How would you fix this team?

[JDR720]

Need to dump Nic, MKG, Marvin and Dwight this offseason.
Dont keep MCW or Johnny and pick up Grahams option

Why? Older, expensive and bad fits.

draft a big (likely a PF)
Draft a backup PG (depth, the FA options suck butt)
Sign Tolliver (yep, he replaces Marvin for 1/5th the cost)

lineup so far

Kemba-Draftee
Lamb-Monk
Bacon-Graham
Draftee-Tolliver
Cody-Frank

Obviously we need some wings. thats where Nic/MKG trades come in (Dwight for a 2nd and Marvin for a late first)

Nic for Danny Green and a 2nd (makes 1/2 Nics contract)
MKG for Brandon Knight (same contract)

Kemba-Knight-Draftee
Lamb-Monk
Green-Bacon-Graham
Draftee-Tolliver
Cody-Frank

New reloaded team, obviously an offensive minded one. Get a new HC obviously. We can sign a better backup PF and starting SF with the added cap from Nic/Dwight deals. Sign some cheap 3rd center (JASON MAXIELL!!!!)

that team is far far worse than that we currently have. Offensive minded or not that team sucks ass

we would have cap space to sign upgrades like i said. Thats not the final roster. Some decent vets available like Ariza, who would be a great fit.

The basis of that roster is pick n roll/pop with the guards and Cody/Frank while being surrounded by 3/D players (mostly)

lets sign Ariza and Trevor Booker

Kemba-Knight-Draftee
Lamb-Monk-Bacon
Ariza-Green-Graham
Draftee-Booker-Tolliver
Cody-Frank

I think that team is definitely better than the one we have. Way more shooting, more scorers and better fits all around. Also doesn't have any huge contracts.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

Trade #1

Charlotte out: Marvin Williams & JOB
Charlotte in: Channing Frye & Jae Crowder

I think that Marvin is underrated here, but step 1 of VG’s rebuild is converting him into a younger player & an expiring contract. This trade also makes MKG fully expendable.


Trade #2

Charlotte out: Nic Batum & Lottery protected 2018 first round pick
Charlotte in: DeAndre Jordan

The cost to get out of Batum’s contract will be steep, but Nic will fit well with the Clips and DeAndre will opt out in Charlotte over the summer.


Trade #3

Charlotte out: Dwight Howard
Charlotte in: Wes Matthews

This is mostly about getting Dwight out. Charlotte trades 2 years of Howard for 2 slightly cheaper years of Wes.


Trade #4

Charlotte out: MKG, MCW, Stone
Charlotte in: Luol Deng & better of either Phoenix, Miami, or Milwaukee’s 2018 First round pick via Phoenix

Phoenix out: Greg Monroe & better of either Phoenix, Miami, or Milwaukee’s 2018 First round pick
Phoenix in: MKG & Julius Randel

Lakers out: Luol Deng & Julius Randel
Lakers in: Greg Monroe, MCW, & Stone

This one is about setting up for the future. Basically it's MKG for Deng and a pick that's likely to end up in the mid to late lottery.


Roster

PG: Kemba, Monk, D-Leaguer
SG: Lamb, Bacon, Wes Matthews
SF: Jae Crowder, Graham*, Luol Deng
PF: Frank, Channing Frye*
C: DeAndre Jordan*, Cody Zeller, D-Leaguer

Team goes all in on making Monk a PG and plays him as Kemba’s backup even if he makes mistakes - the goal is for him to be at least passable by the end of the year. DeAndre does the good things Dwight does without the drama and is potentially resigned or leaves, freeing up cap space. Frank starts at PF and either sinks or swims. A third PG & possibly a 3rd center will need to be found form D-league or wherever. Team will have a single decent draft pick next year if they make the playoffs, or potentially two good picks if they miss. Cap space wise they can have up to $13mil if they let Graham, Frye, & DeAndre go (and a bit less if they have 2 draft picks).

Yes, I know that this team potentially gets a bit worse in all these trades, and has some bad contracts on dudes that can't really play, but they end up in a much better spot for the long haul. More than that, these "temporary" starters fit together much better than what the team has now and they could surprise folks. Bench is far weaker, but forces the young guys to get some floor burn.

[Benjamin Linus]

I would hate doing it, but I'd consider trading Kemba. His trade value will never be higher. He's locked in to one of the best contracts for this season and the next and the closer we get to the end of his contract, the more his value goes down. He's in the prime of his career, no injury issues, and we have all the leverage. I'd try to net something crazy. It would have to be a multi-team trade to bring back all the picks and pieces that I'd want in return.

I'd hold on to Dwight. He has negative trade value ATM (he would be on his fourth team in less than three years, plus see what Atlanta got for him). Trade him next season when he's a giant expiring.

Marv has value to a contender, should be able to get something deece for him.

[HoopsMalone]

I dont think trading Kemba and Marv are the answer. We're still going to be left with all the bad players like dwight, batum, and mkg.... I'd only be willing to trade kemba and marv if we could get rid of them too

[Benjamin Linus]

Clearly, we would be rebuilding in this scenario. I'd rather get picks than cap space if we're rebuilding.

[Roy Tarpley]

I don't think there's much we can do any major changes this year without throwing in the towel on the playoffs, and I'm not quite there yet. I'd most likely end up swallowing the bitter pill of a 38 win season, but after that change would be in order.

If I were the fantasy owner my rough plan would be to start doing all this next summer:

-Quietly inquire about Sam Hinkie's interest. I'm not going for a complete Sixers-style tear down, but instead looking to tinker around the edges now while making savvy moves to stockpile picks in future years. I actually think Hinkie would be good in a situation like Darryl Morey, where the Rockets simply won't let him tank, just because he makes so many great trades. His draft history is also arguably better than Cho's, even if he didn't get to reap the rewards. That's Plan A: Hire Hinkie. Plan B is some other analytic-minded GM who values picks to carry out the following plan:

-Try to move Batum and Dwight. Batum is totally doable, he's still good, we might even get a surprisingly decent asset for him. He never seems to move the needle much when he plays or when he sits, his contract is going to be awful in a couple years, now is the time to cut bait. Dwight is a more difficult guy to unload but he'll only have a 1 year left on his deal by then, and if we can't, so be it. Just play him less.

-Replace Cliff with a coach who embraces the pace and space revolution. I don't have any specific candidates in mind, hopefully someone good gets cut loose but otherwise a fresh face would probably be my choice.

-Invest in the analytics department so it's among the best in the league. Do the same with the medical staff.

-Invest more in international scouting so we can find a use for those 2nd rounders.

-Put Stephanie Ready back in the booth with Curry and Collins.

Tldr: Try to implement a new team culture that makes us Rockets East with a dash of Spurs scouting.

You just described Sean Marks.

[Braggins]

Might be hard to convince someone good to work for MJ. We're probably getting Charles Barkley as GM and Byron Scott as head coach.

[Hornet Mania]

You just described Sean Marks.

I'm definitely a fan of his approach. For a guy who had basically no ammo in the chamber he managed to construct a feisty team with young talent. Your squad's future seems to be in good hands. I think someone with his approach and our assets could whip something decent together.

[LamarMatic7]

Would you guys -- especially the ones who feel like "fans of the team" -- be alright with using Kemba's highest point of value and starting a rebuild with the acknowledgment that this team won't be any better than a first round exit?

Per example, let's say something along the lines of:

Marvin Williams and Kemba Walker for Enes Kanter, Frank Ntilikina, Doug McDermott and a 1st round pick this year (or Noah in the place of Enes and two 1st rounders, Chicago's 2018 2nd rounder)

No you don't need a rebuild while sacrificing kemba, just trade and move a few pieces like batum,Marvin or even mkg and get a few raw talent that can shoot and get monk and bacon rolling. Our true problem is back pg, and injury. If we can fix that we can go deep while still doing a somewhat rebuild with trading.

I don't think you can "just move" the Batum and Marvin pieces. That's why the question itself was something I asked.

Perhaps, there's a perfect moment where someone absolutely needs a Marvin-like player for shooting and passable defense. But, other than that, their contracts and performance are at a point where there has to be a sweetener in the deal for the other team to agree (Hornets take on even worse salary, Hornets send out pick, etc.)

That's why the rebuild out of this "just okay" team will be so freaking hard.

[LamarMatic7]

I would trade Kemba if it made the team better, but I wouldn't do that deal because I don't think it does that. I think Kemba is good enough to build a team around, and right now his salary is easier to do that with. No piece of that deal is worth building around or does much to provide cap relief, so I don't get the point.

The point is that you get extra shots at getting young, new talent, start moving on from your veteran pieces (the Batum, Marvin contracts) and prepare for the day when the 6-1 Kemba will be 29 and will command a new, hefty deal.

Nothing against him. If anything, that might be the loyalty type of deal you talked about. He might beat the odds. But usually that's where the money paid/production of 30-year-old point guard ratio goes sour.

Don't see how this is a scenario in the real world - "I think Kemba is good enough to build a team around, and right now his salary is easier to do that with"

There's only one summer left before Kemba is a free agent. The Hornets already have $118 million on the books for the season after it.

[LamarMatic7]

I bet you MCW's NBA career is over once he leaves here.

Cho is pretty good at signing guys to their last NBA deal. Hibbert... MCW... Stone... reggie williams? We'll count Hawes since he stupidly traded for him on his last deal

His collective effort with Rod Higgins during those years where we didn't know how big is Higgins's role in the franchise would make up a whopping 12-man roster of borderline NBA players.

They were tanking so it's a bit too easy to poke fun at some of the guys they tried out. However, they always went for the most random fliers. Like, what percentage of a chance was there that Sherron Collins or Jamario Moon would be a part of the team that would then win 20 games next season, 30 games the year after that, etc.?

Or were they simply expert tankers? Tough to say, tough to say.... One of these days I'll demand a Charlotte Bobcats 7-59 oral history where the following topics will be explored:

Was the Cory Higgins signing nepotism at its worst in the NBA?

How close was Paul Silas to actually landing a punch on Tyrus Thomas?

The stand out story of Boris Diaw just not giving a **** about his effort and his physical shape.

Was there ever an idea for a lighthearted sketch starring Byron Mullens and D.J. White as two incompetent airport security men who just keep screwing up and allow unchecked goods being brought in the country?

Who was the person who suffered most of Michael Jordan's rage when they lost the lottery, started showing him "Michael Kidd-Gilchrist draft prospect" videos and reached the part about his jumpshot?

Was there a moment where Rich looked at Rod and asked him "does your conscience allow you to sleep, knowing that the god DeSagana Diop could be chasing a ring, instead of toiling away in our 7-win team?"

[JDR720]

I still really like Derrick Brown from the random bums we have had over the years.

Would totally sign him now.

[catch20two]

Lamar came in here spitting venomous truth.

[yosemiteben]

I would trade Kemba if it made the team better, but I wouldn't do that deal because I don't think it does that. I think Kemba is good enough to build a team around, and right now his salary is easier to do that with. No piece of that deal is worth building around or does much to provide cap relief, so I don't get the point.

The point is that you get extra shots at getting young, new talent, start moving on from your veteran pieces (the Batum, Marvin contracts) and prepare for the day when the 6-1 Kemba will be 29 and will command a new, hefty deal.

Nothing against him. If anything, that might be the loyalty type of deal you talked about. He might beat the odds. But usually that's where the money paid/production of 30-year-old point guard ratio goes sour.

Don't see how this is a scenario in the real world - "I think Kemba is good enough to build a team around, and right now his salary is easier to do that with"

There's only one summer left before Kemba is a free agent. The Hornets already have $118 million on the books for the season after it.

Your last point is exactly why we should be trading other guys instead of Kemba. It make more sense to me to keep our best player who also has the lowest cap hit relative to his production. It makes very little sense to me to trade him for pieces that can't be built around because we're stuck with a bunch of other expensive pieces that also can't be built around. We have 18 months to plan out summer of 2019, but the fact that Batum or Dwight is expensive isn't a reason to trade Kemba.

I get the idea of getting young talent, but I'm not moving Kemba to kick the tires on youth. I would have to be confident that one of those pieces is a can't miss.

[SeanBobcats]

I wouldn't move Kemba unless we could get a certain value of picks/prospects. Howard and Batum are the ones I'd love to see off the roster, but the question is how easy can that happen

[JDR720]

we could very well run into a mini OKC/Durant situation.

Not trading him and risking him leaving for nothing is definitely risky. You cant lose All-Star players for nothing. I would offer an extension in the offseason and if he doesn't take it i would trade him.

[Bassman]

All of this discussion leads one to the inevitable truth. There is no fixing this team. Seriously, what team would, today, give us a late 1st, or even a 2nd round pick for Batum...even if they have the cap space? We can't do that deal anyway because we are OVER the cap. Every trade we'd make, short of perhaps Kemba, brings us back pennies on the dollar.

This team bet big on existing players and lost.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

To stay here Kemba will #1 have to be paid & #2 be happy with the situation. To meet both of those a good team will have to be in place with a coach he is comfortable with. Once Kemba is paid the team's flexibility is limited. JDR's suggestion of offering an extension is a reasonable idea on the face of it ... but a signed extension would lock the team down cap wise and there would be little ability to improve.

The team has painted itself into a corner cap wise. *IF* this group of guys was working out and winning then that might be one thing, but they aren't.

I don't want to trade Kemba, but I'm at a point where I feel like it could happen.

[catch20two]

All of this discussion leads one to the inevitable truth. There is no fixing this team. Seriously, what team would, today, give us a late 1st, or even a 2nd round pick for Batum...even if they have the cap space? We can't do that deal anyway because we are OVER the cap. Every trade we'd make, short of perhaps Kemba, brings us back pennies on the dollar.

This team bet big on existing players and lost.

Cho is 99% getting fired. Clifford already stealthily exited the building.

[JDR720]

All of this discussion leads one to the inevitable truth. There is no fixing this team. Seriously, what team would, today, give us a late 1st, or even a 2nd round pick for Batum...even if they have the cap space? We can't do that deal anyway because we are OVER the cap. Every trade we'd make, short of perhaps Kemba, brings us back pennies on the dollar.

This team bet big on existing players and lost.

Batum would have to be a swap between us and another poor contract. Dwight will have value as an expiring and Marvin would be useful on a contender.

Nic for DeMarre Carroll
Nic for Mozgov
Nic for Marco and Plumlee (would be beyond hilarious)
Nic for Wes Matthews
Nic for Wilson Chandler
Nic for Deng
Nic for Parsons
Nic for Asik
Nic for Evan Turner

The ones in bold are the ones i think are the most possible. Obviously Nic has played in Portland and the Nets just need some decent players.

a mega deal between us and the nets: Nets gets Nic and Dwight (they wanted him before) Charlotte gets Carroll, Mozgov and Lin.