Is Pascal Siakam an empty stats guy?

[Capn'O]

If Siakam is so good and OG is so good, and Barnes is so good, why are the Raps so mediocre?

Because they don't have a PG, center, or a bench. Pretty simple.

Raptors FO experimented by constructing a team full of 6'9 forward and the plan backfired terribly.

The team also lacks playmakers, reliable 3pt shooters, and shot creators (Siakam is the lone shot creator).

I saw a rumor that the Raps were interested in... whichever McDaniels is on the Hornets. It's like, try another position.

I do think that a lateral trade for a position of need could improve your team a lot.

[meekrab]

Raptors suck because they're basically built for the NCAA 3 point line.

[nikster]

If the Knicks’ bench wasn’t absolutely horrific this year, you’d have a point there. Randle, Brunson and RJ have been playing 40+ min many times this season, especially recently because the bench is underwhelming.

And considering how flawed all those players are, I’m fine with the Knicks not trading for them. If they were truly worth what your management thought they were, they would’ve been traded by now. Rather deal with our flawed players that are leading us to a winning record.

This is a lot of talk from a fan of a team who has not won a playoff series in a decade

If you are incapable of using some nuance to understand the issues with the Raptors, then IDK what to tell you. Next you are going to tell me that all the Knicks players are better than Lebron and AD simply due to team record, right?

The Raptors players are certainly better than their record:

1. Individually the Raptors smoke the Knicks in top end talent. The Raptors starting lineup is not a great fit (a non-shooter in Barnes, two average shooters in Siakam/OG, and 2 good shooters having horrible years from 3 in FVV/GTJ),

2. We have a very poor bench, and our best bench guys (Precious/Otto) have played a combined 29 games.

3. As we have little to no depth (not Siakam, Barnes, OG, etc. fault), when those guys miss times we are often stuck starting guys like Koloko, Juancho Hernangomez, Thad Young, etc. - aka guys who are not even rotation quality. This is very important when you consider that our top 7 (starters + Otto/Precious) have missed a combined 56 games (plus 37 from Otto). We simply just do not have the ability to withstand any injuries as most of our current youth just has been bad. Malachi Flynn shoots 36% on 2 point shots.

If you are going to retort with ReCoRd (which also ignores our 48 wins last year with the same 5 guys while NYK was at home watching the playoffs), then just do not bother responding please.

Telling me the Knicks sucked in the past doesn’t change that the Knicks are better than the Craptors now.

Considering none of the players on the Raptors are close to LeBron or AD’s level, don’t even know the point of even bringing them up.

As for why the Craptors suck, every team deals with injuries. They’re not even the team that has faced the most adversity when it comes to injuries.

Read on Twitter

Middle of the pack when it comes to games missed by injury. You’d think the whole team was out the way you are making excuses.

And the rotations? If there’s one thing very similar about Thibs and Nurse, they run a very short rotation. Knicks starters routinely run 35-40 min a game because of how bad the bench is.

Doesn’t matter what they did last year either. We’re talking about this year. 2 years ago, the Knicks were a top 4 seed with Randle leading the way and getting 2nd Team All-NBA. Doesn’t matter when speaking about this season.

Please someone explain to me why these players are so good on a sub .500 team? They have basically same record as the Craptors and are both way better then anyone the Craptors have

[canada_dry]

hes real good at getting hot headed and taking out the best player on his way out of the playoffs in a total loser move.

Heat MVP

If that happened to a more well liked player he would be eviscerated for it non F---ing stop

Your team has Joel Embiid who recklessly throws his 275 pound body at people constantly and is flailing around like he got shot.

Potentially ended his own teammates career due to his flopping

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

[YogurtProducer]

If the Knicks’ bench wasn’t absolutely horrific this year, you’d have a point there. Randle, Brunson and RJ have been playing 40+ min many times this season, especially recently because the bench is underwhelming.

And considering how flawed all those players are, I’m fine with the Knicks not trading for them. If they were truly worth what your management thought they were, they would’ve been traded by now. Rather deal with our flawed players that are leading us to a winning record.

This is a lot of talk from a fan of a team who has not won a playoff series in a decade

If you are incapable of using some nuance to understand the issues with the Raptors, then IDK what to tell you. Next you are going to tell me that all the Knicks players are better than Lebron and AD simply due to team record, right?

The Raptors players are certainly better than their record:

1. Individually the Raptors smoke the Knicks in top end talent. The Raptors starting lineup is not a great fit (a non-shooter in Barnes, two average shooters in Siakam/OG, and 2 good shooters having horrible years from 3 in FVV/GTJ),

2. We have a very poor bench, and our best bench guys (Precious/Otto) have played a combined 29 games.

3. As we have little to no depth (not Siakam, Barnes, OG, etc. fault), when those guys miss times we are often stuck starting guys like Koloko, Juancho Hernangomez, Thad Young, etc. - aka guys who are not even rotation quality. This is very important when you consider that our top 7 (starters + Otto/Precious) have missed a combined 56 games (plus 37 from Otto). We simply just do not have the ability to withstand any injuries as most of our current youth just has been bad. Malachi Flynn shoots 36% on 2 point shots.

If you are going to retort with ReCoRd (which also ignores our 48 wins last year with the same 5 guys while NYK was at home watching the playoffs), then just do not bother responding please.

Telling me the Knicks sucked in the past doesn’t change that the Knicks are better than the Craptors now.

Considering none of the players on the Raptors are close to LeBron or AD’s level, don’t even know the point of even bringing them up.

As for why the Craptors suck, every team deals with injuries. They’re not even the team that has faced the most adversity when it comes to injuries.

Read on Twitter

Middle of the pack when it comes to games missed by injury. You’d think the whole team was out the way you are making excuses.

And the rotations? If there’s one thing very similar about Thibs and Nurse, they run a very short rotation. Knicks starters routinely run 35-40 min a game because of how bad the bench is.

Doesn’t matter what they did last year either. We’re talking about this year. 2 years ago, the Knicks were a top 4 seed with Randle leading the way and getting 2nd Team All-NBA. Doesn’t matter when speaking about this season.

LBJ and AD are relevant - you keep bringing up record like it matters to evaluate individuals. So why is record important in TO but not in LA?

That graph ignores the fact that the Raptors have no depth and when players miss games our replacements are worse than most teams replacements. Not to mention the Raps circle is pretty big would you not say?

[Vampirate]

If Siakam is so good and OG is so good, and Barnes is so good, why are the Raps so mediocre?

Because they don't have a PG, center, or a bench. Pretty simple.

Raptors FO experimented by constructing a team full of 6'9 forward and the plan backfired terribly.

The team also lacks playmakers, reliable 3pt shooters, and shot creators (Siakam is the lone shot creator).

I saw a rumor that the Raps were interested in... whichever McDaniels is on the Hornets. It's like, try another position.

I do think that a lateral trade for a position of need could improve your team a lot.

It's ultimately not going to matter, we are a 1st round team at best.

Regardless of where you want to place the blame to the team just has too many issues. The fact that they are losing rather than hovering around .500 is actually a good thing as it might net them an impact player in the draft. The playin is the last thing the Raptors need.

[Capn'O]

Because they don't have a PG, center, or a bench. Pretty simple.

Raptors FO experimented by constructing a team full of 6'9 forward and the plan backfired terribly.

The team also lacks playmakers, reliable 3pt shooters, and shot creators (Siakam is the lone shot creator).

I saw a rumor that the Raps were interested in... whichever McDaniels is on the Hornets. It's like, try another position.

I do think that a lateral trade for a position of need could improve your team a lot.

It's ultimately not going to matter, we are a 1st round team at best.

Regardless of where you want to place the blame to the team just has too many issues. The fact that they are losing rather than hovering around .500 is actually a good thing as it might net them an impact player in the draft. The playin is the last thing the Raptors need.

Not necessarily in season.

[CanadianBacon15]

hes a 3rd or 4th option.

Randle is a bench player then.

[Johnny Bball]

No! He’s also a great defender, which isn’t shown in those stats. He a winning player.

How did this take so long to get posted. It should have been the second post.

[iLLmatic860]

hes a 3rd or 4th option.

Randle is a bench player then.

Randle def aint winning a chip as a 2nd option

[bronxknicksfan1]

This is a lot of talk from a fan of a team who has not won a playoff series in a decade

If you are incapable of using some nuance to understand the issues with the Raptors, then IDK what to tell you. Next you are going to tell me that all the Knicks players are better than Lebron and AD simply due to team record, right?

The Raptors players are certainly better than their record:

1. Individually the Raptors smoke the Knicks in top end talent. The Raptors starting lineup is not a great fit (a non-shooter in Barnes, two average shooters in Siakam/OG, and 2 good shooters having horrible years from 3 in FVV/GTJ),

2. We have a very poor bench, and our best bench guys (Precious/Otto) have played a combined 29 games.

3. As we have little to no depth (not Siakam, Barnes, OG, etc. fault), when those guys miss times we are often stuck starting guys like Koloko, Juancho Hernangomez, Thad Young, etc. - aka guys who are not even rotation quality. This is very important when you consider that our top 7 (starters + Otto/Precious) have missed a combined 56 games (plus 37 from Otto). We simply just do not have the ability to withstand any injuries as most of our current youth just has been bad. Malachi Flynn shoots 36% on 2 point shots.

If you are going to retort with ReCoRd (which also ignores our 48 wins last year with the same 5 guys while NYK was at home watching the playoffs), then just do not bother responding please.

Telling me the Knicks sucked in the past doesn’t change that the Knicks are better than the Craptors now.

Considering none of the players on the Raptors are close to LeBron or AD’s level, don’t even know the point of even bringing them up.

As for why the Craptors suck, every team deals with injuries. They’re not even the team that has faced the most adversity when it comes to injuries.

Read on Twitter

Middle of the pack when it comes to games missed by injury. You’d think the whole team was out the way you are making excuses.

And the rotations? If there’s one thing very similar about Thibs and Nurse, they run a very short rotation. Knicks starters routinely run 35-40 min a game because of how bad the bench is.

Doesn’t matter what they did last year either. We’re talking about this year. 2 years ago, the Knicks were a top 4 seed with Randle leading the way and getting 2nd Team All-NBA. Doesn’t matter when speaking about this season.

Please someone explain to me why these players are so good on a sub .500 team? They have basically same record as the Craptors and are both way better then anyone the Craptors have

I’ve never said Siakam was a bad player. I’ve only said that he’s on the same level as Randle and Brunson, which he is. Stats have been provided to prove that point already. Bringing up LeBron and AD, who don’t even have the talent on their roster that the Craptors have is irrelevant.

[bronxknicksfan1]

This is a lot of talk from a fan of a team who has not won a playoff series in a decade

If you are incapable of using some nuance to understand the issues with the Raptors, then IDK what to tell you. Next you are going to tell me that all the Knicks players are better than Lebron and AD simply due to team record, right?

The Raptors players are certainly better than their record:

1. Individually the Raptors smoke the Knicks in top end talent. The Raptors starting lineup is not a great fit (a non-shooter in Barnes, two average shooters in Siakam/OG, and 2 good shooters having horrible years from 3 in FVV/GTJ),

2. We have a very poor bench, and our best bench guys (Precious/Otto) have played a combined 29 games.

3. As we have little to no depth (not Siakam, Barnes, OG, etc. fault), when those guys miss times we are often stuck starting guys like Koloko, Juancho Hernangomez, Thad Young, etc. - aka guys who are not even rotation quality. This is very important when you consider that our top 7 (starters + Otto/Precious) have missed a combined 56 games (plus 37 from Otto). We simply just do not have the ability to withstand any injuries as most of our current youth just has been bad. Malachi Flynn shoots 36% on 2 point shots.

If you are going to retort with ReCoRd (which also ignores our 48 wins last year with the same 5 guys while NYK was at home watching the playoffs), then just do not bother responding please.

Telling me the Knicks sucked in the past doesn’t change that the Knicks are better than the Craptors now.

Considering none of the players on the Raptors are close to LeBron or AD’s level, don’t even know the point of even bringing them up.

As for why the Craptors suck, every team deals with injuries. They’re not even the team that has faced the most adversity when it comes to injuries.

Read on Twitter

Middle of the pack when it comes to games missed by injury. You’d think the whole team was out the way you are making excuses.

And the rotations? If there’s one thing very similar about Thibs and Nurse, they run a very short rotation. Knicks starters routinely run 35-40 min a game because of how bad the bench is.

Doesn’t matter what they did last year either. We’re talking about this year. 2 years ago, the Knicks were a top 4 seed with Randle leading the way and getting 2nd Team All-NBA. Doesn’t matter when speaking about this season.

LBJ and AD are relevant - you keep bringing up record like it matters to evaluate individuals. So why is record important in TO but not in LA?

That graph ignores the fact that the Raptors have no depth and when players miss games our replacements are worse than most teams replacements. Not to mention the Raps circle is pretty big would you not say?

Unless you believe Siakam is at the level of LeBron or AD, it’s an irrelevant point to make.

[YogurtProducer]

Telling me the Knicks sucked in the past doesn’t change that the Knicks are better than the Craptors now.

Considering none of the players on the Raptors are close to LeBron or AD’s level, don’t even know the point of even bringing them up.

As for why the Craptors suck, every team deals with injuries. They’re not even the team that has faced the most adversity when it comes to injuries.

Read on Twitter

Middle of the pack when it comes to games missed by injury. You’d think the whole team was out the way you are making excuses.

And the rotations? If there’s one thing very similar about Thibs and Nurse, they run a very short rotation. Knicks starters routinely run 35-40 min a game because of how bad the bench is.

Doesn’t matter what they did last year either. We’re talking about this year. 2 years ago, the Knicks were a top 4 seed with Randle leading the way and getting 2nd Team All-NBA. Doesn’t matter when speaking about this season.

LBJ and AD are relevant - you keep bringing up record like it matters to evaluate individuals. So why is record important in TO but not in LA?

That graph ignores the fact that the Raptors have no depth and when players miss games our replacements are worse than most teams replacements. Not to mention the Raps circle is pretty big would you not say?

Unless you believe Siakam is at the level of LeBron or AD, it’s an irrelevant point to make.

So if LBJ and AD are better than Siakam, how are their team records worse?

You see how horrid this argument is? That’s what you’re trying to do here.

[bronxknicksfan1]

LBJ and AD are relevant - you keep bringing up record like it matters to evaluate individuals. So why is record important in TO but not in LA?

That graph ignores the fact that the Raptors have no depth and when players miss games our replacements are worse than most teams replacements. Not to mention the Raps circle is pretty big would you not say?

Unless you believe Siakam is at the level of LeBron or AD, it’s an irrelevant point to make.

So if LBJ and AD are better than Siakam, how are their team records worse?

You see how horrid this argument is? That’s what you’re trying to do here.

Considering AD has only played 25 games and the Lakers have much more games missed due to injury while having even less talent than the Raptors…

Also, record wasn’t the only thing used to evaluate players discussed. Metrics were as well. You’re just nitpicking this part to make a point.

[VanWest82]

Pascal Siakam net on/off:

18/19: +14.4
19/20: +6.2
20/21: +8.6
21/22: +6.6
22/23: +5.7

Raptors are dependent on this guy so they don't suck. Maybe if OPer and a bunch of the trolls itt depended on Pascal a little more, their takes wouldn't suck so much.

[Feed Your Head]

This is a silly thread.

[dickfox]

Since you have given us zero context, I am going to say NO.

He's been the best or one of the best players on successful regular season teams and playoff teams, including a championship team.

Empty-stats-bad-team-guys are usually on bad teams every year, such as DeMarcus Cousins. All-NBA numbers but no success.

Pascal Siakam is an all-around talent and just because the Raptors are not in the top 6 of the east right now, it doesn't mean he's an empty stats guy.

The Raptors have a predictable offense and no interior defense. Not Pascal's fault. Masai and Nurse should get the blame on how thin the roster is constructed and how they run their offense.