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We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread

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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1141 » by yosemiteben » Mon Dec 3, 2018 8:37 pm

I continue to not know how much confidence I have in Monk evolving into a consistently useful player. Really don't know how he ends up.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1142 » by BigSlam » Mon Dec 3, 2018 8:58 pm

yosemiteben wrote:I continue to not know how much confidence I have in Monk evolving into a consistently useful player. Really don't know how he ends up.

Same - although I am leaning pretty heavily towards skeptical.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1143 » by 316Hornets » Tue Dec 4, 2018 4:13 pm

Wonder if Monk's problems are mental more than anything similar to Fultz. Monk seems to play timid and not sure of himself a lot. It's a different ballgame in the pros where everyone is highly skilled. He could come out of his shooting slump pretty easily. If we have to trade him and eliminate the risk, I could go that way too.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1144 » by tondi123 » Tue Dec 4, 2018 5:20 pm

I like the guy and think he's got a ton of potential but I'd flip him in a second for the right deal.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1145 » by Splitta » Tue Dec 4, 2018 5:48 pm

I have my doubts about Monk as well. He size is a problem and he needs to bulk up somewhat to take the contact that happens in the NBA. Without a consistent shot, I am not sure what his NBA future will be. The Hornets should probably give him more time to develop but if they can get a good deal and move a bad contract (Nic) as well I would not hesitate to include him in a trade.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1146 » by Braggins » Wed Dec 5, 2018 5:58 am

Were people not expecting Monk to be a project?
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1147 » by catch20two » Wed Dec 5, 2018 7:40 am

Braggins wrote:Were people not expecting Monk to be a project?

I didn’t expect his defense to be this bad where even when he’s hot he still give away more than he give.

Now throw in the part that he’s been inefficient because he don’t know a good shot from a bad one.

He’s virtually almost unplayable.
They will wage war against the Lamb but the Lamb will triumph them because he is Lord of lords and King of kings - and with him will be his called, chosen and faithful followers." Revelation 17:14 (NIV)
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1148 » by BigSlam » Wed Dec 5, 2018 1:45 pm

Braggins wrote:Were people not expecting Monk to be a project?

I was/am totally still viewing him as a project, but my skepticism remains the same.

I didn't expect Monk to arrive in the NBA and start putting up gaudy numbers. My skepticism of him is based on his shot selection, decision making, style/control etc. I'd be ok if he was putting up fairly pedestrian numbers (like Devonte) but showed a feel for the game that gave me confidence (like Devonte!!). I don't see that feel.

Doesn't mean he wont all of a sudden "get it" and burst out, I just have my doubts.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1149 » by JMAC3 » Wed Dec 5, 2018 3:55 pm

Monk can get his shot in the nba, he just isn’t making a ton of them. Every player in the nba has warts, we just don’t know what everyone’s are because we don’t see them enough.

Monks are fixable, remember when Lamb was unplayable because his defense? Monk played like 30 games last year, and 20 this year. So 50 games in, he is worthless?

CJ McCollum barley played as a rookie. It’s not always as simply as show up and be the man like a Mitchell or Kuzma. Sometimes it’s more of a Terry Rozier or Aaron Gordon path.


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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1150 » by Braggins » Wed Dec 5, 2018 4:11 pm

Parker and Graham both have worse BPM's than Monk and Bacons is only better by .1. Graham and Monk have similarly awful RPMs and Bacon/Parker are both really bad in RPM, although a bit better than Monk/Graham.

Yet, somehow the perception is that Parker is one of our best players and Bacon/Graham are pleasant surprises that have been play far better than Monk.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1151 » by BigSlam » Wed Dec 5, 2018 4:29 pm

Braggins wrote:Parker and Graham both have worse BPM's than Monk and Bacons is only better by .1. Graham and Monk have similarly awful RPMs and Bacon/Parker are both really bad in RPM, although a bit better than Monk/Graham.

Yet, somehow the perception is that Parker is one of our best players and Bacon/Graham are pleasant surprises that have been play far better than Monk.

How do they compare on the feel-o-meter?
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1152 » by 316Hornets » Wed Dec 5, 2018 4:30 pm

So, now Tony Parker is Monk's problem. Got it.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1153 » by Braggins » Wed Dec 5, 2018 4:35 pm

316Hornets wrote:So, now Tony Parker is Monk's problem. Got it.

Thats some pretty bizarre reading between the lines.

I wasnt implying that the bad play of any of those guys was related. I was just trying to point out that there are other players who have been just as bad for the team, but are perceived as playing well and being pleasant surprises, whereas Monk is viewed as some sort of malignant tumor that is sabotaging the team.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1154 » by Benjamin Linus » Wed Dec 5, 2018 4:39 pm

Maybe he's someone that needs minutes to get into rhythm? Kind of like what we're seeing with Terry Rozier.

Just plugged this in real quick... in the games where Monk played over 20 minutes this season, he's putting up 13.9 ppg on 40.5 FG% and 36.5 3p%

Which isn't great, but isn’t that bad. I'm sure you could make those numbers look better if you played around with the minute splits but I don't got time for all that
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1155 » by Braggins » Wed Dec 5, 2018 4:47 pm

BigSlam wrote:
Braggins wrote:Parker and Graham both have worse BPM's than Monk and Bacons is only better by .1. Graham and Monk have similarly awful RPMs and Bacon/Parker are both really bad in RPM, although a bit better than Monk/Graham.

Yet, somehow the perception is that Parker is one of our best players and Bacon/Graham are pleasant surprises that have been play far better than Monk.

How do they compare on the feel-o-meter?

Parker has done a good job of using his old man game to pull points out of his ass when used as a primary ball handler, but we are playing 4v5 offense when he doesn't have the ball, which offsets a lot of his offensive production, and he is easily the worst defender on the team by a comfortable margin.

I thought last year Bacon sucked, but flashed just enough talent to think he might be a rotation player one day. Hes done better this year, but still hasn't been very good. I've always thought his talent was overrated on this board, but I do think hes probably an NBA player. I'm higher on him this year than I was last year.

Graham has been awful and really hasn't really shown much potential. He could be an NBA player, but I'd be surprised if hes ever more than a low end backup PG. Sometimes I advocate playing him over Parker because the Parker/Monk backcourt is such a trainwreck on defense. I'll admit that I haven't seen enough to really feel that strongly about my opinions on him.

Monk has sucked, but has shown way more potential than Bacon/Graham. I don't understand why people are all of a sudden so down on him about sucking on defense and being inconsistent on offense. I 100% expected this, although hes been a bit more streaky than I hoped. His defense effort has actually been better than I worried it might be, but hes weak/undersized and doesn't know what hes doing.

Edit: I didn't mention Miles in my previous post, but that dude is beast. You never know how players are going to develop, but I think a Shawn Marion type of high end role player is a modest expected outcome for him. I also wouldn't be surprised if he develops really well and ends up being an all-star, but we'll have to wait and see.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1156 » by BigSlam » Wed Dec 5, 2018 5:53 pm

Braggins wrote:
BigSlam wrote:
Braggins wrote:Parker and Graham both have worse BPM's than Monk and Bacons is only better by .1. Graham and Monk have similarly awful RPMs and Bacon/Parker are both really bad in RPM, although a bit better than Monk/Graham.

Yet, somehow the perception is that Parker is one of our best players and Bacon/Graham are pleasant surprises that have been play far better than Monk.

How do they compare on the feel-o-meter?

Parker has done a good job of using his old man game to pull points out of his ass when used as a primary ball handler, but we are playing 4v5 offense when he doesn't have the ball, which offsets a lot of his offensive production, and he is easily the worst defender on the team by a comfortable margin.

I thought last year Bacon sucked, but flashed just enough talent to think he might be a rotation player one day. Hes done better this year, but still hasn't been very good. I've always thought his talent was overrated on this board, but I do think hes probably an NBA player. I'm higher on him this year than I was last year.

Graham has been awful and really hasn't really shown much potential. He could be an NBA player, but I'd be surprised if hes ever more than a low end backup PG. Sometimes I advocate playing him over Parker because the Parker/Monk backcourt is such a trainwreck on defense. I'll admit that I haven't seen enough to really feel that strongly about my opinions on him.

Monk has sucked, but has shown way more potential than Bacon/Graham. I don't understand why people are all of a sudden so down on him about sucking on defense and being inconsistent on offense. I 100% expected this, although hes been a bit more streaky than I hoped. His defense effort has actually been better than I worried it might be, but hes weak/undersized and doesn't know what hes doing.

Edit: I didn't mention Miles in my previous post, but that dude is beast. You never know how players are going to develop, but I think a Shawn Marion type of high end role player is a modest expected outcome for him. I also wouldn't be surprised if he develops really well and ends up being an all-star, but we'll have to wait and see.

I really don't get down on Monk because of his D - it's not like he was labelled a defensive player going into the draft - he is an offensive player. Likewise I think it's just gravy when MKG takes (and especially makes) a long J - because that's not his bread and butter. So when people bash Monk for his D I can't help but think "but what did you expect?".

It's his shot selection and overall feel of the game that troubles me. I do like his ability and willingness to drive and drop the ball off to a team mate in the paint, but outside of that I'm not confident in his offensive game. He has natural ability, I'm just not sure the "it" factor is there with him (as in: does he get 'it").

I don't really want to compare Monk to others (even though I did!!), I just used Graham because when I see him play I see a guy who looks like he belongs. I don't get that with Monk - although there is no doubt there is ability there.

Bacon drives me nuts. Like Monk I think there is ability there, but he just doesn't get 'it".

And Miles - well, like you I didn't even bring him up because again like you, I think he's a beast and the sky is the limit. Ability and feel for the game is there. Just needs refinement.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1157 » by Braggins » Wed Dec 5, 2018 6:19 pm

I think Monk's feel for the game is better than Miles on offense right now. Miles would look abysmal if he was used as a primary offensive option and secondary ball handler, which is what Monk is on a lot of the bench units. Pretty much nothing is expected of Miles on offense other than making spot up 3s and occasionally driving against a collapsed defense. Miles struggled a lot with his efficiency when playing Monks role against summer league competition.

Bridges is honestly probably just as clueless as Monk on defense too, but he makes up for it due to being much more physically suited for defense thank Monk.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1158 » by KEMBAtheMETEOR » Wed Dec 5, 2018 6:34 pm

What I see from Monk right now is what I would've expected out of his rookie season- flashes of major upside as a scorer, but with periods of struggle and inconsistency where he struggles to contribute and makes a lot of mistakes.

We've seen both sides.
I thought he started the season very well- his first 11 games he averaged 13.4 points, 2.6 assists in 23 minutes on 42/37/89, providing (if nothing else) a threat that defenses have to account for. Played nicely for our second unit and gained trust with the coach and the team.
Since then, he's struggled hard ever since the 2nd Philly game. Ugly 11 games since then: 7.3 points, 1.5 assists, 29/26/90 splits, despite a 26 point game following a DNP-CD with worse defense, and a much shorter leash as he attempts to do a little too much to find his rhythm.

I wouldn't be opposed to giving him some run in Greensboro if jacking up 20 shots out there helps him find a rhythm. He's not a positive on the floor if he's in a shooting funk. But at the same time, it's always worth it to give him a few minutes each half because at any time he could explode and win us a game like he did against Milwaukee last year.

He's got the potential to be seriously good. He's an immensely talented scorer but has to figure out how to play smart. He better be glued to Parker and Kemba and figure out how to become a consistent contributor, otherwise he risks turning into a Brandon Jennings or JR Smith.
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1159 » by CatgutStitches » Wed Dec 5, 2018 6:41 pm

Dude is 20 years old.

I hate comparing players, but he and Mitchell will probably forever be linked, especially with our fan base. I still stand by that even being 2 years younger if Monk was given the usage and the green light to do whatever he wanted that Mitchell has, Monk would put up better offensive numbers. He has a long way to go as far as defense and filling out his body, and his shot selection leaves a lot to be desired, but IMO every team can use that guy who when he heats up can single handedly bring you a win.

Should I expect to see this Monk love/hate seesaw for his entire career here? Because I think that's just the kind of player he is. He will have ups and downs, but his offensive capabilities are off the charts.

Ive actually been pleasantly surprised with his playmaking ability. I'm more than willing to give the guy a few years of NBA coaching and training to put it all together. If he doesn't work out he doesn't work out, but at least he gives us something to look forward too...plus hes DAMN fun to watch, which to me is the whole point anyway. I like the fact he gambles and sometimes does crazy things...they may not always work but they are entertaining. I'm not expecting the Hornets to win a chip anytime soon so as long as we can stay competitive and entertaining I'm good with it. I absolutely love when Monk, Miles and MKG are on the floor together.

That being said, obviously I'd move him for the right player. At this point I really want to see what Miles turns into, but I don't know that Monk will ever be more than a high end 6th man (which I'm fine with).
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Re: We Want the Monk: The Malik Monk Thread 

Post#1160 » by JMAC3 » Wed Dec 5, 2018 11:34 pm

Well monk should be seeing more minutes now with Miles flexing up to Pf more and Lamb and Bacon playing more 3. Let’s hope he responds well.


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