So how about Joel Embiid

[rzzzzz]

the Process that launched 1000 posts. (dang, i got cut off at the pass.) Sam knew that JoJo was his best shot at snagging a generational talent, JoJo knows that Sam worked his butt off assembling the right medical, rehab and every other supportive resource to get him back on the court so fit and developed.

[NYKHardKnock]

Hope he can stay healthy. NY and 6ers will have an interesting, intense battle for years!

[Misteclipse]

More athletic Al Jeff, huge black hole. One of my fav. players but you can't deny this

Obvious troll post

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

[MrBigShot]

He remind me of playing mycareer on 2k. Just so much production for the number minutes he plays.

[richboy]

When exactly did Isiah Thomas do this. With the Knicks, he traded all his picks/young players for 5 veterans all in their 20's. I don't see the similarity at all.



I think you overestimate what a problem this is. You try and draft the best player until you know who is going to work out as the best building blocks. And if you draft by position, you only increase the odds of drafting a dud. Should he have passed on Simmons to draft say Dunn? Probably not a great idea although it would have met the positional requirement you just criticized him for. I do believe that he wanted Russell instead of Okafor but the Lakers didn't leave him that choice.

And with none of Embiid, Saric and Simmons playing until this season, there were no 'showcase' issues when Hinkie was here for 3 seasons. Had Hinkie still been in charge this past summer perhaps he wouldn't have gone to war this season with all these bigs. But his replacement, Colangelo, decided he would.

Isiah Thomas in his time in New York said forget about team fit. Let me just get assets. Then one day when a superstar ask to be traded I'll have all these assets to move in a trade. That is the point that is similar to Isiah Thomas. Thomas almost didn't care what was happening on the floor. He thought when guys like KG wanted out teams would be running to get a talented big with post skills and no defense and rebounding like Eddy Curry. Phili isn't doing what the Knicks did in terms they were paying those players big money. What they are doing is banking on future trades to help make the roster complete.

Next. Your point would be fine if he was drafting studs. If he was drafting the best player available. Lets be real. He drafted the most popular college player available. Which is pretty much the easiest way to keep a job as a gm. As most fans and management have no clue about international players or even some of the less known college players. If they bust you just say well everyone would have taken that guy.

Nobody is saying pass on Ben Simmons because you have a PF. Part of being a good GM and scout is understanding who is best player available. In his case it was not really best player available. It was we are tanking to find a superstar. Did he really think Noel had superstar talent? That Okafor had superstar talent? They have the same strengths now that they did in college and it isn't anything special. Phili over and over again had opportunities to draft freakish talents and instead went with low ceiling popular college players. Somehow people want him to get credit. Like somehow it is hard to tank and then taking the biggest name college player you can find. Only thing I could give him credit for is he did well in some trades.

Love when people talk about how Hinkie did stuff to extend his job as GM ignoring that he basically got fired after less than 3 years lol.

Also he drafted Saric who last I checked was foreign and taken over a variety of better known college players. Are you just saying he should have drafted Giannis and Porzingis? Yes that would have been nice.

He was fired because what he was doing wasn't working. His teams were so bad that owners literally complained to the commissioner. That is outside of Phili. Inside of Phili people many people loved him.

I'm also aware they drafted Saric. One guy is not going to change the reality. Especially Saric. The top international prospect of his draft but many said didn't have much upside because of his lack of athleticism.

I'm sorry but the love for Hickie from Phili is a mystery to me. He says we have to bottom out to get superstars and then he taking low risk low reward big name college kids. The whole point of all the losing was to be in position to get franchise changing players. It isn't about who they didn't take. It for me is he pretty has no idea on what upside is and just taking whoever the media liked. Hoping one day Ben Simmons and Joel Embiid would show up. Embiid only showed up because of a injury before the draft.

If he had tanked but then drafted high ceiling but potentially risky players it be easier to give him some credit. If he drafted Bruno Caboclo and he busted at least he was swinging big. The kid works out maybe you had a future Durant. Which many people compared Giannis to Durant. Why are you taking skinny Tyson Chandler at best in Noel. Why we taking Enes Kanter with less rebounding in Okafor. You really needed to lose 70 games to get in position to take that. In terms of the drafting of Saric, Okafor and NN each time you had a freakish talent with mega potential on the board in Porzingis, Giannis, and Lavine.

[HartfordWhalers]

The idea that Giannis or LaVine made more sense than Noel at the time is absurd. And the idea that Noel didn't have massive athleticism and thus upside is similar.

[rumdiary]

The idea that Giannis or LaVine made more sense than Noel at the time is absurd. And the idea that Noel didn't have massive athleticism and thus upside is similar.

LaVine was the 2014 draft.

When Giannis was drafted in 2013 everybody looked at him the same way they looked at Bruno Caboclo, just like 2013 Rudy Gobert and other international unknowns they fell in the draft despite freakish measurements. Luckily for the Bucks, Giannis > Caboclo.

[laika]

The idea that Giannis or LaVine made more sense than Noel at the time is absurd. And the idea that Noel didn't have massive athleticism and thus upside is similar.

LaVine was the 2014 draft.

When Giannis was drafted in 2013 everybody looked at him the same way they looked at Bruno Caboclo, just like 2013 Rudy Gobert and other international unknowns they fell in the draft despite freakish measurements. Luckily for the Bucks, Giannis > Caboclo.

Needs a few more >>>.

[rzzzzz]

Sam was fired because the commissioner was scared that his process worked so well that it would encourage other teams to blatantly follow suit. in truth, when you look at what the Lakers were doing, along with the Wolves, Milwaukee and earlier Orlando, and of course Seattle, it was already well rooted. Philly was just easier because the media had focused on them. Silver pushed Jerry Colangelo onto the very owners who had approved Sam's proposed route, but were out of town investors more than local enthusiasts, and more susceptible to authority. depending on a backcourt last year that was already meager, but then never really arrived due to injury, fed into a downward PR cycle that included Okafor's initial immature off court behavior, and a vicious hit piece on Embiid. folks here in Philly knew that by summer Sam would be assembling all his current assets, make a trade or two, and get on with the next phase. But the owners could not stand up to the kind of high school principle pressure that most established franchises would have laughed off by that point. the positive is that Brian Colangelo is smart enough not to give away any of these assets, nor the future picks that Sam assembled, even if he lacks the cool poker demeanor to have made the initial trades that Sam likely would have pulled off by now. but if Brian stays patient he'll do fine. meanwhile, JoJo is way better that we dared to expect (and we expected a franchise star), Simmons will be back soon, Jah is buying into accommodation for the sake of the team, Noel isn't but is still a physical specimen waiting to ignite once he supplements NBA level talent, Saric is developing into a glue guy, and now Stauskas is suddenly emerging as the sharpshooter the Kings thought they were drafting. plus we got a slew of draft picks to look forward to and a ton of cap. nothing is guaranteed, but we'll gladly play this hand,

[SkyHookFTW]

Hmm, through nine games he is averaging 22 minutes per game, 18 pts, 7.6 boards, 1.2 ast, 2.2 blocks, and shooting 50% from 3 pt range (10 for 20). He's shooting 78% FT's too. Gotta think his assists go up once he has real guards that can shoot to pass to. Projected out to 33 mpg, that's 27 pts, 11.4 boards, 1.8 ast, 3.3 blocks. It is dangerous to project like this, but it seems that he has the ability to be an all-star talent for the next 15 years if he can stay healthy. (I don't expect him to maintain 50% on three's, but 40% is very possible). I do expect him to maintain 78% FT shooting though, maybe even better once he gets more experience.

[lorak]

Oh wow you're Karol K?

Yes, "Karol" is my real name and "lorak" is my name if you read it backwards

Anyway, enjoy guys, because we are witnessing greatness in the making:

Watch on YouTube

[Sixerscan]

Isiah Thomas in his time in New York said forget about team fit. Let me just get assets. Then one day when a superstar ask to be traded I'll have all these assets to move in a trade. That is the point that is similar to Isiah Thomas. Thomas almost didn't care what was happening on the floor. He thought when guys like KG wanted out teams would be running to get a talented big with post skills and no defense and rebounding like Eddy Curry. Phili isn't doing what the Knicks did in terms they were paying those players big money. What they are doing is banking on future trades to help make the roster complete.

Next. Your point would be fine if he was drafting studs. If he was drafting the best player available. Lets be real. He drafted the most popular college player available. Which is pretty much the easiest way to keep a job as a gm. As most fans and management have no clue about international players or even some of the less known college players. If they bust you just say well everyone would have taken that guy.

Nobody is saying pass on Ben Simmons because you have a PF. Part of being a good GM and scout is understanding who is best player available. In his case it was not really best player available. It was we are tanking to find a superstar. Did he really think Noel had superstar talent? That Okafor had superstar talent? They have the same strengths now that they did in college and it isn't anything special. Phili over and over again had opportunities to draft freakish talents and instead went with low ceiling popular college players. Somehow people want him to get credit. Like somehow it is hard to tank and then taking the biggest name college player you can find. Only thing I could give him credit for is he did well in some trades.

Love when people talk about how Hinkie did stuff to extend his job as GM ignoring that he basically got fired after less than 3 years lol.

Also he drafted Saric who last I checked was foreign and taken over a variety of better known college players. Are you just saying he should have drafted Giannis and Porzingis? Yes that would have been nice.

He was fired because what he was doing wasn't working. His teams were so bad that owners literally complained to the commissioner. That is outside of Phili. Inside of Phili people many people loved him.

I'm also aware they drafted Saric. One guy is not going to change the reality. Especially Saric. The top international prospect of his draft but many said didn't have much upside because of his lack of athleticism.

I'm sorry but the love for Hickie from Phili is a mystery to me. He says we have to bottom out to get superstars and then he taking low risk low reward big name college kids. The whole point of all the losing was to be in position to get franchise changing players. It isn't about who they didn't take. It for me is he pretty has no idea on what upside is and just taking whoever the media liked. Hoping one day Ben Simmons and Joel Embiid would show up. Embiid only showed up because of a injury before the draft.

If he had tanked but then drafted high ceiling but potentially risky players it be easier to give him some credit. If he drafted Bruno Caboclo and he busted at least he was swinging big. The kid works out maybe you had a future Durant. Which many people compared Giannis to Durant. Why are you taking skinny Tyson Chandler at best in Noel. Why we taking Enes Kanter with less rebounding in Okafor. You really needed to lose 70 games to get in position to take that. In terms of the drafting of Saric, Okafor and NN each time you had a freakish talent with mega potential on the board in Porzingis, Giannis, and Lavine.

I don't get what you're overall theory is. Noel and Embiid were both largely though of as having the biggest upside in their respective drafts at the time, but fell because people thought they were risky because of their health. MCW had a lot of upside but a risk that if his jumper never developed he would become a career backup (Which sadly seems like its happening, though he moved on quickly) Even Saric fell in the draft because people were worried about the risk of him never coming over.

Of all the complaints I've heard about Hinkie, one saying that "he didn't take risks" is a new one. FFS 60% of his lottery picks didn't play their rookie seasons.

Either way, if you think the reason why people like Sam was because he was some sort of wizard talent evaluator you are completely missing the point. If anything it's because he accepted that chances were he wouldn't get the person Monday Morning Quarterbacks like you identify as the best player available in retrospect every time, and therefore gave the team as many chances as possible to get it right. That's what "The Process" is.

Also, it's pretty funny that you mock him for "waiting for Embiid and Simmons to show up" when, um, that happened.

[tsherkin]

I think the Al Jefferson comparison for Embiid is lazy and inaccurate. I'm not seeing it at all really.

This is clear. Anyone who says "Al Jefferson" doesn't actually watch Embiid play. Like, ever.

Al Jefferson is and always has been a guy defined by one skill: post isolation on the low block to get hook shots inside of 10 feet. He is a mediocre shooter past 8 feet most of the time (career under 39% from 10-23 feet, in both zones). He's 8/63 from 3 on his career (12.7%, across 12+ seasons, and has only twice taken 10+ 3PA, and only 4 times has he taken 5+ 3PA in a season, the other two both being exactly 5 3PA). He's 6'9, unathletic and a weak defender.

Embiid is huge. He's got strong promise as a defender. He's ALREADY 10/20 from 3 which, though the specific percentage won't last, is as good an indication as any that the Big Al comparison is sloppy and lazy. And so far, Embiid has actually been quite good at drawing fouls... something Jefferson always sucked at.

When I watch Embiid, I see off-ball movement, I see shooting, good play out of setting a screen, I see considerably better FT shooting and we're still waiting for him to normalize around the rim, where he's presently shooting worse than a 6-foot guard by 7% or so in the early-going. Embiid plays more for just-in-time offense: he pops off of the high mid screen, he's in and around on dive cuts after guard penetration. He hits the offensive glass some (and pretty well for a dude who doesn't have explosive athleticism). He is basically everything that Jefferson ISN'T, and hasn't been his entire career since Boston drafted him over a dozen years ago.

I actually can't fathom how someone who knows anything about the two players would ever connect them in terms of style... or even as a rudimentary projection for player ceiling. It kind of breaks my brain to try and package the two together given how they are different along basically every single visible point of examination. Iso player versus off-ball guy, shooting touch versus none (even if the specific level isn't going to bear out), defensive value versus none. Embiid is a big dude, Al is undersized. I mean yeah, now and again he gets an iso set and he knows what to do with it but man... that's about as wrong a comparison as one can find.

[Michael Lucky]

Oh wow you're Karol K?

Yes, "Karol" is my real name and "lorak" is my name if you read it backwards

Anyway, enjoy guys, because we are witnessing greatness in the making:

Watch on YouTube

Clearly an impressive game, but he sure falls to the ground a ton.

[Hipster Doofus]

Haters gonna hate. It's what they do

Embiid is a straight beast. And only doing it in half the playing time of everyone else

[tsherkin]

Haters gonna hate. It's what they do

Embiid is a straight beast. And only doing it in half the playing time of everyone else

He's looking good. He's not going to shoot ~ 54% from 16+ feet or 50% from 3 for very long, but he clearly has shooting touch and he moves well without the ball. He's got a lot of promise, and I'm glad that the Sixers are taking it slow with him.

[rumdiary]

Oh wow you're Karol K?

Yes, "Karol" is my real name and "lorak" is my name if you read it backwards

Anyway, enjoy guys, because we are witnessing greatness in the making:

Watch on YouTube

Clearly an impressive game, but he sure falls to the ground a ton.

I've never seen anyone hit the deck so hard, so often

[mksp]

Yes, "Karol" is my real name and "lorak" is my name if you read it backwards

Anyway, enjoy guys, because we are witnessing greatness in the making:

Watch on YouTube

Clearly an impressive game, but he sure falls to the ground a ton.

I've never seen anyone hit the deck so hard, so often

We're used to this in Philly. (AI)

[HartfordWhalers]

Haters gonna hate. It's what they do

Embiid is a straight beast. And only doing it in half the playing time of everyone else

He's looking good. He's not going to shoot ~ 54% from 16+ feet or 50% from 3 for very long, but he clearly has shooting touch and he moves well without the ball. He's got a lot of promise, and I'm glad that the Sixers are taking it slow with him.

Looking at those numbers you would certainly expect some mean reversion, but the shots breakdown is pretty informative.

17 of his 20 3's are listed as with the closest defender 6+ Feet - Wide Open.
Similarly he is 12/20 on 2's with 4+ feet of space (and 2/12 when guarded closer).

If defenses keep giving him that much space, shooting high percentages from those areas isn't that unreasonable. I would expect those numbers to drop more from a change in defensive attention away from the hoop than from his wide open shooting dropping off.

[eskimo]

I just can't wait to see the big man PnR when Simmons is here. With Simmons speed, lateral quickness and size it will cause teams problems on defense. They can try and go under but that will also allow Simmons to build up speed. If he develops enough as a shooter to force hard hedges it will leave Embiid open for shots. If defenses try to switch almost no Center in the league will be able to keep up with him and unlike PGs who they can try and block at the rim Simmons is 6-10 with good jumping ability. If the defenses try to use rotations to bring in extra defenders to help Simmons will eat them alive with his passing.

We are really a reliable mid-range jumper from Simmons away from being a playoff team (if Embiid stays healthy, Nik keeps shooting, Saric and Ilyasova keep stretching the 4) right now. Add in a top PG/wing from this upcoming draft and a top FA (either 2017 or 2018) and we could be a legit contender by 2018/19. Of course, right around then we should be collecting the unprotected Kings 2019 pick which could be really good if they decide to rebuild or Cousins leaves (one of which is very likely to happen).

The one thing I'd worry about if I were the Sixers' FO is all of the hard falls from Embiid. They really need to work on his core and dynamic balance. They also need to try and get him to play under more control and focus on landing on two feet with knees bent as much as possible. There were a few times early on when he seemed to land on one leg with knee extended which is very dangerus. In all honesty, falling down will actually be protective of his knees and ankles compared to trying to regain his balance in these situations but it will be hard on the rest of his body. They also have to get on the league about protecting him as he's been thrown down quite a few times already this year- a guy like him is a key cog in keeping the league popular as Lebron declines with age (and that back problem) and a huge chunk of shine has come off of Durant and Curry after the offseason fiasco. I know some have brought up Shaq comparisons and it's what other players will do when confronted by a guy that big but Shaq had about 60-80 pounds on Embiid.