Van Gundy's on my &!!)*! list

[W_HAMILTON]

And I liked him, too.

Watching the game on ABC, that dumb jackass said that Andrew Bynum should be a reserve on the Eastern All-Star team, "because he was born in the East, and no other center is deserving of the backup center spot in the East anyway."

Really?

14 ppg
59% fg
10.9 rpg
1.8 bpg

12ppg
54% fg
8.3rpg
1.9 bpg

I guess I can't fault him, though; when you only televise Lakers and Cavs games, you probably don't know too much about the rest of the league.

[Dexmor]

It's not about stats. You guys know Im a Laker and Bobcats fan so I say this with no bias but Bynum is way better. It's not about stats but Bynum plays less, is more aggressive and has alot of teammates taking shots. Bynum had 42 the other night. He is way better then Mek. Plus the Lakers are awesome.
Mek is a very good player but he is not a star and the allstar game should have only stars.

[countryboi]

yea i liked van gundy's too i think he was more trying to be funny than a serious...but still a slap in the face to meka....not that anyone knows about him outside of charlotte

[W_HAMILTON]

It's not about stats but Bynum plays less, is more aggressive and has alot of teammates taking shots.

Apparently not, seeing as how Bynum actually averages more shots/game than Okafor, even though Bynum plays fewer minutes.

Mek is a very good player but he is not a star and the allstar game should have only stars.

Bynum is not a star. Okafor is a better defender, and he's more efficient offensively (at least from the field).

If Okafor played alongside Kobe, Gasol, Odom, etc, we'd be watching him every Sunday on TV and Van Gundy would be kissing his ass instead.

[W_HAMILTON]

yea i liked van gundy's too i think he was more trying to be funny than a serious...but still a slap in the face to meka....not that anyone knows about him outside of charlotte

He was trying to be both serious and funny. It's obvious from the exchange that he thought no center from the East deserved to be on the All-Star team. If he left it at that, that would be fine. But when he put Bynum's name in there, considering what Okafor has accomplished this season, that was disrespectful. You put Okafor on that team, and they are just as good, if not better, because Okafor is committed to defense and would be content just playing defense and rebounding without worrying about his offense. Lakers fans were bitching earlier in the year how Bynum wouldn't do this exact thing. The Lakers are a much more talented team, yet when it comes to defensive efficiency, Okafor's Bobcats are virtually tied with the Lakers (at least according to Hollinger). If we continue to play the way we have since the PHO trade, it means we will end up surpassing the Lakers in defensive efficiency, and Okafor is our best defender and the anchor of our defense.

So, don't tell me he isn't deserving, while someone like Bynum is.

[thruthefire]

It's not about stats. You guys know Im a Laker and Bobcats fan so I say this with no bias but Bynum is way better. It's not about stats but Bynum plays less, is more aggressive and has alot of teammates taking shots. Bynum had 42 the other night. He is way better then Mek. Plus the Lakers are awesome.
Mek is a very good player but he is not a star and the allstar game should have only stars.

Actually, per minute Emeka is a better rebounder. When you factor in that Lakers are 5th in pace and the Bobcats are 27th in pace, it makes Okafor a much better rebounder. In terms of production, Bynum averages 2 more points than Okafor does at 34.5 mpg (the number of minutes Okafor is averaging). Not much when you consider the difference in pace. Last time I checked, Okafor has alot of teammates taking shots as well. If anything, Bynum benefits from playing with Bryant, Gasol, and Odom. He get's plenty of easy buckets.

The difference in PER is .13

Conclusion: Bynum is not way better than Okafor. He could possible be better, but probably not. Also you must be a woman 'cause you don't know **** about basketball.

[thruthefire]

yea i liked van gundy's too i think he was more trying to be funny than a serious...but still a slap in the face to meka....not that anyone knows about him outside of charlotte

He was trying to be both serious and funny. It's obvious from the exchange that he thought no center from the East deserved to be on the All-Star team. If he left it at that, that would be fine. But when he put Bynum's name in there, considering what Okafor has accomplished this season, that was disrespectful. You put Okafor on that team, and they are just as good, if not better, because Okafor is committed to defense and would be content just playing defense and rebounding without worrying about his offense. Lakers fans were bitching earlier in the year how Bynum wouldn't do this exact thing. The Lakers are a much more talented team, yet when it comes to defensive efficiency, Okafor's Bobcats are virtually tied with the Lakers (at least according to Hollinger). If we continue to play the way we have since the PHO trade, it means we will end up surpassing the Lakers in defensive efficiency, and Okafor is our best defender and the anchor of our defense.

So, don't tell me he isn't deserving, while someone like Bynum is.

I doubt he thought of Okafor because he plays in Charlotte.

When the TNT crew was discussing who should be an all star reserve, David Lee came up, but all of them wrote that off. They didn't even mention Okafor until they should the graphic of Bobcats/Lakers on NBATV, which ironically had Bynum and Okafor on it. Ernie said "how about Okafor?" and everyone else said he deserves to make it. Infact, Webber went as far as to say he's one of the best centers in the world.

[Rich4114]

I don't take what these morons say seriously. Even if our team was good we'd still have guys getting snubbed.

[Dexmor]

I must be a women? Are you serious? Ask any gm who they take Bynum or Mek and they will all tell you Bynum. This is a freaking joke. I don't care if you choose Mek cause your a Bobcats fan but to insult me because Im telling you it's Bynum is redicoulus. Why don't you go to the general board and do a poll. Lets see how many "women" post here.

[thruthefire]

I must be a women? Are you serious? Ask any gm who they take Bynum or Mek and they will all tell you Bynum. This is a freaking joke. I don't care if you choose Mek cause your a Bobcats fan but to insult me because Im telling you it's Bynum is redicoulus. Why don't you go to the general board and do a poll. Lets see how many "women" post here.

I don't doubt that they would take Bynum. He has more potential. Right now, Bynum is not WAY better than Okafor as you said. He may be better, but only by the slightest of margins.

[ohara]

One treads seriously on perilous ground when one starts to use the word "woman" as a derogatory word. I know lots of women who know far more than you or I about sports. That statement was not cool at all.

As for the discussion, I'd take Bynum over Okafor. Okafor may be slightly better at this juncture, but Bynum has a much higher ceiling, and will pass by Okafor within the next year, barring injury. That is not saying anything bad about Okafor, but rather it is a compliment to Bynum.

[fatlever]

back on topic guys. thanks.

[W_HAMILTON]

You can't have it both ways. Just because you have potential, doesn't mean you are better than someone RIGHT NOW. And if Bynum is producing well enough to make the All-Star team, then Okafor damn sure is as well. We aren't talking about who deserves to be in the All-Star game three years from now, we are talking about who deserves to be in the All-Star game THIS season. Bynum could blow out his knee again and suck the rest of his career. We don't know the future. We do know the present, and Okafor is just as good, if not better, than Bynum right now.

That's all that matters in this discussion.

[Paydro70]

I'm fairly sure O'Hara was saying that if offered either one on the team, he'd choose Bynum, not that Bynum should make the all-star team over Okafor if they were in the same conference.

I don't think there's any doubt that Okafor is doing better this year than Bynum and would be more deserving of an all-star berth... the rebounding and defense in my opinion far outweigh the slight edge on offense.

If I were offered Bynum straight up for Okafor, I would also roll the dice on him. His rebounding has fallen off hard from last year (when it was equal to Okafor's) but I would attribute that almost entirely to Gasol. He's clearly better offensively than Okafor is already, and could get better, and at the very least can match his shot blocking. Whether he has the same defensive ability is questionable, of course, but Bynum is also five years younger and has a lot more room to grow on both sides of the ball.

[Dexmor]

If Bynum were on the Bobcats with him being green light and all the guys trying to get him to take more shots he would average 20 points.
His offense is totally polished. He has many go to moves down low and Mek doesn't. Rebounds and blocks are similar.
They play head to head on Tuesday. Lets see who plays better.

[Liver_Pooty]

RIGHT NOW Okafor is superior to Bynum. Bynum is just too inconsistent right now. Puts up 42 one night to disappear the next. With Okafor you know what you are going to get. Granted Bynums footwork, and such are more polished than Okafors, but on the defensive end he isnt up to par yet which gives Okafor a slight edge over him.

I also wish people would stop the Bynum Dwight Howard debate. Bynum doesnt have near the athleticism of Howard, or the desire to rebound the ball that Howard does.

[Dexmor]

This seems SO obvious to me even if your a Bobcat fan. I watch every Laker game I can and have since he was drafted so I know his game inside and out.
Andrew Bynum is 7'1 and about 290-300 pounds of muscle. He grew since he was drafted in height and bulk. He is very very strong. He is surprising quick and way more athletic then people think. He has great hands. He is an excellent rebounder and shotblocker.
He only plays 29 minutes and still gets 1.8 blocks and it would be more but with him and Gasol they alter shots and normally it would be more. He is an excellent rebounder. He is still not even 100% after the injury he is just starting to play up to his old self and next year when he is fully recoved watch out.
He is playing in a system were the first option is Kobe Bryant the second option is Pau Gasol and he is the third option on offense. His pg is a shooter in Derek Fisher who never makes plays.
If he were on the Cats he would do the opposite of Mek and there would never be anybody saying Bynum needs to be more aggressive. He wouldn't airball 8 foot shots and free throws in the 4th. He would be a 20 plus guy and probably play 38 minutes and grab 11 boards with 3 blocks or so.
His teacher is Kareem and because of that he has several unblockable low post moves down low and his game down low is completely polished and he is even learning to hit the 15 footer.
The fact that people even do compare him to Howard even though Howard is clearly better tells you something.


Mek is strong but he is not as strong as Bynum. He is listed at 6'10 but it's more like 6'10 in shoes rounded up. He is undersized which is why there not sure if they want to keep him at Center. He takes 10 shots a game even though his team needs scoring and they want to go to him but it's like the aggressive scoring part of his game is missing. He has no go to move at all down low he just bullies the ball in. He has no finasse like Bynum and no killer insticnt. The coach and the team want him to be the #1 scorer yet he is still timid on offense and he is much older and yet so behind offensively compared to what he can be. He also plays with a pg who does pass alot and makes plays and a PF right next to him that instead of takes his space and scores alot wants to pass pass pass.
Imagine Mek played for the Lakers and was 3rd option after Gasol and Kobe and then imagine Bynum had all the shots on the Cats and Boris and Felton giving him the ball along with Bell.
The only arguement you can make is he is a better defender but the only thing that makes him a better defender imo is he can guard pf's and C's. Bynum is bigger so he could give the big Centers a harder time when the big guys can just shoot over the top of Mek.

Mek would need a few things to happen for him to be on that same level.

1.He would have to change the way he thinks, he would have to develop a killer insticnt and be more competitive and call for the damm ball. Espially when he is playing a weaker Center because he is so strong.
2.He needs to work on his post moves. He needs at least 1 go to move down low. A hook or something. I still think espially now that ZO is retired they should hire ZO to work exclusevely with Mek like they did with Bynum and Kareem. Both 6'10 strong Centers and Mek should copy Zo and that hook he does.
3.He needs to master the 15 footer. I don't understand for a guy who has the reputation of being a "work horse" it doesn't seem like he's gotten all that much better from his rookie year. Any player with a good work ethic should learn to master the 15 footer or at least get better as each year passes.
4.Try and dunk more. He does dunk alot but he needs to keep practicing his post game and until he has a mastered post game he needs to dunk like Amare did his rookie year. Try and dunk all the time. Be aggressive and try and dunk more to get your teammates ampted up and try and draw some fouls.

[Dexmor]

Don't get me wrong Mek is the 2nd best Center in the East so he should tecknically be on the allstar team but I also understand wanting to put Bosh over him is understandable.

Jeff Van Gundy is stupid to say Andy V should be an allstar over Bosh because of wins.
Danny Granger is the 4th scorer in the league. There is no way he should not make it because of wins because if he were on a different team or his team didn't suck he would be surefire.

[BigSlam]

Jeff Van Gundy is stupid to say Andy V should be an allstar over Bosh because of wins.

Totally agree.

The win/loss argument drives me up the wall. Win/loss records are what the playoffs are for, not the All Star game. The All Star game shouldbe just that - the stars of the NBA at their position, regardless of what sort of team they play on.