Bobcats Most Important In Season Transaction

Post #1 » by **BigSlam** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:52 pm

Using Walt's comment as inspiration.......What was it and why?

August Us Seazr · Post #2 » by **August Us Seazr** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 2:01 pm

The trade with Phoenix. 2 starters that actually mesh with what we had. Nothing against Howard, Diop, or Radman, but the J-Rich trade gave us the dimenson to have that 6 game WINNING streak. And something to build on in the future.

Felton for Pres · Post #3 » by **Felton for Pres** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 2:55 pm

I think you could argue that the Radman trade was the bigger return of value given what we gave up (ie, we ripped the Lakers face off in that trade). However, in terms of what impacted the team more, I don't see how it can be anything other than the PHX trade. That remade the team into what LB wanted it to be and was clearly the season changer. Without this trade, the other choices are nice, but I don't think any of them on there own would've made us a playoff contender. The PHX trade did.

chrbal · Post #4 » by **chrbal** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 3:48 pm

Richardson for two starters, no question. The Lakers trade was good value, the Mavericks trade made a lot of sense, but the Suns trade landed this team two starters.

Thats not to discount how well Vlaidimir is doing, while Brown and Morrison only occassionally get playing time.

Post #5 » by **BigSlam** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:22 pm

Let's put a case forward for each of the options:

Swish, Dude and a 2nd for Boris, Raja and Singo
Lost our best ever individual scorer and shooter plus our glue guy and fan fav, but got back two starters (one with a very fair contract and the other who initiates a lot of our easy baskets)

Ammo and Shannon for Radman
We went from pretty much having a non existent bench to having some depth there with a guy who is not affraid to shot and can connect at a pretty high clip. Plus we washed our hands of a draft day mistake

Hammer and Twiggy for Gana
Got out of Hammer's contract and added a defensive big which allows EO50 to get some in game rest (that's for the better........right?)

Signing Juwan Howard
Getting paid peanuts, is pretty much captain of our bench and can come in at a drop of a hat and produce.

Calling Up Bling From The D
Let's face it - I was just making up the numbers with this one!!

ohara · Post #6 » by **ohara** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:24 pm

It's a shutout so far.

Post #7 » by **Walt Cronkite** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:27 pm

I voted for the PHX deal to keep the unanimous decision alive. Bell's leadership, defensive intensity and shooting ability come pretty close to what Jrich gave us and on top of it we got Diaw.

November Walt Cronkite would accuse me of having started drinking too early in the day for what I'm about to write, but here goes: Boris Diaw is a fringe franchise player. On a championship team, I wouldn't count on him being better than a 3rd or 4th scoring option, and as Bassman will point out after any loss where we get brutalized in the paint, he's not a go to post scorer. Furthermore, as Dexmor will point out, he doesn't rebound well. When he was in Phoenix he didn't do so great off of the bench because he needs to be able to freelance a bit and that means he needs the rock in his hands in an appropriate position (read: right elbow to right block zone) a bit and he's got to be given his minutes... but when those things happen, he's one of those guys that does the little things necessary in order to win--the type of guy that makes those around him better.

I totally expect to get lambasted by outsiders and regular posters as well. It's like saying Shane Battier is a borderline franchise player, but he's just one of those guys that you can plug into any team and do good things if you have the right personnel.

Radman trade was awesome though. He can have a bad game and still provide more than what Ammo did on average. I started thinking about the comment I eventually made that lead to this thread after reading Hamilton's post in the playoff race thread. Essentially he was saying that if we don't make the playoffs he would've preferred to not trade Richardson because we'd have a worse record, wouldn't have given up Dudley and a 2nd, etc...but he'd still pull the trigger on the Radmanovic trade regardless. I agree with that. We may second guess the Richardson deal at some point, but I can't ever imagine that happening with the Ammo/Radman trade.

Post #8 » by **BigSlam** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:31 pm

ohara wrote:It's a shutout so far.

In retrospect, maybe I should have made it more interesting by adding "appointing Larry Brown as head coach" as one of the options?

RichBoy923 · Post #9 » by **RichBoy923** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:39 pm

It has to be the one for Raja and Diaw. It is funny that many of you guys didn't like the trade at the time though.

Post #10 » by **BigSlam** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:50 pm

RichBoy923 wrote:It has to be the one for Raja and Diaw. It is funny that many of you guys didn't like the trade at the time though.

We gave up too much in the deal. That will never change.

RichBoy923 · Post #11 » by **RichBoy923** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:51 pm

BigSlam wrote:
RichBoy923 wrote:It has to be the one for Raja and Diaw. It is funny that many of you guys didn't like the trade at the time though.

We gave up too much in the deal. That will never change.

But the outcome is that we improved.

Post #12 » by **BigSlam** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:56 pm

RichBoy923 wrote:
BigSlam wrote:
RichBoy923 wrote:It has to be the one for Raja and Diaw. It is funny that many of you guys didn't like the trade at the time though.

We gave up too much in the deal. That will never change.

But the outcome is that we improved.

Totally - but that doesn't change the fact we gave up too much in the trade.

Felton for Pres · Post #13 » by **Felton for Pres** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:59 pm

BigSlam wrote:
RichBoy923 wrote:It has to be the one for Raja and Diaw. It is funny that many of you guys didn't like the trade at the time though.

We gave up too much in the deal. That will never change.

Completely agree. I still think it could've been JRich for Diaw/Bell. We could've kept Duds and the 2nd rounder.

Post #14 » by **BigSlam** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 5:11 pm

Felton for Pres wrote:
BigSlam wrote:
RichBoy923 wrote:It has to be the one for Raja and Diaw. It is funny that many of you guys didn't like the trade at the time though.

We gave up too much in the deal. That will never change.

Completely agree. I still think it could've been JRich for Diaw/Bell. We could've kept Duds and the 2nd rounder.

RichBoy923 · Post #15 » by **RichBoy923** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 5:13 pm

Yeah I see what you are saying.

But you never know what goes in meetings between front offices. Maybe Suns really wanted Dudley and the only way we'd get Bell and Diaw is if we let go of Dudley too. While we did give up more than what was needed, it worked out in the end and sometimes in order to get pieces you want you might need to throw in some extras to sweeten the deal.

Dexmor · Post #16 » by **Dexmor** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 6:00 pm

I don't believe this is really an arguement. The JRich trade is what made us good. Yes we got Radman for free but in a way we also got either Raja or Diaw for free. I don't know about you guys but I would have just taken Diaw knowing what I know now or Raja for that matter. He takes away points from the other 2 and gives us 14 or so so it's about the same as JRichs 18 and we get leadership.
Diaw and Bell are both more valuable to us then Radman is right now.

GoBobcats · Post #17 » by **GoBobcats** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 6:56 pm

Thats easy , we made out like bandits in the Suns trade.
Its incredible how things changed for the worse in Phoenix after the trade.
I think they miss especially Bell.
Almost feel sorry for them

Liver_Pooty · Post #18 » by **Liver_Pooty** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:29 pm

Obviously its the Richardson trade, but with Radman it was addition by subtraction in getting rid of Morrison anyway, and to add someone like Radman was an added bonus.

therebirth · Post #19 » by **therebirth** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:49 pm

To me J rich is so overrated. He does not make a team better by himself. He is that type of player like Jerry Stackhouse who is a scorer but not a franchise player. How many times have seen him score a lot in the first three quarters just to be quiet in the fourth? How many game winning shots did he make for this team? Unless it is a Jordan, Wade or a Kobe type of greatness, it is better to have a group of team guys than a one on one type of athlete.

As for the trade, there is a reason it took so long to happen. They started talking in the summer but couldn't agree on a deal until some time in December. My guess is management didn't want to do the deal because they didn't think it was fair but with the bad start and Larry crying in the media they were left with little choice. Thank god it worked out.

Marc3287 · Post #20 » by **Marc3287** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 9:16 pm

Each move was great, especially in the context of this team. Diaw and Raja are guys that can benefit any team though. Diaw understands basketball, looks for his teammates, and if he's looking for his shot is amazing around the basket. Raja can play great defense and still put up 15-20 on a high percentage. And maybe above all both are winners. That has to improve the culture having two guys come in that were apart of a very successful team over the last few years and who expect to win. Aside from all that a team is never going to win because of JRich...

Not many teams can have a poll of great moves like we've had, this has been a tremendous season from a personnel standpoint. Hopefully MJ is given a lot of credit for all of this. I am sure Larry Brown had a lot of say in the decision making, but had the moves not worked I can see MJ taking a lot of heat, especially from the general board population, so he deserves credit.

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