Stephen Curry wasn't injured/hurt/70% in 2016 Finals

[QRich3]

You see there are 3 choices:
He underperformed because of an injury (facts disagree)
He underperformed because he was not mentally tough for a situation like that
He underperformed because he was not that much of a player anyway.
Therefore i understund why he's fans choose the first narrative despite that it is not based on facts.They don't like the other 2 choices

There's a 4th choice that is the guy just didn't play at his normal level during a 7 game series, without it having anything to do with being injured, choking, or being a bad player. You know, basketball is a game greatly affected by randomness, and any player can underperform their usual level during a couple of weeks without it being some ultimate personality indicator or a big injury.

Sometimes "he didn't play well" is a perfectly fine description..

[michaelm]

So basically you get the point it's everything but him not being mentally concentrated and "tough" enough for such a moment.Which was the real problem and not some imaginary "hurt" "limp" "roboleg".

That is your opinion, and continually re-stating it makes it no more (or less for that matter) correct.

And disagreeing with you about such an opinion, particularly the perennial armchair pundit ''mental toughness thing", (remote cod psychology is probably the only thing with less scientific validity than the practice of medicine by the untrained via the internet) is not the same as discrediting the Cavs title, which the Cavs obviously won because they, and in particular LeBron and Kyrie, were better over a 7 game series.

Well everyone is restating on 2 sides.A fact(Curry played and scored several games in the finals ) and a speculation (Curry was injured during that play).If i continue restating that Earth isn't flat wouldn't make it more (or less for that matter) correct that's also true

I do not intend to analyse Curry's pshychology regarding his relation to his parents-friends etc. He looks really good and happy but who knows?I am reffering to his bad choices during a very stressfull situation,the last minutes of a final's series.I also take under consideration that he wasn't also that good in the 2015 finals as he used to be in the regular season.That's two times in a row underperforming in the finals.He didn't have surgery after the series and we weren't informed about any treatment that he followed.I just follow the facts and then i add a speculation.You see there are 3 choices:
He underperformed because of an injury (facts disagree)
He underperformed because he was not mentally tough for a situation like that
He underperformed because he was not that much of a player anyway.
Therefore i understund why he's fans choose the first narrative despite that it is not based on facts.They don't like the other 2 choices[/quote]
I am well aware my opinion is my opinion, that was my point, with you previously seeming to consider your speculations to be fact.

What is not supposition is that Curry did have a well documented injury which was observable live on national and international TV and which kept him out for 2 weeks during the play-offs, and whether he made a total recovery in that time is probably only known to him and his doctors. That he missed the Olympics is known fact, and it was at least reported that his knee required rehab in the off season.

I disagree with you about the 2015 finals btw, Curry played well except for 1 game and did better than LeBron did at his first try, not that LeBron is not the better player in general given basketball is a 2-way game.

[oaktownwarriors87]

Curry couldn't take Enes Kanter or Kevin Love off the dribble. Injuries happen and it's part of the game, but let's not pretend he was anywhere close to where he should have been.

Personally, I think he still hasn't recovered and I don't know if he ever will. Sucks, but **** happens.

So your implying that he's still injured??

Just admit he was never injured in the finals. Dude was beasting in the WCF averaging 28/6/6 44% FG 41% 3P with 61% TS. Factoring in the playoff defense and game planning and those stats align with his RS stats. So was he playing injured in the WCF too? Also remember that he got a weeks rest after the WCF too.

I'm tired of these Warrior fans making up excuses/narratives

Yes, he was playing injured in the WCF. That's why they were able to effectively defend him 1v1 with poor defensive players. That's also why I had the thunder winning in 6.

Curry went from destroying double/triple teams to not being able to dribble past Enes Kanter or Kevin Love. You'd have to be a fool to think he was anywhere close to 100% after injuring is surgically repaired ankle (and knee).

[oaktownwarriors87]

also take under consideration that he wasn't also that good in the 2015 finals as he used to be in the regular season.

That's because you only look at the box score. The Cavs were literally swarming Curry with double and triple teams 5-10 get behind the arc. They were daring Iguodala, Barnes, Green, and Bogut to shoot the ball the entire series. Curry actually handles the pressure extremely well and found his teammates plenty of open shots.

On the other side of the ball LeBron James was almost never double teamed. The Warriors defended him 1v1 and dared him to take shots. He did, they were bad shots, and he shot a low percentage with high volume. But those PPG were high so everyone thought it was awesome!

[janmagn]

The Warriors blew a 3-1 lead!

Lähetetty minun LG-H440n laitteesta Tapatalkilla

[michaelm]

also take under consideration that he wasn't also that good in the 2015 finals as he used to be in the regular season.

That's because you only look at the box score. The Cavs were literally swarming Curry with double and triple teams 5-10 get behind the arc. They were daring Iguodala, Barnes, Green, and Bogut to shoot the ball the entire series. Curry actually handles the pressure extremely well and found his teammates plenty of open shots.

On the other side of the ball LeBron James was almost never double teamed. The Warriors defended him 1v1 and dared him to take shots. He did, they were bad shots, and he shot a low percentage with high volume. But those PPG were high so everyone thought it was awesome!

I agree with you and made the same point, as I do about the injury thing. I couldn't quote the other guy's post correctly for some reason.

[dautjazz]

I'm sure Curry wasn't 100% there MENTALLY, coming back from injury can be tough on you, you're scared of reinjury, especially when the injury is fresh. I'm sure Curry wasn't 70% physically, because he had some huge games after his return, but even if he was 70%, give the Cavs credit for doing some remarkable like coming back 3-1. The fact of the matter is that Curry struggles a little more in the Finals.

[druggas]

Such a lame debate.

[Lovethisgamegr]

The Warriors defended him 1v1 and dared him to take shots. He did, they were bad shots, and he shot a low percentage with high volume. But those PPG were high so everyone thought it was awesome!

In the whole series
Lebron James had 3p 37% FG 49%
Steph Curry had 3p 40% FG 40%
Klay Thomson 3p 35% FG 43%

So he was slightly worse on the 3p shots compared to the best two shooters in the league and clearly better overall.Lies don't last but still there are guys stating whatever b**it comes in their head and others agreeing on that.

CAN YOU BELIEVE THAT?

[Lovethisgamegr]

. The Warriors defended him 1v1 and dared him to take shots. He did, they were bad shots, and he shot a low percentage with high volume. But those PPG were high so everyone thought it was awesome!

Elimination James vs the 2 best shooting guards of the NBA
GAME 5 LEBRON JAMES FG 53.3% 3PT 50 % 41 PTS 16 TRB 7 AST
STEPH CURRY FG 38,1% 3PT 33,3% 25 PTS 7 TRB 4 AST
KLAY THOMPSON FG 55% 3pt 54,5% 37 PTS 3 TRB 1 AST

GAME 6 LEBRON JAMES FG 59.3% 3PT 50% 41 PTS 8 TRB 11 AST
STEPH CURRY FG 40% 3PT 46,2 % 30 PTS 2 TRB 1 AST
KLAY THOMPSON FG 42,9% 3PT 30% 25 PTS 3 TRB 1 AST

GAME 7 LEBRON JAMES FG 37,5% 3PT 20% 27 PTS 11 TRB 11 AST
STEPH CURRY FG 31,6% 3PT 28.6 17 PTS 5 TRB 2 AST
KLAY THOMPSON FG 35,3% 3PT 20% 14 PTS 2 TRB 2 AST



TOTAL PERCENTAGE IN THE LAST 3 GAMES
LEBRON JAMES: FG 50% 3PT:40%
STEPH CURRY : FG 36,5% 3PT:36%
KLAY THOMPSON: FG 44,4% 3PTS:34,8%

So when it mattered the most he obviously he made good shots, he shot on a higher percentage with a higher volume than Steph and Klay.Damn i just realise how really awesome it was!

[JonFromVA]

There's a hate on him that's amazing. If the same thing happened to Kyrie everyone would be saying "wow he's such a brave guy, not complaining he has an injury and still playing through it". But just because it's Curry and GSW and the best regular team of all time everyone is so hurt all the time. You should applaud the fact that nobody in GSW ever took away from CLE's title, when a lot of lesser teams and players would use this injury as an excuse.

Well, it's not just Curry. There's just a sizable section of the fan base that figures if a player is on the floor, then he should find a way to step up. That includes Steph himself.

[OsuCavsfan103]

I'm sure Curry wasn't 100% there MENTALLY, coming back from injury can be tough on you, you're scared of reinjury, especially when the injury is fresh. I'm sure Curry wasn't 70% physically, because he had some huge games after his return, but even if he was 70%, give the Cavs credit for doing some remarkable like coming back 3-1. The fact of the matter is that Curry struggles a little more in the Finals.

Huh that's funny, he seemed fine mentally when he was running around in Portland declaring how "I'm back" Watch the clips from that game, he looks fine to me.... almost a whole month before he played the Cavs. 100% BS excuses.

Watch on YouTube

[Mylie10]

The Warriors blew a 3-1 lead!

Lähetetty minun LG-H440n laitteesta Tapatalkilla

By 4 points in a game 7 against hte mighty Lebron James. While losing a 3-1 lead in the series, it wasn't like it was the Orlando Magic or some ish.

Steph had an elbow injury in the playoffs that noone talks about. While it didn't keep him out, I'm sure it was an irritant.

But Cavs get all respect for coming back and winning it. Real props to Kyrie who hit several shots with great defense all over him, but he made them anyway.....Hats off to that dude!

[JonFromVA]

I'm sure Curry wasn't 100% there MENTALLY, coming back from injury can be tough on you, you're scared of reinjury, especially when the injury is fresh. I'm sure Curry wasn't 70% physically, because he had some huge games after his return, but even if he was 70%, give the Cavs credit for doing some remarkable like coming back 3-1. The fact of the matter is that Curry struggles a little more in the Finals.

70% is a made-up number that attempts to explain his condition in simple terms, but reality isn't simple.

[OsuCavsfan103]

I'm sure Curry wasn't 100% mentally, because he had LeBron sending his shots into the stands, he was committing dumb fouls, he was taking a lot of contact, and his shot wasn't falling. For the most part, Cavaliers seem to do a pretty good job when we play him.

[3Diamantidis]

Why are you guys talking about the same things over and over again?
It's past. It's over. Move on

[DubTheVanDamage]

Curry’s health in 2016 playoffs comes back regularly in our discussions and some people use it as explanation of his poor performance in the finals. I think it’s invalid and I will show why. To do so, I will cover 3 types of arguments: quotes, stats/performance on the court and visual analysis of his movement.

Thanks for your diagnosis, doctor. Now, for the actual medical viewpoint:

The MCL is one of four ligaments connecting the femur bone to the tibia at the knee. It helps keep the knee stable as it moves from the outside to the inside.

So the lateral movements that allow a twitchy dribbler like Curry to get past the guy guarding him and go to the rim or to juke a defender to open up a shot are going to put pressure on the ligament.

“His injury was mild on the sprain scale, but, because of what he does, it ends up having a huge impact on what he does and what he can do,” said Rob Landel, a professor of clinical physical therapy at the University of Southern California.

Athletic trainers refer to what’s called a “valgus” position — that’s when the knee is turned inward toward the center of the body, and the MCL stretches to keep the joint stable.

Most people naturally stand in a slight valgus position, meaning they are putting a little pressure on their MCL without even trying. Playing basketball just adds to that stress, especially during the quick movements that guards like Curry rely on.

...

“With a crossover dribble, trying to get a guy to go one way and quickly change direction and go the other way, that kind of lateral move will likely stress it,” Landel said.

Many essential parts of playing basketball put demands on the MCL — stuff as simple as jumping and landing.

“There’s always a tendency in all of us, when you land from a jump, to put valgus stress on the knee,” said Dr. Lyle Micheli, director of the sports medicine division at Boston Children’s Hospital and an orthopedics professor at Harvard Medical School.

Or there’s the basic physical contact that comes with playing tough defense and setting screens — if your feet are planted and somebody pushes you, the MCL is likely to bear the brunt of keeping you steady.

“When you’re colliding with other people, you can get pushed into that valgus position as well,” Petschauer said. “It’s the most common position to get pushed into.”

...

The other factor is not physical, but mental. Petschauer and Landel testified to working with athletes who couldn’t get over the emotional toll of an injury — the fear that their next move could put them back on the trainer’s table.

“They have an awareness of their body that we do not have,” Petschauer said.

After an MCL injury, when the knee can bend side to side in a way that it wouldn’t when healthy, Landel said: “Patients get a queasy feeling in their stomach when it happens.”

“You can imagine if you went up for a jump shot or a layup, you’re thinking, ‘I wonder if I’ll be able to land,’” he said. “You’re not thinking about putting the ball in the bucket.”

https://www.statnews.com/2016/06/02/steph-curry-knee-injury-nba-finals-science/

The reality is that none of us knows what Curry was or wasn't going through, and it's laughable that some untrained Internet poster is attempting a retroactive medical evaluation of Curry. Ridiculous.

[Chris Porter's Hair]

1) I believe he was hurt
2) Who cares?

You play the team that is in front of you. If you win four games before the other team, they give you rings. Then you move on to the next season. The Warriors did what they needed to do in 2015. The Cavs did what they needed to do in 2016. It should be fun if they meet again in 2017. Those that keep doing woulda coulda shoulda on either side must have a lot more spare time than I do.

[Onus]

Spoiler:

[I don't see how this is a rebuttal. It's just someones word, that Curry looked awful and couldn't do this or that at practice, but I've provided actual statistic and video evidence that Stephen was doing his usual things in the game (or before - look at that dunk before G7 vs CLE!).

Just someone's word? You mean national and local journalists who watch the game of basketball for a living. Local journalists who watch practice and games of Steph since he's been in the league. I'm sure it was the Cavaliers defense that was frustrating Curry at practice though.

I don't think you understand the limitations of an MCL sprain. Here's an explanation of what you should be looking for.
https://www.statnews.com/2016/06/02/steph-curry-knee-injury-nba-finals-science/

Essentially lateral movement (crossovers and getting by people) and stability while getting hit.

The percentage of his shots that came on catch-and-shoot opportunities remained essentially the same, while his pull-up shots increased and his shots around the basket dipped. Curry traded those rim-attacking attempts for off-the-bounce jumpers.

Part of the reason Curry stopped attacking the rim may have been his lack off success. After shooting 61% around the rim during the regular season, his percentage dropped about 10%. In the Finals, he shot just 45.5% within 10 feet and had five of his 26 shots around the rim blocked. He had only 31 of his 422 shots around the rim blocked during the regular season — that’s a 270% increase in block rate.

Per NBA.com, 47.0% of his regular season shot attempts were defended tightly (a defender within four feet). That number jumped to 54.8% in the Finals. His field goal percentage on such attempts also dropped 10% on such attempts.
http://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/06/stephen-curry-2016-nba-finals-stats-golden-state-warriors

If someone wants to rebut what I've said here are the points that should be addressed:

- if he was injured, then why vs Irving he shot 66 eFG% and just 49% vs other Cavs defenders? Injury didn't affect him when he was defended by Kyrie?

It's probably because Kyrie is a **** defender and doesn't work to get around screens

- if hurt, then why he played so good for almost a month after injury (from G4 vs POR to G7 vs OKC), when it was for him the best period of playoff basketball in his career?

Possibility that he re-tweaked the knee? From all the physicality?

- what about all these gifs showing his movement? That aren't just selected plays, I could have posted more of them, but it would make post too big. So how can someone says he couldn't drive or get separation or move laterally, when he actually did all these things in the game?

Look at these gifs that show otherwise
http://www.goldenstateofmind.com/2016/10/10/13183734/nba-2016-golden-state-warriors-stephen-curry-knee-injury-update

[Hect0r_Zer0n1]

Cavs Fans and supporters are the worst posters on this board. Cocky, and Sore losers and winners. It's almost been a year yet, you're still bringing up the same thing. I didn't see Warrior fans trashing The cavs after they won the chip. SMH just lock up this topic and see what happens in the playoffs.