Giannis Antetokounmpo's FIBA Stats vs. NBA Stats

[UcanUwill]

meanwhile Bogan Bogdanovic is averaging 24 points on insane efficiency. That guy is going to break out this year, all star.

[The Real Dalic]

I once called out Mirotic for having a clear as day agenda against the US team and some said that it was just newsworthy enough to talk about. Glad to see people are coming around now.

He's clearly trying to say that Euroleague is equal to the NBA. Which is just not true. The NBA is by far the best league in the world and it's because not only are Americans and Canadians great at it, but also because we have the greatest players from all over the world. It's like saying the MLS is equal to Europe in Soccer. It's not. There are just some things you have to accept.

Also, Giannis is a beast and is by far one of the best players in the world and in the Fiba tournament. Hands down.

[sunsbg]

I once called out Mirotic for having a clear as day agenda against the US team and some said that it was just newsworthy enough to talk about. Glad to see people are coming around now.

He's clearly trying to say that Euroleague is equal to the NBA. Which is just not true. The NBA is by far the best league in the world and it's because not only are Americans and Canadians great at it, but also because we have the greatest players from all over the world. It's like saying the MLS is equal to Europe in Soccer. It's not. There are just some things you have to accept.

Also, Giannis is a beast and is by far one of the best players in the world and in the Fiba tournament. Hands down.

I see a thread discussing NBA vs Euroleague rules, yet to see a thread on Euroleague is better than NBA one.

Also for every Mirotic12 there are 10 or more that think EL is garbage, so ...

[The Real Dalic]

I once called out Mirotic for having a clear as day agenda against the US team and some said that it was just newsworthy enough to talk about. Glad to see people are coming around now.

He's clearly trying to say that Euroleague is equal to the NBA. Which is just not true. The NBA is by far the best league in the world and it's because not only are Americans and Canadians great at it, but also because we have the greatest players from all over the world. It's like saying the MLS is equal to Europe in Soccer. It's not. There are just some things you have to accept.

Also, Giannis is a beast and is by far one of the best players in the world and in the Fiba tournament. Hands down.

I see a thread discussing NBA vs Euroleague rules, yet to see a thread on Euroleague is better than NBA one.

Also for every Mirotic12 there are 10 or more that think EL is garbage, so ...

People who think the EL is garbage are obviously wrong, but it is inferior in the way the MLS is inferior to their EL. But it's been clear he's been slowly trying to work up stats to say the EL is equal to or better than the NBA and that just isn't true.

He also celebrates every US loss. It feels almost like jealousy or anger towards the US for some reason. I don't know where he's from, but he should just enjoy the wonders of his country. I'm sure it's great where he lives. Doesn't have to be cheering the downfall of others to raise his agenda. Whether that's the US team, Giannis, Jokic, whatever.

[sunsbg]

I once called out Mirotic for having a clear as day agenda against the US team and some said that it was just newsworthy enough to talk about. Glad to see people are coming around now.

He's clearly trying to say that Euroleague is equal to the NBA. Which is just not true. The NBA is by far the best league in the world and it's because not only are Americans and Canadians great at it, but also because we have the greatest players from all over the world. It's like saying the MLS is equal to Europe in Soccer. It's not. There are just some things you have to accept.

Also, Giannis is a beast and is by far one of the best players in the world and in the Fiba tournament. Hands down.

I see a thread discussing NBA vs Euroleague rules, yet to see a thread on Euroleague is better than NBA one.

Also for every Mirotic12 there are 10 or more that think EL is garbage, so ...

People who think the EL is garbage are obviously wrong, but it is inferior in the way the MLS is inferior to their EL. But it's been clear he's been slowly trying to work up stats to say the EL is equal to or better than the NBA and that just isn't true.

He also celebrates every US loss. It feels almost like jealousy or anger towards the US for some reason. I don't know where he's from, but he should just enjoy the wonders of his country. I'm sure it's great where he lives. Doesn't have to be cheering the downfall of others to raise his agenda. Whether that's the US team, Giannis, Jokic, whatever.

I'll admit I want USA team to lose after reading comments like 'they don't care'. Let someone that cares win then.

[The Real Dalic]

I see a thread discussing NBA vs Euroleague rules, yet to see a thread on Euroleague is better than NBA one.

Also for every Mirotic12 there are 10 or more that think EL is garbage, so ...

People who think the EL is garbage are obviously wrong, but it is inferior in the way the MLS is inferior to their EL. But it's been clear he's been slowly trying to work up stats to say the EL is equal to or better than the NBA and that just isn't true.

He also celebrates every US loss. It feels almost like jealousy or anger towards the US for some reason. I don't know where he's from, but he should just enjoy the wonders of his country. I'm sure it's great where he lives. Doesn't have to be cheering the downfall of others to raise his agenda. Whether that's the US team, Giannis, Jokic, whatever.

I'll admit I want USA team to lose after reading comments like 'they don't care'. Let someone that cares win then.

The players playing the games absolutely will care when things start to matter. Unfortunately though, the best players don't care about FIBA for some reason. I've heard some are just preparing for the season, some are resting/nursing injuries, and some just prefer the Olympics. But I wish they would care more so we don't send in the B or C teams though. Show FIBA, your country, and all the other countries some respect. It's an honor to play for your country. Too bad they only feel that way during the Olympics.

[tundraknight]

That’s because the NBA nerfed the effectiveness of defense.

In Fiba you’re actually allowed to play physical and you’re allowed to play a real zone defense.

[Ree4erMadness]

My best guess is that Giannis’ stats being less in international play are a function of both his minutes and total possessions per game being down. I’d wager his per play/per 100 possessions stats are higher in international play than they are in the NBA.

Said another way, he wouldnt average 50-30 in Euroleague as the game is shorter and slower; however, I’d guess his per possession stats would be higher relative to his per possession stats in the NBA.

To your larger point, we just saw the MVP of the Euroleague come in and be the ~30th best player in the NBA [which isnt a true comparison as Doncic exhibited growth as a player from age 18 to 19]. His rebounds/assists per possession likely decreased in the move while his scoring increased. I think its fair to assume Giannis would grab more rebounds, likely have more assists, but score relatively fewer points overall [though again, this would be a function of minutes/possessions].

Doncic also had noticeable higher stats in NBA than he did in EuroLeague. It really looks like NBA stats are inflated and the 8 minute difference doesn't account for all of it. Even if we factor that in, Doncic had better averages in the NBA, if you prorate the numbers out another 8 minutes on average.

nba stats aren't inflated. They simply play under different rules.

Which inflates the stats, lol. Can't touch anybody, can't protect the rim, defensive 3 seconds in the paint, etc, etc.

[Cavsfansince84]

Doncic also had noticeable higher stats in NBA than he did in EuroLeague. It really looks like NBA stats are inflated and the 8 minute difference doesn't account for all of it. Even if we factor that in, Doncic had better averages in the NBA, if you prorate the numbers out another 8 minutes on average.

nba stats aren't inflated. They simply play under different rules.

Which inflates the stats, lol. Can't touch anybody, can't protect the rim, defensive 3 seconds in the paint, etc, etc.

We're all aware that the nba has moved more towards offense in the last 10-15 years. Its silly though to use fiba as some sort of baseline of what is normal bb and say 'well the nba is more offensive so the stats are inflated'. You could just say as much say stats in fiba are deflated but it serves no real purpose to do so. They play by different rules and should be appreciated as having different styles.

[vagelis]

Giannis pushes his opponents a lot of times when he attacks the basket.
In nba for some reason this is an and 1 and he counts 3 points.
In fiba rules this is an offensive foul and he counts zero points when he pushes his opponent.
In nba there is almost zero help defense, in fiba and eurolegue there is always a big man who will protect the rim when a player penetrates

[Nuntius]

International basketball fans have always been very vocal and passionate. I wonder what it is about Giannis that gives them an incredible hate boner. How do these people feel about how Euroleague MVP's tend to fair in the NBA?

We shouldn't generalize here. International basketball fans do not have a hate boner for Giannis. Only Mirotic12 has a hate boner for Giannis and his reasons are well... different.

There are several negative comments and it’s not one poster. It’s not wrong to be negative per say, but the extent goes beyond normal rationale. I’ve see the other side of this, where fans are extremely passionate about a player for their country and will go to insane levels to defend them. It just seems odd that this passionate energy goes the other direction with Giannis.

I would expect Giannis to be showered with love. He should be an international superstar. He’s the MVP of the best league in the world and has a compelling personality and story.

Giannis is showered with love by fans and media all around the world. There is indeed a vocal minority that are pissed at Giannis for not playing in the last EuroBasket (or for other reasons) but they mostly exist online.

[KqWIN]

We shouldn't generalize here. International basketball fans do not have a hate boner for Giannis. Only Mirotic12 has a hate boner for Giannis and his reasons are well... different.

There are several negative comments and it’s not one poster. It’s not wrong to be negative per say, but the extent goes beyond normal rationale. I’ve see the other side of this, where fans are extremely passionate about a player for their country and will go to insane levels to defend them. It just seems odd that this passionate energy goes the other direction with Giannis.

I would expect Giannis to be showered with love. He should be an international superstar. He’s the MVP of the best league in the world and has a compelling personality and story.

Giannis is showered with love by fans and media all around the world. There is indeed a vocal minority that are pissed at Giannis for not playing in the last EuroBasket (or for other reasons) but they mostly exist online.

Fair. The forums do not represent the whole. I guess I should say I don't know what sparks the over reaching hate for Giannis online from Euro fans. Generally, I see a lot of die hard fans for the international players from international fans. I may not agree, but I get it. That's their guy and they're going to support him. Giannis doesn't seem to get the same love. Instead of reaching for ways to pick him up, people are nitpicking things to bring him down.

It's just really odd coming from a fan of a team who's had someone as beloved and supported as Rubio on roster for two seasons.

[Bob8]

There are several negative comments and it’s not one poster. It’s not wrong to be negative per say, but the extent goes beyond normal rationale. I’ve see the other side of this, where fans are extremely passionate about a player for their country and will go to insane levels to defend them. It just seems odd that this passionate energy goes the other direction with Giannis.

I would expect Giannis to be showered with love. He should be an international superstar. He’s the MVP of the best league in the world and has a compelling personality and story.

Giannis is showered with love by fans and media all around the world. There is indeed a vocal minority that are pissed at Giannis for not playing in the last EuroBasket (or for other reasons) but they mostly exist online.

Fair. The forums do not represent the whole. I guess I should say I don't know what sparks the over reaching hate for Giannis online from Euro fans. Generally, I see a lot of die hard fans for the international players from international fans. I may not agree, but I get it. That's their guy and they're going to support him. Giannis doesn't seem to get the same love. Instead of reaching for ways to pick him up, people are nitpicking things to bring him down.

It's just really odd coming from a fan of a team who's had someone as beloved and supported as Rubio on roster for two seasons.

Giannis didn’t show anything in Europe or for his national team yet. In Europe winning or at least contending is everything. Spanoulis is a superstar in Europe even though he didn’t do anything in Nba.

[Nuntius]

There are several negative comments and it’s not one poster. It’s not wrong to be negative per say, but the extent goes beyond normal rationale. I’ve see the other side of this, where fans are extremely passionate about a player for their country and will go to insane levels to defend them. It just seems odd that this passionate energy goes the other direction with Giannis.

I would expect Giannis to be showered with love. He should be an international superstar. He’s the MVP of the best league in the world and has a compelling personality and story.

Giannis is showered with love by fans and media all around the world. There is indeed a vocal minority that are pissed at Giannis for not playing in the last EuroBasket (or for other reasons) but they mostly exist online.

Fair. The forums do not represent the whole. I guess I should say I don't know what sparks the over reaching hate for Giannis online from Euro fans. Generally, I see a lot of die hard fans for the international players from international fans. I may not agree, but I get it. That's their guy and they're going to support him. Giannis doesn't seem to get the same love. Instead of reaching for ways to pick him up, people are nitpicking things to bring him down.

It's just really odd coming from a fan of a team who's had someone as beloved and supported as Rubio on roster for two seasons.

I think that an important reason is that Giannis never played EuroLeague basketball. He never played for a European club of note. He went from Filathlitikos (a division 2 club that no one cares about) straight to the NBA. He never played for youth national teams (since our state failed to give him citizenship early in his life). He never played for the academy of a big club. He was basically an unknown to the vast majority of Euro fans until he went to the NBA. That's also the reason why Giannis has a purely NBA game and why he struggles (relatively to his NBA production) with FIBA rules. He isn't as experienced at the FIBA game as your average Euro player.

[Buzzard]

Doncic also had noticeable higher stats in NBA than he did in EuroLeague. It really looks like NBA stats are inflated and the 8 minute difference doesn't account for all of it. Even if we factor that in, Doncic had better averages in the NBA, if you prorate the numbers out another 8 minutes on average.

He also was only just a top 25-40 player in the NBA, while he was the Euro League MVP a year earlier.

Yeah.. "only" at the age of 18 in EU and then 19/20 in the NBA. It's not like you're talking about a 10yo vet lol...His year per year progressions are off the charts.

But back to the point, like Luka said, spacing in the NBA is much better hence the "much easier to score" comment. Same goes for Giannis. You can see in FIBA games how 4 players just close down the lane or 2 bigs just camp under the rim, much harder for Giannis to get to the basket. In the NBA, he has a lot more room to operate.

In short, FIBA is a lot more pro defense while NBA is a lot more pro offense.

Luka said it is easier to score but what he really meant is:

#1 it is easier to chuck. His regular season career FG% and FT% was roughly .50 higher at Real Madrid. His regular season career 3PT% was only .07 below what he did in the NBA last season.

#2 Translation: Luka was more efficient, getting cleaner looks just not as many of them, in Real Madrid even when he was just a 17 year old kid.

The sample size for his regular season career at Real Madrid is 94 Games. His 1st NBA Season sample size is 72 Games. So the samples are decent. Like I said its easier to chuck but the shots he was taking are obviously under much more duress in the NBA.

[Bob8]

Giannis is showered with love by fans and media all around the world. There is indeed a vocal minority that are pissed at Giannis for not playing in the last EuroBasket (or for other reasons) but they mostly exist online.

Fair. The forums do not represent the whole. I guess I should say I don't know what sparks the over reaching hate for Giannis online from Euro fans. Generally, I see a lot of die hard fans for the international players from international fans. I may not agree, but I get it. That's their guy and they're going to support him. Giannis doesn't seem to get the same love. Instead of reaching for ways to pick him up, people are nitpicking things to bring him down.

It's just really odd coming from a fan of a team who's had someone as beloved and supported as Rubio on roster for two seasons.

I think that an important reason is that Giannis never played EuroLeague basketball. He never played for a European club of note. He went from Filathlitikos (a division 2 club that no one cares about) straight to the NBA. He never played for youth national teams (since our state failed to give him citizenship early in his life). He never played for the academy of a big club. He was basically an unknown to the vast majority of Euro fans until he went to the NBA. That's also the reason why Giannis has a purely NBA game and why he struggles (relatively to his NBA production) with FIBA rules. He isn't as experienced at the FIBA game as your average Euro player.

I mostly agree with you except about experience. He just doesn’t possess the right skills to play under Fiba rules and be a superstar like in Nba. No experience will change that.

[Bob8]

He also was only just a top 25-40 player in the NBA, while he was the Euro League MVP a year earlier.

Yeah.. "only" at the age of 18 in EU and then 19/20 in the NBA. It's not like you're talking about a 10yo vet lol...His year per year progressions are off the charts.

But back to the point, like Luka said, spacing in the NBA is much better hence the "much easier to score" comment. Same goes for Giannis. You can see in FIBA games how 4 players just close down the lane or 2 bigs just camp under the rim, much harder for Giannis to get to the basket. In the NBA, he has a lot more room to operate.

In short, FIBA is a lot more pro defense while NBA is a lot more pro offense.

He said it is easier to score but what he really meant is:

#1 it is easier to chuck. His regular season career FT% and FG% was roughly .50 higher at Real Madrid. His regular season career 3PT% was only .07 below what he did in the NBA last season.

#2 Translation, he was more efficient, getting cleaner looks just not as many of them, in Real Madrid even when he was just a 17 year old kid.

The sample size for his regular season career at Real Madrid is 94 Games. His 1st NBA Season sample size is 72 Games. So the samples are pretty good. Like I said its easier to chuck but the shots he was taking are obviously under much more duress in the NBA.

No. The difference is that he played for much better club, relatively speaking, when he was 17 years old. He was the best scorer, assistant and rebounder after Dallas traded 4 starters. He didn’t need to do everything alone in Real like he had in Dallas after the trades. 19 years old rookie, doing everything with usage around 35% and you expect great efficiency?

[Coach Carter]

Giannis is showered with love by fans and media all around the world. There is indeed a vocal minority that are pissed at Giannis for not playing in the last EuroBasket (or for other reasons) but they mostly exist online.

Some greek old folk have even said that there hasn't been this much hype about the game in greece since nick galis. Just like galis did, giannis will get so many kids interested in taking up the game.

I'd say there's a minority that are annoyed that giannis doesn't have galis skill-set. They want him taking that final shot. They can't accept that giannis isn't your typical superstar.

[Buzzard]

Giannis is showered with love by fans and media all around the world. There is indeed a vocal minority that are pissed at Giannis for not playing in the last EuroBasket (or for other reasons) but they mostly exist online.

Some greek old folk have even said that there hasn't been this much hype about the game in greece since nick galis. Just like galis did, giannis will get so many kids interested in taking up the game.

I'd say there's a minority that are annoyed that giannis doesn't have galis skill-set. They want him taking that final shot. They can't accept that giannis isn't your typical superstar.

I don't care how confident Kemba is, I do not see any way the Americans win this thing. The Paul George injury is going to play a huge part in American Super Stars playing in this, even in the Olympics.

I can see the younger players wanting to; but the dreams of a Dream Team like AD, Durant, LeBron, George, Leonard, Westbrook, Harden etc are over.

[mysticOscar]

This is really what happens when u cant shoot and u like to play in the perimeter when the paint is crowded.

He has a pretty good post game, but its difficult when u have bigger and heavier defenders also occupying the paint.

Thats why he and other players who like to play in perimeter that have inconsistent jump shots are gonna find harder with Fiba or the 90s NBA rules.

Thats why the greek coaches are trying to limit his usage and play more in a team setting where they can hide his weakness