Lets not overlook the fact... Jayson Tatum exposed

Wilfried · Post #121 » by **Wilfried** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:01 pm

John Murdoch wrote:Reminds me of Indy Paul George..except he actually reached the finals

Very good comparison. Paul never had that quality of a (supporting) cast on the other hand

Crazy-Canuck · Post #122 » by **Crazy-Canuck** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:04 pm

Would tatum get as much heat if it was someone like kawhi was guarding him instead of wiggins?

BoatsNZones · Post #123 » by **BoatsNZones** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:16 pm

48% TS. Disgusting for an All NBA 1st Team selection. Still more efficient than Lebron in 2015.

R-DAWG · Post #124 » by **R-DAWG** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:12 pm

I think Tatum right now is a top-10 player. And at 24 years old and with his physical gifts and natural basketball skills, there is no reason to believe that he has hit his peak. But right now, he is more prime Carmelo Anthony (who was a fringe top-5 player at his peak) than prime Kevin Durant (who was arguably the best offensive player in the league at his peak).

Does Tatum ever get to the point where he is in the same category as Luka, Giannis, Jokic and Embiid (who look like they will be the stars that dominate the league the next 5-7 years). Or is he more Paul George, Dame Lillard, Jimmy Butler types - the next tier.

All I can say is, if I had Jayson Tatum on my team going forward I would be excited.

Lunartic · Post #125 » by **Lunartic** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:21 pm

He's not a top 10 guy, this should be obvious to most people. He and Brown are top-20 guys and would make very nice complimentary pieces for a real #1 option.

They're pretty much Paul George, good and can take over games but too inconsistent to place your team's hopes and dreams on.

Celtics fans should be happy though, they have assets and 2 young, great players with playoff experience.

Jadoogar · Post #126 » by **Jadoogar** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 2:02 pm

Optms wrote:
ratul wrote:Screw off with this take.

How about you tell me why he is a top 10 player instead getting salty this morning Or just ignore the post.

i mean, he made the finals. Played incredibly well against the Nets, dropped 40+ against the Bucks and averaged 26/7/6 for the playoffs. Yes he played poorly in the finals but he's still a top 10 player. Would you rather take the player who couldn't get to the finals? Your original post was a one sentence hot take, it didn't deserve a serious response.

Jadoogar · Post #127 » by **Jadoogar** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 2:04 pm

jerok wrote:
Promezclan wrote:1 game and 1 series definitely outweighs his previous 7 playoff series and 2 full regular seasons- that's just basic statistics!

As an anointed superstar by fans and media. Top 5 player in the world (first team all NBA).
Expectations are big. If you come up spectacularly tiny in the finals you deserve the criticism. Just ask LeBron.

Embiid and Jokic lost very early in the playoffs, by this token, neither of them should be considered top 10 player either?

liquidswords · Post #128 » by **liquidswords** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 2:06 pm

He didn't get exposed but he definitely isn't as good as people think

Jadoogar · Post #129 » by **Jadoogar** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 2:10 pm

_NoMas wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
Optms wrote:
How about you tell me why he is a top 10 player instead getting salty this morning Or just ignore the post.

1. Giannis
2. Jokic
3. Steph
4. Luka
5. Embiid
6. KD
7. Lebron

He'd be fighting over the last two spots with old and/or always injured guys like Kawhi, AD, Harden, Dame. If Kawhi and AD can return to form next year, they're going to slot in there (Kawhi at his best is easily top-5), but that's a big if.

Agree with this. I’m assuming kawhi comes back close to his best, so that’s 8 players definitely ahead of Tatum. After that it’s a bit of ‘what do you prefer’ with guys like Ja, Tatum, Booker, AD, Butler etc

At this point in their career, why is Lebron definitely ahead of Tatum? Lebron has the slight statistical advantage but pretty much everyone would agree that they aren't even close defensively.

Come to think of it, why is Embiid definitely ahead of Tatum? by the logic of this thread, Embiid lost in the second round so surely, Tatum is the better player?

gorz · Post #130 » by **gorz** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 2:47 pm

Tatum is in that Paul George/Jimmy Butler tier. Not a superstar but better than fringe all stars. Not as good as Luka Doncic and Kawhi Leonard but better than Devin Booker and Demar Derozan.

Woodsanity · Post #131 » by **Woodsanity** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 3:09 pm

John Murdoch wrote:Reminds me of Indy Paul George..except he actually reached the finals

PG didn't have Jaylen to bail him out.

jerok · Post #132 » by **jerok** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:04 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
jerok wrote:
Promezclan wrote:1 game and 1 series definitely outweighs his previous 7 playoff series and 2 full regular seasons- that's just basic statistics!

As an anointed superstar by fans and media. Top 5 player in the world (first team all NBA).
Expectations are big. If you come up spectacularly tiny in the finals you deserve the criticism. Just ask LeBron.

Embiid and Jokic lost very early in the playoffs, by this token, neither of them should be considered top 10 player either?

I'm not saying take out Tatum from top player list.
I'm saying if you are anointed as such, and crap the bed in the finals. You deserve major criticism.

He had the worst 2point FG percentage in 60 years in the the NBA finals.
Can't be doing that as a "Top 5" player.

HighFlyer23 · Post #133 » by **HighFlyer23** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 9:29 pm

DroseReturnChi wrote:
HighFlyer23 wrote:Give him time

He's not a superstar and he's young

He's on his way to becoming a great player

hes not 19 anymore hes in his prime already peaked maxed out. intelligence isnt something that can get better. you either born or not. truly great players they put up stats in yr 1 best case tatum goes to curry trajectory where he get better after 30.
but looks like hes barely top 10 he has long ways to catch up to butler has never been better.

He’s in his athletic prime

Many players reach their true prime from their mid 20s till their early or even mid 30s

In recent times guys seem to be reaching their primes later

_NoMas · Post #134 » by **_NoMas** » Mon Jun 20, 2022 11:22 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
_NoMas wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
1. Giannis
2. Jokic
3. Steph
4. Luka
5. Embiid
6. KD
7. Lebron

He'd be fighting over the last two spots with old and/or always injured guys like Kawhi, AD, Harden, Dame. If Kawhi and AD can return to form next year, they're going to slot in there (Kawhi at his best is easily top-5), but that's a big if.

Agree with this. I’m assuming kawhi comes back close to his best, so that’s 8 players definitely ahead of Tatum. After that it’s a bit of ‘what do you prefer’ with guys like Ja, Tatum, Booker, AD, Butler etc

At this point in their career, why is Lebron definitely ahead of Tatum? Lebron has the slight statistical advantage but pretty much everyone would agree that they aren't even close defensively.

Come to think of it, why is Embiid definitely ahead of Tatum? by the logic of this thread, Embiid lost in the second round so surely, Tatum is the better player?

I do see your logic. Embiid hasn’t even been past the second round, and Lebron didn’t even make the play in. But it’s just a gut feeling from watching those guys. If you swap this version of Lebron with Tatum, do the Celtics improve? I think they 100% do. With embiid, it’s mainly the ability to stay healthy, but at their best, I’m taking Embiid as the more impactful player every day of the week, and I think their peers would all agree.

Post #135 » by **tsherkin** » Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:03 am

It was interesting to me that Tatum was very good from 3, but was basically entirely incapable beneath the arc. Also that he fell off a cliff at the line over the last couple games, and couldn't even draw FTAs at all in the elimination game. He wasn't a stunner in the RS as far as rTS, but 57.8% TS has been really good up until the last few years.

He'll have to improve his middle game a little. I'm interested to see if/what he adds next season to try and bounce back. That's what matters. That's what we should be discussing, not just trying to blandly label him as "exposed."

Post #136 » by **og15** » Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:16 am

Meh, he got his team to the finals, impacted both ends and had a tough finals series, if a 24 year old is exposed like that, that's okay.

PizzaSteve · Post #137 » by **PizzaSteve** » Tue Jun 21, 2022 5:42 pm

tsherkin wrote:It was interesting to me that Tatum was very good from 3, but was basically entirely incapable beneath the arc. Also that he fell off a cliff at the line over the last couple games, and couldn't even draw FTAs at all in the elimination game. He wasn't a stunner in the RS as far as rTS, but 57.8% TS has been really good up until the last few years.

He'll have to improve his middle game a little. I'm interested to see if/what he adds next season to try and bounce back. That's what matters. That's what we should be discussing, not just trying to blandly label him as "exposed."

I think that was mental. The warriors took away the easy paint finish and what he needed to do was rise mid range and shoot quicker or drive and pass out quicker, but the swarming defense made him think twice and hesitate. He'll watch tape and figure it out with team mates.

Jables · Post #138 » by **Jables** » Tue Jun 21, 2022 5:49 pm

Exposed is meaningless. I didn't think he could do it all over a playoff series and that's what he was asked to do, need to get a playmaker next to him and he'll be unexposed.

Post #139 » by **tsherkin** » Tue Jun 21, 2022 5:51 pm

PizzaSteve wrote:
tsherkin wrote:It was interesting to me that Tatum was very good from 3, but was basically entirely incapable beneath the arc. Also that he fell off a cliff at the line over the last couple games, and couldn't even draw FTAs at all in the elimination game. He wasn't a stunner in the RS as far as rTS, but 57.8% TS has been really good up until the last few years.

He'll have to improve his middle game a little. I'm interested to see if/what he adds next season to try and bounce back. That's what matters. That's what we should be discussing, not just trying to blandly label him as "exposed."

I think that was mental. The warriors took away the easy paint finish and what he needed to do was rise mid range and shoot quicker or drive and pass out quicker, but the swarming defense made him think twice and hesitate. He'll watch tape and figure it out with team mates.

That's what I'm talking about. If he figures out an appropriate adjustment and Boston contends again with him performing well, no foul, right?

Patsfan1081 · Post #140 » by **Patsfan1081** » Tue Jun 21, 2022 6:16 pm

Pharenheit wrote:He’s just a very average player when he no longer is protected by the referee whistle. Most of his game revolves around flopping his way to the line on every drive

Not surprised to see such horrible takes right off the bat. Forget the fact that he finished first in defensive rating or more assists per game in the playoffs then Luca. Fans can only point to one ask aspect in their attempts to throw shade…..