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Hornets to make pitch for Drummond

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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#21 » by yosemiteben » Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:00 pm

BlackOutBuzz wrote:Presumably the selling point here would be a bigger role than most which could lead to a bigger payday next year.

That was my thought. We can point to how involved guys like Cody and Biz have been in our offense and say you'll get to show that you can contribute to a movement oriented offense rather than just being on cleanup duty like Dwight was in LAL.

Not sure it resonates, but he also doesn't seem like the ring chasing, fall in line type either.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#22 » by BlackOutBuzz » Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:14 pm

yosemiteben wrote:
BlackOutBuzz wrote:Presumably the selling point here would be a bigger role than most which could lead to a bigger payday next year.


Not sure it resonates, but he also doesn't seem like the ring chasing, fall in line type either.


Yeah, he's only like 27, too. I would think showing you can handle a larger role would be a more prudent career move than ring-chasing at this point, but who knows.

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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#23 » by GoBobs » Fri Mar 26, 2021 4:35 pm

Would love to have him. Might be better for us in the long run if he goes to NY.

If he comes here and plays well we might sign him to a large deal in the offseason.

If he goes to NY gets up in tha club life distracted/plays poorly then we could sign him to a more team friendly deal in the offseason or avoid signing him. Cousins is still out there as well.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#24 » by yosemiteben » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:57 pm

Read on Twitter


Kinda thought this already happened, missed the "discussing buyout" part.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#25 » by JDR720 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 7:45 pm

This is basically deciding between...

- Going to a contender for a season. Chase a ring, but he isn't going to resign.(Lakers/Clippers).
- Going to a non-contender, but can likely be paid in the offseason and have a bigger role. (Knicks/Us/Celtics)


Which is better, the Knicks, Celtics or us?

We have Ball.
The Knicks have cap space.
The Celtics are somewhere in between.

And I'm not sure I want to pay him either. He has never been a winning player, but Detroit and the Cavs are allergic to winning so who knows.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#26 » by vtime » Fri Mar 26, 2021 7:53 pm

Ok. Let’s be honest here. Andre Drummond is an all star talent puts up all star numbers year in and year out. People are sour on him solely based on contract, not his production and because the game has shifted to stretchier bigs. Saying he’s not a winner is blaming for the ineptitude the Pistons front office. He had Blake for a year and a played with no one else remotely close in Detroit. The full year he and Blake spent together 2019), they made the playoffs, and Blake missed the end of the year. He also was the lone All Star on their 2016 playoff team. His poor reputation is solely based on contract. He’s the best rebounder in basketball, one of the most physically imposing bigs and can score. Contract isn’t an issue the rest of this season. And then if you want to resign, try to keep it under 20 mil or less. There’s not a lot of teams with money, and less that need a starting center. No risk all reward. And despite being a 9 year vets he’s under 30 years old.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#27 » by KEMBAtheMETEOR » Fri Mar 26, 2021 8:11 pm

vtime wrote:Ok. Let’s be honest here. Andre Drummond is an all star talent puts up all star numbers year in and year out. People are sour on him solely based on contract, not his production and because the game has shifted to stretchier bigs. Saying he’s not a winner is blaming for the ineptitude the Pistons front office. He had Blake for a year and a played with no one else remotely close in Detroit. The full year he and Blake spent together 2019), they made the playoffs, and Blake missed the end of the year. He also was the lone All Star on their 2016 playoff team. His poor reputation is solely based on contract. He’s the best rebounder in basketball, one of the most physically imposing bigs and can score. Contract isn’t an issue the rest of this season. And then if you want to resign, try to keep it under 20 mil or less. There’s not a lot of teams with money, and less that need a starting center. No risk all reward. And despite being a 9 year vets he’s under 30 years old.

I agree that there's (almost) no risk. I agree he is a talent. I disagree that he impacts winning. Remember all the issues we had with Dwight? All those great numbers, but minimal defensive effort, completely bogging down the offense at times? He would be dope if he played to his strengths, but he doesn't, and he's not gonna figure that out in 25 games after about 5 years of being an underachiever.

Drummond's second year in the league, where he was just a rim-runner on offense, was the best version of himself. It's been downhill ever since SVG tried to make him (or let him pretend he was) a post player.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#28 » by yosemiteben » Fri Mar 26, 2021 8:35 pm

Can't imagine BOS is all that appealing, given that there is zero change they are able to sign him this summer for anything above the MLE. They aren't going to have any cap space.

vtime wrote:Ok. Let’s be honest here. Andre Drummond is an all star talent puts up all star numbers year in and year out. People are sour on him solely based on contract...

I mean, not really. I don't buy it 100%, but I find this to be a pretty compelling argument:

In a way, Drummond’s role as a dominant defensive rebounder is like that of a prolific video-store renter, who’s always managed to nab the hit movie from Blockbuster as soon as it came out. It was an impressive feat before. But now, with Netflix—and hardly anyone else in the store—it’s not as meaningful a skill.

With most teams no longer emphasizing offensive boards, just 22.1% of attempts have been retrieved by the offense during the 2020–21 season—the lowest rate in NBA history, and an unrecognizable figure juxtaposed against the 1980s and ’90s, when one of out every of three misses went back to the offense.

It’s no secret that the proliferation of the three-point shot—which generally creates much longer rebound opportunities—has altered the game more than anything. At .696, the statistical correlation between three-point percentage and winning percentage in the NBA (with 0 showing no correlation, and 1 indicating direct correlation) has never been higher than it is now, according to data from Stats Perform.

Because of that shift, teams are all but forced to put more weight on players, centers or otherwise, who can capably defend the arc. Even a 7-footer like Roy Hibbert, who excelled at using verticality to protect the rim, found himself out of a job at age 30, in part because of his relative immobility. Just like there were no shots for the paint-tethered Hibbert to block if someone shot a triple, there are no rebounds for players like Drummond to grab if a sharpshooter hits a wide-open three.

...

[I]n 2017 and 2018, the last two years LeBron James led the Cavs to the Finals, Cleveland ranked 18th and 24th, respectively, in rebound rate. They excelled from the perimeter instead.

With those sorts of teams having four or even all five players spaced out to the arc at times, they’ll see it as more worthwhile to focus on defense. “Statistically, it shows that if you get back every single time, you’re gonna save more points than you’d score by going to the glass [after offensive boards],” Rivers says.

And even when clubs do vie for offensive rebounds, because of the longer shots they’re taking, the misfires are likelier to bounce toward the perimeter than in previous eras. It means rebounders need more range. “Maybe 10 or 12 years ago, you’d only see a few types of guys going for [offensive boards]. Now, you see perimeter guys with that freedom, says Steve Clifford, who coaches the Magic. “With all the long rebounds now, there’s a larger area defensively you have to track in order to finish possessions.”

Which means quickness matters as much as, if not more than, traditional jockeying strength at times.

Clifford points out that a handful of teams last year—the Suns, Pacers, Grizzlies and Bulls—ranked near the top of the NBA in both putback efficiency and in transition defense, which may be the next type of players teams will seek. Which athletes have enough cat-like quickness and basketball instincts to jump into the fray from the three-point line and come up with the ball while still getting back to help defend?

They probably aren’t ones whose games resemble Drummond’s. In a fast-paced game of musical chairs, with teams shape-shifting their rosters around an unprecedented spike in three-point shooting, the overhaul has at least temporarily left the generation’s best rebounder without a seat.

https://www.si.com/nba/2021/03/25/andre-drummond-rebounding-daily-cover
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#29 » by JDR720 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 8:46 pm

The best part of our offense is passing. Almost every player who plays is at least a respectable passer, besides Biz. Drummond has a high chance of becoming a blackhole on offense.

If he'd just screen and run to the rim, he would be good. But we all know he'll want to score in the post some, which he isn't good at.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#30 » by BigSlam » Fri Mar 26, 2021 8:55 pm

Drummond was actually pretty good passer/ball mover at UConn. He drew some early Shaq comparisons in that way.

I would have hated to give up assets (any of our young players and/or draft picks) and to have traded for him but signing him outright, providing it’s not to some massive contract, sure does sound appealing to me.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#31 » by Rich4114 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 9:00 pm

Signing him right now to our existing roster is a full no brainer. We get abused down low against any team with a semi-legit front court. All he has to do is rebound, be a shot blocker and catch lobs.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#32 » by yosemiteben » Fri Mar 26, 2021 9:04 pm

BigSlam wrote:Drummond was actually pretty good passer/ball mover at UConn. He drew some early Shaq comparisons in that way.

There are a bunch of articles from back in 2017 when it looked like he'd turned the corner into a franchise big with a decent passing game.

https://thebasketballnetwork.com/andre-drummond-elite-passing-big/

https://fansided.com/2017/11/22/andre-drummond-pistons-post-up-passing/

https://www.freep.com/story/sports/nba/2017/11/08/detroit-pistons-andre-drummond/839979001/
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#33 » by Rich4114 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 9:15 pm

The worst thing for Drummond was Blake Griffin. That franchise took a turn for the worst after that trade and pretty much everyone figured that might happen. The other bad thing is his game isn't valued in the NBA like it used to. I'd use him like Orlando used to use Dwight Howard. I just trust him down low doing the same thing we try to make Biz do except Dre can catch passes and rebound.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#34 » by SgtMajSlim » Fri Mar 26, 2021 9:32 pm

He’d be an upgrade instantly over anything we have to throw at the 5 position.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#35 » by luciano-davidwesley » Fri Mar 26, 2021 10:22 pm

BlackOutBuzz wrote:
Rich4114 wrote:Aren’t we able to offer him the most for the rest of this season? Might not be a meaningful difference but still
2nd most, we're the only team that has capspace aside from the Knicks. Of course, the Knicks have a ton, and we cut ours by more than half by acquiring Wanamaker. Still, it's more than any contender can offer.

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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#36 » by bravor » Fri Mar 26, 2021 10:35 pm

Unfortunately, this franchise spelled Mobley wrong
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#37 » by BlackOutBuzz » Sat Mar 27, 2021 12:06 am

luciano-davidwesley wrote:
BlackOutBuzz wrote:
Rich4114 wrote:Aren’t we able to offer him the most for the rest of this season? Might not be a meaningful difference but still
2nd most, we're the only team that has capspace aside from the Knicks. Of course, the Knicks have a ton, and we cut ours by more than half by acquiring Wanamaker. Still, it's more than any contender can offer.

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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#38 » by Bassman » Sat Mar 27, 2021 12:25 am

Come on Andre...PLEASE sign with us. Hornets, PLEASE do everything possible to convince Andre of this opportunity with our team.

You can tear Drummond apart any number of ways. Fact is he is a skilled strong big who would be the best we’ve had in a long time. Sing him now with the full intent to make him a key part of our future. You still get this half season to see how he does. Drummond is like any man...he may find the right fit with our Hornets...one that motivates him to his greatest achievement level. Let’s get him.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#39 » by Braggins » Sat Mar 27, 2021 1:23 am

yosemiteben wrote:
BigSlam wrote:Drummond was actually pretty good passer/ball mover at UConn. He drew some early Shaq comparisons in that way.

There are a bunch of articles from back in 2017 when it looked like he'd turned the corner into a franchise big with a decent passing game.

https://thebasketballnetwork.com/andre-drummond-elite-passing-big/

https://fansided.com/2017/11/22/andre-drummond-pistons-post-up-passing/

https://www.freep.com/story/sports/nba/2017/11/08/detroit-pistons-andre-drummond/839979001/

This kind of stuff is whats so frustrating about him. He has good passing skill. If hed stick to rim running and short roll passing hed instantly be so much more serviceable on offense, but he wants to try to create shots himself.

This traditionally hasn't been a franchise where players come and finally "get it". Things are hopefully changing on this front, but if anything, this has been a place where players come for one last shot at indulging their worst impulses. Thats part of the reason Ive been so against giving up assets for him. I have very little faith that hes going to come here and transform his play style, but its worth taking a shot with him if its a buyout scenario. I just hope they aren't planning on throwing him a huge pay down the line and will have a pretty short leash if he comes here and starts to disrupt things.
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Re: Hornets to make pitch for Drummond 

Post#40 » by luciano-davidwesley » Sat Mar 27, 2021 1:58 am

BlackOutBuzz wrote:
luciano-davidwesley wrote:
BlackOutBuzz wrote:2nd most, we're the only team that has capspace aside from the Knicks. Of course, the Knicks have a ton, and we cut ours by more than half by acquiring Wanamaker. Still, it's more than any contender can offer.

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