Let’s clear up Mavs Warriors ref stuff

[Dirk]

Many players in the league get called for moving screen here. But not the guy who got away with the punch on his teammate.

[CS707]

I'm just not sure why it's on the refs to ensure that everyone is clear on what's going on, unless we want games to take 5 hours.

Because it literally is part of their job.

I don't believe it is literally part of their job to see if they're good on every play, and I hope it isn't. At some point the players should know the basic rules of the game.

Personal responsibility. Looney was confused, he sought clarification.

At some point it messes with the competitive advantage by spelling it out to professionals.

[Nuntius]

I'm just not sure why it's on the refs to ensure that everyone is clear on what's going on, unless we want games to take 5 hours.

Because it literally is part of their job.

I don't believe it is literally part of their job to see if they're good on every play, and I hope it isn't. At some point the players should know the basic rules of the game.

Well, we can definitely agree to disagree then. I believe that it literally is.

[DonaldSanders]

Many players get called for a foul here. But not NBA superstar Josh Green!

Read on Twitter

[Johnny Bball]

I'm just not sure why it's on the refs to ensure that everyone is clear on what's going on, unless we want games to take 5 hours.

Because it literally is part of their job.

I don't believe it is literally part of their job to see if they're good on every play, and I hope it isn't. At some point the players should know the basic rules of the game.

Referee; an official who watches a game or match closely to ensure that the rules are adhered to and (in some sports) to arbitrate on matters arising from the play.

Just saying...

[Johnny Bball]

Many players in the league get called for moving screen here. But not the guy who got away with the punch on his teammate.

which one? the one at the top or the one in the key where he moves the defender 5 feet?

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

I can’t believe the commentators talked about it for 30+ minutes just berating the refs. So unprofessional. JVG was on one tonight.

For anyone that knows basketball or basic ref hand signals it was clear that first the ref called the ball as Warriors ball. Then the second hand motion was pointing toward Mavs bench for the timeout call by Jason Kidd. Dallas just dummies and were on the wrong side after the timeout the refs said no mercy rules cuz we’re not in little kid basketball gave the Dubs the ball and they scored the layup.

That’s it.

I watched that game as a Warriors fan.
Overall during the whole game there were a few calls I did not like but I thought the refs at this game did better than the average ref crew for this year at refereeing the game.

The play in question is one of the most embarrassing ref screw ups that I have ever seen. I a ball out of bounds play the refs have 2 jobs; 1 to figure out who touched the ball last, and 2 to let the teams know who’s ball it is.

I don’t think the Mavs were playing psychological games by acting like it was their ball. I think the Mavs and half of the Warriors thought it was Mavs ball. So I think this is the worst case of not informing who’s ball it was that I have ever seen.

If I was a ref I would go to the Mavs and tell them it is Warriors ball before the ball is allowed to be inbounded. If the Mavs were being stupid and should have known it was Warriors ball then issue a delay of game warning to the Mavs for the Mavs needing for the refs to delay the game to tell the Mavs who’s ball it was.

[thisiskoz]

Made this point in the other thread, but watch Jaden Hardy. He crosses half court to walk toward where the Mavs would be inbounding and then backpedals.

My thought is that's a reaction to seeing no gsw players cross half court to get into defensive position when that's what happens when it's your ball going the other way. Jaden thinks play is still stopped.

You can call it a lack of professionalism, but that just seems like you want to attack the players. The truth is that if you're expecting certain things to happen before you do something and those things don't happen, the common response is to pause and wait.

Definitely a mistake on the part of the Mavs, but seems like good officiating would ensure that everyone is clear on what's going on and would realize when that's not the case.

He can think the play is stopped all he wants, but if the ref crew signaled that the play had started, I can't see why he'd think that.

I'm just not sure why it's on the refs to ensure that everyone is clear on what's going on, unless we want games to take 5 hours. Once the whistle blew for play to resume, if the Mavs really thought the ball was theirs, someone should have been walking over to inbound it. And nobody was even close to it. Hardy was the closest, but he actually starts backing up when the ref is doing his usual "bounce the ball and hand the ball to the inbounder" thing. It seems like if you think it's your ball you start to go over there to inbound it, if that was his job in the situation.

You can call it attacking the players if you want, but they're the ones who are supposed to know what's going on out there.

I mean I get that you're being intentionally obtuse here, but try watching the video again, with sound:

https://youtu.be/NPQHTwXVyxk

Then read what you wrote and think about:

- whether there was any time for the Mavs players to react when the whistle was blown to resume play?

- was Hardy still backing up when the official bounced the ball or had he already done that and instead put up his arm like wtf is going on? Did other Mavs players react similarly at that same moment?

Again, it's on the Mavs for the misunderstanding who had possession, but saying the players should've inferred they didn't have possession based on what happened in the moments prior to the inbounds like you are is a bad take. And one that seems like you just want to call players stupid and bad at their jobs, which based on your other posts, seems like your thing.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Many players in the league get called for moving screen here. But not the guy who got away with the punch on his teammate.

Current rules allow the screener to run anywhere they want other than into the defender. The degree to which Draymond initiated contact with the defender is legal for everybody by current rule interpretations. Many modern screens would have been illegal in 1980 when I was still getting a feel for NBA rules but that screen by Draymond was a borderline call by 1980s rules and definitely legal now.

Rick Mahorn in 1984 would absolutely emphatically unmistakably plant his feet clearly enough to be seen in the cheap seats and then Mahorn would lean in and attempt to knock the defenders teeth out without moving his feet. The rules got changed to stop the leaning in with intent to cause pain play.

Much later in 1998 Antonio and Dale Davis were still dramatically planting their feet but trying to hurt defenders without leaning in by jumping in front of defenders when their heads were turned there by creating big collisions with defenders that did nor know a screener had jumped in front of thief path. Those screens were legal then and are legal now but now there is no reason to make a show of planting your feet. Dale and Antonio Davis did get hurt in those collisions as well as hurting the defenders. Today nobody is willing to hurt themselves just to hurt the defenders. Legalizing moving screens lets the screen setter set a solid moving screen without knocking the defenders teeth out.

The moving screen was legalized by a change in rule interpretations about 9 years ago.

[steger_3434]

In a soccer game involving rangers Malik Tillman stole a ball that was supposed to be given back to the other team when it was played out for an injury. Rangers subsequently let the other team score right away.

Why didn’t the warriors just let the mavs score and call it even? Sportsmanship is still a thing


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[blackcosmos]

Look at the play in question. If the Mavs thought it was their ball, where was their in-bounder? Where was their receiver?

Look at the two Mavs players near mid-court. They were looking at the in-bounder. It is pretty clear to me that 1. They knew the play is about to begin. 2. They knew it wasn’t their ball and were ready to defend. They were just defending the wrong basket.

It is easy to sh*t on the refs. But this is on Mavs players and coaching staff.

[The Servant]

To clear things up the NBA is closer to entertainment than it is a sport, and we all know this.

Watch on YouTube

[QPR]

Where I think the refs screwed up is if the PA announcer gets it wrong, the refs should ask for a correction if there is a timeout. At some level this is entertainment and there's no reason not to clarify for everyone -- TV, the fans, and the players. I'm not replaying this game but the refs should be setting the proper expectation for everyone.

It's not their job to listen to or correct the PA though. If you do that for a living, you probably condition yourself to tune out all the announcements and other noise anyway, I doubt they even heard it.

Regardless of what caused the confusion, the officials should obviously have worked out what was going on rather than letting GSW inbound. It's awful officiating even if they weren't initially responsible for the confusion.

It's not their job to listen to the PA but it is their job to make sure players know what is going on. Dallas isn't gaining an advantage by going to the other side of the court so why wouldn't you stop and correct it?

[Nate505]

Made this point in the other thread, but watch Jaden Hardy. He crosses half court to walk toward where the Mavs would be inbounding and then backpedals.

My thought is that's a reaction to seeing no gsw players cross half court to get into defensive position when that's what happens when it's your ball going the other way. Jaden thinks play is still stopped.

You can call it a lack of professionalism, but that just seems like you want to attack the players. The truth is that if you're expecting certain things to happen before you do something and those things don't happen, the common response is to pause and wait.

Definitely a mistake on the part of the Mavs, but seems like good officiating would ensure that everyone is clear on what's going on and would realize when that's not the case.

He can think the play is stopped all he wants, but if the ref crew signaled that the play had started, I can't see why he'd think that.

I'm just not sure why it's on the refs to ensure that everyone is clear on what's going on, unless we want games to take 5 hours. Once the whistle blew for play to resume, if the Mavs really thought the ball was theirs, someone should have been walking over to inbound it. And nobody was even close to it. Hardy was the closest, but he actually starts backing up when the ref is doing his usual "bounce the ball and hand the ball to the inbounder" thing. It seems like if you think it's your ball you start to go over there to inbound it, if that was his job in the situation.

You can call it attacking the players if you want, but they're the ones who are supposed to know what's going on out there.

I mean I get that you're being intentionally obtuse here, but try watching the video again, with sound:

https://youtu.be/NPQHTwXVyxk

Then read what you wrote and think about:

- whether there was any time for the Mavs players to react when the whistle was blown to resume play?

- was Hardy still backing up when the official bounced the ball or had he already done that and instead put up his arm like wtf is going on? Did other Mavs players react similarly at that same moment?

Again, it's on the Mavs for the misunderstanding who had possession, but saying the players should've inferred they didn't have possession based on what happened in the moments prior to the inbounds like you are is a bad take. And one that seems like you just want to call players stupid and bad at their jobs, which based on your other posts, seems like your thing.

That's not quite the whistle I was talking about. I'm referring to one when the timeout is over that tells the players that play is going to resume and to get off the bench or whatever.

Now if that was the whistle there, and the refs literally gave Golden State the ball to inbound a second later, then yeah, the refs deserve a ton of heat for it.

If the refs whistled for the Mavs 30 seconds or a minute or two before that they needed to be back on the court, and all of them were standing around in their own end of the court, that's on them, and they are unprofessional morons. Sorry if you think their hands should be held thru the entire process, but I don't think expecting professional athletes to be professionals is a big ask.

[Nate505]

Because it literally is part of their job.

I don't believe it is literally part of their job to see if they're good on every play, and I hope it isn't. At some point the players should know the basic rules of the game.

Referee; an official who watches a game or match closely to ensure that the rules are adhered to and (in some sports) to arbitrate on matters arising from the play.

Just saying...

What was there to arbitrate? It was an inbounds play.

[The Servant]

You guys think Tim Donaghy was the only mobbed up ref?

[BmanInBigD]

Embarrassing for the Mavs but the most egregious error was the no-call on the pull-down of Luka by his jersey. I mean, wtf are they looking at to not see that?

[DonaldSanders]

Embarrassing for the Mavs but the most egregious error was the no-call on the pull-down of Luka by his jersey. I mean, wtf are they looking at to not see that?

Probably the same thing as when Anthony Lamb got knocked over in front of the refs. It was an absolutely terrible officiating night all around.

I don't blame the Mavs for being a bit irritated by the out of bounds play (though not to the point of a formal protest), I think refs (though not required currently) should make sure everyone is aware of the possession call if a P.A. announcer gets it wrong. It's basic fairness, and we didn't even see the Looney dunk originally live because the TV crew was also confused.

[Jerry Maine]

He can think the play is stopped all he wants, but if the ref crew signaled that the play had started, I can't see why he'd think that.

I'm just not sure why it's on the refs to ensure that everyone is clear on what's going on, unless we want games to take 5 hours. Once the whistle blew for play to resume, if the Mavs really thought the ball was theirs, someone should have been walking over to inbound it. And nobody was even close to it. Hardy was the closest, but he actually starts backing up when the ref is doing his usual "bounce the ball and hand the ball to the inbounder" thing. It seems like if you think it's your ball you start to go over there to inbound it, if that was his job in the situation.

You can call it attacking the players if you want, but they're the ones who are supposed to know what's going on out there.

I mean I get that you're being intentionally obtuse here, but try watching the video again, with sound:

https://youtu.be/NPQHTwXVyxk

Then read what you wrote and think about:

- whether there was any time for the Mavs players to react when the whistle was blown to resume play?

- was Hardy still backing up when the official bounced the ball or had he already done that and instead put up his arm like wtf is going on? Did other Mavs players react similarly at that same moment?

Again, it's on the Mavs for the misunderstanding who had possession, but saying the players should've inferred they didn't have possession based on what happened in the moments prior to the inbounds like you are is a bad take. And one that seems like you just want to call players stupid and bad at their jobs, which based on your other posts, seems like your thing.

That's not quite the whistle I was talking about. I'm referring to one when the timeout is over that tells the players that play is going to resume and to get off the bench or whatever.

Now if that was the whistle there, and the refs literally gave Golden State the ball to inbound a second later, then yeah, the refs deserve a ton of heat for it.

If the refs whistled for the Mavs 30 seconds or a minute or two before that they needed to be back on the court, and all of them were standing around in their own end of the court, that's on them, and they are unprofessional morons. Sorry if you think their hands should be held thru the entire process, but I don't think expecting professional athletes to be professionals is a big ask.

This.

I agree if the ref had just blown the whistle it's a dog act. But I doubt it as all 10 players, and none else, were on the court, I'm guessing they'd called them back some time prior.

The Dubs players knew what was going on and couldn't believe it. If they were being sneaky they'd have sent a couple of them down the other way.

Total brain fart by the Mavs

[Statlanta]

If the Mavs had a defense or a good coach they wouldn't be complaining about 1 possession in a 48 minute game