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JMAC3 wrote:Stats are all fine and dandy, but you still have to be able to project how he scores points. He played center for Dayton, they ran 5 out and he basically stood in the paint on defense.

He scored a ton of points leaking out on offense, do you think he scores like that in NBA playing the 4/5? I don’t.

I think offensively he might be a more athletic PJ, who shoots threes and scores a little down low. However I don’t think he has any superstar upside.


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If he could replicate his college success where he was the college player of the year in the NBA that would equal being the MVP. Maybe one player in 50 replicates their college success in the NBA. However, his shooting and finishing skills are probably the best combination of those two skills in the draft. For example my Wolves want to play 5 out. He's about the perfect player for that. I'm not advocating for him at #1 overall. I just think the naysayers regarding him are a bit over the Toppin.

Statistically Toppin is lousy? 99th percentile in offensive efficiency. Trounces Frank in effective field goal percentage.

Rebutted by Okongwu and Wiseman? One had an inferior points per possession, the other had a small sample, both built their numbers on foul shots rather than modern NBA offense. Do yourself a favor and don't compare Okongwu to Toppin on offense and I won't compare them on defense. 99th percentile doesn't mean the bottom, it means the top.

I said Toppin is a lousy prospect I didn’t say he was statistically lousy. I’d rather not draft a defensive turnstile.

luciano-davidwesley wrote:The last few posts in this thread by yourself and KGdaBom show statistically speaking Toppin is a lousy prospect. Even the offensive stats MasterIchiro found to support him have been rebutted as Wiseman and Okongwu do similar if not better offensively with much better defensive ratings.

To say an 18/19 year old Miles Bridges posted similar numbers in a much better conference is just the icing on the cake. To put it in perspective like you said he’s almost the exact same age right now as Miles Bridges. Bridges would probably average 30/10/10 for Dayton last year lol.

Not to mention to me Toppin looked terrible with the eye test (particularly defensively) unless you get excited for highlight dunkers. Hard, hard pass on Toppin.

Maybe try again.

Obi strikes me as the Cho/Jordan/Cliff kind of pick.

MasterIchiro wrote:

luciano-davidwesley wrote:The last few posts in this thread by yourself and KGdaBom show statistically speaking Toppin is a lousy prospect. Even the offensive stats MasterIchiro found to support him have been rebutted as Wiseman and Okongwu do similar if not better offensively with much better defensive ratings.

To say an 18/19 year old Miles Bridges posted similar numbers in a much better conference is just the icing on the cake. To put it in perspective like you said he’s almost the exact same age right now as Miles Bridges. Bridges would probably average 30/10/10 for Dayton last year lol.

Not to mention to me Toppin looked terrible with the eye test (particularly defensively) unless you get excited for highlight dunkers. Hard, hard pass on Toppin.

Maybe try again.

My bad, I meant he is a lousy prospect he isn’t statistically. Sorry I don’t always proofread my post.

Either way he still sucks defensively and is a one trick pony dunking on offense.

Still anti-Obi, but still hear stuff like this from time to time.

Vanderbilt_Grad wrote:Still anti-Obi, but still hear stuff like this from time to time.

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Who's gonna beat him out for ROY? With this class it's not clear at all. His offense is the most NBA-ready in the draft. It's the defense that has mocks dropping him. But this is an offense league. It helps establish trade value, contract value etc. You swing towards the other extreme and you have Okoro. Toppin will go ahead of Okoro.

this might be the most worthless ROY award in years tho

wouldn't say its an offense league at all really. there's functional offenses and nonfunctional offenses. both finals teams made it on defense and their ability to control the pace of the game

Obi winning ROY would be kinda like MCW winning in 2014.

I was watching a bunch of Toppin clips today and you want to know what stood out the most to me?

Man does he ever cherry pick!!

No wonder he’s accused of not playing D - he’s always too busy hanging out at the top of the key and leaking out for easy fast break points.

He looks spectacular windmill dunking in the open court with no one in front of him (because everyone is at the other end of the court) but also really seems like a guy who scores 20ppg but costs his team 30ppg.


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BigSlam wrote:I was watching a bunch of Toppin clips today and you want to know what stood out the most to me?

Man does he ever cherry pick!!

No wonder he’s accused of not playing D - he’s always too busy hanging out at the top of the key and leaking out for easy fast break points.

He looks spectacular windmill dunking in the open court with no one in front of him (because everyone is at the other end of the court) but also really seems like a guy who scores 20ppg but costs his team 30ppg.


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I used to hate pricks like that, I’d end up hitting them with a hard clumsy foul,

Diop wrote:

BigSlam wrote:I was watching a bunch of Toppin clips today and you want to know what stood out the most to me?

Man does he ever cherry pick!!

No wonder he’s accused of not playing D - he’s always too busy hanging out at the top of the key and leaking out for easy fast break points.

He looks spectacular windmill dunking in the open court with no one in front of him (because everyone is at the other end of the court) but also really seems like a guy who scores 20ppg but costs his team 30ppg.


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I used to hate pricks like that, I’d end up hitting them with a hard clumsy foul,

Amen!!

As a big guy who loved you playing in the paint I took great enjoyment in pulling down a rebound and initiating a fast break by throwing an outlet pass to a guard who leaked out, but if I pulled down a rebound, looked up and it was my power forward continually leaking out I’d be SUPER pissed.

Like, how about you get in here with me, get your hands a little dirty and box out so these opposing bigs aren’t climbing all over me all the time?!?!?


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No one confused Carlos Boozer with defense. But he made a lot of money in the same way Toppin is fixin' to - with undeniable offensive skill. I like late bloomers like Boozer and Anthony Davis and Jimmy Butler. Watch Atlanta at #4, who could move up to #1 and nab Edwards. Minny would then take Toppin at #4 and look good doing it.

Kupchak ruled out Toppin. He said when asked about drafting a more ready player due to the condensed season he stated they will likely draft someone 19-20 at 3. Then added pick 32 is the pick more likely to have flexibility in consideration of a college senior or more polished product.

At any rate, he will be ROY and those can always be flipped for assets as the Sixers wisely did with MCW. I think he returns to Ohio and goes to the Cavs. He fits with their speedy guard play. He feasts in transition.

So I think Toppin is not high on our board. We'd be dying for him to fall to 8 though. He's gonna be way better than most of the players drafted after him. There are always exceptions and surprises.