who can beat the suns?

[falcolombardi]

That is a singular instance. Its not a pattern, therefore more unlikely it wouldve happened again. Either way, not here to argue with people about that bucks nets series, ive done that plenty. I hope they matchup both healthy this year. Nets are the team to beat imo, and i think they beat phoenix in the finals.

also happened in 2019 bucks vs raptors

is not common to come back down 0-2 without hca

but if you change the question to "how many teams won a series they tied 2-2 after being down 0-2 without hca" i would imagine is not that lopsided

and bucks were likely tying the series in game 4

Big deal. You have to win 4 out of 5 after you go down 2-0. Your citing of 2 specific examples of 0-2 comebackss does nothing for your argument.

Why do i say its likely the Nets close out that series? In the 435 NBA playoff series where a team had a 2-0 lead, that team won the series 404 times, or 92.9% of the time. The team down 0-2 had come back to win 31 times, or 7.1%. Plus, again, that game 2 was a 39 point blowout! Sorry, Bucks fans, but it was extremely likely the Nets wouldve bounced them had Kyrie stayed healthy, based on NBA history and what they showed prior to his injury.

that is not how those stats work

let me ask you this, a series starts 2-0 (90% win probability) but it ends 3-3

is it still 90% win probabibity?

what you are saying is that bucks winning game 3 didnt inprove their odds or winning game wouldnt have improved their odds cause they started 0-2

win probability changes with each game

is different at 1-0 than 2-0 than 2-1 than 3-1 etc

[Pachinko_]

I don’t see much comparisons between a Bucks teams who flamed out early and a Suns team who lost the Finals. Bucks didn’t win until they shored up a weakness by bringing in Holiday. Suns have been addressing all year weaknesses they had last year.Depth, size, player progression. Doing that helped them to easily take and keep the top spot all year.

The experience of being one of the biggest target to other teams most of the year is invaluable.

And yet the Bucks were winning more regular season games without Holiday than with him.

That's the whole point: the Bucks also looked great before the playoffs, best record in the League, and looked like they had addressed their weaknesses by adding Bledsoe and Mirotic, and yet both of them were horrible in the playoffs. You don't really know if you have actually addressed your weaknesses until the big games start. And all that people have to go by to see if you've done that is last year's playoffs, because they know the regular season is becoming more and more a big joke really. Bucks were facing exactly the same attitude from media and fans as the Suns are facing now, people were suspicious until the saw them go all the way. It's just how it is: you gotta prove it, and regular season proves nothing. Bucks have been there done that now it's the Suns turn.

By the way those Bucks did not flame out. They got to the ECF and lost a tight series exactly the same way the Suns lost to the Bucks: Up 2-0 with HCA advantage, and then 0-4. Against an eventual champion Raptors team that was behind us all year in the standings.

I hope you see the similarities now. What does it all mean?
That it might be the Suns turn or it might not, only one way to find out

[spanishninja]

I don’t see much comparisons between a Bucks teams who flamed out early and a Suns team who lost the Finals. Bucks didn’t win until they shored up a weakness by bringing in Holiday. Suns have been addressing all year weaknesses they had last year.Depth, size, player progression. Doing that helped them to easily take and keep the top spot all year.

The experience of being one of the biggest target to other teams most of the year is invaluable.

And yet the Bucks were winning more regular season games without Holiday than with him.

That's the whole point: the Bucks also looked great before the playoffs, best record in the League, and looked like they had addressed their weaknesses by adding Bledsoe and Mirotic, and yet both of them were horrible in the playoffs. You don't really know if you have actually addressed your weaknesses until the big games start. And all that people have to go by to see if you've done that is last year's playoffs, because they know the regular season is becoming more and more a big joke really. Bucks were facing exactly the same attitude from media and fans as the Suns are facing now, people were just not suspicious until the saw them go all the way. It's just how it is: you gotta prove it, and regular season proves nothing. Bucks have been there done that now it's your turn.

By the way those Bucks did not flame out. They got to the ECF and lost a tight series exactly the same way the Suns lost to the Bucks: Up 2-0 with HCA advantage, and then 0-4. Against an eventual champion Raptors team that was behind us all year in the standings.

I agree with most of this, but there's a difference between not trusting a team until they prove it and what is happening to the Suns now, where everybody is convinced they will not prove it. Such lack of open mind suggests that it's not just cautious skepticism, but outright dismissal for no good reason.

[Pachinko_]

I agree with most of this, but there's a difference between not trusting a team until they prove it and what is happening to the Suns now, where everybody is convinced they will not prove it. Such lack of open mind suggests that it's not just cautious skepticism, but outright dismissal for no good reason.

Yeah ok, we're just fans mate... a fan is irrational by definition
And the TV guys are actually paid to pretend they're idiots.

[spanishninja]

I agree with most of this, but there's a difference between not trusting a team until they prove it and what is happening to the Suns now, where everybody is convinced they will not prove it. Such lack of open mind suggests that it's not just cautious skepticism, but outright dismissal for no good reason.

Yeah ok, we're just fans mate... a fan is irrational by definition
And the TV guys are actually paid to pretend they're idiots.

what did I say that's irrational? that it's absurd to brand the finalist from last year as an sure-out? i'm not saying to crown the Suns right now or anything, mind you. I personally wouldn't even have made this thread if I were the OP, since it's a stupid question to ask.

[Pachinko_]

I agree with most of this, but there's a difference between not trusting a team until they prove it and what is happening to the Suns now, where everybody is convinced they will not prove it. Such lack of open mind suggests that it's not just cautious skepticism, but outright dismissal for no good reason.

Yeah ok, we're just fans mate... a fan is irrational by definition
And the TV guys are actually paid to pretend they're idiots.

what did I say that's irrational? that it's absurd to brand the finalist from last year as an sure-out? i'm not saying to crown the Suns right now or anything, mind you. I personally wouldn't even have made this thread if I were the OP, since it's a stupid question to ask.

LOL not you, I said "we" are irrational, as in fans in general. People are gonna talk up their team and put everybody else down, it's what fans do.

[MrBigShot]

The same team that beat them last year to win a championship

[jefe]

Grizz.

[Bobbymcgee]

Grizzlies vs Suns - Western Conference Finals. Grizzlies have a shot.