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Fun with Stats!!!

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Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#1 » by fatlever » Fri Nov 29, 2013 12:49 am

hey gang,

with all the new fancy stats at our fingertips i thought it would be fun to have a dedicated thread to post interesting, strange, telling, funny stats that you dig up along your daily surfing and research. also a place to compile great websites that are useful for stats or tiny urls you make on bball-ref etc...


links to great stat pages
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#2 » by JDR720 » Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:09 am

MKG is 2-2 on dunks in the 2nd quarter on the road and one of those dunks was when we were down by 15+
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#3 » by fatlever » Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:16 am

i'll kick things off...

today and am looking at stats.nba.com - bobcats page, sorting by 2-man lineups, filter of greater than 100 minutes played together. lets see what we can find.

jefferson/mcbob have the highest offensive rating with 104pts per 100 possessions. the next four are:
taylor/mcbob
henderson/jefferson
jefferson/walker
mcroberts/walkter

the worst 5 ortg duos
biyombo/taylor - 80pts per 100 possessions
biyombo/mcroberts
biyombo/mkg
biyombo/henders
adrien/sessions

^thats not flattering for biz

best 5 defensive rating
jefferson/mkg 88pts allowed per 100 possessions
henderson/mkg
mkg/walker
mkg/mcroberts
jefferson/walker

^pretty damn impressive for mkg

worst 5 defensive rating
mcroberts/taylor 112drtg
biyombo/taylor
henderson/taylor
mkg/taylor - strange that mkg in featured in the best 4 drtgs and taylor in the worst 4 and taylor is so bad defensively he brings mkg into the bottom 5 when paired together. also strange because this duo last year had a fantastic drtg when paired together
sessions/tolliver

best 5 net rating
jefferson/mcroberts
henderson/jefferson
jefferson/walker
jefferson/mkg
adrien/walker

worst 5 net rating
biyombo/taylor at a whopping -29.4, which is miles worse than anyone else
mkg/taylor
biyombo/henderson
henderson/taylor
mkg/zeller

(6th was taylor/zeller - i was shocked they werent the worst. its the reason i started this search. i wanted to see just how bad those two have been when on the floor together. shame because they were both fantastic this summer)

conclusions - jefferson and mcbob make our offense the best, MKG makes our defense the best. biz makes us suck on offense and taylor makes us suck on defense and god help us when they are paired together.


what about pace?

we play our fastest pace when kemba and sessions are both on the floor - makes sense. 100 possessions per 48mins. kemba is in the top 3 duos in pace.

when mkg and mcroberts are on the floor we play our slowest at 89 per 48. biz/mkg and jefferson/mcroberts next slowest.


rebounding?
this seems flukey, but our best rebounding duo - sessions and mkg at 53%. sessions also in next highest with adrien. lots of adrien and MKG at the top of the rebounding list.

and at the bottom, lots of jeff taylor, highlighted by the infamous biyombo/taylor pairing. this doesnt surprise me since taylor is often miscast as a small forward, where he is a terrible rebounder for that position.


true shooting percentage?
we get another entry from the biyombo/taylor pairing. when they are on the floor the true shooting percentage is 41% which is just atrocious. jefferson and mcroberts lead the way at 53%.


thats it for now. lets see what you guys can find.
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#4 » by BigSlam » Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:52 am

When I first quickly glanced at this thread title I thought it said:

"Fun with sluts"

and I thought - wow, this thread has some potential......
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#5 » by countryboi » Fri Nov 29, 2013 4:08 am

BigSlam wrote:When I first quickly glanced at this thread title I thought it said:

"Fun with sluts"

and I thought - wow, this thread has some potential......


Now I'm disappointed it isn't fun with sluts...sounds like a movie
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#6 » by Liver_Pooty » Fri Nov 29, 2013 7:10 am

fatlever wrote:i'll kick things off...

today and am looking at stats.nba.com - bobcats page, sorting by 2-man lineups, filter of greater than 100 minutes played together. lets see what we can find.

jefferson/mcbob have the highest offensive rating with 104pts per 100 possessions. the next four are:
taylor/mcbob
henderson/jefferson
jefferson/walker
mcroberts/walkter

the worst 5 ortg duos
biyombo/taylor - 80pts per 100 possessions
biyombo/mcroberts
biyombo/mkg
biyombo/henders
adrien/sessions

^thats not flattering for biz

best 5 defensive rating
jefferson/mkg 88pts allowed per 100 possessions
henderson/mkg
mkg/walker
mkg/mcroberts
jefferson/walker

^pretty damn impressive for mkg

worst 5 defensive rating
mcroberts/taylor 112drtg
biyombo/taylor
henderson/taylor
mkg/taylor - strange that mkg in featured in the best 4 drtgs and taylor in the worst 4 and taylor is so bad defensively he brings mkg into the bottom 5 when paired together. also strange because this duo last year had a fantastic drtg when paired together
sessions/tolliver

best 5 net rating
jefferson/mcroberts
henderson/jefferson
jefferson/walker
jefferson/mkg
adrien/walker

worst 5 net rating
biyombo/taylor at a whopping -29.4, which is miles worse than anyone else
mkg/taylor
biyombo/henderson
henderson/taylor
mkg/zeller

(6th was taylor/zeller - i was shocked they werent the worst. its the reason i started this search. i wanted to see just how bad those two have been when on the floor together. shame because they were both fantastic this summer)

conclusions - jefferson and mcbob make our offense the best, MKG makes our defense the best. biz makes us suck on offense and taylor makes us suck on defense and god help us when they are paired together.


what about pace?

we play our fastest pace when kemba and sessions are both on the floor - makes sense. 100 possessions per 48mins. kemba is in the top 3 duos in pace.

when mkg and mcroberts are on the floor we play our slowest at 89 per 48. biz/mkg and jefferson/mcroberts next slowest.


rebounding?
this seems flukey, but our best rebounding duo - sessions and mkg at 53%. sessions also in next highest with adrien. lots of adrien and MKG at the top of the rebounding list.

and at the bottom, lots of jeff taylor, highlighted by the infamous biyombo/taylor pairing. this doesnt surprise me since taylor is often miscast as a small forward, where he is a terrible rebounder for that position.


true shooting percentage?
we get another entry from the biyombo/taylor pairing. when they are on the floor the true shooting percentage is 41% which is just atrocious. jefferson and mcroberts lead the way at 53%.


thats it for now. lets see what you guys can find.


Lord. Biyombo is horrible from a statistics stand point.
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#7 » by Diop » Fri Nov 29, 2013 9:55 am

fatlever wrote:i'll kick things off...

today and am looking at stats.nba.com - bobcats page, sorting by 2-man lineups, filter of greater than 100 minutes played together. lets see what we can find.

jefferson/mcbob have the highest offensive rating with 104pts per 100 possessions. the next four are:
taylor/mcbob
henderson/jefferson
jefferson/walker
mcroberts/walkter

the worst 5 ortg duos
biyombo/taylor - 80pts per 100 possessions
biyombo/mcroberts
biyombo/mkg
biyombo/henders
adrien/sessions

^thats not flattering for biz

best 5 defensive rating
jefferson/mkg 88pts allowed per 100 possessions
henderson/mkg
mkg/walker
mkg/mcroberts
jefferson/walker

^pretty damn impressive for mkg

worst 5 defensive rating
mcroberts/taylor 112drtg
biyombo/taylor
henderson/taylor
mkg/taylor - strange that mkg in featured in the best 4 drtgs and taylor in the worst 4 and taylor is so bad defensively he brings mkg into the bottom 5 when paired together. also strange because this duo last year had a fantastic drtg when paired together
sessions/tolliver

best 5 net rating
jefferson/mcroberts
henderson/jefferson
jefferson/walker
jefferson/mkg
adrien/walker

worst 5 net rating
biyombo/taylor at a whopping -29.4, which is miles worse than anyone else
mkg/taylor
biyombo/henderson
henderson/taylor
mkg/zeller

(6th was taylor/zeller - i was shocked they werent the worst. its the reason i started this search. i wanted to see just how bad those two have been when on the floor together. shame because they were both fantastic this summer)

conclusions - jefferson and mcbob make our offense the best, MKG makes our defense the best. biz makes us suck on offense and taylor makes us suck on defense and god help us when they are paired together.


what about pace?

we play our fastest pace when kemba and sessions are both on the floor - makes sense. 100 possessions per 48mins. kemba is in the top 3 duos in pace.

when mkg and mcroberts are on the floor we play our slowest at 89 per 48. biz/mkg and jefferson/mcroberts next slowest.


rebounding?
this seems flukey, but our best rebounding duo - sessions and mkg at 53%. sessions also in next highest with adrien. lots of adrien and MKG at the top of the rebounding list.

and at the bottom, lots of jeff taylor, highlighted by the infamous biyombo/taylor pairing. this doesnt surprise me since taylor is often miscast as a small forward, where he is a terrible rebounder for that position.


true shooting percentage?
we get another entry from the biyombo/taylor pairing. when they are on the floor the true shooting percentage is 41% which is just atrocious. jefferson and mcroberts lead the way at 53%.


thats it for now. lets see what you guys can find.

this could be really helpful if they make another NBA Jam!
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#8 » by EwingSweatsALot » Fri Nov 29, 2013 5:54 pm

So the reason I started doing this stat earlier in the year is because I wanted to keep up with Kemba's assists and how much better he made his teammates. I always thought he got somewhat of a bad rap on his passing and assist numbers and in my mind it was because of how poorly his teammates are and how poorly they shot.

I wish I had the stats to compare to last year, but I do not, if anyone knows where to get assist opportunities for last year please tell me. I only have this year's because of NBA.com's player tracking. What I did was find out what each player's FG% was for that player's assist opportunities (just AST/AST Opp). Then compare that to what his teammates shot when the player didn't assist them. Find that ratio between what they shot when he assisted and what they shot when he didn't and see how much better he made his teammates with his passing. I wanted to know if he set his teammates up in better spots to score or if his passing and reading the situation was poor compared to others.

Anyways I set parameters on players of 10 GP, 20 MP, 5 Assist Opportunites and 2 Assists. That way I could get Sessions in on the stat as well. 4 Bobcats made this grouping, Walker, Sessions, Henderson, and McRoberts. So far this year, 81 players in the NBA met this criteria.

So before I get into the 4 Bobcats, here is just a couple of guys to show the variance in the stat. The leader in this stat is GSW's Andre Iguodala. His teammates shoot 63.6% from his assist opportunities and only 44.3% when he does not assist them. So at a 1.44 ratio. The worst player is HOU's Patrick Beverley. His teammates shoot 42.3% on his assist opportunities and 50.2% when he doesn't assist them. A .84 ratio. The average ratio is 1.13 which includes, Blake Griffin, Jeremy Lin, Nate Wolters, and Marc Gasol.

Now to the Bobcats. This probably comes to no surprise, but Josh McRoberts leads the Bobcats in this category. He is at a 1.38 ratio(53.8%/39%). This is 3rd on the list behind Iggy and Lance Stephenson. Henderson(46.4%/40.6%) and Sessions(45.5%/39.9%) are both tied at 1.14, just a tick above average. Then you have Kemba, Kemba is below average at 1.08. His teammates shoot 44.1% when he assists and 40.8% when he doesn't. There are only 7 starting PGs that are below him on this stat.

So this obviously doesn't show everything. Video evidence is needed for that. I wish they had more stats on where the assist opportunities were going to be able to determine a clear points per opportunity. I wish I could compare these to see how well Kemba did last year, but he just doesn't seem to put guys, based on this, in a good position to score compared to what they are normally capable of. I'd like to know more though on how he does and pick and roll, pick and pop, slash and kick, slash and dump type scenarios. Also who each guy is passing to would help as well to give a more definitive answer.

Something else I found interesting.

Out of the 4 Bobcats, Sessions produces more Assist Opportunites per minute played than the others. He also has more Assist Opportunities per Pass and Assists per pass. He is 3rd on the team in passes per minute, but 22 out of 81 in this study. The top two passes per minute guys. McRoberts and Kemba. So he doesn't pass as much as some guys on our team, but he does seem to make the most of it when he does.
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#9 » by EwingSweatsALot » Fri Nov 29, 2013 5:59 pm

fatlever wrote:i'll kick things off...

today and am looking at stats.nba.com - bobcats page, sorting by 2-man lineups, filter of greater than 100 minutes played together. lets see what we can find.

jefferson/mcbob have the highest offensive rating with 104pts per 100 possessions. the next four are:
taylor/mcbob
henderson/jefferson
jefferson/walker
mcroberts/walkter

the worst 5 ortg duos
biyombo/taylor - 80pts per 100 possessions
biyombo/mcroberts
biyombo/mkg
biyombo/henders
adrien/sessions

^thats not flattering for biz

best 5 defensive rating
jefferson/mkg 88pts allowed per 100 possessions
henderson/mkg
mkg/walker
mkg/mcroberts
jefferson/walker

^pretty damn impressive for mkg

worst 5 defensive rating
mcroberts/taylor 112drtg
biyombo/taylor
henderson/taylor
mkg/taylor - strange that mkg in featured in the best 4 drtgs and taylor in the worst 4 and taylor is so bad defensively he brings mkg into the bottom 5 when paired together. also strange because this duo last year had a fantastic drtg when paired together
sessions/tolliver

best 5 net rating
jefferson/mcroberts
henderson/jefferson
jefferson/walker
jefferson/mkg
adrien/walker

worst 5 net rating
biyombo/taylor at a whopping -29.4, which is miles worse than anyone else
mkg/taylor
biyombo/henderson
henderson/taylor
mkg/zeller

(6th was taylor/zeller - i was shocked they werent the worst. its the reason i started this search. i wanted to see just how bad those two have been when on the floor together. shame because they were both fantastic this summer)

conclusions - jefferson and mcbob make our offense the best, MKG makes our defense the best. biz makes us suck on offense and taylor makes us suck on defense and god help us when they are paired together.


what about pace?

we play our fastest pace when kemba and sessions are both on the floor - makes sense. 100 possessions per 48mins. kemba is in the top 3 duos in pace.

when mkg and mcroberts are on the floor we play our slowest at 89 per 48. biz/mkg and jefferson/mcroberts next slowest.


rebounding?
this seems flukey, but our best rebounding duo - sessions and mkg at 53%. sessions also in next highest with adrien. lots of adrien and MKG at the top of the rebounding list.

and at the bottom, lots of jeff taylor, highlighted by the infamous biyombo/taylor pairing. this doesnt surprise me since taylor is often miscast as a small forward, where he is a terrible rebounder for that position.


true shooting percentage?
we get another entry from the biyombo/taylor pairing. when they are on the floor the true shooting percentage is 41% which is just atrocious. jefferson and mcroberts lead the way at 53%.


thats it for now. lets see what you guys can find.


I am a big fan of the lineup stats. It can't tell you everything, no stat can in basketball, but it can easily show you glaring weaknesses and great strengths. Just in the case you did. The Biyombo offense, and the MKG/Taylor defense comparison. The Biz/Taylor duo made me laugh. Not seeing Biz at least once on the defense top 5 was a little head scratching. I figured he would have snuck in there with MKG at some point.
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#10 » by fatlever » Fri Nov 29, 2013 6:26 pm

@ESaL

your findings do confirm some of what my eyeballs have told me for the past 3 years, that kemba doesnt really anticipate/read the game as well as many point guards and therefor many times his passes simply seem to be passes for the sake of passing. its almost like he will probe and penetrate looking for his jumper/a lane to the rim/or an obvious pass to an open teammate and when its not there he simply hands the ball off to someone else and re-groups. and sometime that pass kemba makes after exhausting his opportunities leads to someone forcing a bad shot (and a missed assist opp for kemba).

[waits for the onslaught of excuses for kemba]
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#11 » by LamarMatic7 » Fri Nov 29, 2013 7:42 pm

great research, ESaL. Talk about using the new player tracking data to the fullest.
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#12 » by fatlever » Fri Nov 29, 2013 9:30 pm

stats porn (dont get too excited slam) from hoopshype

http://hoopshype.com/articles/hoopshype ... s-week-154

not bobcats related but some interesting random stats
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#13 » by mrknowitall215 » Fri Nov 29, 2013 9:36 pm

fatlever wrote:stats porn (dont get too excited slam) from hoopshype

http://hoopshype.com/articles/hoopshype ... s-week-154

not bobcats related but some interesting random stats


I've learned that the Bobcats might want to try to trade Gerald Henderson plus something else for Arron Afflalo from reading that article. I used to think that Afflalo & Henderson were similar with Afflalo only being slightly better due to experience, but I was wrong. Afflalo is everything that Charlotte wants out of Henderson, an improved 3-point shooter with the ability to create his own shot or catch-and-shoot off spot ups
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#14 » by JDR720 » Fri Nov 29, 2013 10:54 pm

[tweet]https://twitter.com/rick_bonnell/status/406556156702621696[/tweet]

well then this is surprising
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#15 » by LamarMatic7 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 4:23 pm

Checking out the SportsVU stats and looking for whatever trends I could find for our guys.
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#16 » by LamarMatic7 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 4:25 pm

Unfortunately, the SportsVU cameras don't tell anything that good about our guys rebounding the ball:

I chose guys who average 5 rebounds per game and have participated in at least 10 games (to get rid of the Kobe's and Derrick Williams'es) and here's what I got:

Out of 96 guys who made the cut, Mike Kidd-Gilchrist was 88th in contested REB percentage (contested rebounds/total rebounds) with 1.3 contest rebounds out of his 5.2 (24.5%). And this is understandable. He's ahead of Paul George, Durant and LeBron. This category certainly is for bigger and thicker guys and no small forwards really excel. But none of our big guys really stand out which is sort of bad. Biz is right in the middle (47th, 38.5%), Al is 57th (35.8%) McBob is 71st (33.1%)

And then there is percentage of rebounds per chance, it measures the times a player actually grabbed the rebound against the number of times where he was within 3.5 feet of it. It has big guys in the top10 like DeAndre, Drummond and Bynum, but Durant and James are number one and two, respectively, guys like Pierce and Stephenson are also high so it's also a category for the the crafty (Pierce and Lantz) and the guys who can leap over everyone (James and Durant) as well.

Biz is again the best of our guys, ranking 37th with a percentage of 61.9% (6.8 rebounds in 10.9 chances). Al is 52nd (59.1%), McRoberts is 75th (55.8%) and disappointingly Mike is only 85th (53.7%). For some reason all of the guys who were surrounding him in the contested REB stat, the small forwards like Batum, Ariza, James and Durant, are top20 and even guys like Turner and Butler are in the top50. MKG is the lone small forward in this category at the bottom of this stat. The closest small forward to him is DeMarre Carroll at the 57 spot, unless you consider Josh Smith or Jeremy Evans a real small forward.
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#17 » by LamarMatic7 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 4:35 pm

Out of the 191 guys who have played at least 8 games and average 2 points per game on catch and shoot situations, Jeff Taylor is in the last place in the whole league at 24.0%. Kemba is 185th with 29.7%. Only Big Al (42.3%) made the top100, with Hendo, Tolliver and McBob also in the second hundred.

If you look at it from the perspective of effective field goal percentage, Hendo is 183rd and JT is 190th. Obviously this is were the fact that three pointers are more effective don't help Hendo's case.
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#18 » by LamarMatic7 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 4:39 pm

Kemba is tied for the 12th spot in the league in points per game on pull-up situations. Hendo is 86th (out of 108 guys who average at least 2ppg) in effective field goal percentage with 35% in pull-ups, Kemba is 54th (39.1%).
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#19 » by LamarMatic7 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 4:49 pm

And finally something positive. It seems to me that 4 defender opponent field goal attempts at the rim is the cut-off point to get rid of the random small forwards (and Jeremy Lin) and take a look at the real rim protectors.

Well, Biz is 3rd in the league at opponent field goal percentage when he defends the shot. Even though Sanders is number one, he has only played 2 games so let's see if he can repeat the same success he had last year. Then it's Gibson (1.4/4.3, 31.0%), Chris Kaman (what??? 2.2/5.8, 37.7%) and Biyombo (1.9/4.8, 39.1%). Biz is followed by guys known league-wide for protecting the paint. Brook Lopez is 4th, then it's Hibbert, Chandler, Koufus, Noah, Anthony Davis, Garnett, Tim Duncan, Jason Thompson (didn't expect him), Asik (MrKnowItAll, :D), Bogut, Henson and so on and so on, the guys we know as good defenders because of the eye test.

Jeff Adrien is 20th (1.9/4.2, 44.8%), right ahead of Dwight Howard.

McBob (2.3/4.4, 53.3%) is somewhere right in the middle, too tired of this to count up the exact spot.

Big Al (3.8/6.8, 56.2%) is 74th out of 90, no surprises here.

And JaVale McGee is in the last, 90th, place. An ode to the worthlessness of the "blocks" stat.
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Re: Fun with Stats!!! 

Post#20 » by jlfans » Mon Dec 16, 2013 9:31 am

IMO, finding the "ball hog" or "give me the ball" by FGApg (field goals attempted per game) is funny and meaningful:
http://ns.twhappy.com/?select=14,leader,advance,fgapg,all,all,

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