Fake Trade Thread #5

[GoBobs]

Rozier having a down year last year in terms of efficiency has to be looked at in the context of the whole team having a down year in that area. We were in the first year of a new coach. We stopped going small which was where we generated our best offense in the past.

You can pretty much count on him for 20 pts 4 reb 4 ast based on the last 3 years. That is good enough to be in the rotation on any team in the league. I am fine with him being the 6th man, but somebody has to step up and prove they deserve the starting spot more than he does. So far that hasn't happened.

[Rich4114]

I don't know how you could really make a strong case for Terry being a good fit next to LaMelo. Terry does one thing well and that's streaky scoring. He takes a lot of difficult shots and was clutch for one season out of his career. If he was a solid defender and not a liability, it would be different. But instead he's an undersized 2 who can't give you efficient minutes at the 1, cannot defend and is a streaky shooter/scorer. Meaning if the streak is pointed downward, he's a net negative, which is like 50% of the time. Again, I'll say this until I'm blue in the face -- Terry's ideal role is a scorer off the bench. He's a capable starter, obviously but you maximize his skillsets and raise his efficiency by using him in the right role in a capped capacity (unless he's hot then you play him more).

But again, the organization views him in a much higher regard than everyone else in the world so I'd be shocked if they grew a pair and put him in that role and I'd also be shocked if he accepted it with a smile on his face. So when that situation exists, the best move is usually a trade. A typical 3&D wing next to LaMelo would be the best fit. In fact, I would not be opposed to just starting Cody next to him assuming his knee isn't dust.

[SWedd523]

Terry is fine off the bench, and I'm okay with retaining him in the Kelly role. I just don't see a way forward with him has a big minutes starter

[JMAC3]

Love how this thread just stares at Terry in a vacuum, ignores the context of replacing him and that there are 10-15 other players just like him playing 30+ mins per game in the NBA.

Some of the themes of this board are really outdated and not realistic in today's NBA.
1. Don't pay anyone unless it is viewed as a win the moment the contract is signed.
- We expect every deal to favor the team heavily and act like if a player is overpaid by 5 million it is the end all be all.
2. We also focus way too much on starters.
-Whether a guy starts or not is way too much of a discussion. Who cares if PJ comes off the bench and makes more then 15 million. In my opinion you want the best guys possible playing mins and if he costs more than some starters who cares. Most teams can afford 1 or 2 guys like that.
3. Focus way too much on guys weak areas.
-80% of NBA players have at least one massive flaw, it doesn't make them worthless.
4. We look way too much at the salary cap as if it is a hard cap.
2/3 of NBA ignore salary cap altogether and live 20+ over it. They focus on Lux Tax. Trying to live within 5 million of the actual salary cap is such a playing with one hand tied behind your back strategy. We are never ever going to be successful with that mentality.
5. We are looking big picture way too much.
- Who cares if in 2 years Terry isn't a starter. He is our best option right now. We can cross that bridge once we get there.

[Rich4114]

Love how this thread just stares at Terry in a vacuum, ignores the context of replacing him and that there are 10-15 other players just like him playing 30+ mins per game in the NBA.

Some of the themes of this board are really outdated and not realistic in today's NBA.
1. Don't pay anyone unless it is viewed as a win the moment the contract is signed.
- We expect every deal to favor the team heavily and act like if a player is overpaid by 5 million it is the end all be all.
2. We also focus way too much on starters.
-Whether a guy starts or not is way too much of a discussion. Who cares if PJ comes off the bench and makes more then 15 million. In my opinion you want the best guys possible playing mins and if he costs more than some starters who cares. Most teams can afford 1 or 2 guys like that.
3. Focus way too much on guys weak areas.
-80% of NBA players have at least one massive flaw, it doesn't make them worthless.
4. We look way too much at the salary cap as if it is a hard cap.
2/3 of NBA ignore salary cap altogether and live 20+ over it. They focus on Lux Tax. Trying to live within 5 million of the actual salary cap is such a playing with one hand tied behind your back strategy. We are never ever going to be successful with that mentality.
5. We are looking big picture way too much.
- Who cares if in 2 years Terry isn't a starter. He is our best option right now. We can cross that bridge once we get there.

While this aligns to some of the posts about Terry, I think the main point that should be focused on is his chemistry and fit. It has nothing to do with how much he's paid and has everything to do with how much he plays and in what combination of other players. You're looking at similar SG's in a vacuum and not considering their style of play or where their strengths are and how it balances with the rest of their teams primary rotations. If we had Alex Caruso as our PG1, then Terry instantly becomes more valuable and important, for example.

[SWedd523]

(2015 Offseason)
-Extends MKG for 4 years/52mil
-Extends Jeremy Lamb for 3years/21mil

(2016 Offseason)
-Signs Nicolas Batum to a 5 year/120mil contract
-Signs Marvin Williams to a 4 year/54.5mil contract
-Signs Ramon Sessions to a 2 year/12.27mil contract
-Signs Roy Hibbert to a 1 year/5mil contract

(November 2016)
-Extends Cody Zeller for 4 years/56mil

They devoted roughly half a decade (and Kemba's prime) to a core of Batum, MKG, Marvin Williams, and Cody Zeller. I'm so glad they weren't cheap and signed their role players.


*The 2016-17 team had the 10th highest payroll in the league, finished 11th in the East with a 36-46 record, and devoted 62% of the $94mil salary cap to Batum, MKG, Miles Plumlee, and Marvin Williams. It's just money, gotta pay somebody.


*The 2017-18 team had the 12th highest payroll in the league, finished 10th in the East with a 36-46 record, and devoted 85% of the $99mil salary cap to Dwight Howard, Batum, Marv, and MKG. Those long term contracts are really looking good now that the cap is growing.


*The 2018-19 team had the 16th highest payroll in the league, finished 9th in the East with a 39-43 record, and devoted 80% of the $102mil salary cap to Batum, Biyombo, Marv, Zeller, and MKG. year three of capping out the team with long term contracts to role players... but hey they're almost .500, right?


*The 2019-2020 offseason brought the realization that they had to blow it up. Kemba would be turning 29 that year and would soon be on the decline. The team had zero flexibility because they had given too much money to non-needle-moving role players (because you gotta pay somebody), and had absolutely nothing to show for it.

Kemba was traded, Marv was waived after not finding a trade suitor, MKG was waived after not finding a trade suitor, Batum would be waived and stretched (so they could replace him with another bloated, long term contract to Hayward). Zeller was kept because they couldn't find a trade. The team bottomed out. Still finished 9th in the East (lol) with a 23-42 record.


LaMelo ball would then be selected #3 overall in the 2020 Draft


Now here we are again, having finally (kinda) come out from almost a decade of excessive money to role-players, and some folks are lamenting the thought of not repeating that mistake.

[JMAC3]

(2015 Offseason)
-Extends MKG for 4 years/52mil
-Extends Jeremy Lamb for 3years/21mil

(2016 Offseason)
-Signs Nicolas Batum to a 5 year/120mil contract
-Signs Marvin Williams to a 4 year/54.5mil contract
-Signs Ramon Sessions to a 2 year/12.27mil contract
-Signs Roy Hibbert to a 1 year/5mil contract

(November 2016)
-Extends Cody Zeller for 4 years/56mil

They devoted roughly half a decade (and Kemba's prime) to a core of Batum, MKG, Marvin Williams, and Cody Zeller. I'm so glad they weren't cheap and signed their role players.


*The 2016-17 team had the 10th highest payroll in the league, finished 11th in the East with a 36-46 record, and devoted 62% of the $94mil salary cap to Batum, MKG, Miles Plumlee, and Marvin Williams. It's just money, gotta pay somebody.


*The 2017-18 team had the 12th highest payroll in the league, finished 10th in the East with a 36-46 record, and devoted 85% of the $99mil salary cap to Dwight Howard, Batum, Marv, and MKG. Those long term contracts are really looking good now that the cap is growing.


*The 2018-19 team had the 16th highest payroll in the league, finished 9th in the East with a 39-43 record, and devoted 80% of the $102mil salary cap to Batum, Biyombo, Marv, Zeller, and MKG. year three of capping out the team with long term contracts to role players... but hey they're almost .500, right?


*The 2019-2020 offseason brought the realization that they had to blow it up. Kemba would be turning 29 that year and would soon be on the decline. The team had zero flexibility because they had given too much money to non-needle-moving role players (because you gotta pay somebody), and had absolutely nothing to show for it.

Kemba was traded, Marv was waived after not finding a trade suitor, MKG was waived after not finding a trade suitor, Batum would be waived and stretched (so they could replace him with another bloated, long term contract to Hayward). Zeller was kept because they couldn't find a trade. The team bottomed out. Still finished 9th in the East (lol) with a 23-42 record.


LaMelo ball would then be selected #3 overall in the 2020 Draft


Now here we are again, having finally (kinda) come out from almost a decade of excessive money to role-players, and some folks are lamenting the thought of not repeating that mistake.

I understand, but the issue was not that we paid these guys. It was the fact that they were our best players and they simply weren't very good. Even if they had paid everyone on this list 3 million less per year or whatever you think they were worth we would not have had a massively different team. Unless you think by not signing these players altogether that Star players would have flocked to Charlotte because we had cap space, seems pretty unrealistic to me.

At the end of the day we could have chosen to trade these contracts for other players. That would have been the more realistic route to putting talent around Kemba. Never signing them at all would have done very little IMO.

Fast foward to now... same thing now with PJ. Not signing PJ isn't creating some massive cap space that we are landing a star in. More realistically what it does is it keeps our payroll limited to the salary cap and gives us a few more million to chase bench level players.

We need to be keeping/adding talent. Not giving it away and operating as one of the lowest payrolls in the NBA.

[amcoolio]

Love how this thread just stares at Terry in a vacuum, ignores the context of replacing him and that there are 10-15 other players just like him playing 30+ mins per game in the NBA.

Some of the themes of this board are really outdated and not realistic in today's NBA.
1. Don't pay anyone unless it is viewed as a win the moment the contract is signed.
- We expect every deal to favor the team heavily and act like if a player is overpaid by 5 million it is the end all be all.
2. We also focus way too much on starters.
-Whether a guy starts or not is way too much of a discussion. Who cares if PJ comes off the bench and makes more then 15 million. In my opinion you want the best guys possible playing mins and if he costs more than some starters who cares. Most teams can afford 1 or 2 guys like that.
3. Focus way too much on guys weak areas.
-80% of NBA players have at least one massive flaw, it doesn't make them worthless.
4. We look way too much at the salary cap as if it is a hard cap.
2/3 of NBA ignore salary cap altogether and live 20+ over it. They focus on Lux Tax. Trying to live within 5 million of the actual salary cap is such a playing with one hand tied behind your back strategy. We are never ever going to be successful with that mentality.
5. We are looking big picture way too much.
- Who cares if in 2 years Terry isn't a starter. He is our best option right now. We can cross that bridge once we get there.

All of what you are saying could be valid and reasonable points if it weren't for the fact the Hornets are the worst, most losing team in the NBA this century and just finished 27-55, with signs everywhere that the other franchises/front offices think we are a joke

This team needs big, sweeping changes. You don't just suck for 18 years and feel content as a fan to continue with mediocre players on a bad team and try to ignore their flaws.

[JMAC3]

Love how this thread just stares at Terry in a vacuum, ignores the context of replacing him and that there are 10-15 other players just like him playing 30+ mins per game in the NBA.

Some of the themes of this board are really outdated and not realistic in today's NBA.
1. Don't pay anyone unless it is viewed as a win the moment the contract is signed.
- We expect every deal to favor the team heavily and act like if a player is overpaid by 5 million it is the end all be all.
2. We also focus way too much on starters.
-Whether a guy starts or not is way too much of a discussion. Who cares if PJ comes off the bench and makes more then 15 million. In my opinion you want the best guys possible playing mins and if he costs more than some starters who cares. Most teams can afford 1 or 2 guys like that.
3. Focus way too much on guys weak areas.
-80% of NBA players have at least one massive flaw, it doesn't make them worthless.
4. We look way too much at the salary cap as if it is a hard cap.
2/3 of NBA ignore salary cap altogether and live 20+ over it. They focus on Lux Tax. Trying to live within 5 million of the actual salary cap is such a playing with one hand tied behind your back strategy. We are never ever going to be successful with that mentality.
5. We are looking big picture way too much.
- Who cares if in 2 years Terry isn't a starter. He is our best option right now. We can cross that bridge once we get there.

All of what you are saying could be valid and reasonable points if it weren't for the fact the Hornets are the worst, most losing team in the NBA this century and just finished 27-55, with signs everywhere that the other franchises/front offices think we are a joke

This team needs big, sweeping changes. You don't just suck for 18 years and feel content as a fan to continue with mediocre players on a bad team and try to ignore their flaws.

Part of the reason we are who we are is because the Hornets don't spend money to be competitive.
I am not saying we have to be the highest payroll in the league, but there are teams who are willing to overpay a guy that is an 84 overall level talent. Meanwhile Hornets are celebrating underpaying a 77 overall talent. At the end of the day it is good for our owners, but the other team has the better player. Especially if we don't use the cap space/lux space we saved from signing a winning contract.

You can have a team of good contracts but if your payroll is 50 million less than another team they probably still are more talented 80% of the time.

It is the same with PJ. If he signs for 15 million instead of 20 million, do you honestly think in the next 3 years that cap space will be pivotal to us signing a major difference maker? or if we don't sign him at all we are going to go into FA and sign an All NBA talent?

[Rich4114]

Love how this thread just stares at Terry in a vacuum, ignores the context of replacing him and that there are 10-15 other players just like him playing 30+ mins per game in the NBA.

Some of the themes of this board are really outdated and not realistic in today's NBA.
1. Don't pay anyone unless it is viewed as a win the moment the contract is signed.
- We expect every deal to favor the team heavily and act like if a player is overpaid by 5 million it is the end all be all.
2. We also focus way too much on starters.
-Whether a guy starts or not is way too much of a discussion. Who cares if PJ comes off the bench and makes more then 15 million. In my opinion you want the best guys possible playing mins and if he costs more than some starters who cares. Most teams can afford 1 or 2 guys like that.
3. Focus way too much on guys weak areas.
-80% of NBA players have at least one massive flaw, it doesn't make them worthless.
4. We look way too much at the salary cap as if it is a hard cap.
2/3 of NBA ignore salary cap altogether and live 20+ over it. They focus on Lux Tax. Trying to live within 5 million of the actual salary cap is such a playing with one hand tied behind your back strategy. We are never ever going to be successful with that mentality.
5. We are looking big picture way too much.
- Who cares if in 2 years Terry isn't a starter. He is our best option right now. We can cross that bridge once we get there.

All of what you are saying could be valid and reasonable points if it weren't for the fact the Hornets are the worst, most losing team in the NBA this century and just finished 27-55, with signs everywhere that the other franchises/front offices think we are a joke

This team needs big, sweeping changes. You don't just suck for 18 years and feel content as a fan to continue with mediocre players on a bad team and try to ignore their flaws.

Part of the reason we are who we are is because the Hornets don't spend money to be competitive.
I am not saying we have to be the highest payroll in the league, but there are teams who are willing to overpay a guy that is an 84 overall level talent. Meanwhile Hornets are celebrating underpaying a 77 overall talent. At the end of the day it is good for our owners, but the other team has the better player. Especially if we don't use the cap space/lux space we saved from signing a winning contract.

You can have a team of good contracts but if your payroll is 50 million less than another team they probably still are more talented 80% of the time.

It is the same with PJ. If he signs for 15 million instead of 20 million, do you honestly think in the next 3 years that cap space will be pivotal to us signing a major difference maker? or if we don't sign him at all we are going to go into FA and sign an All NBA talent?

It's about production:cost ratio and the 15-19 teams were criminally out of balance on that ratio in an unfavorable way. It crippled us from making trades or signing better free agents because we were locked into a cluster of bad contracts nobody else wanted without draft incentive. That is what everyone here is trying to explain basically. I think PJ would have value around the league if he never got any better but was making < $20m/yr because he's versatile. I don't get the impression Terry has much value around the league at $23m/per considering outside of scoring 20ppg on high volume, he offers nothing else when the shots aren't falling. I think Hayward has more value than this board gives him credit for, because he brings multiple qualities to the table and his contact is expiring anyway. It's not black and white. It would be difficult to mess up again like they did in 15-19. Cho gambled by paying these guys what were modest deals at the time early with the hope/expectation those guys would develop and get better with the exception being Kemba. You just can't be carrying too many big contracts with that risk and that is probably why they aren't signing PJ to what he wants. You can't have Terry + PJ + Cody on the books with big contracts because there's a decent chance they'd all become nearly untradable. I'm happy it looks like they understand that, but now we're sacrificing a more impactful two way player in PJ because we have a huge ? in Cody and a one trick pony in Terry making sizable money.

[JMAC3]

It's about production:cost ratio and the 15-19 teams were criminally out of balance on that ratio in an unfavorable way. It crippled us from making trades or signing better free agents because we were locked into a cluster of bad contracts nobody else wanted without draft incentive. That is what everyone here is trying to explain basically. I think PJ would have value around the league if he never got any better but was making < $20m/yr because he's versatile. I don't get the impression Terry has much value around the league at $23m/per considering outside of scoring 20ppg on high volume, he offers nothing else when the shots aren't falling. I think Hayward has more value than this board gives him credit for, because he brings multiple qualities to the table and his contact is expiring anyway. It's not black and white. It would be difficult to mess up again like they did in 15-19. Cho gambled by paying these guys what were modest deals at the time early with the hope/expectation those guys would develop and get better with the exception being Kemba. You just can't be carrying too many big contracts with that risk and that is probably why they aren't signing PJ to what he wants. You can't have Terry + PJ + Cody on the books with big contracts because there's a decent chance they'd all become nearly untradable. I'm happy it looks like they understand that, but now we're sacrificing a more impactful two way player in PJ because we have a huge ? in Cody and a one trick pony in Terry making sizable money.

What do you consider a big contract lol.
Cody makes 7.5 million per year. You lost me there man.
Even Rozier at 23 million I would not consider a big contract. That is basically the average salary in the NBA these days. There are guys making 2x3 times that.

Again, our brains are broken. We are stuck looking at contracts like it is 5 years ago. 23 million isn't even a lot if you look at the salary cap. Even less if we were operating as a real NBA team and using the 165 lux tax as the barometer instead of the 136 million cap.

We entered the offseason with 30+ million in cap space. For no reason lol. We could have made all the same moves we have made if we entered the offseason 5 million over the cap.

[Rich4114]

It's about production:cost ratio and the 15-19 teams were criminally out of balance on that ratio in an unfavorable way. It crippled us from making trades or signing better free agents because we were locked into a cluster of bad contracts nobody else wanted without draft incentive. That is what everyone here is trying to explain basically. I think PJ would have value around the league if he never got any better but was making < $20m/yr because he's versatile. I don't get the impression Terry has much value around the league at $23m/per considering outside of scoring 20ppg on high volume, he offers nothing else when the shots aren't falling. I think Hayward has more value than this board gives him credit for, because he brings multiple qualities to the table and his contact is expiring anyway. It's not black and white. It would be difficult to mess up again like they did in 15-19. Cho gambled by paying these guys what were modest deals at the time early with the hope/expectation those guys would develop and get better with the exception being Kemba. You just can't be carrying too many big contracts with that risk and that is probably why they aren't signing PJ to what he wants. You can't have Terry + PJ + Cody on the books with big contracts because there's a decent chance they'd all become nearly untradable. I'm happy it looks like they understand that, but now we're sacrificing a more impactful two way player in PJ because we have a huge ? in Cody and a one trick pony in Terry making sizable money.

What do you consider a big contract lol.
Cody makes 7.5 million per year. You lost me there man.
Even Rozier at 23 million I would not consider a big contract. That is basically the average salary in the NBA these days. There are guys making 2x3 times that.

Again, our brains are broken. We are stuck looking at contracts like it is 5 years ago. 23 million isn't even a lot if you look at the salary cap. Even less if we were operating as a real NBA team and using the 165 lux tax as the barometer instead of the 136 million cap.

We entered the offseason with 30+ million in cap space. For no reason lol. We could have made all the same moves we have made if we entered the offseason 5 million over the cap.

To further simplify, is the contract tradable or not. Meaning is it something another team would take based on the performance/availability. I don't put Cody there yet, but $7.5m for an unavailable player would make it difficult to trade for a value return. Terry is difficult to trade because he's a one dimensional high volume shot taker who makes $23m.

[JMAC3]

I don't think Terry is all that difficult to trade. 23 million for a guy that can play either guard spot, a good volume 3 pt shooter and has already had big moments in the playoffs. The real question is are Hornets getting any offers that make sense. He is better than most of the board is giving credit right now, which is fair because we live in a what have you done lately society and he is coming off a bad year.

I have yet to see anyone actually put together real trades that net us a real upgrade at SG. Like of course I would take Bane over him, but are we willing to pay that price tag? Who would be a realistic target and what would you give up to get them? Are you giving up 2 future firsts for the right guy (Bane would cost more btw)? or would we rather just complain about Terry like having him off the roster somehow automatically makes us better because there is just no way that is true.

Probably will just get a bunch of hindsight complaining about Bouknight, Kai picks etc. Nobody has any real potential solutions they believe in moving forward which is the funny part.

[luciano-davidwesley]

I don't think Terry is all that difficult to trade. 23 million for a guy that can play either guard spot, a good volume 3 pt shooter and has already had big moments in the playoffs. The real question is are Hornets getting any offers that make sense. He is better than most of the board is giving credit right now, which is fair because we live in a what have you done lately society and he is coming off a bad year.

I have yet to see anyone actually put together real trades that net us a real upgrade at SG. Like of course I would take Bane over him, but are we willing to pay that price tag? Who would be a realistic target and what would you give up to get them? Are you giving up 2 future firsts for the right guy (Bane would cost more btw)? or would we rather just complain about Terry like having him off the roster somehow automatically makes us better because there is just no way that is true.

Probably will just get a bunch of hindsight complaining about Bouknight, Kai picks etc. Nobody has any real potential solutions they believe in moving forward which is the funny part.

Terry can not play both guard spots (unless you want to suck) and I didn't like the Bouknight or Jones picks at the time (not in hindsight).



I think the deal to get the first off New York was decent value when you consider the protections we put on it, however we made an obviously-dumb-at-the-time selection in Kai "Bambi on ice" Jones with the pick.

Then Mitch Cuckchak got absolutely cucked by Detroit in the next draft for the 13th pick, destroying any credibility he earned from the previous year's pick trade with New York.

[JMAC3]

I don't think Terry is all that difficult to trade. 23 million for a guy that can play either guard spot, a good volume 3 pt shooter and has already had big moments in the playoffs. The real question is are Hornets getting any offers that make sense. He is better than most of the board is giving credit right now, which is fair because we live in a what have you done lately society and he is coming off a bad year.

I have yet to see anyone actually put together real trades that net us a real upgrade at SG. Like of course I would take Bane over him, but are we willing to pay that price tag? Who would be a realistic target and what would you give up to get them? Are you giving up 2 future firsts for the right guy (Bane would cost more btw)? or would we rather just complain about Terry like having him off the roster somehow automatically makes us better because there is just no way that is true.

Probably will just get a bunch of hindsight complaining about Bouknight, Kai picks etc. Nobody has any real potential solutions they believe in moving forward which is the funny part.

Terry can not play both guard spots (unless you want to suck) and I didn't like the Bouknight or Jones picks at the time (not in hindsight).



I think the deal to get the first off New York was decent value when you consider the protections we put on it, however we made an obviously-dumb-at-the-time selection in Kai "Bambi on ice" Jones with the pick.

Then Mitch Cuckchak got absolutely cucked by Detroit in the next draft for the 13th pick, destroying any credibility he earned from the previous year's pick trade with New York.

Crushed it here with the solutions. No complaining about the past. lol

[luciano-davidwesley]

I don't think Terry is all that difficult to trade. 23 million for a guy that can play either guard spot, a good volume 3 pt shooter and has already had big moments in the playoffs. The real question is are Hornets getting any offers that make sense. He is better than most of the board is giving credit right now, which is fair because we live in a what have you done lately society and he is coming off a bad year.

I have yet to see anyone actually put together real trades that net us a real upgrade at SG. Like of course I would take Bane over him, but are we willing to pay that price tag? Who would be a realistic target and what would you give up to get them? Are you giving up 2 future firsts for the right guy (Bane would cost more btw)? or would we rather just complain about Terry like having him off the roster somehow automatically makes us better because there is just no way that is true.

Probably will just get a bunch of hindsight complaining about Bouknight, Kai picks etc. Nobody has any real potential solutions they believe in moving forward which is the funny part.

Terry can not play both guard spots (unless you want to suck) and I didn't like the Bouknight or Jones picks at the time (not in hindsight).



I think the deal to get the first off New York was decent value when you consider the protections we put on it, however we made an obviously-dumb-at-the-time selection in Kai "Bambi on ice" Jones with the pick.

Then Mitch Cuckchak got absolutely cucked by Detroit in the next draft for the 13th pick, destroying any credibility he earned from the previous year's pick trade with New York.

Crushed it here with the solutions. No complaining about the past. lol

The solutions are continue the course (we aren't contenders yet) by developing players through the draft and adding value contracts rather than overpays, regardless of our cap sheet.

As value contracts can be traded as positive assets or draft equity.

I don't get how adding on bad contracts over and over again helps you contend, regardless of whether you operate over or under the cap

[SWedd523]

I don't get how adding on bad contracts over and over again helps you contend, regardless of whether you operate over or under the cap

It doesn't. The total team salary is irrelevant. No smart team just gives money just because they have it.

[JMAC3]

I don't get how adding on bad contracts over and over again helps you contend, regardless of whether you operate over or under the cap

It doesn't. The total team salary is irrelevant. No smart team just gives money just because they have it.

Yeah, just so happens that the bottom 10 teams in salary will be lucky to get 2 teams in the playoffs. Meanwhile the top 10 teams in salary for this season will likely get 8+ teams. But sure total team salary gives you no advantage or disadvantage lol.

We could be the #1 seed, we just need to have 12 undermarket salaries and all our wishes will come true.

And yes the smart teams do just give out money to give it out. See Lakers paying DLo, Rui.
See Clippers in the next 6 months when they give up a bunch of nothing in contracts for a major contributor.
Same with the Knicks.

All three teams have built salary cap to 165 million plus and will be able to trade for a Max player without giving up their highly paid stars. Teams are playing chess with the salary cap, roster building..... meanwhile Hornets are over here trying to have 15 million in cap space only to have FA choose to take 12 million on MLE from competitive teams.

[SWedd523]

"What's an extra $3mil annually for this guy, another $5mil annually here for this guy? This guy is only slightly overpaid. That guy is only slightly overpaid. We can't let talent (bottom 5 starter in the league at his position) walk for nothing."

leads to

We have to waive Batum and cut all these other guys because we're capped out and nobody wants our trash.

[JMAC3]

If we paid Dlo 17 million and Rui 15 million this board would be losing their mind talking about overpay overpay. Those guys aren't worth it etc etc etc.... "We are better off to preserve cap space for the future.. yada yada" We would of kept our payroll at 130 instead of 165 million

Now watch a smart team, the Lakers flip them for someone like Demarr, Lavine or Jerami Grant at the deadline.

Basically, without signing DLo or Rui those possibilities aren't there. If you switch Lakers mindset and give them Hornets roster they are signing PJ and Oubre without thinking twice.