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Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts

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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#81 » by amcoolio » Thu Nov 19, 2020 1:42 am

LaMelo-

Hated the kid at first, but quickly warmed up to him over the last few weeks before the draft due to good reports and work ethic. I like him the most out of the top 3 of Wiseman/Edwards/Ball. I am weary of Edwards work ethic and his red flags with not liking basketball, but he will be a good player. I think Wiseman will be another Hassan Whiteside, and you can get those types of players easier. LaMelo has the most star potential and can unlock our offense.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#82 » by BigSlam » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:10 am

2020 pick #3 = LaMelo Ball

He was 4th on my personal big board, and even then I wasn't super feeling him.

I think we have drafted him with the hope of him somehow developing a reliable jump shot and that he will stop taking bad shots, things he's said he doesn't want to change. We are also banking on him also improving his defense enough that doesn't make him a liability like he currently is. My worry is that his ability to improve in these areas exceeds how much he will be able to in order to morph into that super star status the "Ball-ievers" think he can/will reach.

I think there will be highlight plays but I think there will be many, many more frustrating plays.

I'll fully support him now he is ours, but I am not optimistic.

I will add that I am very happy that we didn't use any assets to trade up and instead stood pat and took Ball #3 without having to give anything up.



P.S. I am trade marking "Ball-ievers".
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#83 » by DY_nasty » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:24 am

i'm not excited obviously, but hoping for the best nonetheless
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#84 » by KEMBAtheMETEOR » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:25 am

it won't ever happen for optics reasons, but Greensboro did wonders for Devonte', and even Martin and McDaniels looked reasonably polished after half a season there. Wouldn't be the worst thing for him initially especially with no offseason to train with the team.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#85 » by amcoolio » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:32 am

KEMBAtheMETEOR wrote:it won't ever happen for optics reasons, but Greensboro did wonders for Devonte', and even Martin and McDaniels looked reasonably polished after half a season there. Wouldn't be the worst thing for him initially especially with no offseason to train with the team.


I seem to remember Marks asking every prospect if they would spend time in the G-League and some players that he wouldn't name said "Don't draft me then" but that Ball was the only one that said he would so he could constantly play basketball and improve
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#86 » by LofJ » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:32 am

KEMBAtheMETEOR wrote:it won't ever happen for optics reasons, but Greensboro did wonders for Devonte', and even Martin and McDaniels looked reasonably polished after half a season there. Wouldn't be the worst thing for him initially especially with no offseason to train with the team.


That's because we have one of the best development coaches in the NBA - Nick Friedman. Folks around the league think he'll be a head coach down the line. I hope we can keep him in NC for a few more years.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#87 » by KEMBAtheMETEOR » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:33 am

amcoolio wrote:
KEMBAtheMETEOR wrote:it won't ever happen for optics reasons, but Greensboro did wonders for Devonte', and even Martin and McDaniels looked reasonably polished after half a season there. Wouldn't be the worst thing for him initially especially with no offseason to train with the team.


I seem to remember Marks asking every prospect if they would spend time in the G-League and some players that he wouldn't name said "Don't draft me then" but that Ball was the only one that said he would so he could constantly play basketball and improve

Interesting note. Being coachable is important because holy **** he's gonna need it
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#88 » by Chapelchilla » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:34 am

I think we may actually get a few national TV games in the upcoming years< especially on City jersey nights....
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#89 » by countryboi » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:19 am

We didnt do anything dumb to get Ball, He has some NBA elite level skills like his court vision, passing and dribbling. his shot selection is one of some who thinks they are a dead eye shooter and his defense is just trash. if he can get his shot to match his confidence and just give a damn on defense, he could be a major problem. these are some major IFs and I dont like drafting another player that cant shoot but he has the tools to be the best player we have ever drafted

yall asked for a boom or bust pick...well
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#90 » by BigSlam » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:22 am

2020 pick #32 = Vernon Carey Jr

I think I would have preferred Oturu, but I aint angry about Carey.

I liked the size of Oturu and the fact he offers rim protection and already shoots the 3 pretty well, but Carey seems more polished I guess - and is about 2 years younger than Oturu.

If Carey can be a more athletic, modern version of prime Al Jefferson that might not be a bad thing.

I'm down with this pick.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post 2020 Draft thoughts 

Post#91 » by JMAC3 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:26 am

JMAC3 wrote:Pick 3: Happy with whoever falls out of Ball, Edwards and Wiseman- in that order I guess, but Edwards has me all over the map.

Rooting for us not to trade up (see no point in losing assets at this point in rebuild)

Guys I like and will root for: Deni, Okongwu, Vassell, Maxey, Okoro, Bey

Guys I don't think will be great for where they are taken: Haliburton, Hayes, Williams, Toppin


Obviously quoting this from earlier in the night. As you can see Ball was my number 1 guy so to get him at 3 without having to trade up made my night. Think we have a chance to make some noise in a few years and ultimately believe Wiseman was limited upside and Edwards character were more concerning than Melo's.

Also think we did pretty well in second round, Carey and Richards should give us much needed depth at Center. Riller is shot in the dark, but he can apparently fill it up so never bad to have a guy like that waiting in the wings.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#92 » by cornchip » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:08 am

My guess: Wiseman was at the top of our board and Minny was asking for too much (probaly Miles and a lightly protected 2021 1st).

So we took Ball who is intriguing and talented but I struggle to see the fit. It seems like he's best in transition but who knows what kind of rebounding team we'll be.

It's really going to come down to his shooting imo. I think the FO saw enough in his shooting potential to think he'll be servicable. If he can't shoot, how does he beat defenders using his passing? He isn't overpowerful going to like Simmons, Doncic, and Mitchell, he can't use the threat of his jumper like Murray or Kemba, and he doesn't have the explosive quickness of a Mitchell or Westbrook. It actually reminds me of Lonzo except LaMelo is bigger and more adept in the pick and roll.

On the Carey pick, you could always use a big guy who can bang a bit....but he got switched out on and beat in college. I think he has value but I see him as a situational player.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#93 » by CuseMayne » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:39 am

LaMelo - Hopefully I can be proved wrong as he's been the player I wanted to avoid during this whole process. As the initial disappointment has worn off, though, if he's going to work his tail off to be a servicable shooter, he does have a few elite skills, and we have young pieces all around that will, at least, make us a fun team to watch. Him being 6'7 could work to play alongside Tae/Terry/Malik, and if he's able to open everything up for Miles/PJ/Twins/McDaniels, it could be really cool. It's a boom or bust pick that nobody can fault us for doing, and it either really clicks or we go back to the drawing board (and the next 2 drafts are seemingly amazing). I think a lot of my, perhaps unfair, bias is how annoyed I've been with the family (mainly LaVar) for the last few years.

Vernon Carey Jr. - Seems pretty promising. Again, at first my knee jerk reaction was negative and that we were picking a slow C with uninspiring measurables that seemed to just be a good college player and the second coming of Al Jefferson at best. The fact that he's seemingly been working a ton and dropped 30 pounds, had a very impressive freshman year, and seems pretty damn polished for a 19 year old has me optimistic. If he earns it I think he should be the backup C this year.

Nick Richards - Similar measurables to Wiseman, seems really athletic and made big strides at Kentucky this year, and for a 2024 second round pick, seems like a solid gamble. Him and Carey seem like opposite players, so it's cool to in a way pit them against one another. After watching some highlights, he reminds me of Nerlens Noel a bit. Definitely happy that we're taking another chance in this draft for some legitimate size and length down low. Might have previous chemistry with PJ as well. See how he does in the G-League, will be a fun player to monitor.

Grant Riller - At first kinda threw my hands up wondering why we picked another PG. Then watched some tape, and sheesh, looks like the guy is a professional scorer. Definitely worth taking a chance at the 56th pick. Three level scorer with a deadly first step and sneaky athleticism at 6'3. Reminded me a bit of Fred VanVleet...who went undrafted and earned his way from the G-League to a big time contributor for a championship. So yeah, let him ball out in the G-League and see what happens.

Nate Darling - Looks like he averaged 21.0PPG for Delaware in 2019-2020. Presumably a shooter, seems like a reasonable candidate for a two-way contract. Let's see how he does in the G-League. Pretty cool name, seems harmless/fitting for a Canadian.

My draft grade for 2020: B+
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#94 » by Vanderbilt_Grad » Thu Nov 19, 2020 1:06 pm

LaMelo Ball – The team didn’t give up assets to move up and still got a guy that most of the national media was projecting to be the best player available at #1. There are real concerns around LaMelo, but his best case outcome is absurdly good. He was a no-brainer pick at #3 given that the team’s better fit targets (Edwards & Wiseman) were off the board. I have a good feeling about his development path and Charlotte as a landing spot for him in that respect … but I also forecast long term difficulty with both his family and with him wanting to be in a larger market. For the record Okongwu, Halliburton, and Vassell were the guys I most wanted, but I can’t be mad about the LaMelo pick. He has the most upside and potential will alter the course of the franchise for years to come.

Vernon Carey Jr. – Love this pick. I’m skeptical of burning lottery picks on traditional big men, but getting a guy with Carey’s offensive potential in the second round is amazing. Gut feeling is that he will turn out to be a starter and will play really well with LaMelo. I would have picked Xavier Tillman in a vacuum, but Vernon is probably a better fit with LaMelo.

Nick Richards – Can bring the defense that Carey hasn’t show so far. Really like that the team drafted someone with a very different skillset and can see which one develops. I expect that he’ll be an NBA player for several years which is really all you can ask for with a 2nd round pick. Nick is found money since none of us were expecting Mitch to trade for a pick.

Grant Riller – If Riller develops this pick has the potential to be a steal. The team has had really good luck with 2nd round guys so far, and Riller seems like the kind of guy who could actually make it. Had no preference here, but was happy with the pick.

Overall I have to give the team an A-. This was a strong draft showing by Mitch.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#95 » by UNCNYC » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:01 pm

WHO WE CHOSE -

Ball - I like this pick. I think he has good enough upside and if he pans out he can help add other big names.
We can also shop Graham and Zozier.

Carey - Not big on this pick. I think he has an old school game that is coming back but not quite current in the league.
Also can be better defensively. Might have a weight issue.

Riller - I would like this pick more if he didn't have an injury. Good news is that injury came after his first year so he
has gone strong since then.

-----
WHO I WOULD HAVE CHOSEN -

3 - Tyrell Terry - I would have selected Terry and acquired a future first rounder

32 - Tyler Bey - Bey ended up being my pick here

56 - Isaiah Joe

-----
WHO I ENDED UP CHOOSING -

3 - Tyrell Terry - With a future 1st

32 - Tyler Bey

56 - Paul Reed

-----
DRAFTED SLEEPERS -

Skylar Mays, Jay Scrubb, CJ Elleby

----
UNDRAFTED players I wanted -

LaMar Stevens, Keandre Cook, Ty'Shon Alexander, Karim Mane
UPDATED 11-21-2020

3 - Tyrell Terry - + future 1st

32 - Tyler Bey

56 - Isaiah Joe, Ty'shon Alexander

L Stevens, D Dotson, Rayshaun Hamm, Josh Hall, K Mane, Hinton, Mason J, Cumberland

Sleepers - Mays, Scrubb, Elleby, Krejci

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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#96 » by wilson115 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:28 pm

UNCNYC wrote:WHO WE CHOSE -

Carey - Not big on this pick. I think he has an old school game that is coming back but not quite current in the league.
Also can be better defensively. Might have a weight issue.

Riller - I would like this pick more if he didn't have an injury. Good news is that injury came after his first year so he
has gone strong since then.

Carey - Thought the same until I saw his high school tape. Wasn't a post-up big until Coach K stuck him at center, like Calipari did with Bam. Not saying he'll do a Bam here but a PnR/pop big doing screens and dribble hand-offs out on the perimeter doesn't look out of reach seeing the tape. Only 19-years-old.

Riller - Averaged five boards per game as a senior. Think he's over it.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#97 » by -Ian- » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:03 pm

I wanted to have Wiseman or Hayes but I still like the LaMelo pick. I'm confident that our coaching staff and the young guys we have will have a good effect on him. He may have said that he doesn't think his shooting form needs some work but that will change. I hope Melo turns out to be a superstar because God knows we're long overdue.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#98 » by vorbis » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:25 pm

I'm good with LaMelo, for the record. at #3 you should be swinging for the fences. and I think he's a swing for the fences type pick. not because he's boom or bust, but because the higher limit of his potential is a first-team all-NBA type.

I don't think LaMelo's floor is particularly low, because I sense he has matured quite a bit in part due to his unique journey as a teenager. I'm not particularly worried about the Ball in the family angle as long as there's no friction about LaMelo's role. if there is trouble in paradise at some point, all bets are off.

but in the meantime, he's got a couple legitimate top-3-in-the-NBA traits (court vision, handles). I'm not super worried about his shot to be honest. more worried about his mindset on defense. I think you can get away with being an indifferent defender in some situations, but once that becomes baked into your profile as a pro, I don't see many instances of that changing with coaching or motivation or a different role or whatever. hopefully it was just a blip from him playing on a terrible NBL team with different terminology, unclear expectations, and that sort of thing.
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#99 » by amcoolio » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:39 pm

Just a reminder but you need to post who you would have taken at each pick
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Re: Not Revisionist History: Post LaMelo Ball thoughts 

Post#100 » by tondi123 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:44 pm

Not to be a Negative Nancy because I'm OK with the Ball pick but whats the over/under on the first media story about how he wants out of Charlotte? Two years, perhaps three? I assume it will depend on how well he plays. The better he plays the quicker the media will generate rumors about him wanting to leave. If he's a bust nobody will care.

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