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Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija

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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#21 » by Liver_Pooty » Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:45 am

Good size, can play 3 positions, highly skilled, shot is improving. I wouldn't mind him at all. If we did pick him a lot of fans would be irate, though.
Balllin wrote:Zion Williamson is 6-5, with a 6-10 wingspan. I see him as a slightly better Kenneth Faried.
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#22 » by wilson115 » Mon Aug 24, 2020 5:21 am

Just the fact he's a legit 6'9" (at least as tall as his teammates Amare and Tarik Black) and can be a playmaker makes him worth a serious look. The shooting is a real problem, after seeing this Hornets front office bench guys like MKG, Frank Kaminsky, and even Nic -- a tall wing in a similar, versatile mold as Avdija -- on account of their shooting struggles, it's worth asking if Mitch is looking forward to repeating the experience. Especially if it costs a pick in the top 3.




(And I think I can see what people mean about his "athleticism.")
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#23 » by Hornet Mania » Mon Aug 24, 2020 5:11 pm

Liver_Pooty wrote:Good size, can play 3 positions, highly skilled, shot is improving. I wouldn't mind him at all. If we did pick him a lot of fans would be irate, though.


This guy and Melo are who Mitch should pick if he wants to see the fan base flip out. Deni will be universally booed, Melo would instantly start a fight between the believers and the doubters.
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#24 » by amcoolio » Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:10 pm

Looks an awful lot like Frank Kaminsky in those clips
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#25 » by DY_nasty » Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:11 pm

I got no problem with Deni. He's a good prospect - just not a #3 overall prospect. If we happen to trade back or something... sure.

But there's always the fact that workouts and combine drama hasn't begun yet either. Someone always jumps up or down the chain due to the media attention over that so Deni might be a lot more attractive later on.

I can deal with the questionable shooting right now. But his lack of an off hand is kinda alarming for anyone labeled a playmaker the way he is.
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#26 » by Rich4114 » Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:45 pm

I don't know anything about this guy, but how does his stats at this stage of his development compare to some other euro's with similar games? Just because Doncic is a stud doesn't mean this guy would be because he hails from Europe and can create. This team should be most sensitive to drafting a guy like that based on the types of picks that have been made over the last decade plus.
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#27 » by DY_nasty » Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:02 am

JMAC3 wrote:
driveandkick wrote:
JMAC3 wrote:Not saying he is Luka by any means, but gah if he is 75% of Luka you have to consider him with how well Luka is playing.

An aggressive playmaking wing with size and handles is where the league is heading.


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I’m not even sure he is 7.5% of Luka


Seems like an exaggeration, what about Deni are you so against?


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His production in Euroleage wasn't even close to Luka's man :lol: Its fair.

What's not fair is comparing all international player's against Luka though. Deni's certainly got a better body of work than Frank Ntilikina and Hezonja though. Deni plays on the same team as Omri Casspi and ironically he looks to be a better version of him one day.

Which, again - would be cool on any team just not at #3.
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#28 » by JMAC3 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:20 am

I’m not saying he is close to Luka, but I think he can do a lot of the same things. Bigger guard/forward who can run the offense. Makes playing small guards who can shoot (Burke, Curry) but not great ball handler (rozier) more of an option.

Uses his mix of size, speed and skill to score. Luka uses his size the most once he gets inside, able to bump defenders off him and get some daylight- Deni could do the same with his size.

Makes playing positionless basketball easy- can shoot off the dribble at a decent rate- still needs to work on it though.

Has sneaky athleticism in open court and will dunk on you if you’re not careful.

I could see him being a 15-8-5 guy pretty easily.


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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#29 » by JMAC3 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:29 am

Also I’m a stickler for IQ. Basketball or street IQ it doesn’t matter.

Watching the interviews with Mike Schmitz, Luka seems the most put together out of the top 5 and he isn’t even speaking in his primary language...


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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#30 » by DY_nasty » Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:32 am

JMAC3 wrote:I’m not saying he is close to Luka, but I think he can do a lot of the same things. Bigger guard/forward who can run the offense. Makes playing small guards who can shoot (Burke, Curry) but not great ball handler (rozier) more of an option.

Uses his mix of size, speed and skill to score. Luka uses his size the most once he gets inside, able to bump defenders off him and get some daylight- Deni could do the same with his size.

Makes playing positionless basketball easy- can shoot off the dribble at a decent rate- still needs to work on it though.

Has sneaky athleticism in open court and will dunk on you if you’re not careful.

I could see him being a 15-8-5 guy pretty easily.


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I don't know about that.... I think he's a capable passer and ball handler that could be be a solid release valve in an offense, but he ain't running anything for a long time most likely.

I also don't think you can ask a guy to play positionless hoops until they've proven they can work their own position first. He's a good prospect but its hard to be a creator when you can't shoot and can only score with one hand.
JMAC3 wrote:Also I’m a stickler for IQ. Basketball or street IQ it doesn’t matter.

Watching the interviews with Mike Schmitz, Luka seems the most put together out of the top 5 and he isn’t even speaking in his primary language...


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I think there's a massive difference between the two. That's the difference between a Jordan Crawford and a Malcom Brogdon man.
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#31 » by JMAC3 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:43 am

DY_nasty wrote:
JMAC3 wrote:I’m not saying he is close to Luka, but I think he can do a lot of the same things. Bigger guard/forward who can run the offense. Makes playing small guards who can shoot (Burke, Curry) but not great ball handler (rozier) more of an option.

Uses his mix of size, speed and skill to score. Luka uses his size the most once he gets inside, able to bump defenders off him and get some daylight- Deni could do the same with his size.

Makes playing positionless basketball easy- can shoot off the dribble at a decent rate- still needs to work on it though.

Has sneaky athleticism in open court and will dunk on you if you’re not careful.

I could see him being a 15-8-5 guy pretty easily.


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I don't know about that.... I think he's a capable passer and ball handler that could be be a solid release valve in an offense, but he ain't running anything for a long time most likely.

I also don't think you can ask a guy to play positionless hoops until they've proven they can work their own position first. He's a good prospect but its hard to be a creator when you can't shoot and can only score with one hand.
JMAC3 wrote:Also I’m a stickler for IQ. Basketball or street IQ it doesn’t matter.

Watching the interviews with Mike Schmitz, Luka seems the most put together out of the top 5 and he isn’t even speaking in his primary language...


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I think there's a massive difference between the two. That's the difference between a Jordan Crawford and a Malcom Brogdon man.



Right and Malcolm Brogdon is both high IQ off the court and on... seems like Crawford is low IQ on and off...

I’m saying I’m pro high IQ players


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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#32 » by LofJ » Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:53 am

I'm still angry that we didn't draft Brogdon. He flat out said that he wanted us to draft him, but freaking Cho traded the pick for Bellineli.

On topic +1 for smart players, it's the reason why Chris Paul is so damn good.
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#33 » by DY_nasty » Tue Aug 25, 2020 1:04 am

JMAC3 wrote:
DY_nasty wrote:
JMAC3 wrote:I’m not saying he is close to Luka, but I think he can do a lot of the same things. Bigger guard/forward who can run the offense. Makes playing small guards who can shoot (Burke, Curry) but not great ball handler (rozier) more of an option.

Uses his mix of size, speed and skill to score. Luka uses his size the most once he gets inside, able to bump defenders off him and get some daylight- Deni could do the same with his size.

Makes playing positionless basketball easy- can shoot off the dribble at a decent rate- still needs to work on it though.

Has sneaky athleticism in open court and will dunk on you if you’re not careful.

I could see him being a 15-8-5 guy pretty easily.


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I don't know about that.... I think he's a capable passer and ball handler that could be be a solid release valve in an offense, but he ain't running anything for a long time most likely.

I also don't think you can ask a guy to play positionless hoops until they've proven they can work their own position first. He's a good prospect but its hard to be a creator when you can't shoot and can only score with one hand.
JMAC3 wrote:Also I’m a stickler for IQ. Basketball or street IQ it doesn’t matter.

Watching the interviews with Mike Schmitz, Luka seems the most put together out of the top 5 and he isn’t even speaking in his primary language...


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I think there's a massive difference between the two. That's the difference between a Jordan Crawford and a Malcom Brogdon man.



Right and Malcolm Brogdon is both high IQ off the court and on... seems like Crawford is low IQ on and off...

I’m saying I’m pro high IQ players


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I'm not talking on and off. I'm talking two different brands of basketball :lol:

Without understanding the Xs and Os, the flashy stuff doesn't matter that much. One looks cool, the other is like.... fundamentally important to organized hoops and consistent winning ball. You need both. And if you can't have both, at least get the one that matters.

But this is becoming a tangent now
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#34 » by JMAC3 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 1:27 am

DY_nasty wrote:
JMAC3 wrote:
DY_nasty wrote:I don't know about that.... I think he's a capable passer and ball handler that could be be a solid release valve in an offense, but he ain't running anything for a long time most likely.

I also don't think you can ask a guy to play positionless hoops until they've proven they can work their own position first. He's a good prospect but its hard to be a creator when you can't shoot and can only score with one hand.

I think there's a massive difference between the two. That's the difference between a Jordan Crawford and a Malcom Brogdon man.



Right and Malcolm Brogdon is both high IQ off the court and on... seems like Crawford is low IQ on and off...

I’m saying I’m pro high IQ players


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I'm not talking on and off. I'm talking two different brands of basketball :lol:

Without understanding the Xs and Os, the flashy stuff doesn't matter that much. One looks cool, the other is like.... fundamentally important to organized hoops and consistent winning ball. You need both. And if you can't have both, at least get the one that matters.

But this is becoming a tangent now


Yeah you’re not making sense man lol

But anyways I think Deni has the highest IQ of any of the top 5 guys. Lamelo sounds like a 12 year old when he talks, it was like he couldn’t understand basic questions he was getting asked.


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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#35 » by amcoolio » Tue Aug 25, 2020 1:54 am

From the ringer:

"He shot 56 percent on 363 free throw attempts since 2017, per RealGM data. There is little historical precedent for a player with such poor free throw numbers to ever become a reliable shooter."

PASS!
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Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#36 » by JMAC3 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 2:07 am

Impressive he is leading Israel over France, Spain and Germany. Kid gets it done, knows how to win.

“In July 2019, Avdija led Israel to a second straight gold medal at the FIBA U20 European Championship in Tel Aviv. He averaged 18.4 points, 8.3 rebounds, 5.3 assists, 2.4 blocks and 2.1 steals per game, earning MVP and all-tournament team accolades, as the second-youngest player at the event. Avdija tallied 26 points, 11 rebounds and 5 steals against France in the semifinal, before recording 23 points, 7 assists, 5 rebounds and 3 blocks against Spain in the final.”


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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#37 » by Braggins » Tue Aug 25, 2020 2:40 am

amcoolio wrote:From the ringer:

"He shot 56 percent on 363 free throw attempts since 2017, per RealGM data. There is little historical precedent for a player with such poor free throw numbers to ever become a reliable shooter."

PASS!

His shot looks fine to me, but his percentages are straight up garbage. That might actually be worse than having a broken form because there is lots of room for improvement if you fix the form. If the form is fine that suggests he just has awful touch.
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#38 » by Braggins » Thu Aug 27, 2020 5:33 pm

Dean is very low on Deni
5. Deni Avdija

Deni’s appeal is that he brings a little bit of everything. He is 6’8″, can shoot a little, handle a little, pass a little, move reasonably well on defense, and just turned 19 in January.

But on the flipside, he doesn’t bring much of anything. He has a meager 6’9.5″ wingspan, is lacking in strength, and is only an OK athlete. He doesn’t get many steals or blocks, and there’s a limit to his defensive upside even though he is considered solid on that end.

And there are major concerns about his shooting. He takes a good rate of 3PA, but only has made 33% while shooting a gross 59% from the line. If we include his 18-19 numbers drop to 31% 3P and 55.6% FT. He is still young with time to improve, and he may be better from three than free throws, but there is serious concern that he will never be a decent shooter.

His best quality is likely his passing, with a good assist to turnover ratio for his size and youth, averaging 3.7 assists and 2.9 turnovers per 40 this season. But his passing impact is limited by his low usage rate, as he posted just 21% usage in BSL and 15.6% in Euroleague.

His Euroleague performance is especially concerning when you consider the low level of competition in BSL. He has posted merely a 10.5 PER in 371 Euroleague minutes this year, raising the concern that he may lack the skills and physicality to make any significant impact against higher levels of competition.

Ultimately it seems like the hope is that he improves his shooting and provides quality defense and a willingness to move the ball and avoid mistakes as a 6’8″ wing role player. And it’s easy to see him develop into a passable role player, especially as wings become more essential toward filling out NBA lineups.

But he has a huge downside tail if his defense and shooting flop, he is not going to be playable. And even if they become decent, what other meat is there on his profile to make him collectively above average? He needs to vastly improve his handle and scoring, otherwise he’s a very boring 3 + D prospect who may not even be good at either 3 or D.
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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#39 » by JMAC3 » Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:18 pm

JMAC3 wrote:Impressive he is leading Israel over France, Spain and Germany. Kid gets it done, knows how to win.

“In July 2019, Avdija led Israel to a second straight gold medal at the FIBA U20 European Championship in Tel Aviv. He averaged 18.4 points, 8.3 rebounds, 5.3 assists, 2.4 blocks and 2.1 steals per game, earning MVP and all-tournament team accolades, as the second-youngest player at the event. Avdija tallied 26 points, 11 rebounds and 5 steals against France in the semifinal, before recording 23 points, 7 assists, 5 rebounds and 3 blocks against Spain in the final.”


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I’m still impressed by this, he carried Israel to the championship back to back years vs all the top teams in Europe.

Some mixture of Prime Hedu, Young Galo and a 75% version of Luka.


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Re: Prospect Thread: Deni Avdija 

Post#40 » by JMAC3 » Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:22 pm

https://youtu.be/InVSUCDCEFo

I think this game gives you a quick showcase of his talent, again this is all in one game.


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