Ant-Man is it

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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#141 » by Ambrose » Mon Feb 1, 2021 5:20 pm

Quentin wrote:A lot of crow will be eaten in this thread. Last night showed how good this kid is going to be....despite having to overcome the Timberwolves organization. I was wowed.


Highly unlikely. A three game hot streak from deep isn't indicative of his actual ability.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#142 » by bisme37 » Mon Feb 1, 2021 5:21 pm

I love how there are 8 pages here full of people acting like they watch Timberwolves games.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#143 » by AbeVigodaLive » Mon Feb 1, 2021 5:28 pm

Quentin wrote:A lot of crow will be eaten in this thread. Last night showed how good this kid is going to be....despite having to overcome the Timberwolves organization. I was wowed.



Easily his best game of the season because he did more than score in volume.

Efficiency.
Rebounding was decent.
Passing was decent.
Forced fewer shots.

It's an anomaly so far. Time will tell if it becomes the norm.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#144 » by FinnTheHuman » Mon Feb 1, 2021 5:31 pm

Ambrose wrote:
Quentin wrote:A lot of crow will be eaten in this thread. Last night showed how good this kid is going to be....despite having to overcome the Timberwolves organization. I was wowed.


Highly unlikely. A three game hot streak from deep isn't indicative of his actual ability.


Has very little to do with a three game hot streak from deep. How about you watch the Wolves games before giving your opinion?

bisme37 wrote:I love how there are 8 pages here full of people acting like they watch Timberwolves games.


Lots of :clown: in this thread, can't wait to quote them all at some point in the future when Ant becomes a star.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#145 » by FNQ » Mon Feb 1, 2021 5:37 pm

AbeVigodaLive wrote:
Quentin wrote:A lot of crow will be eaten in this thread. Last night showed how good this kid is going to be....despite having to overcome the Timberwolves organization. I was wowed.



Easily his best game of the season because he did more than score in volume.

Efficiency.
Rebounding was decent.
Passing was decent.
Forced fewer shots.

It's an anomaly so far. Time will tell if it becomes the norm.


Yup, this was the guy the Wolves hope they drafted. He tried more than scoring and it looked good. Being truthful, first time I was impressed with him all season as a player in the lens of being a top draft pick
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#146 » by FinnTheHuman » Mon Feb 1, 2021 5:40 pm

FNQ wrote:
AbeVigodaLive wrote:
Quentin wrote:A lot of crow will be eaten in this thread. Last night showed how good this kid is going to be....despite having to overcome the Timberwolves organization. I was wowed.



Easily his best game of the season because he did more than score in volume.

Efficiency.
Rebounding was decent.
Passing was decent.
Forced fewer shots.

It's an anomaly so far. Time will tell if it becomes the norm.


Yup, this was the guy the Wolves hope they drafted. He tried more than scoring and it looked good. Being truthful, first time I was impressed with him all season as a player in the lens of being a top draft pick


He's always been looking this way, except he hit more shots than before and refrained from 4 to 5 low percentage shots he usually takes from isolation out of desperation. This is nothing surprising, he's always been at least decent in pretty much every aspect of the game.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#147 » by Quentin » Mon Feb 1, 2021 5:45 pm

Apparently he was the youngest player to ever start a game for the Timberwolves.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#148 » by AbeVigodaLive » Mon Feb 1, 2021 6:01 pm

FinnTheHuman wrote:
FNQ wrote:
AbeVigodaLive wrote:

Easily his best game of the season because he did more than score in volume.

Efficiency.
Rebounding was decent.
Passing was decent.
Forced fewer shots.

It's an anomaly so far. Time will tell if it becomes the norm.


Yup, this was the guy the Wolves hope they drafted. He tried more than scoring and it looked good. Being truthful, first time I was impressed with him all season as a player in the lens of being a top draft pick


He's always been looking this way, except he hit more shots than before and refrained from 4 to 5 low percentage shots he usually takes from isolation out of desperation. This is nothing surprising, he's always been at least decent in pretty much every aspect of the game.




Not entirely sure what you're trying here... but that's objectively false.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#149 » by FinnTheHuman » Mon Feb 1, 2021 6:22 pm

AbeVigodaLive wrote:
FinnTheHuman wrote:
FNQ wrote:
Yup, this was the guy the Wolves hope they drafted. He tried more than scoring and it looked good. Being truthful, first time I was impressed with him all season as a player in the lens of being a top draft pick


He's always been looking this way, except he hit more shots than before and refrained from 4 to 5 low percentage shots he usually takes from isolation out of desperation. This is nothing surprising, he's always been at least decent in pretty much every aspect of the game.




Not entirely sure what you're trying here... but that's objectively false.


What's objectively true is that he was missing shots and making rookie mistakes on defense, and everything else he was doing was always fine, except for playing off ball which is a systemic problem and a 19 year old rookie playing on a team for a month with so many different lineups can't be blamed for that.

Defense has to do with the short training camp, youth, inexperience etc, while shooting had to do with inexperience, poor Wolves offense and poor luck, it was simply a cold streak. You could see the shooting form's always been there, drive game's always been there, you could see the man on man defense, rebounding, passing have all been there. He's also been good at getting open for the 3-ball off ball.

If your shot isn't falling at all and you don't play great defense, you are gonna have a very negative impact on your team, but that doesn't mean your potential is low, you can look like a great prospect while greatly contributing to losses at the same time, which is exactly what Ant's been doing. And now that his shot's falling, he's suddenly a plus player for 3 games as a 19 year old.

Your overall negativity about Wolves' position as a franchise in the NBA, while justified, is clouding your perception of Ant's talents, that's what I'm seeing in your posts.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#150 » by cupcakesnake » Mon Feb 1, 2021 6:44 pm

bisme37 wrote:I love how there are 8 pages here full of people acting like they watch Timberwolves games.


This is always what's the most special about every T-Wolves thread. :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#151 » by AbeVigodaLive » Mon Feb 1, 2021 6:45 pm

FinnTheHuman wrote:
AbeVigodaLive wrote:
FinnTheHuman wrote:
He's always been looking this way, except he hit more shots than before and refrained from 4 to 5 low percentage shots he usually takes from isolation out of desperation. This is nothing surprising, he's always been at least decent in pretty much every aspect of the game.




Not entirely sure what you're trying here... but that's objectively false.


What's objectively true is that he was missing shots and making rookie mistakes on defense, and everything else he was doing was always fine, except for playing off ball which is a systemic problem and a 19 year old rookie playing on a team for a month with so many different lineups can't be blamed for that.

Defense has to do with the short training camp, youth, inexperience etc, while shooting had to do with inexperience, poor Wolves offense and poor luck, it was simply a cold streak. You could see the shooting form's always been there, drive game's always been there, you could see the man on man defense, rebounding, passing have all been there. He's also been good at getting open for the 3-ball off ball.

If your shot isn't falling at all and you don't play great defense, you are gonna have a very negative impact on your team, but that doesn't mean your potential is low, you can look like a great prospect while greatly contributing to losses at the same time, which is exactly what Ant's been doing. And now that his shot's falling, he's suddenly a plus player for 3 games as a 19 year old.

Your overall negativity about Wolves' position as a franchise in the NBA, while justified, is clouding your perception of Ant's talents, that's what I'm seeing in your posts.




I've never dismissed his talents.

I'm merely dismissing your inaccurate claims that he has "been at least decent in pretty much every aspect of the game."

Again... you make a lot of excuses. But it's an objectively false statement any way you try to spin it. Let's hope yesterday becomes more of the norm and your grandiose claims can be rooted in reality. And Wolves fans can rejoice.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#152 » by FNQ » Mon Feb 1, 2021 6:49 pm

AbeVigodaLive wrote:
FinnTheHuman wrote:
FNQ wrote:
Yup, this was the guy the Wolves hope they drafted. He tried more than scoring and it looked good. Being truthful, first time I was impressed with him all season as a player in the lens of being a top draft pick


He's always been looking this way, except he hit more shots than before and refrained from 4 to 5 low percentage shots he usually takes from isolation out of desperation. This is nothing surprising, he's always been at least decent in pretty much every aspect of the game.




Not entirely sure what you're trying here... but that's objectively false.


Yeah.. I've watched quite a few Wolves games this year (in chunks, not watching the whole thing) and I definitely dont feel like he's decent in every aspect of the game. Maybe relative to him being a raw prospect? The playmaking and rebounding especially. Shooting/scoring I'm not that worried about, but everything else, felt like he needed a lot of work. But like I said, watching him against CLE, that looked very different to me, and definite reasons for optimism going forward. I didnt see last 2 so I can't really speak to those 2, if it was an incremental climb the past 3 games or if it just came outta nowhere
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#153 » by FinnTheHuman » Mon Feb 1, 2021 6:59 pm

FNQ wrote:
AbeVigodaLive wrote:
FinnTheHuman wrote:
He's always been looking this way, except he hit more shots than before and refrained from 4 to 5 low percentage shots he usually takes from isolation out of desperation. This is nothing surprising, he's always been at least decent in pretty much every aspect of the game.




Not entirely sure what you're trying here... but that's objectively false.


Yeah.. I've watched quite a few Wolves games this year (in chunks, not watching the whole thing) and I definitely dont feel like he's decent in every aspect of the game. Maybe relative to him being a raw prospect? The playmaking and rebounding especially. Shooting/scoring I'm not that worried about, but everything else, felt like he needed a lot of work. But like I said, watching him against CLE, that looked very different to me, and definite reasons for optimism going forward. I didnt see last 2 so I can't really speak to those 2, if it was an incremental climb the past 3 games or if it just came outta nowhere


His passing is what's been the brightest aspect of his game during his slump, the fact that you're saying that his playmaking especially worried you is what reveals that you haven't been watching, which is expected of a non-Wolves fan, but then it is also expected to listen to the Wolves fans on this matter instead of sharing uninformed opinions.

Literally every game thread and every post-match analysis on the Wolves board during Ant's cold shooting streak pointed out his passing as the silver lining in the whole mess, so you don't have to believe me, just go and check those threads. Reading the defense and reacting appropriately has been his most consistent skill so far, and it's probably the best proof that his bbiq is pretty high, and bbiq is the best indicator of the ability to improve.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#154 » by Big J » Mon Feb 1, 2021 7:01 pm

The biggest problem with him is that he is a low IQ guy. That maxes him out at like a rich mans Waiters.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#155 » by FNQ » Mon Feb 1, 2021 7:06 pm

FinnTheHuman wrote:
His passing is what's been the brightest aspect of his game during his slump, the fact that you're saying that his playmaking especially worried you is what reveals that you haven't been watching, which is expected of a non-Wolves fan, but then it is also expected to listen to the Wolves fans on this matter instead of sharing uninformed opinions.


I get that "you dont watch" is a great, all-encompassing comeback, but I've been watching, commenting on specific games (league pass plus quarantine really is a good motivator), and I really have no skin in the game because I liked Edwards as a prospect:
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=2032776

Funny that my opinion lines up with other Wolves fans but my opinion's uninformed, I guess its not as ironclad as you think it is.. anyways moving on past that defensiveness, for the amount the guy drives and the amount of drive/kick options he leaves on the table, for all his pausing and surveying when he gets the ball.. he does not create much. It looked different against the Cavs, it looked better.

The passing game being his 'brightest aspect' during a slump is more a grasping at straws thing than anything, because boy was he bad early on. Was clearly forcing it and trying to live up to #1 pick status, when really he seemed to be way more at ease vs CLE and was a much, much better player
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#156 » by FNQ » Mon Feb 1, 2021 7:10 pm

Big J wrote:The biggest problem with him is that he is a low IQ guy. That maxes him out at like a rich mans Waiters.


Nah he's not nearly that bad. He's not even close to a guy like Oubre who has 0 peripheral vision. Edwards just cant see the game unfold before it does, which isn't uncommon for a 19 year old jumping into NBA speed, but I'd stop well short of calling him an average passer even.

There was one play, I think it was against the Jazz, where he led a fast break beautifully and I was starstruck for a second (I think on Gobert as well).. Dion Waiters does not make that play in his dreams.. the kid has a debatable BBIQ but he's not a low IQ guy for sure, just as sure as he's not a high IQ one either. Way too early to determine if its him catching up to NBA speed or a flaw in the game
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#157 » by SAKURABA216 » Mon Feb 1, 2021 7:23 pm

Timberwolves have to be one of the unluckiest teams in any sport. It always seems like they end up with one of the few high lottery picks that is an actual bum and can't play. It's not like its their duty to develop these guys and put them in the best position possible to succeed or anything like that lol.

Seriously, Curry must be one of the luckiest players ever as he dodged 2 bullets on draft night and could have easily been drafted by the T'Wolves instead of Rubio and Flynn. At some point it has to be the organization's fault for not being able to develop some of the top draft picks they've been blessed with getting over the years. These guys couldn't all be bums, could they? I badly wanted Ant-man on the Warriors and I still think he could be an exceptional player, but even if the T'Wolves drafted Wiseman instead its not like he would have anyone there to mentor him and teach him early to avoid developing bad habits that could ruin his game and set his career back.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#158 » by Ckay » Mon Feb 1, 2021 7:26 pm

SAKURABA216 wrote:Timberwolves have to be one of the unluckiest teams in any sport. It always seems like they end up with one of the few high lottery picks that is an actual bum and can't play. It's not like its their duty to develop these guys and put them in the best position possible to succeed or anything like that lol.

Seriously, Curry must be one of the luckiest players ever as he dodged 2 bullets on draft night and could have easily been drafted by the T'Wolves instead of Rubio and Flynn. At some point it has to be the organization's fault for not being able to develop some of the top draft picks they've been blessed with getting over the years. These guys couldn't all be bums, could they? I badly wanted Ant-man on the Warriors and I still think he could be an exceptional player, but even if the T'Wolves drafted Wiseman instead its not like he would have anyone there to mentor him and teach him early to avoid developing bad habits that could ruin his game and set his career back.

Curry wanted to go to the Knicks.
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#159 » by FNQ » Mon Feb 1, 2021 7:37 pm

Ckay wrote:
SAKURABA216 wrote:Timberwolves have to be one of the unluckiest teams in any sport. It always seems like they end up with one of the few high lottery picks that is an actual bum and can't play. It's not like its their duty to develop these guys and put them in the best position possible to succeed or anything like that lol.

Seriously, Curry must be one of the luckiest players ever as he dodged 2 bullets on draft night and could have easily been drafted by the T'Wolves instead of Rubio and Flynn. At some point it has to be the organization's fault for not being able to develop some of the top draft picks they've been blessed with getting over the years. These guys couldn't all be bums, could they? I badly wanted Ant-man on the Warriors and I still think he could be an exceptional player, but even if the T'Wolves drafted Wiseman instead its not like he would have anyone there to mentor him and teach him early to avoid developing bad habits that could ruin his game and set his career back.

Curry wanted to go to the Knicks.

Not really (put in spoiler because its OT):
Spoiler:
According to Dell, they wanted to go to PHX, because both they and PHX thought that there was a deal with the Warriors ready to be made. The deal was tentative for the Suns, though the Warriors didnt know why. And the Warriors weren't ironclad on the deal either, but didnt indicate to the Suns that there were scenarios where they'd back out.

Both teams were waiting on the same qualifier: Steph Curry

Dell Curry told the Wolves not to draft Steph, and they obliged. But the Warriors - who were also told not to draft Steph by Dell - ignored that, and drafted him

The Curry to NY narrative seemed to be more media driven than anything. The aftermath showed that the Suns were the Currys' preferred destination, and the the chagrin on his face was because the preferred destination was so close (PHX) yet was taken from him at the last second


But this has nothing to do w/Ant and I really doubt that JW proves to be a Curry that the Wolves passed on. I dont think Ant goes #1 in a redraft but this isn't a Flynn/Curry situation, and the Wolves are just a KAT defensive complement away from being a good team. Been saying that for a while but this whole Wiggins scenario has really cemented that belief to me. And that's something that Ant can't overcome by himself
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Re: Ant-Man ain't it 

Post#160 » by AbeVigodaLive » Mon Feb 1, 2021 7:38 pm

FinnTheHuman wrote:
FNQ wrote:
AbeVigodaLive wrote:


Not entirely sure what you're trying here... but that's objectively false.


Yeah.. I've watched quite a few Wolves games this year (in chunks, not watching the whole thing) and I definitely dont feel like he's decent in every aspect of the game. Maybe relative to him being a raw prospect? The playmaking and rebounding especially. Shooting/scoring I'm not that worried about, but everything else, felt like he needed a lot of work. But like I said, watching him against CLE, that looked very different to me, and definite reasons for optimism going forward. I didnt see last 2 so I can't really speak to those 2, if it was an incremental climb the past 3 games or if it just came outta nowhere


His passing is what's been the brightest aspect of his game during his slump, the fact that you're saying that his playmaking especially worried you is what reveals that you haven't been watching, which is expected of a non-Wolves fan, but then it is also expected to listen to the Wolves fans on this matter instead of sharing uninformed opinions.

Literally every game thread and every post-match analysis on the Wolves board during Ant's cold shooting streak pointed out his passing as the silver lining in the whole mess, so you don't have to believe me, just go and check those threads. Reading the defense and reacting appropriately has been his most consistent skill so far, and it's probably the best proof that his bbiq is pretty high, and bbiq is the best indicator of the ability to improve.




Again... I disagree.

Edwards has had some next-level passing moments... but those have been blips. In fact, after an early four-assist performance where Edwards made some shockingly clever passes, Saunders went out of his way to mention his passing publicly.

Edwards proceeded to take 40 shots over the next two games (15 - 40 fg) with only 2 assists.

Most NBA players can pass to some degree. Some can pass better than others. Some are athletic enough to put themselves and teammates in great spots for those passes.

But they have to be willing to actually pass. There have been moments where Edwards seemed very unwilling to share the ball. In fact, he had a negative TO/A ratio until last night.

Again, maybe last night is more the norm than the anomaly. Only time will tell.

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