Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss

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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#61 » by Da ThRONe » Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:18 am

The biggest problem I have with Harden's play style is it seems to drain him for the playoffs when it matters most.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#62 » by brettski » Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:24 am

ken6199 wrote:
MartyConlonOnTheRun wrote:
JN61 wrote:Think how much he would have been positive had he created better spots for his teammates instead of killing ball movement with dribble dribble dribble 3 pointer. Food for thought. If you have off night trust your teammates more.

That is why I may overrate Giannis. He is more than willing to set his guys up for easy buckets. Maybe it is fantasy he makes other guys better by playing the game the right way, buy what is real is the bucks being able to sign Robin, Wes and korver for less than $10m combined. People will say harden has no help but 1. He has had and all nba PG with him for multiple years 2. You start to see why role player don't want to join him.

His backcourt running mate: Lin, Beverley, Lawson, Prigioni, Terry.

The year he got Paul is the year we were that close to a championship. Then Paul declined big time.

I do agree with your second part though, that legit role players like Wes and Korver don't want to play with him because of his style.


CP3 ia proving that he has not declined big time. That is a false narrative you're pushing.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#63 » by JN61 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:42 am

Dr Aki wrote:
JN61 wrote:This is why Chris Paul is crucial for rockets success. He controls the pace and puts ball moving. Tucker just attempting 1 shot was just ridiculous. It's a team game. You gotta trust your teammates.


Fixed

Chris Paul didn't control pace at all. Westbrook does.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#64 » by TheBallsDeeper » Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:47 am

Da ThRONe wrote:The biggest problem I have with Harden's play style is it seems to drain him for the playoffs when it matters most.

He doesn’t care - he is only interested in regular season personal records.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#65 » by AussieCeltic » Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:52 am

JN61 wrote:
Dr Aki wrote:
JN61 wrote:This is why Chris Paul is crucial for rockets success. He controls the pace and puts ball moving. Tucker just attempting 1 shot was just ridiculous. It's a team game. You gotta trust your teammates.


Fixed

Chris Paul didn't control pace at all. Westbrook does.


Chris Paul, one of the best PG’s of all time, doesn’t control pace but Westbrook does? Westbrook has one speed and that’s redlining it
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#66 » by JN61 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:55 am

AussieCeltic wrote:
JN61 wrote:
Dr Aki wrote:
Fixed

Chris Paul didn't control pace at all. Westbrook does.


Chris Paul, one of the best PG’s of all time, doesn’t control pace but Westbrook does? Westbrook has one speed and that’s redlining it

Harden controlled it all the time and only when he was on the floor last year.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#67 » by KGtabake » Wed Jan 15, 2020 1:23 pm

I said it in the MVP thread a while ago.
Blame D'Antoni.
When it was the last time you watched Harden take a midrange shot? A fadeaway jumper?
D'Antoni is making Harden less enjoyable for the eye.
Does anyone really believe that Harden can't score without stepback 3s or drives to the hoop?
His coach is making him and the whole team predictable.
That's why Westbrook(with all his flaws) is valuable for the Rockets. He can make the unexpected and he clearly doesn't buy D'Antoni's system all the way.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#68 » by Bergmaniac » Wed Jan 15, 2020 2:07 pm

Do we really need such a thread every time Harden has an inefficient game?

He was quite good for most of the game, BTW, but the 4th quarter was a disaster from him, uncharacteristically poor decision-making, he kept trying to force shots inside against 3 or 4 defenders instead of passing to wide open teammates and got blocked several times.

But he's had an amazing season. Houston being the 2nd best offense with Eric Gordon missing half the season and with Westbrook's jump shot gone completely MIA for most of the season is quite the achievement.

When it was the last time you watched Harden take a midrange shot?

He took one last night. And it's not MDA who is forcing him not to take them, he has the ultimate green light to do whatever he wants. Westbrook takes plenty of midrange shots and MDA allows it.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#69 » by PistolPeteJR » Wed Jan 15, 2020 3:09 pm

ken6199 wrote:
The Lazy Potato wrote:While GIannis had 37 points 9 rebounds and 4 assists on a 70% FG, 83 % FT , 3-5 from 3's in only 20 minutes. lol

Are we this low now? Just based on one game, you come in here and swing attacks? When Giannis had a terrible game, did we go there attack him?

If you really need to pick a game, u pick a beat down on Knicks vs a Memphis team who won 8-2 in their last 10 and on a 6 game winning streak, led by an exciting ROY. Are you really doing this?

Look I respect Giannis and I respect his game. Please do the same thing or if you can't, at least don't come in and clown around with your "one game analysis" garbage. You are embarrassing yourself and making the Giannis fans look bad.


Welcome to RealGM haha. It’s always been like this, you know that.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#70 » by PistolPeteJR » Wed Jan 15, 2020 3:11 pm

JN61 wrote:
Dr Aki wrote:
JN61 wrote:This is why Chris Paul is crucial for rockets success. He controls the pace and puts ball moving. Tucker just attempting 1 shot was just ridiculous. It's a team game. You gotta trust your teammates.


Fixed

Chris Paul didn't control pace at all. Westbrook does.


What? What do you mean Paul doesn’t control pace but Westbrook does? I’m sorry but I’m flabbergasted here. Have you been watching basketball since before 2018?
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#71 » by Bum Adebayo » Wed Jan 15, 2020 3:22 pm

KGtabake wrote:I said it in the MVP thread a while ago.
Blame D'Antoni.
When it was the last time you watched Harden take a midrange shot? A fadeaway jumper?
D'Antoni is making Harden less enjoyable for the eye.
Does anyone really believe that Harden can't score without stepback 3s or drives to the hoop?
His coach is making him and the whole team predictable.
That's why Westbrook(with all his flaws) is valuable for the Rockets. He can make the unexpected and he clearly doesn't buy D'Antoni's system all the way.


This is correct, Harden may go as the biggest what if ever. He could have been the GOAT, he is that talented, but then disgusting Moreyball happened and his style of play suffered as a result.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#72 » by FlatearthZorro » Wed Jan 15, 2020 3:24 pm

When you play the style of ball Harden does, you're bound to have that type of a game or two. I mean he has usage and shoots a lot regardless. So when he's cold, things wont look too good.
Good assessment:

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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#73 » by HotelVitale » Wed Jan 15, 2020 3:26 pm

WHITE_HOT_HEAT wrote: The hate is too much, however he is a chucker (not inefficient) and isn't playing basketball that will lead the team to a Championship. You know that it's the free throws and ref baiting that makes fans loathe him.

NoZoLakers wrote:you sure his ts% isnt mostly due to the ridiculous amt of fts he gets a gm?


You talk about drawing free throws like it's some BS loophole or something rather than the product of unstoppable skill. Every single night teams defenses and coaching staffs spend hours gameplanning for how not to foul Harden, how to play him when he gets into the defense in various ways that you're not giving him those freebies. And just about every night he gets fouled 5-20 times. It's not a trick or a loophole or anything else, it's game. He's beating the defense and he's too shifty and strong for them to stay in his way, and he's way too good for them to just give him room.

I feel like people fixate on the maybe 1-2 plays per game when he draws a foul in a lazy way or where he actively sort of sets up a foul. That happens sure but he's involved with literally 50 plays a night and the overwhelmingly majority of those are him playing the game and usually beating it.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#74 » by The_Hater » Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:33 pm

Barnzy wrote:When will this guy realise it's not all about points, stats and the MVP award? That is another full on garbage chuck fest night.

RIP to his MVP chances. Houston slipping down to equal 5th in the West.



The Rockets have been one of the league's top teams for years now, including leading the league with 65 wins 2 years back. So saying his production doesn't lead to winning is false. They were the only team who truly gave the stacked Warriors any trouble the past 3 seasons when they were fully healthy with KD.

The Rockers offense has finished in the top 2 in the league for 4 straight seasons now. So considering that Harden has been the main part of that offense, his stats are actually fueling that ranking.

And to say he's just a chucker would also be completely wrong. Not only is he scoring points at a rate like we've never seen in a long time, he's doing so while posting an efficiency rate well above the league average and dishing out assists at a top 3 pace. His current TS% of 63.0 is his highest yet in a Rocket's uniform and currently rates 2nd in the league for all perimeter players. Only George Hill is higher, and obviously that's on a much smaller volume of shots.

There are players putting up huge numbers on terrible basketball teams right now, perhaps those players actually fit your narrative but Harden does not.

Your bias on this issue seems clear but hopefully you'll read my post and notice the obvious flaws in your argument. One bad game doesn't make your overall narrative correct, the stats and the wins over a larger sample say otherwise.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#75 » by inquisitive » Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:39 pm

They just need to avoid the sub .500 teams
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#76 » by eskis » Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:59 pm

feels like everybody just waiting for harden or westbrook to have bad game so they can post about it....
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#77 » by dhsilv2 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:09 pm

Da ThRONe wrote:The biggest problem I have with Harden's play style is it seems to drain him for the playoffs when it matters most.


He's running the system his coach put in place.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#78 » by dhsilv2 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:10 pm

brettski wrote:
ken6199 wrote:
MartyConlonOnTheRun wrote:That is why I may overrate Giannis. He is more than willing to set his guys up for easy buckets. Maybe it is fantasy he makes other guys better by playing the game the right way, buy what is real is the bucks being able to sign Robin, Wes and korver for less than $10m combined. People will say harden has no help but 1. He has had and all nba PG with him for multiple years 2. You start to see why role player don't want to join him.

His backcourt running mate: Lin, Beverley, Lawson, Prigioni, Terry.

The year he got Paul is the year we were that close to a championship. Then Paul declined big time.

I do agree with your second part though, that legit role players like Wes and Korver don't want to play with him because of his style.


CP3 ia proving that he has not declined big time. That is a false narrative you're pushing.


Say what? CP3 was a legit top 10 per minute player two years ago. This year he's in that 20-35 range. He's declined.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#79 » by NBAFan93 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:13 pm

eskis wrote:feels like everybody just waiting for harden or westbrook to have bad game so they can post about it....


Yep. Notice we don’t get threads like these every time other playoff teams lose or when Lillard or Luka or CP3 or Kemba or PG or Kawhi have bad games? Cause there have been plenty of bad games by those players but they don’t get threads. People even hate on Harden and Westbrook when the team wins if their individual stats aren’t up to par. It’s pretty funny.
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Re: Harden 13/37 FG 5/19 3pt in another loss 

Post#80 » by dhsilv2 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:14 pm

These threads are just weird. Harden is leading one of the best offenses in the league with all these things people are crying about. He's getting his team out of the first round and has made at least 2 conference finals. What he's doing is leading to wins, this isn't debatable. It's leading to wins in the playoffs, again it isn't debatable.

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