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Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Tue Sep 1, 2015 3:52 pm
by spaceballer
The ATH guy who posted the original stats comparison of Mo Williams/Lance Stephenson/Kemba Walker/Nicolas Batum/Jeremy Lin has posted a follow up.
The original analysis of Hornets passing ability:
http://www.atthehive.com/2015/7/30/9072079/hornets-guards-passingThe recently posted new second analysis of Hornets assist quality:
http://www.atthehive.com/2015/8/29/9225837/hornets-guards-assistKeep in mind that these comparisons are slightly flawed due to the fact that the three teams (Blazers, Hornets, Lakers) had different systems, teammates, coaches, schemes, etc.
I find Batum's effect on the Blazers intriguing.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Tue Sep 1, 2015 4:23 pm
by LofJ
Kemba isn't doing much of anything to help our offense, this analysis makes that pretty clear.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Tue Sep 1, 2015 9:54 pm
by DY_nasty
Been saying this for the past two years. Kemba protects the ball so well because he's not looking to create.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Wed Sep 2, 2015 12:56 am
by TikiJJ
Wow! The amount of time he must have spent on that analysis... mad props to the man and btw, Batum's pretty awesome.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Wed Sep 2, 2015 7:28 am
by thesneakysneak
That was fantastic, cheers for sharing.
Lin and Batum's passing will be much welcomed this season. The more they can create offence for others in place of Walker, the better off the team will be. If Clifford still wants to have Kemba hold the ball so much, like last season, I expect Lin and Batum to fall off ala Lance last year also.
Other notes: How poorly people shot off passes from Kemba compared to others is disturbing.
Looking at the pie charts and the assists % from shot distance is also not flattering for Kemba with the nba gearing towards 3s and shots at the rim. He had the highest % of assists coming from both the categories of >16ft and 8-16 feet. He has 34,3% of his assists coming from arguably the worst shots you can make in the modern NBA, so its unsurprising that his team mates are shooting low percentages off his assists.
Lance was second worst at 32% and Mo was the best with 28,2%.
Lin and Nic's assist areas are encouraging.
Also Kemba and lance by FAR had the worst assist rate at the rim.
Batum's pass fg effectiveness for his team mates last year is amazing and surely a sign of high BB IQ.
The Lin to Davis connection is intriguing. I didn't watch any of the Lakers train wreck last year so I have no input but I'm just praying that Lin can get some good chem with Zeller and Tank in the second unit.
In short I think we need Lin and Nic to have the chance to run the offense much more this season and have Kemba play more off the ball. Kemba has the shooter around him now so if the offence still stagnates then Cliff and Kemba need to have a long look at themselves.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Wed Sep 2, 2015 1:22 pm
by LofJ
Kemba can't play off the ball, at all. He has no idea what to do on offense without the ball in his hands. If he doesn't make big strides as a facilitator this season it will be beyond obvious the problem with our offense is him. At that point he will be what everyone pegged him as when he was drafted - a 6th man spark plug off the bench. If he doesn't make the leap as a facilitator, I expect by the time the 2017 offseason rolls around the majority of our fan base will be ready to find a new starting point guard.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Wed Sep 2, 2015 1:56 pm
by JuanCesta
Lin is the best passer in the team and he should play about 36 mins a game as 1st option and handle the ball whenever he is on the court. None of this off ball play, stand in thecorner like he was forced to do with James Harden and Kobe bryant
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Wed Sep 2, 2015 3:59 pm
by spaceballer
JuanCesta wrote:Lin is the best passer in the team and he should play about 36 mins a game as 1st option and handle the ball whenever he is on the court. None of this off ball play, stand in thecorner like he was forced to do with James Harden and Kobe bryant
Stop it. You already got locked out of one thread, don't start your trolling here, too. Why can't you just stay on Clutchfans with your thread rooting for Lin and the Hornets to fail, instead of pretending to be a fake Lin fan here to sow discord?
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Wed Sep 2, 2015 9:52 pm
by Mystical Apples
JuanCesta wrote:Lin is the best passer in the team and he should play about 36 mins a game as 1st option and handle the ball whenever he is on the court. None of this off ball play, stand in thecorner like he was forced to do with James Harden and Kobe bryant
Lin is better than Kemba but he's no great shakes either. Both he and Kemba ranked near the bottom of the league for PG's in assisted shot efficiency, hockey assists, etc.. What Lin has going for him is better size/versatility to defend and the ability to play 2 as a floor spacer.
Batum is easily the best passer/playmaker on the team.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Thu Sep 3, 2015 6:37 am
by JDR720
playmaking is just as big a problem as shooting for us.
our offense revolves around dumping the ball to Al and he is a terrible passer. hopefully clifford isn't lying when he says he wants Batum to step up and have a big role here, he is our best playmaker. maybe if Frank can pass like he did in college he could become our new McBob.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Thu Sep 3, 2015 7:05 am
by Braggins
Between Frank and Batum we should always be able to keep a playmaker in the high post, which seems to be a necessity in Cliffords offensive scheme. We might even be able to use MKG in this role at times and Cody is also a solid passer. I hope we run our offense primarily through Kemba/Lin and the high post with Batum/Frank early in the shot clock and use Al mostly as a bail out option at the end of shock clock. We should only be looking to iso him when we've used ball movement or some other kind of offensive action to get him in a position where the defense cant easily help and he can go to work 1v1 or take advantage of an awkward rotation by passing out of the double team. If Alfense finally dies and Clifford is willing to sub Al out when he is tired, injured, or we have a lead to protect, then this roster could really work. Al doesn't need to be playing more than 28-30mpg.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Thu Sep 3, 2015 12:45 pm
by JuanCesta
spaceballer wrote:JuanCesta wrote:Lin is the best passer in the team and he should play about 36 mins a game as 1st option and handle the ball whenever he is on the court. None of this off ball play, stand in thecorner like he was forced to do with James Harden and Kobe bryant
Stop it. You already got locked out of one thread, don't start your trolling here, too. Why can't you just stay on Clutchfans with your thread rooting for Lin and the Hornets to fail, instead of pretending to be a fake Lin fan here to sow discord?
Stop with the personal attacks and focus on the subject. I see most of your posts are calling me a troll or fake and you have very little to contribute to the thread. I one of Lin's biggest fans. You can find my posts at lakersground or jeremylin.net
Grow up.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Thu Sep 3, 2015 1:04 pm
by Liver_Pooty
Lol
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Thu Sep 3, 2015 3:20 pm
by spaceballer
JuanCesta wrote:spaceballer wrote:JuanCesta wrote:Lin is the best passer in the team and he should play about 36 mins a game as 1st option and handle the ball whenever he is on the court. None of this off ball play, stand in thecorner like he was forced to do with James Harden and Kobe bryant
Stop it. You already got locked out of one thread, don't start your trolling here, too. Why can't you just stay on Clutchfans with your thread rooting for Lin and the Hornets to fail, instead of pretending to be a fake Lin fan here to sow discord?
Stop with the personal attacks and focus on the subject. I see most of your posts are calling me a troll or fake and you have very little to contribute to the thread. I one of Lin's biggest fans. You can find my posts at lakersground or jeremylin.net
Grow up.
I seem to find more twitter mentions and retweets of JLinPortal.com than jeremylin.net.
Your statements and trolling actions in the locked thread are straight out of the clutchfans playbook and speak for themselves. But since the mods have asked that we not continue the discussion from the locked thread, I'll stop here.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Thu Sep 3, 2015 3:26 pm
by spaceballer
JDR720 wrote:playmaking is just as big a problem as shooting for us.
our offense revolves around dumping the ball to Al and he is a terrible passer. hopefully clifford isn't lying when he says he wants Batum to step up and have a big role here, he is our best playmaker. maybe if Frank can pass like he did in college he could become our new McBob.
Cliff did say that Al hasn't completed yet but was in the process of going through a weightloss regimen this summer. We'll see when the season starts.
A fitter Al might give more athletic and mobile play, but things like weight shouldn't affect passing skills and vision (or lack thereof).
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Thu Sep 3, 2015 6:00 pm
by DY_nasty
spaceballer wrote:JDR720 wrote:playmaking is just as big a problem as shooting for us.
our offense revolves around dumping the ball to Al and he is a terrible passer. hopefully clifford isn't lying when he says he wants Batum to step up and have a big role here, he is our best playmaker. maybe if Frank can pass like he did in college he could become our new McBob.
Cliff did say that Al hasn't completed yet but was in the process of going through a weightloss regimen this summer. We'll see when the season starts.
A fitter Al might give more athletic and mobile play, but things like weight shouldn't affect passing skills and vision (or lack thereof).
It does and did. Al couldn't move at all last season, he was planted firmly on the block. When he could actually move around a bit the season before, he could open up more passing lanes by pulling defenses with him to the elbow. He's a much better passer there than once he establishes himself down low as well.
Al's not a terrible passer. At least he isn't in Charlotte. The issue is, last year in particular, nearly every pass the team made was crappy and pointless and redundant within the offense's goals.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Thu Sep 3, 2015 9:10 pm
by Braggins
We've all seen Al occasionally make some sweet passes out of the post. His problem is more willingness to pass and possibly court vision. I think he has the skill to throw accurate passes when he wants to. The problem is that he has spent his entire career being a black hole, not looking to exploit double teams, and not giving any thought to reading defenses, so it would be a difficult task for him to all of a sudden learn how to be a good post passer. We don't need him to be great at it, so if he would at least be willing to try then it would help quite a bit even if he still wasn't particularly good at it. As of now defenses don't even have to worry about covering other options once they collapse on Al because he will usually force a shot even if there are players wide open all over the court.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Thu Sep 3, 2015 9:18 pm
by Braggins
JuanCesta wrote:Lin is the best passer in the team and he should play about 36 mins a game as 1st option and handle the ball whenever he is on the court. None of this off ball play, stand in thecorner like he was forced to do with James Harden and Kobe bryant
Brian Roberts is clearly better than Lin. He has the higher free throw and 3 point percentage and if it wasn't for Anthony Davis being jealous and running him out of town he would have kept the starting PG job for the Pelicans and would be an all-star 40+ minutes per game guy. American players were so jealous of Brian Roberts that he had to go all the way to Europe to find a team/coaches that weren't already jealous and trying to throw him under the bus. It didn't take long for that to change and he had to come back to America. Anthony Davis was too young and immature to share the spotlight with the best free throw shooter in the NBA and got scared that people were going to be talking more about Roberts shooting 90% from the line than his precious unibrow. Monty Williams also didn't want to have to explain to the media why he was playing the mediocre Jrue Holiday over the best free throw shooter since Steve Nash just to satisfy his jealous star players. Luckily, Steve Clifford is a real coach and was willing to let him play his game. We all saw what happened when he was able to start in this league. Too bad Kemba was too scared and jealous to allow Roberts to take some of his spot light and forced the organization to sign a big name like Lin, who is an inferior player to Brian Roberts, so that they could bury Brian Roberts back as the 3rd string PG like all the other haters have done. By the end of the season Brian Roberts will be the starting PG playing 45 minutes per game and average 24/9/3(steals) with 48%/50%/95% shooting numbers.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Fri Sep 4, 2015 12:49 pm
by JuanCesta
Braggins wrote:JuanCesta wrote:Lin is the best passer in the team and he should play about 36 mins a game as 1st option and handle the ball whenever he is on the court. None of this off ball play, stand in thecorner like he was forced to do with James Harden and Kobe bryant
Brian Roberts is clearly better than Lin. .
Sorry but I stopped reading there. It just goes to show your lack of basketball knowledge to make such a horrible statement.
Re: Hornets passing and assists
Posted: Fri Sep 4, 2015 1:46 pm
by Liver_Pooty
JuanCesta wrote:Braggins wrote:JuanCesta wrote:Lin is the best passer in the team and he should play about 36 mins a game as 1st option and handle the ball whenever he is on the court. None of this off ball play, stand in thecorner like he was forced to do with James Harden and Kobe bryant
Brian Roberts is clearly better than Lin. .
Sorry but I stopped reading there. It just goes to show your lack of basketball knowledge to make such a horrible statement.