Danny Ainge just took the whole NBA execs to school

[Pointgod]

Cleveland won, Jazz won, Knicks as always, lost

Ainge was asking for way more from the Knicks dude what are you talking about. Knicks dodged a huge bullet considering they don’t have a Mobley, Garland, Jarrett Allen to cover up Mitchell’s flaws. In two years Mitchell could be the 2A/B option on his team and still be really good. No such situation on the Knicks.

Knicks fans are always triggered when they "win" by not losing a trade because they didn't make the trade due to the entitled sentiment of them feeling they shouldn't have to trade 3-5 picks for anyone because the player should just be happy to play for NY.

Always followed by lashing out at the player (Donovan doesn't play defense we don't need him) but they needed to re-up RJ Barrett as if that was the urgent thing to do.

You make the trade then figure it out afterwards not let a guy like Mitchell go to CLE and push you further away from PO contention to where you'll always have a good ol' mid to late lotto pick.

Lmao I’m not even a Knicks fan, I just have two working eyes and realize that it would have been a **** trade for the Knicks and Mitchell is a horrible fit with the Knicks. Let’s walk through the scenario.

Let’s say the Knicks traded Toppin, Quickley, Grimes plus 2 of their picks unprotected and 3 picks from other teams for Mitchell. You have to include Fournier for salary purposes so that leaves the Knicks with:

Brunson, Mitchell, Barrett, Randle, Robinson with Derrick Rose, Deuce Mcbride, Jericho Sims, Cam Reddish and Isiah Hartenstein off the bench. Not only is that bench pretty bad, Brunson and Mitchell make a small back court with nobody upfront to cover up for them defensively. That team’s ceiling is the play-in. Even worse now the Knicks dont have flexibility to trade picks. Let’s assume Ainge only asked for their 23’ and 25’ picks (Ainge would most likely push those picks out) all they have to trade is their 27’ and 29’ picks and another pick from a playoff team. That package is not bringing in a player better than Mitchell. There is no do the trade and figure it out later when you kill your flexibility.

Meanwhile on the Cavs Mitchell is walking onto a team with two recent Allstars and if all goes well another blossoming allstar (Mobley) with Caris Lavert and Kevin Love headlining the bench. And despite what they gave up they still have a lot of flexibility to bring in more talent and even a borderline or former allstar.

[Dupp]

Ainge hates talent, just hoarding pics.

[dc]

More like Danny Ainge hella settled on this trade. Remember he was asking for 4-5 picks from the Knicks plus another 3-4 young assets for Mitchell. Now he’s getting picks that are more likely to be low first round picks at least for the next 5 years and who honestly believes that the Jazz are going to be leagues better than the Cavs in the next 7 years? The Jazz are a team that struggles to sign free agents and they’re going to be a tanking team for the next half decade at least. Good luck selling free agents on that future.

3 picks are heavily protected, the young players aren't good, this is much better than the Kicks package, Sexton and LAuri >> any Knicks young player.

Heavy amounts of compium here. The Knicks would have sent out 2 unprotected Knicks picks of their own plus 2-3 other picks from other teams that you are guaranteed to get. You do know the pick swap is useless right if the Cavs have a better record right? So Ainge took 3 guaranteed picks over 4-5 guaranteed picks plus additional young players. Lauri and Sexton were trade filler and while I like them as players don’t delude yourself into believing that this was a trade for talent.

Should add that Ainge also got Agbaji, who was the last pick of the lottery 2 months ago. Still has the new car smell. So he basically got 4 1st rounders.

[Pointgod]

3 picks are heavily protected, the young players aren't good, this is much better than the Kicks package, Sexton and LAuri >> any Knicks young player.

Heavy amounts of compium here. The Knicks would have sent out 2 unprotected Knicks picks of their own plus 2-3 other picks from other teams that you are guaranteed to get. You do know the pick swap is useless right if the Cavs have a better record right? So Ainge took 3 guaranteed picks over 4-5 guaranteed picks plus additional young players. Lauri and Sexton were trade filler and while I like them as players don’t delude yourself into believing that this was a trade for talent.

Should add that Ainge also got Agbaji, who was the last pick of the lottery 2 months ago. Still has the new car smell. So he basically got 4 1st rounders.

Agbaji was wildly panned as a bad pick by the Cavs. He was a throw in like Walker Kessler. Basically it’s a bonus if either of them become an average starter.

[Richard4444]

Gobert + Mitchel for
6 unprotected 1sts
3 unprotected swaps
1 top 4 protected 1st
Lottery pick in Agbaghi
Late 1st in Kessler

AND on top of it these rotation players:
Beasly
Beverley
Markannen

AND young scorer on 18/yr deal in Sexton

I'm really not sure the Jazz post Mitchell trade are worse team than pre Mitchell trade, and add to that picks.

You forgot Jarred Vanderbilt.

You also can replace Bevs for THT.

[QingJames]

The 1996-97 Spurs would like to introduce you to their draft strategy of tanking and getting the #1 pick. They drafted this guy Tim Duncan. He is pretty good.

Strategic tanking for a single year because of an injury to your best player is in no way, shape or form the same as gutting your entire roster for picks and trying to put the worst possible team and product on the floor for 3+ years.

The Jazz needed to tank. There is 0% chance they could have strategically tanked 1 year. and got a high draft pick. This is the way.

The way to what? Perennial second round exits like the Sixers?

This strategy has literally never resulted in a championship.

[zeebneeb]

The Jazz did, what the Knicks and Lakers both should have done.

The Knicks didn't have the personnel to land as much as Danny did, but if there is a team, that needs to tank, it's the damn Knicks.

The Lakers should have done the exact same thing. They have the assets to land some good picks, but instead are trotting out round 2 failed experiment boogaloo.

[taikibansei]

More like Danny Ainge hella settled on this trade. Remember he was asking for 4-5 picks from the Knicks plus another 3-4 young assets for Mitchell. Now he’s getting picks that are more likely to be low first round picks at least for the next 5 years and who honestly believes that the Jazz are going to be leagues better than the Cavs in the next 7 years? The Jazz are a team that struggles to sign free agents and they’re going to be a tanking team for the next half decade at least. Good luck selling free agents on that future.

3 picks are heavily protected, the young players aren't good, this is much better than the Kicks package, Sexton and LAuri >> any Knicks young player.

Danny's ask of the Knicks was 6+ frps--at least 3 unprotected--plus swaps, plus various (accounts vary) young players. I'll explain it more below, but I think we can both agree that this package from the Knicks would have been far, far better than what the Cavs actually paid.

The Knicks actual offer was 5 frps--2 unprotected--plus expirings, plus young talent. Frankly, that's still better than what Danny got. First, due to the poor roster fit, even with Mitchell our record each year would have been in the 7-10 range; on the other hand, the Cavs (now with multiple all-stars and the ROY) are going to be competing each season for top-4 in the East...meaning that the Knicks' two unprotected picks would likely have been better than the Cavs frps.

But I'm not done: let's talk about the "heavily protected" (your words) picks. Here are the picks that were in play:
--23 Dallas (top 10 protected in a deep draft; 1-10 in 2024 and 1-10 in 2025)
--25 Bucks (top 4 protected)
--Wizards (top 14 in 2023, top 12 in 2024, top 10 in 2025, top 8 in 2026)
--Detroit (top 18 in 2023-24, top 13 in 2025, top 11 in 2026, top 9 in 2027)
I.e., all four of these "heavily protected" frps likely convey, all with the potential for being in the mid- to late-lottery. Accordingly, none are "heavily" protected by any definition of the term. Indeed, given the strength of the Cavs' current roster, I'd argue that all but the Bucks will come in lower than the Cavs' unprotected picks.

Finally, let's talk about the young players Utah got. I'm going to focus on Sexton, as you mention him specifically. Sexton was a decent player before the season-ending injury. That said...he just came back from a season-long injury...was never really that good...and you've now signed to pay him $72,000,000 (more than the Cavs offered) over the next four years. Yeah, good luck with that.

Again, I think Danny did just fine with his "haul," but there was no "great victory" here (and the Knicks were right to walk away). Assuming the Cavs stay healthy, they didn't give a lot out.

[_qubik]

Cleveland won, Jazz won, Knicks as always, lost

Ainge was asking for way more from the Knicks dude what are you talking about. Knicks dodged a huge bullet considering they don’t have a Mobley, Garland, Jarrett Allen to cover up Mitchell’s flaws. In two years Mitchell could be the 2A/B option on his team and still be really good. No such situation on the Knicks.

The Knicks, as they are, are losing, they will still lose, the team is bad, they are bad drafting, better waste those picks in a serviceable player

[Bankai]

Honestly, Jazz won both deals. Jazz were not winning with Gobert and Mitchell. Excellent return on replaceable players.

[TravisScott55]

Those picks might be all late firsts and none of the swaps may convey

[TMac Culloch]

Good asset plays but at the end of the day it's what you do with them

[og15]

Still have to dump Conley, Clarkson and Bogdanovic and Rudy Gay. Then you add in Sexton, Beasley, Vanderbilt, and THT to the above players. That is a Jazz team that is still too good to feel secure in acquiring a top 3 pick IMO. Got to make more trades to get in full tank mode.

The #7 seed has jumped up to the top 3 every year since they started the new lottery system.. I feel safe saying the Jazz are going to get a top 3 pick within the next few seasons.

That’s a pretty small sample to feel safe about

[jazzfan1971]

I dunno folks. Ask yourselves what are the 5 least desirable cities to play in for NBA players. I'm not talking about the team/teammates, simply the location.

Probably cold. small market, not coastal.

Would probably have both Minnesota and Cleveland on that 5 team list, right?

When a player gets good in these types of cities the media goes into a feeding frenzy trying to get that player to a large market. It's brutal trying to keep your assets in a small, cold, flyover city.

Things change pretty fast in the NBA, you can't say for sure that those picks will amount to anything, but I think you'd be foolish to assume that they won't either.

We will have to wait and see.

[jswede]

I dunno folks. Ask yourselves what are the 5 least desirable cities to play in for NBA players. I'm not talking about the team/teammates, simply the location.

Probably cold. small market, not coastal.

Would probably have both Minnesota and Cleveland on that 5 team list, right?

When a player gets good in these types of cities the media goes into a feeding frenzy trying to get that player to a large market. It's brutal trying to keep your assets in a small, cold, flyover city.

Things change pretty fast in the NBA, you can't say for sure that those picks will amount to anything, but I think you'd be foolish to assume that they won't either.

We will have to wait and see.

Which markets are you talking about that are getting all these free agents? Edit: and which players?

[Pointgod]

More like Danny Ainge hella settled on this trade. Remember he was asking for 4-5 picks from the Knicks plus another 3-4 young assets for Mitchell. Now he’s getting picks that are more likely to be low first round picks at least for the next 5 years and who honestly believes that the Jazz are going to be leagues better than the Cavs in the next 7 years? The Jazz are a team that struggles to sign free agents and they’re going to be a tanking team for the next half decade at least. Good luck selling free agents on that future.

3 picks are heavily protected, the young players aren't good, this is much better than the Kicks package, Sexton and LAuri >> any Knicks young player.

Danny's ask of the Knicks was 6+ frps--at least 3 unprotected--plus swaps, plus various (accounts vary) young players. I'll explain it more below, but I think we can both agree that this package from the Knicks would have been far, far better than what the Cavs actually paid.

The Knicks actual offer was 5 frps--2 unprotected--plus expirings, plus young talent. Frankly, that's still better than what Danny got. First, due to the poor roster fit, even with Mitchell our record each year would have been in the 7-10 range; on the other hand, the Cavs (now with multiple all-stars and the ROY) are going to be competing each season for top-4 in the East...meaning that the Knicks' two unprotected picks would likely have been better than the Cavs frps.

But I'm not done: let's talk about the "heavily protected" (your words) picks. Here are the picks that were in play:
--23 Dallas (top 10 protected in a deep draft; 1-10 in 2024 and 1-10 in 2025)
--25 Bucks (top 4 protected)
--Wizards (top 14 in 2023, top 12 in 2024, top 10 in 2025, top 8 in 2026)
--Detroit (top 18 in 2023-24, top 13 in 2025, top 11 in 2026, top 9 in 2027)
I.e., all four of these "heavily protected" frps likely convey, all with the potential for being in the mid- to late-lottery. Accordingly, none are "heavily" protected by any definition of the term. Indeed, given the strength of the Cavs' current roster, I'd argue that all but the Bucks will come in lower than the Cavs' unprotected picks.

Finally, let's talk about the young players Utah got. I'm going to focus on Sexton, as you mention him specifically. Sexton was a decent player before the season-ending injury. That said...he just came back from a season-long injury...was never really that good...and you've now signed to pay him $72,000,000 (more than the Cavs offered) over the next four years. Yeah, good luck with that.

Again, I think Danny did just fine with his "haul," but there was no "great victory" here (and the Knicks were right to walk away). Assuming the Cavs stay healthy, they didn't give a lot out.

Wow if this is accurate. Ainge isn’t half as smart as he thinks he his and Knicks were saved by Ainge’s arrogance.

Read on Twitter

[Capn'O]

It also looks like he held the Knicks as collateral for months to get a better deal.

[seren]

Mitchell is 26, Gobert is 30. Both are flawed players at least a full tier below true franchise level. They won two playoffs series in 5 years together and often seemed to fumble in the playoffs in embarrassing fashion. The returns last year were already diminishing. And on top of that the two didn't like each other.

I'm shocked that anyone was still vying for building around them.

Every player is a flawed player until they win the whole thing. It is the front office’s job to build a winning squad around flawed players

Interesting logic. So by extension is every flawed player or collection of flawed players simply a good front office away from winning the whole thing? Wonder why the 2011-12 Bobcats never got their parade in the sun.

LOL. If you believe Mitchell and Gobert were 11-12 Bobcats level, I don’t know what to tell you. You need to start watching some games

[seren]

Honestly, Jazz won both deals. Jazz were not winning with Gobert and Mitchell. Excellent return on replaceable players.

Jazz fans lost. The franchise doesn’t seem to care. Probably they are looking to sell at some point. Ainge won big.

[taikibansei]

3 picks are heavily protected, the young players aren't good, this is much better than the Kicks package, Sexton and LAuri >> any Knicks young player.

Danny's ask of the Knicks was 6+ frps--at least 3 unprotected--plus swaps, plus various (accounts vary) young players. I'll explain it more below, but I think we can both agree that this package from the Knicks would have been far, far better than what the Cavs actually paid.

The Knicks actual offer was 5 frps--2 unprotected--plus expirings, plus young talent. Frankly, that's still better than what Danny got. First, due to the poor roster fit, even with Mitchell our record each year would have been in the 7-10 range; on the other hand, the Cavs (now with multiple all-stars and the ROY) are going to be competing each season for top-4 in the East...meaning that the Knicks' two unprotected picks would likely have been better than the Cavs frps.

But I'm not done: let's talk about the "heavily protected" (your words) picks. Here are the picks that were in play:
--23 Dallas (top 10 protected in a deep draft; 1-10 in 2024 and 1-10 in 2025)
--25 Bucks (top 4 protected)
--Wizards (top 14 in 2023, top 12 in 2024, top 10 in 2025, top 8 in 2026)
--Detroit (top 18 in 2023-24, top 13 in 2025, top 11 in 2026, top 9 in 2027)
I.e., all four of these "heavily protected" frps likely convey, all with the potential for being in the mid- to late-lottery. Accordingly, none are "heavily" protected by any definition of the term. Indeed, given the strength of the Cavs' current roster, I'd argue that all but the Bucks will come in lower than the Cavs' unprotected picks.

Finally, let's talk about the young players Utah got. I'm going to focus on Sexton, as you mention him specifically. Sexton was a decent player before the season-ending injury. That said...he just came back from a season-long injury...was never really that good...and you've now signed to pay him $72,000,000 (more than the Cavs offered) over the next four years. Yeah, good luck with that.

Again, I think Danny did just fine with his "haul," but there was no "great victory" here (and the Knicks were right to walk away). Assuming the Cavs stay healthy, they didn't give a lot out.

Wow if this is accurate. Ainge isn’t half as smart as he thinks he his and Knicks were saved by Ainge’s arrogance.

Read on Twitter

Yeah, if true, the Knicks were indeed saved by Ainge. This said, again if true, Leon Rose needs to be fired immediately for even offering such an overpay. (I.e., I'm far more pissed at the rumored offer than at our "missing out" on Donovan Mitchell.... )