China and the NBA/day 11/ Lebron weighs in

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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#221 » by Simmons25 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:55 pm

Mamba Mentality wrote:
Read on Twitter


somebody needs to work out the schematics and verify is this is true, that % seems ways too high


The figure posted elsewhere was $500 million in revenue from China... but in all honesty it's a correction that probably has to happen and now is a good time as any. You can't have a professional sporting organization in the US so heavily reliant on funding from a Communist country that at a whim will pull the carpet from under you... for absolutely no reason other than a harmless tweet.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#222 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:56 pm

taikibansei wrote:
OrlandoNed wrote:
celtics543 wrote:
Kind of just sounds like he'd like to learn more about it to make an informed comment rather than an off the cuff uniformed comment. Seems like a smart decision. Just because he has some knowledge of American politics and goings-on doesn't mean he has the same knowledge of what's happening in China.

Bull.

How informed do you have be to say, "Oppressive Communist regimes are bad. Harvesting organs from ethnoreligious minorities is bad. Attacking peaceful protesters with uniformed and ununiformed state-sponsered thugs are bad."?

He has no problem running his mouth when there are no consequences.


Yeah, what Kerr should have said instead was, "Exactly like President Trump, who promised Xi that he would not speak out in support of the HK protests, and who has banned US diplomats from discussing this topic, I too will not speak out against China at this time."

Feel better?


It's amazing how these dudes want coaches and players to make statements like this, but they cry like bitches when Popovich and Kerr tell the truth about Donald Trump, when Adam Silver wants to give women equal opportunity, or the players speak out against police brutality.

They don't care about China, they don't care that Trump is a racist lunatic, they don't want women to be treated as equals, and they want Black players to shut up about police killing us with impunity. This is the truth of the matter and why they're going on about this.

A pack of **** ing frauds.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#223 » by scrabbarista » Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:57 pm

Here's that link again. https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27812008/nba-game-china-played-some-restrictions

Interesting how it starts with a blatant case of priming. "Return to normalcy," before it proceeds to say that the Chinese government cancelled Adam Silver's news conference and also banned all players from speaking to the media! Lol.

But the article does contain a couple of other interesting points. Fans were handed Chinese flags when entering the stadium.

Neither national anthem was played.

Lastly, the article goes into the LAL-BKN game itself. When it reached this point, I was reminded that yes, sports actually can be a way of bringing people together from wildly different backgrounds. While this aspect of sports may sometimes be exploited by different entities for their own purposes, it's true nevertheless. I would assume most of us have experienced this. You meet a stranger, maybe someone from a different country or culture or whatever, and discovering they're an NBA fan just bonds you in spite of everything. I think anyone who's ever played pick-up in a foreign country (or even "foreign culture" for those of us who've crossed between different socio-economic classes via the game) can also attest to this. In spite of everything going on right now, the game itself is still one of the greatest things on Earth.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 5)... 

Post#224 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:58 pm

kobe808lak wrote:
spikeslovechild wrote:
First Step wrote:The difference is the NFL hasn't been the leader of the woke culture. From the leagues perspective, they tend to be very apolitical. You don't see them making open political statements like the NBA does.

The issue here is that Silver will make money in the market of China, while ignoring all the human rights issues that are going on there, while also leading the equality of rights movement in the States where he is at no risk of financial loss for his ideologies.


I think cancel culture has gotten out way out of control to me it has sort of reinforced the notion that if you don't want Kap to kneel on the field make a rule against it and either fine or suspend him when he does. Don't boycott him don't try to take away his livelihood. I am not going to lie this event has caused me to rethink some things.

What we are seeing with China where they have taken a tweet from Morey and used that as a basis to leverage their entire economy against the NBA sort of is eye opening and makes me believe even more that we as a country need to learn to respect the rights of others who hold different viewpoints to have those viewpoints

I highly doubt it will change the outrage culture and boycotting seems so ingrained at the moment but I think what the Chinese did is sort of the logical counterpoint to why this is such a dangerous dark path to go down on


Nothing about what the CCP is doing here is logical.


Oh, it is logical. This is the same scam that they've been running globally for years now.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#225 » by Simmons25 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:58 pm

.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#226 » by lakers2020 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:02 pm

I would argue that a lot of these actors or NBA players aren't necessarily the leftists claim to be. It's just the ideology that makes them the most money, protects their career. And conveniently you can see it with China now.

The main reason is that leftists get super easily offended, while people on the right don't really care about peoples beliefs or what people say. So these actors and athletes don't want to offend these sanctimonious cry babies on the left.
Look at all the bullying from the media and celebs if someone comes out of the closet as having a small government ideology. Dare step off the thought plantation... and the Orwellian beast will slander you and destroy you. Independent thinkers like Elon Musk and Kanye West are branded as lunatics and they aren't even necessarily right wing.

The left is no longer liberal and that's why I almost never use that word. The right is much more classically liberal than leftists in the 21st century. The lefts want big oppressive government to control your speech, to take away your guns so you are defenseless against them ( I bet Hong Kong would love a 2nd amendment) and for merit to be based on how oppressed you are by your race, gender or sexuality, not your skill.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#227 » by scrabbarista » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:02 pm

Mamba Mentality wrote:
Read on Twitter


somebody needs to work out the schematics and verify is this is true, that % seems ways too high


Everything I've heard seems to indicate that it's more or less accurate. When it comes to NBA licensed apparel, for example, China accounts for 20% of global sales. I don't think any number is worth siding with a censoring, murderous government, but the numbers are significant and do have to be acknowledged.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#228 » by Simmons25 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:03 pm

DubTheVanDamage wrote:
taikibansei wrote:
OrlandoNed wrote:Bull.

How informed do you have be to say, "Oppressive Communist regimes are bad. Harvesting organs from ethnoreligious minorities is bad. Attacking peaceful protesters with uniformed and ununiformed state-sponsered thugs are bad."?

He has no problem running his mouth when there are no consequences.


Yeah, what Kerr should have said instead was, "Exactly like President Trump, who promised Xi that he would not speak out in support of the HK protests, and who has banned US diplomats from discussing this topic, I too will not speak out against China at this time."

Feel better?


This isn't only directed at you, but why is the ultimate goal of an argument to declare someone else a hypocrite?

It really doesn't matter if Trump is a hypocrite -- he was also right here.

I like Kerr but his quote was pathetic. "Need to learn more," well, Steve, the information is out there -- what have you learned in the past 3 days? When can we expect you to opine on the matter?

It would have been a poor business decision for Kerr to speak out -- he may have decided that a Pyrrhic gesture in support of Hong Kong simply wasn't worth the damage it would have done -- that's a reasonable, albeit slightly weaselly, decision. The reality is that nothing Kerr or the NBA does is going to alter events unfolding in Hong Kong. But he should have just said, "No comment, I will let the commissioner address this," rather than a weak excuse about not knowing enough to speak.


Kerr is an outright liar which is what really grinds my gears. At least be honest and say "I don't want to comment on other countries issues"... but pretending he doesn't know was just gutless.

Only 12 months ago a story was written about him where it was made pretty clear by his own players that he not only knows what goes on in world politics... but goes out of his way to pull players aside to teach them about world politics. Then he comes out and says "I don't know enough" :lol:

He often talks to his players before practice about what is going on in the world socially and politically. Warriors forward David West said most of their conversations are not about basketball.

https://theundefeated.com/features/steve-kerr-speaks-truth-to-power-and-his-players-respect-him-for-it/
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 5)... 

Post#229 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:07 pm

edit: staying on topic.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 5)... 

Post#230 » by spikeslovechild » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:07 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:
spikeslovechild wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:Why are you dudes not calling out the owners for their complicity? You think that Adam Silver is some god that calls the shots for the league? The Rockets owner was the first one to get on his knees for Winnie the Pooh and none of you are calling him or the other owners, who are either silent or gaslighting Americans (Joe Tsai), out. Why?

Your outrage is fraudulent. The most I can agree on yall is that no authoritarian dictatorship should ever dictate what American free speech is. I think that's common ground. But this stuff about you guys getting your rocks off because you hate Silver, Kerr, Popovich and the players for caring about American social issues is lame af.


I mean sure but the owners are not the one speaking out on other issues. We KNOW they won't prioritize human rights over profits.

But it says something when a player criticizes the use of the word "owner" and talks about NFL owners having a "slave owners mentality" but are completely silent on China even as they today use NK slave laborers to build their cities, sends minorities to reducation camps (hanization camps), and try to snuff out what little freedoms the people of Hong Kong enjoy.

Why? Because they are worried if the Chinese blood money dries up their contracts might go down. What a bunch of frauds.


So it's cool for the owners to keep quiet and suck Xi Jinping off but because the players and coaches call attention to issues in America that impact Americans directly they're also supposed to be calling out China's bad behavior?

and you know what the Chinese will say when they do it? They'll say you Americans put children in cages, separate families, and your police hunt down Black men for sport.

The players have no obligation to say anything about a foreign country. Period. This entire argument you guys are on is complete garbage because you don't want to hear athletes call attention to the problems in our country that don't impact you.


Of course they will they always have. Way back when the USSR used to go infront of the UN and absolve the millions deaths in ukraine, poland and their other satellites from collectivization (starvation/famine) with the saying "And you lynch negros".

Noone is saying America is perfect and doesn't have problems but if you buy in into Chinese propaganda that they are in anyway comparable to what is happening inside of China then that is a YOU problem.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 5)... 

Post#231 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:08 pm

spikeslovechild wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
spikeslovechild wrote:
I mean sure but the owners are not the one speaking out on other issues. We KNOW they won't prioritize human rights over profits.

But it says something when a player criticizes the use of the word "owner" and talks about NFL owners having a "slave owners mentality" but are completely silent on China even as they today use NK slave laborers to build their cities, sends minorities to reducation camps (hanization camps), and try to snuff out what little freedoms the people of Hong Kong enjoy.

Why? Because they are worried if the Chinese blood money dries up their contracts might go down. What a bunch of frauds.


So it's cool for the owners to keep quiet and suck Xi Jinping off but because the players and coaches call attention to issues in America that impact Americans directly they're also supposed to be calling out China's bad behavior?

and you know what the Chinese will say when they do it? They'll say you Americans put children in cages, separate families, and your police hunt down Black men for sport.

The players have no obligation to say anything about a foreign country. Period. This entire argument you guys are on is complete garbage because you don't want to hear athletes call attention to the problems in our country that don't impact you.


Of course they will they always have. Way back when the USSR used to go infront of the UN and absolve the millions deaths in ukraine, poland and their other satellites from collectivization (starvation/famine) with the saying "And you lynch negros".

Noone is saying America is perfect and doesn't have problems but if you buy in into Chinese propaganda that they are in anyway comparable to what is happening inside of China then that is a YOU problem.


Nice strawman by saying I buy into CCP propaganda when I was on here tearing into Nets owner Joe Tsai for his obvious gaslighting of American citizens by using...CCP Propaganda.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#232 » by Kordic27 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:08 pm

Best to get out of this relationship while you’re not too dependant - if a soft Morey tweet, that was quickly deleted and apologized for, causes this much reaction, imagine what would happen if a player said what’s pretty damn clear at this point, and DOESN’T apologize?
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#233 » by Hornet Mania » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:11 pm

Corporate greed probably does not (or cannot) realize it but it's a lot smarter to take that 10% hit now rather than later.

In 30 years lets say the NBA's presence in China takes off the way they hope, and assume that the CCP is still in charge. In that scenario China could easily represent half of the league's revenue if not more. In that scenario Adam Silver does not have the luxury of allowing his employees freedom of expression, he either bends the knee immediately to an authoritarian government or the entire league is ruined overnight.

Doing business with China is inherently an unstable proposition because the CCP's whims can and will shift on a dime. If the heath of your business depends on the CCP's approval you have no control over your business. The real question in the long term is not whether the NBA wants to pursue a large potential market or sacrifice those possibilities, it's whether the NBA wants to control itself or slowly but surely become controlled by a foreign government with authoritarian policies.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#234 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:12 pm

taikibansei wrote:
Hardaway2step wrote:The Turks are not even Native to that region, and here they have been slaughtering and chasing out the native peoples with some of the worst recorded genocides in history with no obvious intentions of stopping and governments like the USA dont even bat an eye. Israel gets given back to the jews and they get tons of money from the USA and the UK every year. Well kick out the turks from Turkey and send them back to central Asia and return the Armenians, Greeks and Kurds their home too and give them money yeah.


Shh...Turkey (and North Korea, and Saudi Arabia, and Russia) are our allies now, so no speaking truth about them, or about the myriad of domestic issues (the real trigger for most posters here) we need to address. You need to discuss China and only China--again, a country half these posters didn't know existed before this week.


Dudes can't even find Hong Kong on a map.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 5)... 

Post#235 » by Roy The Natural » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:13 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:
kobe808lak wrote:
spikeslovechild wrote:
I think cancel culture has gotten out way out of control to me it has sort of reinforced the notion that if you don't want Kap to kneel on the field make a rule against it and either fine or suspend him when he does. Don't boycott him don't try to take away his livelihood. I am not going to lie this event has caused me to rethink some things.

What we are seeing with China where they have taken a tweet from Morey and used that as a basis to leverage their entire economy against the NBA sort of is eye opening and makes me believe even more that we as a country need to learn to respect the rights of others who hold different viewpoints to have those viewpoints

I highly doubt it will change the outrage culture and boycotting seems so ingrained at the moment but I think what the Chinese did is sort of the logical counterpoint to why this is such a dangerous dark path to go down on


Nothing about what the CCP is doing here is logical.


Oh, it is logical. This is the same scam that they've been running globally for years now.


Most other industry's have learned not to deal too much with China. Outsource some cheap parts, but if you're assembling any new technology over there, expect your IP to be stolen, and then to get undercut. I'm sure there are great people in the country of China, but the whole system there is a system of thieves and authoritarians. Doing businessmen with China really is "shaking hands with the devil" and is very akin to doing business with Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union (kind of a milder combination of both).

I wouldn't condemn the populace of China, but the government has put policies in place that encourage internationally illegal behavior. I stand with Hong Kong. It's a beautiful place (been there 5 times) and a good place to do business. China should keep out, they'll ruin Hong Kong.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#236 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:13 pm

celtics543 wrote:
Jimmy Recard wrote:
Read on Twitter


Kind of just sounds like he'd like to learn more about it to make an informed comment rather than an off the cuff uniformed comment. Seems like a smart decision. Just because he has some knowledge of American politics and goings-on doesn't mean he has the same knowledge of what's happening in China.


It's pretty obvious to me that he would rather Steve Kerr speak directly out of his ass, like the President of the United States does, than to offer a well thought out and educated opinion.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#237 » by scrabbarista » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:13 pm

This thread's getting a bit icky. I'm gonna take a break. I'll probably be back later today. Peace, guys. Fight for freedom. Stand with Hong Kong.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#238 » by Simmons25 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:14 pm

lakers2020 wrote:I would argue that a lot of these actors or NBA players aren't necessarily the leftists claim to be. It's just the ideology that makes them the most money, protects their career. And conveniently you can see it with China now.

The main reason is that leftists get super easily offended, while people on the right don't really care about peoples beliefs or what people say. So these actors and athletes don't want to offend these sanctimonious cry babies on the left.
Look at all the bullying from the media and celebs if someone comes out of the closet as having a small government ideology. Dare step off the thought plantation... and the Orwellian beast will slander you and destroy you. Independent thinkers like Elon Musk and Kanye West are branded as lunatics and they aren't even necessarily right wing.

The left is no longer liberal and that's why I almost never use that word. The right is much more classically liberal than leftists in the 21st century. The lefts want big oppressive government to control your speech, to take away your guns so you are defenseless against them ( I bet Hong Kong would love a 2nd amendment) and for merit to be based on how oppressed you are by your race or sexuality, not your skill.


Probably the most accurate post here. I was always considered "centre-left" according to my political compass tests... but the left has gone so far to the left that it's been completely overtaken by this cancel culture and name calling... that even I am considered a "right winger" even though I despise guns and pro-choice etc etc.

I mean... someone mentioned that Conservatives are getting their moneys worth on social media over this. Why? Well because they have been pro Hong Kong and anti-China for the last few months because they see Hong Kong as wanting the same values the right cherish... whilst they see the Communism of China as holding values that closely align to the left.

And now it is coming home to roost... that the very people in the NBA that have been pushing extreme left wing narratives and cancel culture... are now falling victims to the very Cancel culture they created. China is literally now trying to cancel the NBA... for having one opinion that they did not agree with. That fact isn't being lost on most people.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 5)... 

Post#239 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:15 pm

Roy The Natural wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
kobe808lak wrote:
Nothing about what the CCP is doing here is logical.


Oh, it is logical. This is the same scam that they've been running globally for years now.


Most other industry's have learned not to deal too much with China. Outsource some cheap parts, but if you're assembling any new technology over there, expect your IP to be stolen, and then to get undercut. I'm sure there are great people in the country of China, but the whole system there is a system of thieves and authoritarians. Doing businessmen with China really is "shaking hands with the devil" and is very akin to doing business with Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union (kind of a milder combination of both).

I wouldn't condemn the populace of China, but the government has put policies in place that encourage internationally illegal behavior. I stand with Honk Kong. It's a beautiful place (been there 5 times) and a good place to do business. China should keep out, they'll ruin Honk Kong.


Yeah, I think it's good to make a distinction that when folks are talking about the CCP we're not attacking the people of China. I feel bad for them as well for having to live under that kind of rule.
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Re: China and the NBA / Ongoing discussion (day 6)... 

Post#240 » by Michael Jordan » Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:15 pm

I bet that China is telling the NBA to fire Morey over his harmless tweet and the league is resisting over the backlash they'll face for doing so.

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