Frank Kaminsky #2 - Not Extended (UFA)

[catch20two]

how many interim coaches overhaul a defensive scheme mid season?

Don’t need a overhaul. Just a few tweaks. These guys are professional basketball players that have been doing this stuff for at least 10-15 years if not more. They didn’t learn basketball a few years ago. There’s not much they haven’t seen or done before.

Our offense is worse than our defense. That’s where the primary focus should be at anyway.

Its incredibly hard to justify in our case too because we're not even a bad defensive team. It'd be one thing if we were the Kings out there or something but that's just not the case. I don't think its fair to throw that at Silas. Especially when the team has been fighting injuries at every position this year and was struggling to get back on the same page even up to the Zeller injury.

I think we’re beyond the injury excuses.

John Wall has missed about one-third of the Wizards games and they’re still top 4 in the East.

The Celtics lost Gordon Hayward for the season in their very first game.

The Raptors have had just about everyone in their rotation outside of DeRozan and Lowry in and out of the lineup due to injuries.

The Bucks entire bench rotation has missed about 5 games each but they’ve been able to fill in with end of the bench players to keep themselves well above .500

The Heat have been way more injury-riddled than us with their most integral players missing games from Dragic to Whiteside to Waiters.

The Pistons are about to be without Reggie Jackson for about 2 months so we’ll see if they can stay above .500 the next several games.

[DY_nasty]

Don’t need a overhaul. Just a few tweaks. These guys are professional basketball players that have been doing this stuff for at least 10-15 years if not more. They didn’t learn basketball a few years ago. There’s not much they haven’t seen or done before.

Our offense is worse than our defense. That’s where the primary focus should be at anyway.

Its incredibly hard to justify in our case too because we're not even a bad defensive team. It'd be one thing if we were the Kings out there or something but that's just not the case. I don't think its fair to throw that at Silas. Especially when the team has been fighting injuries at every position this year and was struggling to get back on the same page even up to the Zeller injury.

I think we’re beyond the injury excuses.

John Wall has missed about one-third of the Wizards games and they’re still top 4 in the East.

The Celtics lost Gordon Hayward for the season in their very first game.

The Raptors have had just about everyone in their rotation outside of DeRozan and Lowry in and out of the lineup due to injuries.

The Bucks entire bench rotation has missed about 5 games each but they’ve been able to fill in with end of the bench players to keep themselves well above .500

The Heat have been way more injury-riddled than us with their most integral players missing games from Dragic to Whiteside to Waiters.

The Pistons are about to be without Reggie Jackson for about 2 months so we’ll see if they can stay above .500 the next several games.

....how you just gonna be like injuries at every position early in the year while having one of the most difficult schedules isn't a big deal?

I'm not saying that its the reason this team sucks, I'm saying that its absolutely why the team can't make the same adjustments that others can at this point in the season.

The thing is, none of those teams have an offense predicated on playing literally perfect basketball without error to be functional either on that end. The offense has been an indictment on Cliff, and there's been significant shifts by Silas already. But the defensively?

We're actually still an above average defensive team and somehow steadily improving. You gotta kinda scapegoat Silas if you want to say he's somehow making the situation worse or something.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

he's always been bad. some of you managed to convince yourselves that he was a serviceable defender, but he is not. I'm ready to cut our losses and trade him for a backup PG.

He was decent his rookie season defensively. He was usually where he was supposed to be on rotations and positioned himself well to contest shots. He just wasn’t strong or long enough (pause) to be a statistically effective defender.

Good post, this is my view on him.

I strongly disagree with the take that Cliff is a bad defensive coach though. What are these defensive strengths that Frank has that Cliff neglected?

This is probably edging into something that should be in the Cliff thread, but the Hornets have not been as good at defense either this year or last as they were early in Cliff's tenure here. I do believe that part of it is the NBA changing, part of it is personnel (Nic doesn't defend as well as Henderson used to for example), and most importantly the team as a whole doesn't seem to have bought into the whole thing as strongly. That last one is totally IMHO, but Cliff talked a bit about that at the end of last season and it seems to have carried over to this one.

Frank's DRtg & DBPM
2015-16 105 & -1.2
2016-17 110 & -1.5 (injury year)
2017-18 109 & -0.6

Kemba's DRtg & DBPM
2014-15 105 & 0.1
2015-16 104 & 0.0
2016-17 111 & -1.7
2017-18 109 & -1.1

[yosemiteben]

I just brought that up because I saw Hugo say the staff isn't good enough to capitalize on Frank's strengths right after catch was talking about his bad defense. I'd love to see the argument for Frank's defensive strengths that are coaching staff can't figure out.

[catch20two]

Its incredibly hard to justify in our case too because we're not even a bad defensive team. It'd be one thing if we were the Kings out there or something but that's just not the case. I don't think its fair to throw that at Silas. Especially when the team has been fighting injuries at every position this year and was struggling to get back on the same page even up to the Zeller injury.

I think we’re beyond the injury excuses.

John Wall has missed about one-third of the Wizards games and they’re still top 4 in the East.

The Celtics lost Gordon Hayward for the season in their very first game.

The Raptors have had just about everyone in their rotation outside of DeRozan and Lowry in and out of the lineup due to injuries.

The Bucks entire bench rotation has missed about 5 games each but they’ve been able to fill in with end of the bench players to keep themselves well above .500

The Heat have been way more injury-riddled than us with their most integral players missing games from Dragic to Whiteside to Waiters.

The Pistons are about to be without Reggie Jackson for about 2 months so we’ll see if they can stay above .500 the next several games.

....how you just gonna be like injuries at every position early in the year while having one of the most difficult schedules isn't a big deal?

I'm not saying that its the reason this team sucks, I'm saying that its absolutely why the team can't make the same adjustments that others can at this point in the season.

The thing is, none of those teams have an offense predicated on playing literally perfect basketball without error to be functional either on that end. The offense has been an indictment on Cliff, and there's been significant shifts by Silas already. But the defensively?

We're actually still an above average defensive team and somehow steadily improving. You gotta kinda scapegoat Silas if you want to say he's somehow making the situation worse or something.

I’m just saying...every team has had injuries. We’re not exempt in that matter. We’ve had our best players in the lineup for the most part. I wish MCW was still injured. We’d be better off.

I agree with mostly everything else about the indictments on Cliff but Silas is not going to go unscathed in the midst. At least not me. Silas has been a part of this team longer than Cliff. As the associate head coach and lead assistant Silas has his input on how this team is ran. We actually got worse when Silas stepped in but we may have turned a corner since that Warriors win. We shall see.

[DY_nasty]

Every team doesn't have injuries at every position and still rely on playing perfect on offense to look average though lol

we've seen this team get derailed over a cody zeller injury before. there's no way this group can operate outside the margins like that

i feel like i'm missing something on silas, because its not like he's "just" player development either lol - he was acting coach several times in the past too so its kinda ....i don't even know the word... to kinda minimize his role with the team and at the same time find a way to attribute everything to him at the same time doesn't make sense to me yet

[catch20two]

Every team doesn't have injuries at every position and still rely on playing perfect on offense to look average though lol

we've seen this team get derailed over a cody zeller injury before. there's no way this group can operate outside the margins like that

i feel like i'm missing something on silas, because its not like he's "just" player development either lol - he was acting coach several times in the past too so its kinda ....i don't even know the word... to kinda minimize his role with the team and at the same time find a way to attribute everything to him at the same time doesn't make sense to me yet

You’re affirming what I’m saying about our coaches, that our offensive scheme doesn’t work if requires perfection because in reality nothing is perfect and that includes injuries. Other teams are able to stride through injuries like a bump in the road while we use injuries as a excuse for why we have to detour into losing records.

The fact that our team is reliant on a role player like Cody being healthy to be a winning team is the saddest crock of a excuse I’ve ever heard.

As far as Silas I’m just saying that I’m not going to allow him to go without criticism even though he doesn’t deserve the brunt of the blame.

When I mention his job titles that he’s had over the years that’s not to minimize him. That’s telling it like it is. He’s been a assistant coach, he’s been a acting head coach under Papa Silas. He’s been head of player development. He’s also been associate head coach. Now he’s the interim head coach.

[DY_nasty]

Every team doesn't have injuries at every position and still rely on playing perfect on offense to look average though lol

we've seen this team get derailed over a cody zeller injury before. there's no way this group can operate outside the margins like that

i feel like i'm missing something on silas, because its not like he's "just" player development either lol - he was acting coach several times in the past too so its kinda ....i don't even know the word... to kinda minimize his role with the team and at the same time find a way to attribute everything to him at the same time doesn't make sense to me yet

You’re affirming what I’m saying about our coaches, that our offensive scheme doesn’t work if requires perfection because in reality nothing is perfect and that includes injuries. Other teams are able to stride through injuries like a bump in the road while we use injuries as a excuse for why we have to detour into losing records.

The fact that our team is reliant on a role player like Cody being healthy to be a winning team is the saddest crock of a excuse I’ve ever heard.

As far as Silas I’m just saying that I’m not going to allow him to go without criticism even though he doesn’t deserve the brunt of the blame.

When I mention his job titles that he’s had over the years that’s not to minimize him. That’s telling it like it is. He’s been a assistant coach, he’s been a acting head coach under Papa Silas. He’s been head of player development. He’s also been associate head coach. Now he’s the interim head coach.

That's not what I'm saying at at all. I'm saying that our offense has to run with almost zero hiccups to even be average. No turnovers, every screen has to be godlike, we have to dominate possessions, etc. That's got nothing to do with injuries either - its an offense that isn't even realistic in today's NBA. Its inherently broken. The offense is stuck on everyone working in a locked in fashion and that's exactly why Marvin over Lin was a much easier decision than it should've been (not that I disagree, just that the FO/CS operates on how good guys are in the system vs how much they can add to it or create within it - I just feel that's a good example to illustrate my point).

Also, what other guy who's just player development regularly acts a interim coach? Player development is a very focused role for most organizations. Its not something where you just switch hats and go from focusing on 2-3 players to the entirety of the roster. Silas' role was never limited to that at any point since he's been in Charlotte. So again, I'm kinda confused there lol. I guess I'm sayin I don't get the knock or history of failure you're putting to him.

Assistant coaches that oversee that still maintain a portion of that responsibility, sure, but its not the same thing. Is there something I'm missing on that? Because I don't think its fair to say that x players didn't work out and that's how you can tell that its this guy's fault for not creating an instant turn around for a team with a host of issues.

also frank always sucked on defense

[catch20two]

I’d argue that at our best offensively we’ve been much better than average offensively. Talking about 2015-16 season to be exact. We were top 10 offensively that year.

Silas gonna get some blame from me regardless of how much you want to champion him because you like him. He’s been a mainstay to all of our inconsistencies as a franchise. So that’s that. If the guy doesn’t have any say so or importance on how our team is ran then there’s no reason he should be valued enough to stick around all of these years.

And Frank was solid defensively his rookie year as evidenced by his positive DBPM.

[DY_nasty]

I’d argue that at our best offensively we’ve been much better than average offensively. Talking about 2015-16 season to be exact. We were top 10 offensively that year.

Silas gonna get some blame from me regardless of how much you want to champion him because you like him. He’s been a mainstay to all of our inconsistencies as a franchise. So that’s that. If the guy doesn’t have any say so or importance on how our team is ran then there’s no reason he should be valued enough to stick around all of these years.

And Frank was solid defensively his rookie year as evidenced by his positive DBPM.

I'm hardly championing the guy. At least I don't think so. I just don't get how he's a 'cause' for any of the present situation or somehow making things worse.

I'm still trying to figure that one out the guy's task is to pick up a horrendous start and right the ship knowing he's not in a position to make drastic lineup changes (batum/mcw). Its been a few weeks now and the team has actually kinda sorta just a little bit maybe even improved.

Why are we calling for his head by association to Clifford when he's not even Clifford's direct hire? This isn't even an honest try out either. Most young head coach hires get a 2-3 year conditional deal with some sort of established relationship with the FO. There's no indication that Silas even has the intention to run anything on the court that we see, that he wants keep any of the players, or know what kind of communication he has with the FO regarding the staff as a whole.

[catch20two]

Bobby Portis breaking Nikola Mirotic jaw might’ve knocked some sense into him. He’s been playing crazy good since his return. Chicago likely about to get Favors in return for him.

I always like to compare Kaminsky and Mirotic. If I could’ve chose one I would’ve taken Kaminsky despite it all because I’ve seen Mirotic be just as bad. I’d probably still take Kaminsky over Mirotic to this day.

With that said somebody on the team need to punch Kaminsky. Who will it be?

[Liver_Pooty]

Bobby Portis breaking Nikola Mirotic jaw might’ve knocked some sense into him. He’s been playing crazy good since his return. Chicago likely about to get Favors in return for him.

I always like to compare Kaminsky and Mirotic. If I could’ve chose one I would’ve taken Kaminsky despite it all because I’ve seen Mirotic be just as bad. I’d probably still take Kaminsky over Mirotic to this day.

With that said somebody on the team need to punch Kaminsky. Who will it be?

Monk looks like hes ready to stomp some ass at any given moment.

[Hugo The Hornet]

Bobby Portis breaking Nikola Mirotic jaw might’ve knocked some sense into him. He’s been playing crazy good since his return. Chicago likely about to get Favors in return for him.

I always like to compare Kaminsky and Mirotic. If I could’ve chose one I would’ve taken Kaminsky despite it all because I’ve seen Mirotic be just as bad. I’d probably still take Kaminsky over Mirotic to this day.

With that said somebody on the team need to punch Kaminsky. Who will it be?

I guess Malik Monk is the most suitable for the mission.

[HornetJail]

Bobby Portis breaking Nikola Mirotic jaw might’ve knocked some sense into him. He’s been playing crazy good since his return. Chicago likely about to get Favors in return for him.

I always like to compare Kaminsky and Mirotic. If I could’ve chose one I would’ve taken Kaminsky despite it all because I’ve seen Mirotic be just as bad. I’d probably still take Kaminsky over Mirotic to this day.

With that said somebody on the team need to punch Kaminsky. Who will it be?

I guess Malik Monk is the most suitable for the mission.

no, Clifford will bench him all season for that, and that just means more MCW and more Batum running at half power

[HornetJail]

Bobby Portis breaking Nikola Mirotic jaw might’ve knocked some sense into him. He’s been playing crazy good since his return. Chicago likely about to get Favors in return for him.

I always like to compare Kaminsky and Mirotic. If I could’ve chose one I would’ve taken Kaminsky despite it all because I’ve seen Mirotic be just as bad. I’d probably still take Kaminsky over Mirotic to this day.

With that said somebody on the team need to punch Kaminsky. Who will it be?

Monk looks like hes ready to stomp some ass at any given moment.

If Monk fought MCW I wouldn't even blame him

[catch20two]

no, Clifford will bench him all season for that, and that just means more MCW and more Batum running at half power

What’s new? He’s already pretty much benched for the season barring a injury to MCW. And I’m under the impression that Silas will be the coach for the rest of the season and is making his own decision to bench Monk at the moment.

[Robot Rock]

Bobby Portis breaking Nikola Mirotic jaw might’ve knocked some sense into him. He’s been playing crazy good since his return. Chicago likely about to get Favors in return for him.

I always like to compare Kaminsky and Mirotic. If I could’ve chose one I would’ve taken Kaminsky despite it all because I’ve seen Mirotic be just as bad. I’d probably still take Kaminsky over Mirotic to this day.

With that said somebody on the team need to punch Kaminsky. Who will it be?

Monk looks like hes ready to stomp some ass at any given moment.

If Monk fought MCW I wouldn't even blame him

I'd pay more to see that than I'd pay to see a game

[yosemiteben]

Frank in our last 15 - 11 points, 44% FG, 40% 3PT

[HornetJail]

Frank in our last 15 - 11 points, 44% FG, 40% 3PT

His last 9 has been the most consistent stretch we've seen out of him. No super crazy highs but only one real dud. 16, 14, 9, 14, 16, 12, 12, 10, 16. 44/45/81 splits. 13.2ppg

[catch20two]

Who’s “one legged step back” is better between Frank and Batum?