The OFFICIAL rookie impressions thread pt.III

[Shem]

You should hardly be quick to call anyone a homer guy.

Oh, I get it. Just because I defend Lillard from guys who are trying to make this rookie season look like it's nothing special is being a homer. Meanwhile we have these Davis homers come on here and even Beal, Drummond, and Waiters homers come on here throughout the season and try to make their rookie look better and at times make a case why their rookie should win if only they got the minutes, or they're not healthy, but then passive aggressively say that Lillard is the ROY, but word in a way that he really doesn't deserve it isn't being a homer. Gotcha!

[mopper8]

You have zero credibility if you can't look at those stats and admit that Evans had nearly identical point/assist production to Lillard. Take the homer goggles off.

Oh, so is that what Hoops Nation is doing as well for example?

http://www.hoops-nation.com/damian-lill ... -team-usa/

Damian Lillard, the first NBA player since LeBron James to record 1,000 points and 300 assists in their first 55 career games, is being considered for Team USA’s basketball team.

Or even Dime Magazine? So when data like that is released and you don't see Evan's name there, what do you expect people to think when they're using those references like I was doing. You make it sound like I deliberately blew it off.

But obviously Evans didn't put that type of production through 55 games or any other game totals that have been mentioned throughout the year as this isn't the first time this sort of comparison has happened or wouldn't his name be mentioned as well?

Through 55 games Evans had over 1100 points and 297 assists Or, in other words, Evans got to those marks in 56 games instead of 55.

Get over it dude.

[DeBlazerRiddem]

Unfortunately this will probably get buried/passed over, but what some people seem to be forgetting:

- Not all Blazer fans are on the same page: I like Lillard and I will describe why in a second, but I don't think what he is doing puts him in elite PG company. In fact, I haven't see any Blazer fan put him in that elite company except as a comparison between rookie seasons. The thing is, I think Irving is a lock to have a better career than Lillard and I think for his career Lillard will have trouble differentiating himself from Curry/Holiday. So when you criticize Blazer fans nebulously, try and remember my opinion that you are lumping in there.

- Almost all of the comparisons have come from other rookie seasons. There has been surprisingly little projection in those comparisons, no one is has said or is saying that Lillard has the same potential of LeBron, Jordan or Oscar. I have said this several times, and fans of other teams have not seemed to understand: What Lillard is doing is not impressive in terms of a stats-per-minute metric - what is impressive was his ability to step in and immediately play like a veteran - to assume the role of primary playmaker and offensive 1b option. There was very little learning curve unlike most rookies. His strength isn't his advanced stats, his strength is his NBA readiness and his ability to deliver in 36 minutes what most people can only extrapolate for other rookies. He isn't the intangible promise of delivering 18/6 in 36 minutes, he actually produces it, he puts his money where his mouth is and that is why is he a run-away ROY.

- No one knows how Lillard is going to develop. Some of the more optimistic Blazer fans might say he will continue to improve in tangible statistical ways. Some of the less optimistic Blazer fans might think he will improve but in less tangible ways - I might even hazard a guess that his scoring and usage goes down if the Blazers ever find the right 6th man. I think what everyone can agree on is that Lillard has a solid start in this league, and while he might not ever make huge strides forward, he obviously isn't going to be a bust either. You absolutely cannot hate him for being one of the most ready to contribute rookies in the last 10 years, but you also cannot take away from those comparisons that he will be as good as the other top notch rookies. Also you cannot fault a fan for maintaining he could be, but don't make the mistake of thinking all Blazer fans think there is a good chance he could be.

[Copperhead]

You should hardly be quick to call anyone a homer guy.

Oh, I get it. Just because I defend Lillard from guys who are trying to make this rookie season look like it's nothing special is being a homer. Meanwhile we have these Davis homers come on here and even Beal, Drummond, and Waiters homers come on here throughout the season and try to make their rookie look better and at times make a case why their rookie should win if only they got the minutes, or they're not healthy, but then passive aggressively say that Lillard is the ROY, but word in a way that he really doesn't deserve it isn't being a homer. Gotcha!

No, not at all. The thing that makes you look like a homer is when others say things about their rookies and you downplay what other rookies are doing. We know Lillard is good and we know he's ROY. You accuse people of doing what you do. I knew there was a reason I don't frequent this thread. If other fans think their rookies are playing well and think they should be ROY, let them think it. We know it won't happen but you can't tell people how to feel or what to think. I'm certainly not making a case for anyone else to be ROY other than Lillard. We know no one else will be ROY. It's just hilarious though at how spitting mad you get when other people mention anyone other than Damian Lillard. We know you love Lillard bruh.

[JungleCat022]

You should hardly be quick to call anyone a homer guy.

Oh, I get it. Just because I defend Lillard from guys who are trying to make this rookie season look like it's nothing special is being a homer. Meanwhile we have these Davis homers come on here and even Beal, Drummond, and Waiters homers come on here throughout the season and try to make their rookie look better and at times make a case why their rookie should win if only they got the minutes, or they're not healthy, but then passive aggressively say that Lillard is the ROY, but word in a way that he really doesn't deserve it isn't being a homer. Gotcha!

Show me the Waiters homers, please. No one has come on here saying anything more than he had a good game or posting his stats.

[Hendrix]

I have no clue what you are referring to with Jordan. Maybe try reading the last few pages where Lillard was put on short lists with Jordan, and a Blazer fan said Lillard had a comparable season to Jordan.

I have read what happened and it's you who has been obsessing with Jordan like people are trying to bring him into the conversation and they're not while others have been trying to compare Lillard's rookie season to other NBA point guards and Lillard having a season where a player in their rookie season.

The only exception is LeBron James because it hasn't been since LeBron that Lillard is doing in terms of scoring and assists. Granted LeBron doing it at 19 is massively impressive and that he's not a point guard, but the fact that it's been 9 years since somebody is doing it now, that namely Lillard is also impressive since no other player let alone a point guard in that time has done what Lillard is doing now this season in that 9 year period.

While you didn't originally bring up that Lillard isn't exactly common argument, you sure have been the one to defend it as if you should have been the one who said it by downplaying Lillard's accomplishments like they're not a big deal.

I honestly have no idea what the hell you are talking about. I didn't put him on a short list with MJ, Iverson, LBJ. That was other people, and other people saying he had comparable rookie seasons to them.

Tbh, while I think you have lost your mind, I have quite clearly lost my mind as well if I am sitting here arguing with extreme homers. I don't know why I bothered. I should have learned my lesson arguing with Andrea Bargnani homers back in the day, but I don't seem to learn.

Carry on with your extreme defense anytime someone comes along that isn't willing to put Lillard up there with the all time greats.

[j_angel]

This statistic is interesting though. Both rookie years and both show per 36.

Lillard: 17.8 - 6.1 - 3.0 with 0.9 steal.
Player B: 17.1 - 6.3 - 3.8 with 1.4 steal.
Turnovers also close with 2.8 to Lillard and 2.7 to the other player.

Lillard had a much higher shooting percentage though, .55 TS compared to .475. Although player B was a better 3 point shooter.

Lillard was 22 in the July before his rookie year started.
Player B was 20 in the September of his rookie year.

btw Player B was Brandon Jennings.

Lillards stats are closer to Jennings than any of these great players. That seems to be ignored here.

[King d]

This statistic is interesting though. Both rookie years and both show per 36.

Lillard: 17.8 - 6.1 - 3.0 with 0.9 steal.
Player B: 17.1 - 6.3 - 3.8 with 1.4 steal.
Turnovers also close with 2.8 to Lillard and 2.7 to the other player.

Lillard had a much higher shooting percentage though, .55 TS compared to .475. Although player B was a better 3 point shooter.

Lillard was 22 in the July before his rookie year started.
Player B was 20 in the September of his rookie year.

btw Player B was Brandon Jennings.

Lillards stats are closer to Jennings than any of these great players. That seems to be ignored here.

Why do you use the useless per 36 stats? We are talking about raw stats here.

Lillard - 19.1 ppg, 3.2 rpg 6.5 assists 43%fg

Lebron - 20.9 ppg 5.5 rpg 5.9 assists 41%fg

Jennings - 15.5 ppg 3.4 rpg 5.8 asist 37% fg

Sorry but LIllard's rookie numbers look more closer to LeBron than Jennings, stop embarrassing yourself and deal with it please

[kidleader]

and three years later jennings is still a chucker and sucks. so much for age and upside

[King d]

and three years later jennings is still a chucker and sucks. so much for age and upside

Yeah, that's why I find funny when 90% of the times a random poster assumes one player is going to be better than other because he is a 19 year old rookie and the other one is 22.

It's not about age, it's about hard working and having your head in your shoulders, both things jennings seems to lack

[monopoman]

This statistic is interesting though. Both rookie years and both show per 36.

Lillard: 17.8 - 6.1 - 3.0 with 0.9 steal.
Player B: 17.1 - 6.3 - 3.8 with 1.4 steal.
Turnovers also close with 2.8 to Lillard and 2.7 to the other player.

Lillard had a much higher shooting percentage though, .55 TS compared to .475. Although player B was a better 3 point shooter.

Lillard was 22 in the July before his rookie year started.
Player B was 20 in the September of his rookie year.

btw Player B was Brandon Jennings.

Lillards stats are closer to Jennings than any of these great players. That seems to be ignored here.

Why do you use the useless per 36 stats? We are talking about raw stats here.

Lillard - 19.1 ppg, 3.2 rpg 6.5 assists 43%fg

Lebron - 20.9 ppg 5.5 rpg 5.9 assists 41%fg

Jennings - 15.5 ppg 3.4 rpg 5.8 asist 37% fg

Sorry but LIllard's rookie numbers look more closer to LeBron than Jennings, stop embarrassing yourself and deal with it please

Nah man everyone knows per 36 is how the whole league evaluates talent. The next MVP will be based on per 36. I hear guys that are amazing in 5-10 MPG will win it easily. We all know playing 5 MPG is the same as playing 36!

I think per 36 will become a useful metric when we have this game played by androids that can play at 100% optimum levels for a full game with ease.

[Shem]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQmCg5Rjpdo[/youtube]

[Shem]

Lillard with 19 points, 6 assists against the Thunder at @OKC on 7-16 shooting and 4-9 from 3-point range. Lillard has 12 games left to hit 5 three-pointers in order to tie Stephen Curry's rookie record.

[King d]

Lillard has 12 games left to hit 5 three-pointers in order to tie Stephen Curry's rookie record.

Stop throwing those arbitrary stats dude , you are pissing off the haters

[Jsun947]

Nobody was comparing Lillard to ANY all time greats. I simply made a list of rookie guards that averaged more points than he did. That is all. You are the one trying to make more out of it.

[Waynearchetype]

Is there usually this much hate for a ROY front runner? I realize most people who follow the draft and rookies are looking for a young generational talent, but those only come once in a generation. Whats so bad about Lillard? He might not be LeBron, MJ, or hell even Kyrie Irving, but he's a damn fine player. People act like his age is a cause for concern, but he's only slightly older than Wade and Brandon Roy their first years, and both still had plenty of growth after their first year in the league. Is it because he was from a small school and people just assume he should be bad because of that?

Personally I think his story is unique and interesting. He's a great guy, super humble. His work ethic is amazing, as we saw not only in his pre-draft videos but also his ability to go from un-recruited to ROY in 4 years time. If anything, his time spent with pro training should only make him better, and he is a great underdog story to root for.

[Mister Ze]

What Lillard and Holiday both have in common is that they're both 22 but when you look at the differences you'll understand that Lillard will be an absolute stud compared to him.

Player A: 19 points 9 assists, 4 rebounds 2 steals 45% FG 37% 3pt

Player B: 19 points 7 assists, 3 rebounds, 1 steal, 43% FG, 37% 3pt

Holiday has played 4 seasons and steadily adjusted to the NBA which is why he's having a breakout season. Lillard is only in his first year and putting up Holiday like numbers while adjusting to the NBA. It's obviously unfair to compare Holidays rookie season to Lillards current season but Lillard absolutely destroys him in that category. IMO Lillard will become a top 5 PG in 2-3 years with Kyrie, Paul, Rondo, Westbrook, and maybe Rose depending on his condition.

[orangeparka]

Holiday's quite overrated IMO. I don't see becoming a top 5 PG. Not enough improvement over the past four years.

Lillard could get there, who knows? He has such a lethal jumper and he's not inept at drawing fouls/finishing (which is something many good shooters suffer from), so at worst I see him as like a Steph Curry-lite. No doubt his improvement next season will be telling.

On a side note, no one's really hating on Lillard though. It's just that one little troll post or something slightly against him and like 5-6 different posters will come to his defense, it can be a little annoying to non-Blazer fans.

[ComboGuardCity]

What Lillard and Holiday both have in common is that they're both 22 but when you look at the differences you'll understand that Lillard will be an absolute stud compared to him.

Player A: 19 points 9 assists, 4 rebounds 2 steals 45% FG 37% 3pt

Player B: 19 points 7 assists, 3 rebounds, 1 steal, 43% FG, 37% 3pt

Holiday has played 4 seasons and steadily adjusted to the NBA which is why he's having a breakout season. Lillard is only in his first year and putting up Holiday like numbers while adjusting to the NBA. It's obviously unfair to compare Holidays rookie season to Lillards current season but Lillard absolutely destroys him in that category. IMO Lillard will become a top 5 PG in 2-3 years with Kyrie, Paul, Rondo, Westbrook, and maybe Rose depending on his condition.

Not to discount Lillard, but Holiday is an excellent defender as well.

[Jsun947]

I don't remember there ever being as many good point guards in the league as right now. The list goes forever. It went from one of the hardest positions to fill to being absolutely stacked.