Semi-OT: Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Thread VI (Don't Read Post 1 & FAQ)

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Can someone chime in and elaborate if this is a seasonal thing that will pass by once we reach 70s and 80s ?

Brazil has 3904 cases and Australia has 3969 cases, also it was spreading in Singapore which has been low 90s & high humidity all month there.

[ThumbsUpBaby]

This whole Corona virus is incredibly tricky. You can't even be 100% sure if you have it or not, because its symptoms are so alike to other kind of sicknesses. My friend had a Corona scare recently, but fortunately it turned out he had some gastric acid issue which made him cough and have shortness of breath. Now he has to be self-isolated over no more than a month just because he got himself checked. His situation alone just made this feel so much more real than it does listening and reading about this. And it wasn't even a Corona virus case.

[ThumbsUpBaby]

An interesting article & idea:
https://dash.harvard.edu/bitstream/handle/1/42639016/How%20to%20accelerate%20Coronavirus%20vaccine%20testing_020.pdf?sequence=2&isAllowed=y

The idea is to ask a hundred volunteers who are young, healthy and has a high risk of infection (because of their everyday life for example) to get artificially infected and test the efficacy of the proposed vaccines w/ isolation & close health monitoring. If a vaccine is found to be efficient then increase the number of volunteers to 3000 and perform a placebo controlled trial. If the trial works well,start an accelerated licensure and parallely monitor those 3000 people to check if the vaccine has any long term adversary health effect (that was seen among neither the 100 other people nor in animal studies). By this it would take a few months' less to produce a vaccine than otherwise.

At a first sight it raises ethical questions (the author admits this as well), but after a second thought this seems to be the right approach. 2 months can mean 20-100 thousand people depending on which stage of the disease we are. The first argument is that if the volunteers' condition is closely monitored and they have access to intensive care units then none of them might die while the world saves 20-100k people. The other argument is that even the 3100 volunteers are better off with this approach: among them 30-150 would most probably die otherwise (depending on what care they could get), and by participating they would ensure that they get the best possible care which significantly increases their chance for survival.

I'm 100% on board to volunteer. I'm currently exposed to over 100 people a day, because I work at a farmers' market. I'm only 26, have no underlying conditions, and have a really high immune system. Ethical or not, if it means finding a solution to save others, I'm willing to volunteer.

[HollowEarth]

Can someone chime in and elaborate if this is a seasonal thing that will pass by once we reach 70s and 80s ?

Brazil has 3904 cases and Australia has 3969 cases, also it was spreading in Singapore which has been low 90s & high humidity all month there.

I can't predict the future, but I thought I might be able to give some insight into this. The coronavirus (like SARS, influenza, and quite a few viruses) is an enveloped virus. This means that it's surrounded by a protective lipid envelope. Think of those lipids as similar to bacon fat or candle wax. The colder it is, the harder and waxier that lipid bilayer becomes. The warmer it is, the softer and less protective the envelope becomes. Because of this, warm weather can reduce the time that an enveloped virus survives on surfaces like door handles. Warm weather has little effect on how the virus is transmitted from person to person. The flu is normally seasonal, but the Spanish Flu peaked in the summer being spread from body to body.

[EH15]

An unintended consequence of New York's rumored quarantine is that many will be spooked and try to flee the state. I don't know how or why that leaked, but it's going to have a butterfly effect. People do irrational things in fear. With their state hospitals approaching capacity, people will flee if given the opportunity. That's what happened when Northern Italy locked down. They announced it a few days ahead and people all fled to the south.

[spacemonkey]

An unintended consequence of New York's rumored quarantine is that many will be spooked and try to flee the state. I don't know how or why that leaked, but it's going to have a butterfly effect. People do irrational things in fear. With their state hospitals approaching capacity, people will flee if given the opportunity. That's what happened when Northern Italy locked down. They announced it a few days ahead and people all fled to the south.

It happened in China, too. Many successfully evaded quarantine from Wuhan, making it as far south as Hong Kong.

[HMFFL]

Bobby Hebert Sr., father of former Saint and Falcon Bobby Hebert Jr., dies from COVID-19

Bobby Hebert Sr. -- the father of former New Orleans Saints and Atlanta Falcons quarterback Bobby Hebert -- died Saturday at the age of 81 after testing positive for the coronavirus.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/28966199/bobby-hebert-sr-father-former-saint-falcon-bobby-hebert-jr-dies-covid-19

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[ken6199]

An unintended consequence of New York's rumored quarantine is that many will be spooked and try to flee the state. I don't know how or why that leaked, but it's going to have a butterfly effect. People do irrational things in fear. With their state hospitals approaching capacity, people will flee if given the opportunity. That's what happened when Northern Italy locked down. They announced it a few days ahead and people all fled to the south.

They didn't announced the northern Italy lockdown. It got leaked unintentionally.

You are right about China though. They made the announcement of lockdown for 10am the next day and may fled the night before. I don't blame them.

[paxson_4_3]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.mediterranee-infection.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/COVID-IHU-2-1.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjL2uDc_r7oAhXKtp4KHWXEDoYQFjAFegQIChAB&usg=AOvVaw2w8blOdGL8IiRELgR57vSR

Another study of 80 patients. 79 showed improvement with the Hydroxychloroquine combo.

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I am following theses threads for a while now for the simple reason that it gives me a nice summary on information and opinions being dicussed in the USA. And there is obviously a wide variety of opinion. Above all a wide variety of opinion coming from people that have close to zero knowledge.

The freedom of speach is a wonderful thing. But it goes with taking responsibility for the things you say. When it comes to Chloroquin people are referring to studies like the one mentioned above. And the simple fact that people like ClipsFan are posting this shows that they obviously don't have any knowledge at all about clinical studies and how to interpret data.

The study in France gives zero reliable information and probably doesn't even deserve to be called clinical study. As other people have already written detailed information on WHY this "study" has no value I am just posting two links:

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2020/03/28/coronavirus_hydroxychloroquine_azithromycin/

https://scienceintegritydigest.com/2020/03/24/thoughts-on-the-gautret-et-al-paper-about-hydroxychloroquine-and-azithromycin-treatment-of-covid-19-infections/

Please read it ClipsFan. And please be careful with spreading news that might have dangerous consequences.

Thank you ( I am a Clinical Research Associate and Projectmanager whose daily work is to set up Clinical Trials)

[basketballRob]

I thought about this today for anybody that's died from the coronavirus that's considered young. If a young person dies, there's an underlying condition whether the person knows they have a underlying condition or they not aware they have an underlying condition. I'm thinking there's people that have died that didn't know he/she had an underlying condition. It could also been a person having the Type A blood which is the worst blood type a person can have if they catch the coronavirus. The sneaky underlying conditions if a person is not aware they have an underlying condition would be high blood pressure, diabetes or Type A blood.

I also came to realize the USA as long as the USA stays #1 in the world in the most confirmed cases, That eventually the USA will be #1 in the world with the most recoveries.

An infant died in Illinois.

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[mcmurphy]

A great and simple resume done by a Italian Specialist in Anesthesia and Resuscitation about Covid-19 (quickly translated with Google translator):

- Viruses are microparticles, about a hundred times smaller than a bacterium. For this reason they are not visible under the optical microscope (the normal one to indent us), but only the electronic one.

- viruses have an extremely simple structure: they contain filaments of genes (in the form of DNA or RNA), which are enclosed by a protein shell (càpside), around which a layer of fat is (often but not always) (phospholipids). Coronavirus this fat envelope has it.

- viruses don't have a metabolism. They don't move. They are there, capable of infecting only if transported / conveyed. They do not reproduce / multiply if they do not have a cell to infect.

- Who are Coronaviruses transported by? From humans (the virus is contained in water vapor droplets emitted during normal exhalation, sneezing, coughing and stool) and some materials

- if the virus stops being transported (this is the very important meaning of the quarantine) it ceases to infect.

- viruses (in general) can infect cells (that is, they penetrate them) of an animal, vegetable and, sometimes, they also infect bacteria. They are real cellular parasites.

- SARS-CoV-2 is the seventh Coronavirus to have been identified.

- Coronavirus is an RNA virus. Do you know those beautiful (not kidding!) Images of the viral particle on whose surface you see all those "tacks"? Here, those nails are very important proteins, the so-called glycoproteins, necessary for the virus to interact with the cell to be infected (if the cell in turn does not have certain glycoproteins on its surface, the virus cannot infect it => see innate immunity against HIV in subjects who do not express CCR5 glycoprotein on lymphocytes)

- what do viruses do once they enter the cell? They reproduce: some by exploiting the metabolism and cell organelles of the infected cell, others by inserting their own genes among the genes of the host (ie infected) cell. Multiplication of the virus equates to an increase in its pathogenicity (aggressiveness) for the organism.

- Coronavirus favors respiratory cells (that's why CoViD19 gives a clinical picture that varies from dry cough in mild cases to very severe pneumonia in cases requiring intubation, mechanical ventilation and intensive care unit).

- Coronavirus also has an affinity for some nerve cells, which is why anosmia and ageusia occur in some individuals (loss of sense of smell and taste respectively)

- Viral particles that have not reached (i.e. have not been transported to) the target cell (the one to be infected) decay / denature / disintegrate. The spontaneous denaturation time depends on / is influenced by various factors: temperature, humidity, material from which the surface on which the virus is found is made. On porous surfaces it disintegrates within 3 hours, on copper after about 4 hours, on cardboard after about 24 hours, on metal after about 42 hours, on plastic after about 72 hours.

- Coronavirus subjected to temperatures of 70 celsius grasps disintegrates. A disintegrated virus is no longer infectious.

- what are you interested in then?

- know that Coronavirus penetrates the body through some main ports, namely mouth, nose, eyes. That's why the need not to touch your face with potentially contaminated hands.
And that's why the importance of the mask.

- The FFP2 and FFP3 masks protect you from viruses in case you are negative; these masks have a "life" of about 6-8 hours after which the filter "runs out" and the mask itself, if badly handled, can carry the virus. They must also be worn perfectly on the face, the beard reduces its protective effect.

- Normal surgical masks do not protect you from the virus, but if we all wear it, we reduce the emission of water vapor droplets, protecting each other. In addition, the surgical mask protects us from bacterial infections affecting the respiratory system. If we avoid bacterial infections we make sure that our immune system remains strong, how to say, we keep it healthy to cope with Coronavirus, in case we become infected.

- Alcoholic disinfectants containing between 90% and 100% ethanol or those containing at least 30 grams of propanol are virucidal.

- Why is it said that it is enough to wash your hands with soap? Because the old and dear chemical rule "grease washes grease" applies. Soap is a fat that dissolves the fatty tissue of the viruses mentioned above.

- how should you behave in everyday life? Simple: go out wearing a mask and gloves, avoiding watches. You have to stay focused: when you have a mask and gloves your hands should not touch your face. Much less you have to use your cell phone with gloves. Well yes, we have to get used to leaving the phone at home, that is to live as pre-smartphones at the time. Hurry up your errands you will go home, take off your gloves, wash your hands with soap, take off your mask taking care not to touch the external surface (which is the one that possibly comes into contact with the virus). At that point you will relax your hands and enjoy the relaxation of your home. The objects in your apartment are not contaminated (if you have followed the rules above), the virus does not enter through the window! So please ventilate the premises is a must.

- the mask should be thrown away !!! If you don't have hundreds of them, spray the outside with alcoholic disinfectant (without moistening it too much!) Always taking care not to touch the outside with your hands.

- reuse of gloves needless to talk about it!

- how should you behave if you receive parcels or food at home? Open with mask and gloves, keep away from the courier, ask that the goods be placed on the ground. Collect it, bring it inside and, again with a mask and how many, disinfect it.

- personally I find the use of steam (vaporetto et similia) very suitable for the purpose. You can disinfect parcels and groceries (water vapor has a temperature of 100 or more degrees Celsius).

- always observe the safety distance of at least 1.5 meters, even with friends! for couples and families the speech is worth very little.

- washing your hands often and using disinfectants often damages the skin and its lipid layer. So if on the one hand the disinfectant kills bacteria and viruses on your skin, on the other it damages the hands making them more exposed to infections. Here is the importance of moisturizers (we also use them who work in the operating room;))

- keep your nails short

- the general rules of the grandmother are always valid: zinc at high concentrations (for example 25 mg per day) and vitamin c (of which they are rich for example raw peppers) support the immune system (no, I am not talking about hoax of the high buffalo doses of Vitamin C to counteract the acute phase of disease)

- if you become infected and develop a mild form that does not require hospitalization, you can also use paracetamol and also IBUPROFENE as antipyretics, remembering that ibuprofen also acts as an anti-inflammatory.

- quitting smoking would be an advantage however (I omit the discussion on the likely lower incidence of CoViD19 in smokers because there are insufficient data. For now it seems to be a mere clinical observation)

- if you want to rinse and gargle you can use 3% hydrogen peroxide diluted with water (attention: very unpleasant taste). It is implied that the mixture should not be swallowed / drunk (is it?).

- I believe there are explanatory videos on youtube showing how to effectively disinfect / wash your hands. The sequence of movements is not so obvious, which is why I recommend that you take a look at them.

- smile and breathe

Dr. Spiga
(Specialist in Anesthesia and Resuscitation)

[basketballRob]

Everyday things like this continue is another day all of us are going to be stuck in our homes.... the longer it takes for these idiot states to shutdown the longer we are all going to be shutdown and the more people will die

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Desantis did make a good point that people are like sardines on the NY subway and no one says anything. He also said that people didn't comply with the only 10 people in a gathering order.

Disturbing things from yesterday's news conference was that we only have 2100 icu beds and some are saying we'll need 200k beds and 30k icu beds in two weeks.

When he answered questions yesterday, he seemed to start cracking. He kept repeating himself, like a stutter.

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[basketballRob]

Can someone chime in and elaborate if this is a seasonal thing that will pass by once we reach 70s and 80s ?

It's been over 90 without a cloud in the sky for the last 2-3 weeks in Florida, but it's still spreading. I think the ultraviolet rays do help kill the virus on objects in the sun.

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[mcmurphy]

https://www.facebook.com/ciccio.cicciotti/videos/2844732265563144/

piazza navona empty... the tricolor that flies... and Morricone's music... I have a lump in my throat to see my Italy right now

[theonlyclutch]

Oh boy, Ken61999 will lose it as CDC doubles down

Read on Twitter

Did those bozos in there (and the WHO) look at Taiwan, South Korea, Japan, Singapore, and HK, all of which have had confirmed cases for over two months, the latter two being NYC-dense with even higher reliance on public transport, and just think, "yup their authorities are just THAT good at quarrantines and contact tracing" but totally disregard that most people there wear masks out in public?

I have zero medical knowledge/experience, but it sure seems a lot easier to identify potential candidates for contact-tracing/quarrantine measures when the authorities can take a good bet that the infected person isn't spreading it in say, public transport or grocery stores because they and near everyone else they go near in those places are wearing masks.

[Courtside]

Can someone chime in and elaborate if this is a seasonal thing that will pass by once we reach 70s and 80s ?

It's been over 90 without a cloud in the sky for the last 2-3 weeks in Florida, but it's still spreading. I think the ultraviolet rays do help kill the virus on objects in the sun.

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The UVA and UVB rays that are naturally occuring do not kill the virus. The wavelength needs to be between 250-290mm with a peak around 265nm, and this is extremely dangerous to humans both in terms of skin exposure and retinal damage. This range is called UVC and when these rays combine with oxygen, they create ozone.

In a closed environment, the ozone helps to carry the UVC rays and penetrate porous surfaces or go around all objects, with 99.99% effectiveness in killing most known germs, bacteria and viruses. Testing is being done now on Corona but it's expected to be right there at 99.9 as well.

You're going to hear a lot more about UV disinfection products going forward, initially for hospital use, then in the places we all have to go like groceries and pharmacies, and eventually making its way to restaurants and ultimately homes. A restaurant could blast their space with UVC at 5am when there are no occupants and 99.9% disinfect everything inside, for example. Every home could have a closet or drawer or safe box that they put their things into before continuing on to the rest of the house.

LOTS of personal habits are going to change going forward.

[Stillwater]

Ohio expecting to have 10k new positive tested reported cases of covid-19 DAILY by mid May which apparently their projections bon it's peak.
I find it very hard to believe 10k people per day will be getting tested, but if this thing continues it's path of rapid ascension and they get the test kits who knows...
I was one of the "crazy fools" about this being a major historical pandemic, but society doesn't ever want to hear their lives have to change even for a week on the premise it would save lives , because the world we live in needs proof of everything before they get off their ass.
There are people still don't get it.
It's like the measles as far as spreading and it all goes back to ignoring early warnings.

Does anyone know the survival rate for people on ventilators?
If you ask me all this ventilator production is foolish false hope prolonging the inevitable.
If you get it that bad your sol barring a miracle.

[Mind_Odyssey]

So a tornado ripped through Arkansas and this video made me laugh more than it should.

I understand why some believe this virus was engineered, but I think it’s just Mother Nature being that terrifying. As a society, we got soft and just assume everything will continue as it normally does.

Read on Twitter

[bravor]

Ohio expecting to have 10k new positive tested reported cases of covid-19 DAILY by mid May which apparently their projections bon it's peak.
I find it very hard to believe 10k people per day will be getting tested, but if this thing continues it's path of rapid ascension and they get the test kits who knows...
I was one of the "crazy fools" about this being a major historical pandemic, but society doesn't ever want to hear their lives have to change even for a week on the premise it would save lives , because the world we live in needs proof of everything before they get off their ass.
There are people still don't get it.
It's like the measles as far as spreading and it all goes back to ignoring early warnings.

Does anyone know the survival rate for people on ventilators?
If you ask me all this ventilator production is foolish false hope prolonging the inevitable.
If you get it that bad your sol barring a miracle.

We had a special case among the good stories (some also were displayed in Italy, for this case it's in France, video in french here) for seniors who went through this infection and survived.
The husband who is in his 90yrs got hit first and was in serious condition at the hospital, knowing he was too old to be on ventilator (had had oxygen for a few days). His daughter & his wife in the itw said that he fought for his life with the help of oxygen and the medical staff skills & care. His wife also got the infection, and she had joined her husband in a room in the hospital.
Now both are "cured", but remains in quarantine since doctors can't guarantee they are not longer contagious.

There is no rule here about who will die from this virus, just probabilities of dying. Which is why everyone has to be cautious, not just for the eldest.
The most important is obvious, having enough protections for medical care since you can't get any care if most of your medical crew has been infected and have to remain at home (or worse). Which is why most countries followed China (etc) for quarantine.
As for the global population, they just have to behave smart and follow quanratine advices/rules untll things get into control. As frustrating as it is.

As Mind-Odyssey suggested, humanity get into areas which were wild for centuries, and it's more than logical to see this kind of pandemic. i am suprised that american don't know their own history (as a whole). Considering the number of 'indians' who died from 'european conquistador' diseases/germs. it's not like we have immediate answers from everything, especially from virus which are known to evolve/mutate.

The most dangerous virus right now, if i have to voice an opinion, is from social networks since many are spreading disinformation and fake sh*t all around (from supposed miracle treatment to virus's origin, passing by so many plot theories). Which is why 'normal ' (unbiased) medias are so important other any kind of wannabe specialist.

[Stillwater]

Can someone chime in and elaborate if this is a seasonal thing that will pass by once we reach 70s and 80s ?

Brazil has 3904 cases and Australia has 3969 cases, also it was spreading in Singapore which has been low 90s & high humidity all month there.

I can't predict the future, but I thought I might be able to give some insight into this. The coronavirus (like SARS, influenza, and quite a few viruses) is an enveloped virus. This means that it's surrounded by a protective lipid envelope. Think of those lipids as similar to bacon fat or candle wax. The colder it is, the harder and waxier that lipid bilayer becomes. The warmer it is, the softer and less protective the envelope becomes. Because of this, warm weather can reduce the time that an enveloped virus survives on surfaces like door handles. Warm weather has little effect on how the virus is transmitted from person to person. The flu is normally seasonal, but the Spanish Flu peaked in the summer being spread from body to body.

I would think with this COVID-19 the aspiration transfer will increase in warmer moister air (already seen in humidifier equipped bipap machines) even with it having a shorter life on touched surfaces.
People could and should consider any dust masks and goggles to be necessary practice in public not just useful ideas as it gets warmer.
Most of these hot spots are colder but I think it's just phase 2 of many