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KGdaBom wrote:Stat wise Haliburton is the next Steve Nash with better defense. According to scouting reports his stats are a mirage and he doesn't have the ability to back them up at the NBA level. This is not my opinion. It's just what I've been reading about him.

James Gatz wrote:His lack of burst and pullup game make me believe he can never be a primary initiator. He'll likely be a good 4th option who plays plus team defense. I also worry about his size. Weighing in at 175 at 6'5 and not likely to be able to put much more weight on his frame.

FWIW he was 16/57 (28%) from pullup shots this past season. His form/lack of burst makes it difficult for him to get space.

Haliburton is an analytics darling with tremendous efficiency and nearly unprecedented steal and block rates for a guard. He combines great standstill shooting -- a career 43.5% from 3, funky mechanics and all -- with strong playmaking (3-to-1 assist-to-turnover ratio). And he's full of positivity, with an approach to the game that teammates, opponents, coaches and agents of rival prospects rave about.

"He's the complete package in terms of intangibles," added Iowa State assistant coach James Kane, who recruited Ja Morant to Murray State.

After starting the year on a high note with a 25-9-5 game against Michigan and a 23-11-9 performance in a win over Alabama, the do-it-all point guard fractured his left wrist in late December. He opted to play through the injury, posting a 22-point, 12-rebound, 10-assist triple-double against TCU. After reaggravating the injury during a Feb. 8 win over Kansas State, Haliburton was forced to shut it down, although he did hang around and function basically as "another assistant coach," according to Kane.

Despite battling injury issues for half of the season, Haliburton was still the only player in the NCAA to average 15-5-5 while shooting at least 59% from 2 and 41% from 3.

When Haliburton walked into the Impact Basketball gym in Las Vegas, the mood changed. He regularly lifts up teammates with daps and words of encouragement. He's positive and charismatic by nature, something he attributes to his father. After getting hung on the rim on a baseline dunk attempt, Haliburton ran out of the gym smiling. Moments later, he rejoined the drill and splashed three 3s to quiet the playful hecklers.

"People look at the joyous kid and think he's just happy to be there, but his competitive nature is crazy," Niang said.

In a gym that included several other potential first-round picks, Haliburton was in a class of his own in competitive situations, taking over 3-on-3 bouts with his passing, deep range and feel for the game, which has been the norm over the past few months. He stepped into 30-footers when opponents went under screens. He picked weakside defenders apart, using his height to see over the top. On defense, he makes good reads and remains competitive off the ball, though he has room to grow in on-ball situations.

"His basketball IQ is off the charts," Colorado forward Tyler Bey said.

As we saw when surrounded by Cade Cunningham, Jalen Green and Reggie Perry on the gold medal Team USA Under-19 squad at the 2019 FIBA World Cup, Haliburton comes alive as a facilitator next to elite talent.

ESPN's Kevin Pelton rates Haliburton as the second-best prospect in the draft, behind only LaMelo Ball, in both his stats-only projections and his model that accounts for a prospect's ranking in our Top 100. Other analytics models, both inside and outside NBA teams, have Haliburton at No. 1.

He boasts a stellar career 64.9 true shooting percentage through 57 games at Iowa State. With a much larger role on a middle-of-the-road Cyclones team last season, he posted the seventh-best true shooting percentage among prospects in our Top 100 (and the best among perimeter players). Given that his usage rate spiked from 9.2% as a freshman to 20.2% as a sophomore, his ability to adapt and improve is impressive.

"I do it in a different way," Haliburton said. "I don't take tough shots, I don't force bad things. I try to get the best looks at all times, and I think people aren't used to that. People are used to guys taking tough shots for no reason at times."

Haliburton was even more effective during seven World Cup games. He became one of only 11 players in FIBA history to post a true shooting percentage over 80 (minimum 20 minutes per game), joining a list that includes Hall of Famer Reggie Miller and NBA stars LeBron James and Nikola Jokic, while also averaging 11.0 assists, 3.7 steals and 1.1 blocks per 40 minutes.

Pelton said that Haliburton has the 18th-best projected shooting rating (which incorporates 3P%, 3PA rate and FT%) among all point guards using his model. Current NBA stars Trae Young and Jamal Murray were the only two guys who were younger than him in that database.

Based on what he showed at Impact, he's stronger (18-pound increase since the college season ended) and starting to look more comfortable shooting off the dribble when under duress. Overanalyzing Haliburton's unorthodox game could lead scouts to miss some of the factors that make him such an impactful player on and off the court.

"Everybody's like, 'He has a high floor, he's probably the safest pick in the draft,' which I agree with but low ceiling is a tough comment to make I think," Haliburton said. "We'll revisit it in a couple years and see what that ceiling really is."

DY_nasty wrote:If we take him at 3, I wouldn't even trip tbh

SWedd523 wrote:I don't think you can trust your PG to be a star player if he cannot consistently beat his man off the dribble and force defenses to collapse. I'm struggling to think of a high level modern PG who lacks that quickness.

SWedd523 wrote:I spent much of last year's pre-draft cycle defending PJ while bemoaning the fact that people equate "high floor" with "low ceiling". I think it's a silly statement that somebody who has skills at a young age cannot have the same developmental curve as a guy with little or no skills.

That said, the thing that turns me off about Haliburton is his relative lack of quickness/blow by speed/first step/whatever you want to call it.

I don't think you can trust your PG to be a star player if he cannot consistently beat his man off the dribble and force defenses to collapse. I'm struggling to think of a high level modern PG who lacks that quickness.

The only one I can think of who comes close would be Trae Young and I was wrong about how he'd pan out in the NBA so maybe I'm wrong about Haliburton too

BigSlam wrote:

DY_nasty wrote:If we take him at 3, I wouldn't even trip tbh

After Wiseman came off our big board at #1 I started voting for this kid straight away as my #2.

I get the concern about his lack of explosiveness that a Westbrook, Maront or Fox have but he's also no 6'0" 210lb grounded slouch - and there are just SO many other things to like about him.

James Gatz wrote:

BigSlam wrote:

DY_nasty wrote:If we take him at 3, I wouldn't even trip tbh

After Wiseman came off our big board at #1 I started voting for this kid straight away as my #2.

I get the concern about his lack of explosiveness that a Westbrook, Maront or Fox have but he's also no 6'0" 210lb grounded slouch - and there are just SO many other things to like about him.

I worry about him only being 175lb at 6'5. I don't think he has the frame to put on much more weight. Also adding weight likely won't help his slow first step. If you can 't get past guys I don't think you can be a primary in the league right now.

yosemiteben wrote:The only thing keeping me from complete Haliburton fanboy territory is SWedd's very valid point about his quickness.

BigSlam wrote:

yosemiteben wrote:The only thing keeping me from complete Haliburton fanboy territory is SWedd's very valid point about his quickness.

Would his 1st step be any slower than guys like Lowry, Conley, Bledsoe, Brogdon, Dinwiddie and Dragic?

I would think he would compare athletically well to those guys, especially Lowry, Brogdon and Dinwiddie - and they do alright?


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BigSlam wrote:

yosemiteben wrote:The only thing keeping me from complete Haliburton fanboy territory is SWedd's very valid point about his quickness.

Would his 1st step be any slower than guys like Lowry, Conley, Bledsoe, Brogdon, Dinwiddie and Dragic?

I would think he would compare athletically well to those guys, especially Lowry, Brogdon and Dinwiddie - and they do alright?


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SWedd523 wrote:

BigSlam wrote:

yosemiteben wrote:The only thing keeping me from complete Haliburton fanboy territory is SWedd's very valid point about his quickness.

Would his 1st step be any slower than guys like Lowry, Conley, Bledsoe, Brogdon, Dinwiddie and Dragic?

I would think he would compare athletically well to those guys, especially Lowry, Brogdon and Dinwiddie - and they do alright?


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Lowry is 34
Conley 33
Dragic is 34
Bledsoe is 30 and has had multiple fairly significant knee injuries.
Brogdon is far from a star and is career 13/4 guy (though he did just drop 16/7 last season). I expect more than Brogdon with a top 3 pick.
Dinwiddie has also had a fairly significant knee injury and has 40lb on Haliburton.

Its not a good look to compare his athleticism to old guys close to the end of their careers and guys who are much heavier and/or have sustained multiple knee injuries

SWedd523 wrote:You might be playing the recency victim a little bit there.


For example, Bledsoe had the nickname Mini-LeBron before his knees exploded. That doesn't happen because he's unathletic