need work. And also understand how and when and how to make sacrifices for the betterment of the team.

/rant

Bottom line is I get my teams are in love with ace and I get why teams would be not that excited to bring that personality into their locker room. anthony edwards Had a similar personality and he ended up going number one and it worked out well for him except for his off court **** but that's separate. So I'm not saying that it cannot workout for a player or an organization. And there is a certain appeal to having someone with a killer mentality also something I'm not sure this team has had in a long time. But you better be by far the best **** player on the team to act like that.

Applying this to the corporate / business world like I want to naturally do myself would mean I'd never consider someone like Ace because of an answer like that. It really does mean less coming from an athlete in this position though. And in fact like it was suggested, some teams WANT that type of arrogance / confidence but the expectation is that you better be backing it up with play on the court.

So really, I cannot tell if him answering in a "not so humble" way is a good thing because this team NEEDS some dawgs or is it a red flag. And I agree, is this the right organization and environment to harness that arrogance and develop him into a star/productive player. I'd feel way better about that on VJ over Ace right now, even though VJ doesn't have the shot making skill of Ace.

[fatlever]

Right, I certainly agree that it's apples to oranges applying corporate job interviews versus elite NBA draft pick interviews. I 100% get that.

But there's still that level of professionalism and self awareness that a lot of front offices certainly want to see from candidates, and there's certainly other front offices that don't give a flying **** as long as you can put the ball in the basket. And thats what makes him a very polarizing prospect. And I honestly don't know which type of front office we are at this moment in time. I would have said under the old regime that they would lean towards the old School of I don't give a **** as long as you can but the ball in the basket. Mitch was never afraid to draft immature players as we saw it multiple times. I'm not sure that applies to this whole Hornets dna mantra that we have now. I guess we will find out. And sometimes the talent outweighs the mantra and you just have to take the best player regardless.

[SWedd523]

Ace has settled in as my #3 behind Flagg and Harper.

I think he's Philly's pick if they keep it so things open up a bit between VJ or Tre

[Chapelchilla]

The Hornets have to had one of the dumber player groups in the league from 2018 or so onward. I think we need talented dudes that are ALSO leaders/hard workers/have high BBIQ. It seems like Ace may not be that.

[JMAC3]

Anthony Edwards said a lot of the same type of things at the combine when he was drafted. Edwards also had the same issues in college with settling for low percentage shot attempts, was on a bad team that finished around .500 just like Rutgers. Edwards still has this confidence in the NBA now and is one of the better players in the league.

On the flip side, we experienced the humble, say all the right things with MKG where he lacked confidence in himself.

I would rather have the overconfident guy, especially if he has the natural ability to back it up.

[KingCat]

Anthony Edwards said a lot of the same type of things at the combine when he was drafted. Edwards also had the same issues in college with settling for low percentage shot attempts, was on a bad team that finished around .500 just like Rutgers. Edwards still has this confidence in the NBA now and is one of the better players in the league.

On the flip side, we experienced the humble, say all the right things with MKG where he lacked confidence in himself.

I would rather have the overconfident guy, especially if he has the natural ability to back it up.

Yeah really world intellect =/= bball IQ.

Mo Bamba was touted as a genius, but looks as lost as Tijuane on the court.

Meanwhile guys like Kyrie and Rondo come off as jackasses off the court but are absolute savants on the court

I never put too much stock in interviews unless dudes are putting out some really flagrant stuff.

[JustBuzzin]

I've come around a little more on Ace, but I can't tell if the kid is a dawg or immature and dumb. I'd want to know that Ace has the ability to get to the rim, draw fouls and stand his ground on defense. The elite shot making is nice, especially when it's the late 4th quarter and you NEED someone who can go get you a bucket when it matters most. Is he Bouknight level of idiocy or is he coachable and willing to expand his game beyond just practicing and taking difficult (low IQ) shots?

What on earth makes you think he's immature and dumb?

If you don't like his game just say that, but to say he's immature and dumb is just flat out wrong unless you provide proof.

[fatlever]

I've come around a little more on Ace, but I can't tell if the kid is a dawg or immature and dumb. I'd want to know that Ace has the ability to get to the rim, draw fouls and stand his ground on defense. The elite shot making is nice, especially when it's the late 4th quarter and you NEED someone who can go get you a bucket when it matters most. Is he Bouknight level of idiocy or is he coachable and willing to expand his game beyond just practicing and taking difficult (low IQ) shots?

What on earth makes you think he's immature and dumb?

If you don't like his game just say that, but to say he's immature and dumb is just flat out wrong unless you provide proof.

We literally just gave specific examples of his behavior during the Chicago combine where multiple teams made comments about him being immature in his interviews.

[JustBuzzin]

I've come around a little more on Ace, but I can't tell if the kid is a dawg or immature and dumb. I'd want to know that Ace has the ability to get to the rim, draw fouls and stand his ground on defense. The elite shot making is nice, especially when it's the late 4th quarter and you NEED someone who can go get you a bucket when it matters most. Is he Bouknight level of idiocy or is he coachable and willing to expand his game beyond just practicing and taking difficult (low IQ) shots?

What on earth makes you think he's immature and dumb?

If you don't like his game just say that, but to say he's immature and dumb is just flat out wrong unless you provide proof.

We literally just gave specific examples of his behavior during the Chicago combine where multiple teams made comments about him being immature in his interviews.

So having a bad interview makes you dumb and immature?

Do you realize some people are just not comfortable doing interviews. Maybe he has a joking/unserious personality.

To call him flat out dumb is disrespectful. You don't make it to this level being dumb and immature.