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I meant to start a thread on this a couple times but never got around to it. Saw this post and it reminded me:

AttitudeAjusta wrote:We did so well last year because of the great chemistry we had, prior to the trade. Stephenson will absolutely destroy whatever's left of that with his f*cked up attitude and straight up childish antics.

Not picking on AttitudeAjusta, just wanted to show what triggered the thought.

So how much impact on team chemistry did the Sessions - Adrien for Ridnour - Neal trade have? I honestly think very little to none, but curious to hear other thoughts?

This should probably evolve into a discussion on the relevance of team chemistry in general and how much it should be valued as opposed to making moves that seem to upgrade talent.

We're fine. Lance isn't a JR Smith or Michael Beasley-like moron. He isn't Ron Artest either. The positives severely outshine the negatives of bringing him in. I hope that bringing Hairston to Charlotte doesn't have any impact on a Lance signing.

bonnell said our lockerroom last year was the most drama free lockerroom he had seen in his 25 years of covering the NBA.

CDR pretty much said the same thing.

i'd hate to bring in anyone who would disrupt that chemistry.

The Pacers locker room was full of players that were mentally fragile. Put a player like Lance Stephenson on my team and I would just laugh at the silliness he display from time to time. For instance, the 'blowing in LeBron' ear fiasco was 'overblown' by Pacers players like Paul George & Roy Hibbert to the media. If my teammate did something like that I would've garnered more respect for him and found it hilarious rather than ridicule him. With that said, I think a lot of the players in the Hornets locker room like Kemba, McRoberts, MKG, Jefferson, and CDR among others have a laid back attitude towards things without huge egos, and that's why it was a great locker room with great chemistry. I don't blame Stephenson for not getting along with those buzzkills. I wouldn't have gotten along with them neither

I agree. I think Lance lost respect for his teammates after the rumored George/Hibbert fiasco. I don't propose to know anything about the inner workings of the Pacers but I bet bringing in Turner and his "i can take over scoring give the damn ball to me" ego killed the Pacers and not Lance. And Vogel doesn't seem to be an alpha-male type coach like Clifford is. I don't think Lance is a JR Smith type at all.


Also, Lance will thrive having a real point guard (Kemba) and offensive center (Al) and will get a lot of easy 1 on 1 opportunities, especially if Vonleh is a threat from 15 feet.

Its a no brainer, as long as its around 11 mil a year and not 14.

Don't forget PJ s already potential drama. Noah might be as well, given his age. The team may not be able to bring back McBob also. Each one is a potential risk to chemistry. Things might be fine. But maybe not. Adding Lance is another risk. May push things over the edge, but maybe not.


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Vanderbilt_Grad wrote:Don't forget PJ s already potential drama. Noah might be as well, given his age. The team may not be able to bring back McBob also. Each one is a potential risk to chemistry. Things might be fine. But maybe not. Adding Lance is another risk. May push things over the edge, but maybe not.


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In interviews, Noah didn't strike me as somebody who'll be bringing in any trouble or drama. He's described as a gym rat, so I think he'll fit right in. Plus, he's already friends with Cody.

But with PJ, yeah I'm worried.

The Celtics reportedly passed on Vonleh due to character concerns, but I can't find anything specific so Ill just ignore it.

Hairston on the other hand..

The beauty with Hairston is that he lost a ton of money and is making less than a million dollars. So if his off the court problems endure...then thats it, he doesn't get a second NBA contract and loses out on so much more.

just keep PJ away from weed and rental cars and he'll be fine

SpearNMgicHelmt wrote:

Vanderbilt_Grad wrote:Don't forget PJ s already potential drama. Noah might be as well, given his age. The team may not be able to bring back McBob also. Each one is a potential risk to chemistry. Things might be fine. But maybe not. Adding Lance is another risk. May push things over the edge, but maybe not.


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In interviews, Noah didn't strike me as somebody who'll be bringing in any trouble or drama. He's described as a gym rat, so I think he'll fit right in. Plus, he's already friends with Cody.

But with PJ, yeah I'm worried.

PJ was never considered a bad teammate just borrowed a car from the wrong guy. He should not hurt the locker room at all and he can afford his own car now.

Our chemistry stems from the fact that the players are all in this together.

Cho also deliberately drafts and signs/trades for guys who are known as high character and high motor.

Guys play hard and everyone respects that.

I love those photo's from the plane etc, guys on our team seem like family.

In regards to Stephenson, I wouldn't give this guy anything north of 8m per.

I don't want us to sign him.

I don't think Lance Stephenson is a bad teammate. I think he's a little off in the head similar to the basketball player formerly known as Ron Artest, which is reason to give pause to how much he should be paid, because he has a few loose screws, but I don't think he'd ruin team chemistry. That's just my opinion on him from distant observation

Kemba knows him personally though, at least from the standpoint of close encounters beyond just a 'hi & bye'. If we see Charlotte seriously pursuing Stephenson, trust & believe that Kemba gave Cho & Co. the okay that he's a tolerable character, because if he isn't then I'm sure Kemba would tell them that he doesn't really get along with him. Remember, Kemba is the leader of the team at this point

Kemba is not the leader of this team at this point.

Jefferson is.

Chemistry is always important, but talent and leadership ultimately matter most. Annually every team has players come and go. The franchise sets a standard, the coach is critical to execution of that direction, and the player's leaders set the expectations.

I do believe that Big Al emerged as one of our key leaders, but Kemba exerts himself in this role as well. Lance is not a cancer, not a troublemaker off court nor typically on. He plays with intensity and emotion. All Lance needs is some maturing in approach. Who better to be his mentor than the greatest player ever? MJ will show him how to channel his intensity into excellence in performance, and I predict he will also be one of the leaders of this team.

yosemiteben wrote:Not picking on AttitudeAjusta, just wanted to show what triggered the thought.

Damn Yosemite, why do you have to just go and pick up on me so ruthlessly like that? I mean gol..

I really liked our chemistry last season and remembered reading somewhere that RC Bufford or Pop or somebody saying something along the lines of their players attitudes meant more than anything when it comes to drafting, signing, etc.

A while later, I was watching the Suns and Spurs playing, and it just seemed to make sense that team chemistry is a lot more important than most people give it credit for.

It's the little things, the gestures, tone, attitude that really make a difference and it's not always so easy to spot all the time, but you can avoid players who straight up

So how much impact on team chemistry did the Sessions - Adrien for Ridnour - Neal trade have? I honestly think very little to none, but curious to hear other thoughts?

I truly believe that the trade noticeably diminished the chemistry. Neither Ridnour nor Neal ever produced well for us and everyone else's production dropped off too.

I think all the guys we had Kemba, Sessions, Pargo, Hendo, Tolliver, CDR, MKG, McRoberts, Big Al, and even Biz were all equally part of the chemistry we had going on at that time. I mean they ALL worked like clockwork.

Bassman wrote:Chemistry is always important, but talent and leadership ultimately matter most. Annually every team has players come and go. The franchise sets a standard, the coach is critical to execution of that direction, and the player's leaders set the expectations.

I agree, as important as chemistry is, talent and leadership matter most. But that standard can be destroyed or delayed if we have players like that.

Either way, Lance Stephenson isn't that great. Dude is streaky at best and annoying at all times.

Lance is not a cancer, not a troublemaker off court nor typically on. He plays with intensity and emotion.

Lance is easily a cancer to any team. Look around on the IND board, it seems like they don't mind him leaving, and I'm sure there's a good reason for it other than his production. Not to mentions Bird's words to him.

Lance is also a serious troublemaker on AND off the court, look it up. He groped a 17 yr old girl and lost some reality show he had. He also pushed his girlfriend down a flight of stairs while they were fighting.

I'm not necessarily doubting his talent. He's pretty talented and I've seen many amazing plays by him, but I just don't buy into it.

For example, players like Demarcus Cousins, Lance Stephenson are players that could be the best or 2nd best player in their position if they did not have the headcase/character issues they have.

Another thing, all this douchey behavior/ annoying buffoonery does not = competitive nature.

MJ, Kobe, Derrick Rose to name a few, are some of the most competitive players I've seen and they never did half the stupid sh*t Lance does on the court.

My worry with Lance is he had every reason to be on his best behaviour last year. What is he going to look like with a large guaranteed contract.

My theory on what destroyed the Pacers chemistry though is Andrew Bynum. Right after they picked him up they went downhill, right after they announced he would not be with the team for the rest of the playoffs they started playing decent again. He also killed the cavs last season. After the Cavs let him go they started playing better.

I compare Lance to Stephen Jackson, except I think Lance is more talented. When he is on the court he plays his ass off, and hates to lose. I want those kinds of guys on our team. Indiana had NO leadership once they traded Granger. Hibbert is a pansy, George is scared of Lance, and had his own off the court issues anyway going on. Vogel is not the kind of coach that can handle Lance, Clifford is.