Early Top 8 in the East projections.

[dobrojim]

Nobody thought that.

lots of the so called experts on espn thought that.
I remember a panel that had around 10-12 'pundits' and only one picked the
Wizards to win that series.

Uhm just about every analyst picked the Wizards from what I remember.

http://espn.go.com/chicago/nba/story/_/id/10795867/2014-nba-playoffs-washington-wizards-ideal-matchup-chicago-bulls

http://espn.go.com/blog/chicago/bulls/post/_/id/18897/espn-chicago-picks-bulls-vs-wizards

[sca]

It's so hard to predict the EC teams right now, but if I had to put them in tiers, here's what I got:

1st tier: Pacers, Cavaliers, possibly Bulls
2nd tier: Raptors, Wizards, Heat, Hawks
3rd tier: Nets, Bobcats, Pistons, Knicks
4th tier: Celtics
5th tier: Magic, Bucks
6th tier: Sixers

[sca]

Noah, Gibson, Butler, Pau and possibly McDermott are all better than the Knicks' second best player.

Not going to argue the Knicks here (even though your statement is absurd), but other than Noah (depending on Health), none of those guys fit any reasonable definition of talent.

1. What's your definition of "talent?"
2. Who's the Knicks' second best player and what makes my statement absurd?

[il_knicks7]

1. What's your definition of "talent?"
2. Who's the Knicks' second best player and what makes my statement absurd?

I think you putting a guy who hasn't played a single NBA game in front of guys who have been putting up consistent numbers for years says it all. No point in taking this further.

I'll make three predictions right now:
1. The Bulls will finish this season in the 4th seed or lower.
2. Mcdermott is either a minimum salary player in 5 years or out of the league completely.
3. Not a single player out of the "talent" you just stated will wear a Bulls uniform in November 2016.

[sca]

1. What's your definition of "talent?"
2. Who's the Knicks' second best player and what makes my statement absurd?

I think you putting a guy who hasn't played a single NBA game in front of guys who have been putting up consistent numbers for years says it all. No point in taking this further.

I'll make three predictions right now:
1. The Bulls will finish this season in the 4th seed or lower.
2. Mcdermott is either a minimum salary player in 5 years or out of the league completely.
3. Not a single player out of the "talent" you just stated will wear a Bulls uniform in November 2016.

So can he only be considered better once he puts his foot on an NBA court? Not a single person would disagree that Wiggins is a better player than, say, Ben McLamore. But unless the former plays a game, the latter is better by default? I don't think that's how it works. So what makes my statement absurd, while the one in the example is not? I stand by my statement that McDermott is probably a better player than JR Smith, Amare Stoudemire, Andrea Bargnani or Jose Calderon right now.

[il_knicks7]

I stand by my statement that McDermott is probably a better player than JR Smith, Amare Stoudemire, Andrea Bargnani or Jose Calderon right now.

This statement is so absurd, I don't even know where to start, so I'll end it here. Good luck with your beliefs.

[sca]

I stand by my statement that McDermott is probably a better player than JR Smith, Amare Stoudemire, Andrea Bargnani or Jose Calderon right now.

This statement is so absurd, I don't even know where to start, so I'll end it here. Good luck with your beliefs.

"Your statement is absurd because it's absurd!"

Tautology 101 stuff right here. Anyway, agree to disagree then

[te887848]

Cavs and Bulls as the top 2 assuming Rose returns to full strength. Followed by Indiana or Washington as #3 and #4, though Indiana would be a 5th seed due to the division seeding rules. Next best teams I'd say are Toronto and Atlanta. After that I'll say Charlotte. I'd be shocked if the Knicks even make the playoffs. Their roster is utterly horrid.

[House12]

Dat feel when apparently according to the general majority of the GB, there will be no Atlantic Division winner in the Top 4, despite knowing that Philly, NYC, Boston and BKN will be less than productive, and one other mystery team within the same division being clearly better.

I don't know if this is ignorance or what.

Sent from my SGH-I747M using RealGM Forums mobile app

[il_knicks7]

"Your statement is absurd because it's absurd!"

Tautology 101 stuff right here. Anyway, agree to disagree then

There's a lower bound to what you can reasonably claim. For example you can claim that Dwight Howard has a higher IQ than Albert Einstein. I wouldn't argue with that claim, just like 'm not going to argue with your claims about Mcdermott.

There's only so much nonsense you can post.

[House12]

Raptors fans are getting way too butthurt, because Nets fans think were gonna be better than them.

The Nets are going back to the JJ/Lopez/Johnson core that won them 49 games. I don't think its hard to believe that we can do that again and be better than Raptors. We proved we were better than them in the playoffs.

And no Pierce did not win us that series. He wasn't even our best player, Johnson was. And his production can be replaced with younger players. Plus Lopez is our best player overall anyway.

I was extremely high on the Nets last year I thought they could contend for the tittle when they
first put that roster together...

Even going into the playoffs Brooklyn was the last team a lot of us wanted to face outside of
Miami. That's why Ujiri yelled F*ck Brooklyn because they tanked to play us. No doubt in my mind
the Raps would have beat the Wizards or Bulls.

Going into the series I thought the Nets would win in 4 or 5...I couldn't believe how close the
series was and how it came down to the final shot. The Nets looked old and overrated as many
people had said.

With that said since that series ended...

Out

Pierce
Livingston
Thorton
Blatche (possibly)
Anderson (possibly)

In

Lopez
Jack
Bodjanivic (Probably misspelled euro project)

Also Kevin Garnett is done like dinner and at this point of his career is a defender
who can play 18-20 mins a night. Kirilenko was a complete non factor in the playoffs
and is on his last legs.

Deron Williams looks like hes lost a step and isn't an elite PG anymore and now has had
some surgery on his ankles. Joe Johnson is more effective in the playoffs than the regular
season and is 33. I've always been a Jarrett Jack fan but he's coming off one his worst seasons
of his career in Cleveland where he couldn't get any consistency going all season. You guys
will severely miss Pierces clutch ability. He was one of the most clutch players in the league
last year according to espn and is the difference in a few wins in super tight games.

I agree Brook Lopez is your best player everybody knows his injury history in the last 3 years
he's probably gonna be on a minute restriction early on but he's gonna have to be healthy
and play at a very high level to compensate the lost depth and declining pieces around him.

The Nets look like they're gonna be on the treadmill of 8-10 in the next few years before they
inevitably crash into the lottery.

The loss of our players is overstated.

I don't see how Livingston is much better than Jack. Blatche was gonna lose his minutes anyway with Lopez back and Plumlee developing. Anderson will be back.

That leaves us with Pierce leaving. The fact of the matter is, with Lopez's offense we don't need Pierce anymore. And its better to have younger athletic players in like Plumlee and Bojan. I agree Pierce was important. But I don't see us losing more games without him. Hes easily replaceable.

KG getting older is fine. He wasn't that important last year anyway outside of short stretches.

Deron Williams may look bad, but I don't think hes getting any worse. We all hope that he can get better after surgery, but even if he cant he can at least replicate his production.

Pierce was one of the most clutch players? You clearly didn't watch the Nets. Yes in that Raptors series he had a few clutch moments. In the season he was AWFUL in the clutch. Absolutely terrible. Johnson is the one who was truly clutch and had game winners.

Again, this lost depth simply doesn't exist. Lopez gives us more depth then anything we had last year. He was scoring 20 PPG. Now players like Plumlee, KG, Johnson, don't have to do as much.

If Lopez/Johnson/Williams are so incapable of winning games, why did they get 49 wins in 2013? You guys have been unable to answer that question. And they had a much worse bench that year and coach.

In 2012-2013, most of the key Nets players were 2 years younger. Now you have a new coach. Also, the east projects to be better this year. The east was extremely bad the last couple of years with the 8th seed a 38 win team.

[23-7]

Noah, Gibson, Butler, Pau and possibly McDermott are all better than the Knicks' second best player.

Not going to argue the Knicks here (even though your statement is absurd), but other than Noah (depending on Health), none of those guys fit any reasonable definition of talent.

Who is the Knicks second best player?

[Troubadour]

Few items:

1) Shaun Livingston v Jarret Jack
Livingston is the vastly superior defender. It's not even close. His size and quickness allows him to defend 1 through 3. Jack is a combo guard whose primary strength is scoring. He is a strong finisher and finds ways to score late in games. There is almost a complete overlap in his skills with Deron Williams' abilities as a player. Starting Joe Johnson against quicker 2s, AK47 at 3, and starting a traditional 4 will reverse any progress the Nets made as a small-ball team.

2) Losing Paul Pierce
He may not have had a great season, but he was the key to this team turning its season around. Without him as a stretch 4, the Nets' style of play would not have emerged. Lionel Hollins is also a traditional coach who I expect to play two bigs at all times.

3) Aging/Injuries
This is not the same Nets team that won 49 games two years ago. Lopez's stress fracture, Williams having surgery on both ankles, and the core becoming one of the oldest in the league will continue to show this year. Williams was woefully inconsistent, Lopez's lack of any mobility will force the Nets to change their defensive schemes, and the aging roster will force Hollins to coach his traditional style.

Williams / Jack
Johnson / Bogdanovic
AK47 / Anderson
KG / Teletovic
Lopez / Plumlee

Plumlee and Bogdanovic offer some youth, but the core players on this roster do not mesh well. Teams will double Lopez off of Kirilenko/Garnett on every possession. Without the spacing to punish teams that double, Lopez will be less effective in his return from a severe injury. Williams is not as adept as he once was in creating off the dribble and creating for others. Iso Joe can carry this team to a few wins, but he's no LeBron or Carmelo when it comes to carrying a team for a season.

Here's my #Hottake for the upcoming season: only one team from the Atlantic Division makes the playoffs (guess which team I think it is...haha).

[Troubadour]

Noah, Gibson, Butler, Pau and possibly McDermott are all better than the Knicks' second best player.

Not going to argue the Knicks here (even though your statement is absurd), but other than Noah (depending on Health), none of those guys fit any reasonable definition of talent.

Who is the Knicks second best player?

JR Smith? Andrea Bargnani? Jose Calderon? Samuel Dalembert? hahahaha

[freakon0mics]

It's so hard to predict the EC teams right now, but if I had to put them in tiers, here's what I got:

1st tier: Pacers, Cavaliers, possibly Bulls
2nd tier: Raptors, Wizards, Heat, Hawks
3rd tier: Nets, Bobcats, Pistons, Knicks
4th tier: Celtics
5th tier: Magic, Bucks
6th tier: Sixers

Who is this team I see people keep posting?

[23-7]

Not going to argue the Knicks here (even though your statement is absurd), but other than Noah (depending on Health), none of those guys fit any reasonable definition of talent.

Who is the Knicks second best player?

JR Smith? Andrea Bargnani? Jose Calderon? Samuel Dalembert? hahahaha

ill, ill, ill, ill

If you had to rate the players in order of best to worst from both teams how would that go.

Anthony
(rose) if healthy number 1
noah
pau
taj
butler
etc. its really a toss up becasue we havent seen mirtic and mcdermott yet but I like their upside.

[sca]

It's so hard to predict the EC teams right now, but if I had to put them in tiers, here's what I got:

1st tier: Pacers, Cavaliers, possibly Bulls
2nd tier: Raptors, Wizards, Heat, Hawks
3rd tier: Nets, Bobcats, Pistons, Knicks
4th tier: Celtics
5th tier: Magic, Bucks
6th tier: Sixers

Who is this team I see people keep posting?

Zombie Hornets.

[OrlandoNed]

Going by just record I'd go with this assuming Lance stays in Indy and Monroe stays in Detroit: (I'll post again if he goes elsewhere)

1. Pacers
2. Bulls
3. Cavs
4. Raptors
5. Wiz/Heat/Hawks
6. Wiz/Heat/Hawks
7. Wiz/Heat/Hawks
8. Hornets/Nets/Knicks/Pistons

That would turn the seeding into:

1. Pacers
2. Raptors
3. Wiz/Heat/Hawks
4. Bulls
5. Cavs
6. Wiz/Heat/Hawks
7. Wiz/Heat/Hawks
8. Hornets/Nets/Knicks/Pistons

[Meeksology]

Stopped reading after I saw the Bobcats mentioned 3 times. That isn't our name. Keep up with things.

Hey buddy don't know if anyone's mentioned it to u yet, but u should change ur sig

[kane]

Wow I'm really shocked this thread has derailed into a lets crap on the Knicks thread