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Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball

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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#81 » by amcoolio » Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:41 pm

Is Ball even better than Lonzo Ball?

They both don't shoot well, but Lonzo is much much better defender, and while not as great a passer still in the upper 5% in the NBA I would say in passing.

I just don't see it with this guy. He also doesn't fit personality wise with Graham, Miles or PJ.
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#82 » by driveandkick » Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:46 pm

amcoolio wrote:Is Ball even better than Lonzo Ball?

They both don't shoot well, but Lonzo is much much better defender, and while not as great a passer still in the upper 5% in the NBA I would say in passing.

I just don't see it with this guy. He also doesn't fit personality wise with Graham, Miles or PJ.

Before getting to the rest, what do you mean he doesn't fit personality wise? By all accounts he is a terrific lockerroom guy that is very humble.
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1) LaMelo Ball
2) Anthony Edwards
3) Killian Hayes
4) Onyeka Okongwu
5) Deni Avdija
6) James Wiseman
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#83 » by amcoolio » Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:52 pm

driveandkick wrote:
amcoolio wrote:Is Ball even better than Lonzo Ball?

They both don't shoot well, but Lonzo is much much better defender, and while not as great a passer still in the upper 5% in the NBA I would say in passing.

I just don't see it with this guy. He also doesn't fit personality wise with Graham, Miles or PJ.


Before getting to the rest, what do you mean he doesn't fit personality wise? By all accounts he is a terrific lockerroom guy that is very humble.


I'll have to do more research on him I guess, I was going by interviews I've seen from him so far. But I guess Derrick Rose interviewed poorly too.
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#84 » by 316Hornets » Sun Aug 23, 2020 8:18 pm

LaMelo has a hunger. The type of hunger you see from a guy like Lebron. You can sense it in him, never satisfied with where he's at. Always thinking two, three steps ahead. Physical gifts are one thing, mental gifts are something else. LaMelo will succeed because he is focused on doing just that.

And, that's the difference between Lonzo and LaMelo. Lonzo doesn't hunger for success the same way LaMelo does.
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Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#85 » by BigSlam » Sun Aug 23, 2020 8:30 pm

driveandkick wrote:
amcoolio wrote:Is Ball even better than Lonzo Ball?

They both don't shoot well, but Lonzo is much much better defender, and while not as great a passer still in the upper 5% in the NBA I would say in passing.

I just don't see it with this guy. He also doesn't fit personality wise with Graham, Miles or PJ.

Before getting to the rest, what do you mean he doesn't fit personality wise? By all accounts he is a terrific lockerroom guy that is very humble.

Ya, I’m pretty sure he represented himself really well when in Australia. I think there were some question marks years ago, but that might have been more “guilt by association” because his Dad is a knob.

I think I remember reading that one of the reasons LaMelo went to play in Australia was to get away from all that nonsense and to become his own person - and he impressed people in Australia with his commitment to practice and how he interacted with his teammates.


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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#86 » by 316Hornets » Sun Aug 23, 2020 8:32 pm

chabber wrote:Ryan Russillo roasted Lemelo the other day on the ringer draft lottery podcast. He said watching full games of LeMelo play on that Australian team was an utter **** show. He was jacking shots like he was Lillard or Curry and his defensive numbers equate him as the worst defender in their league. He was getting toasted by marginal athletes and looked really bad against RJ Hampton when trying to guard him.

From what I've seen I'd stay away. Love his handles and his passing, but the shooting and shot selection is a glaring stop sign. Plus he's not a great athlete. He's just tall. Even on his highlights when he's past his defender but their still riding him, he gets no lift on his layups. He's way below the rim as a 6'8" guard. (Not talking about strait line driving dunks.)


Getting toasted by RJ Hampton?

They played 2 games against each other

RJ 2 games:
#1 4/9 8 points, 7 rebounds, 3 assists, 3 turnovers
#2 4/8 12 points, 4 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 turnovers

Lamelo 2 games:
#1 3/13 10 points, 7 rebounds, 4 assists, 5 turnovers
#2 10/28 25 points, 12 rebounds, 9 assists, 6 turnovers


If this guy is so bad, playing on a team that averaged least amount of points in the NBL by 5 points, how in the world did he finish 2nd in the league in assists??? He is a playmaker. Does Luka get lift on his shot? No, he's a game manager that reads the defense.
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2 Edwards 99
3 Hayes 97
4 Wiseman 97
5 Okongwu 96
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#87 » by 316Hornets » Sun Aug 23, 2020 8:39 pm

"Approaching the best imaginable passer one could hope for with a 18-year-old prospect. Not enough praise can be given to LaMelo in this regard. Concepts like skip passes and high-velocity lefty dishes from a live dribble are exceedingly elementary from his perspective. LaMelo habitually incorporates multiple pass-fakes and finishes the sequence before other prospects would even make the initial read. He masterfully incorporates backspin, even when operating at blazing speeds, and threads the needle with incredible velocity, confidence, and precision. He craftily navigates the ball through gaps in the pick-and-roll, and rifles baseball passes on target, getting great utility from wrist involvement. Can lob entry passes in full-stride off the live dribble. His affinity for pushing the pace–backed by his advanced handling capabilities–catalyzes his ability to utilize his tremendously versatile passing tools"

https://www.thestepien.com/2019/11/27/lamelo-ball-scouting-report/
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2 Edwards 99
3 Hayes 97
4 Wiseman 97
5 Okongwu 96
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#88 » by driveandkick » Sun Aug 23, 2020 9:03 pm

amcoolio wrote:Is Ball even better than Lonzo Ball?

They both don't shoot well, but Lonzo is much much better defender, and while not as great a passer still in the upper 5% in the NBA I would say in passing.

I just don't see it with this guy. He also doesn't fit personality wise with Graham, Miles or PJ.


I think a consensus I'm hearing through draft circles is that Melo has the higher ceiling, Zo the higher floor. When I watch draft prospects, I like looking for elite traits in a player. LaMelo isn't just a good passer, he's a generational passer and arguably the best I've ever seen to enter the league. That's a huge green check for me, he already has a skill that he is one of the best in the world at at 19 years old. I truly think his "lack of defense" or whatever is incredibly overblown. Is he a good defender right now? Probably not. But people acting like he's a complete liability on that end are just looking for any reason they can find to push their agenda against the kid. He's not a Trae Young type of liability on defense, and as he continues to grow into his body and learns to use his length I think at a minimum he's an average NBA defender. Which is fine.

His shot is obviously the most concerning part of his game. For sure, the bit Swedd shared about how some scouts say he needs to totally throw the form out the window and start over that's definitely concerning. Especially because I think MKG will haunt our nightmares for a long time. I do think our player development is the best it has ever been since the team came back to the city. Let's not act like he's never been able to shoot. There is plenty of film of him showing a ridiculous range and putting on a show from deep. Hell it's kind of why he burst onto the scene as young as he did. Remember, he has grown like a foot over the past 4-5 years. Dude is figuring out an entirely new body. The thing with Ball is this: if he does figure out his form and gets a shot he's got the highest ceiling in this draft and I don't even think it's remotely close. If he can just hit spot up threes at a decent clip we have an absolute lethal weapon on our hands that is just an ideal fit in the modern NBA.

I KNOW. It's a huge IF! But all these guys have glaring concerns. We don't even know how Wiseman will look playing against players he's not half a foot taller than, Edwards game currently screams inefficiency and he's never been a part of a winning team, Hayes has a slow first step and turns it over, etc. It wasn't a great draft to get lucky in, but I am confident there is a star or two in here somewhere and we have a chance to find him. I'm putting my money on Ball.
2020 NBA Draft Charlotte Hornets Wishlist for #3:
1) LaMelo Ball
2) Anthony Edwards
3) Killian Hayes
4) Onyeka Okongwu
5) Deni Avdija
6) James Wiseman
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#89 » by BigSlam » Sun Aug 23, 2020 9:44 pm

If his passing is the thing we’re hanging our hats on, it’s not enough for me - because I’m perfectly fine with Devonte’s court vision, passing and creating for others.

So I need more than just passing from LaMelo, and I’m not sure there’s more there?
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#90 » by JMAC3 » Mon Aug 24, 2020 2:39 am

His dad is still the one making decisions for him, I don’t buy into the narrative of he wants to be great at all. He doesn’t seem like he cares much about winning. I have watched some of the Ball in the family reality show and he is selfish in that show.


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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#91 » by Rich4114 » Mon Aug 24, 2020 2:04 pm

BigSlam wrote:
driveandkick wrote:
amcoolio wrote:Is Ball even better than Lonzo Ball?

They both don't shoot well, but Lonzo is much much better defender, and while not as great a passer still in the upper 5% in the NBA I would say in passing.

I just don't see it with this guy. He also doesn't fit personality wise with Graham, Miles or PJ.

Before getting to the rest, what do you mean he doesn't fit personality wise? By all accounts he is a terrific lockerroom guy that is very humble.

Ya, I’m pretty sure he represented himself really well when in Australia. I think there were some question marks years ago, but that might have been more “guilt by association” because his Dad is a knob.

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lmao Honestly the worst thing that could've happened to him was going to the Lakers because of his Dad. You never heard anything bad come out of Lonzo's mouth. His dad did all of that for him. Although since being traded, I haven't heard anything about the guy. I wouldn't judge LaMelo based on Lonzo or his dad as tempting as that is.
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#92 » by KEMBAtheMETEOR » Wed Aug 26, 2020 2:51 pm

Strengths: High level passing ability … Tremendous length and height for his position combined with a high basketball IQ. ... is a gifted athlete … He has the ability to handle the ball well for his size … Possesses the skill to burst through a first line of defenders, with a deceptive first step … Can turn a broken play into points with an outstanding ability to find the open man … Solid competitor … Rebounds the ball very well for a player at his position…Defensively, his length allows him to create turnovers at a high rate… Ignites the fast break, finding streaking teammates for easy dunks, trailing shooters, or finishes at the rim on his own, ... can be a handful for opposing defenders … Was able to dominate running [his coach]’s offense at times, getting the ball to shooters in their spots, as well as lead the fast break, and create shots for himself … A true ball hawk with excellent anticipation and reflexes put him into the top 10 in steals …

Weaknesses: Ceiling is considerable, but so is his basement, has star potential but also appears to be a guy that could end up playing the majority of his career overseas … Already the age of a senior, so there is concern about his upside and how much his body and offense will improve … Routinely passes up open shots … His inconsistent outside shooting (29% from 3) will make it easy for opponents to sag off him, making it even more difficult for him to get by defenders … Battled inconsistency during his first full year as a starting point guard … Turnover prone. His youth showed at times … He needs to improve as a leader, a floor general, to become the player he can be at the next level … His upper body strength will have to improve … Needs to improve his outside shooting… Defensively, he will need to transition from [his coaches]’s 2-3 to an NBA Man-to-Man … Takes a lot of risks defensively, can get away with it in college, NBA players will expose this

Overall: With his vision, speed, and ball handling ability, possesses uncommon PG tools … Proving that he can be a leader night-in and night-out is something NBA teams will need to see if they are to turn the keys of an offense over to him …



That was not LaMelo Ball's scouting report. Aside from this mystery player being a couple years older than Ball, I'd argue this player has a better scouting report since he can also play defense. This was the scouting report of....
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#93 » by LofJ » Wed Aug 26, 2020 3:49 pm

Please be drafted by the Wolves :pray:
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#94 » by Rich4114 » Wed Aug 26, 2020 5:35 pm

I really am wary about drafting someone whose weakness is shooting. If you’re a basketball player and by the time you get to the NBA you don’t shoot very well, history tells us that is unlikely to change. I realize we have seen some exceptions ourselves but we’ve also seen a lot of non exceptions. I guess in LaMelos case he seems willing to shoot threes but just doesn’t make them at a good % where as with MCW and Ben Simmons, they don’t trust themselves enough to even take them. So there’s that. I am intrigued by the other skills LaMelo brings so if he has shooting potential I’d be more for it. If his jumper and form are just broken like MKG, then no thanks.
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#95 » by Vanderbilt_Grad » Wed Aug 26, 2020 6:29 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20

This is a good thing and is likely to reduce the drama factor around him.

FWIW, I'm with Rich as well. Shooting weakness is a huge deal these days.
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#96 » by DY_nasty » Wed Aug 26, 2020 7:29 pm

Vanderbilt_Grad wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

This is a good thing and is likely to reduce the drama factor around him.

FWIW, I'm with Rich as well. Shooting weakness is a huge deal these days.

NOT jordan brand 8-)
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#97 » by LofJ » Wed Aug 26, 2020 7:50 pm

Jordan Brand broke the bank signing both Zion and Luka. They're going to be signing struggle guys for a few years.
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#98 » by Diop » Thu Aug 27, 2020 12:53 am

that Illawara team was terrible, he had little help. something about him makes me real nervous though.
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#99 » by amcoolio » Fri Aug 28, 2020 4:43 pm

Ok, I know I was sour on this kid just as recently as 3 days ago. But I've watched a lot of tape and highlights the past few days, and I'm beginning to warm on Ball. He is very quick, good ball handling, has good size and court vision (and obviously a great passer already). Its up to whether or not a few years of NBA shot training and defense can fix his flaws. I think I'd rather have him than Wiseman
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Re: Prospect Thread: LaMelo Ball 

Post#100 » by James Gatz » Fri Aug 28, 2020 4:56 pm

amcoolio wrote:Ok, I know I was sour on this kid just as recently as 3 days ago. But I've watched a lot of tape and highlights the past few days, and I'm beginning to warm on Ball. He is very quick, good ball handling, has good size and court vision (and obviously a great passer already). Its up to whether or not a few years of NBA shot training and defense can fix his flaws. I think I'd rather have him than Wiseman


This is basically where I'm at. He's far from a flawless player, but his upside is clearly so high. His team defense is also excellent at times and disastrous at others. Dude has clearly the best basketball IQ/feel in the class. It'll really come down to his ability to improve his shooting and add strength. Both problems that can, but not necessarily will, be remedied.

I think Minn takes him none the less though.

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