Woj: Kanter signing an offer sheet w/Portland

Post #161 » by **bondom34** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:16 am

Agenda42 wrote:
slick_watts wrote:'One day' is the key phrase here. Eventually he might. I can't think of too many bigs who are this poor on defense improving before their 7th-9th season or so. Zach Randolph maybe one pertinent example. Didn't care about defense until Memphis, his 9th year in the league. Many others never seem to put it together.

The improvements on offense are compelling and undeniable but still a small sample of his career numbers. Will he be a 60%+ TS scorer, 17%+ ORB force for the long term? His ORB% in OKC would have led the league in all but one of the last 20 seasons I believe. I'd anticipate some regression to mean on offense no matter where he ends up.

Yup. We're on the same page here.

My view is that Kanter is worth more to Portland than OKC. Portland has oodles of cap space and isn't going anywhere fast. They can offer Kanter tons of developmental minutes as the clearly best big on their roster and hope he becomes something other than a turnstile over the next 4 years. It seems highly unlikely that he'll earn that contract this season.

The thing is, I can't see OKC letting him go given Durant free agency. Bad optics. Maybe if Durant signed off on it.

This has been pretty much the OKC board's consensus since slick put up the numbers. If you look at Kanter's DX profile before he was drafted, it reads:

-This lack of experience shows up first and foremost on the defensive end, where Kanter was incredibly ineffective in the film we watched. His fundamentals, instincts and positioning leave a lot to be desired. He can often be found standing straight up in the paint with his arms down, putting in little to no effort. He rarely boxes out his opponent and generally looks disinterested in anything that has to do with defense. He rarely bends his knees and often fails to get back in transition--doing very little to protect the paint when he does.

From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com/#ixzz3fRm3aDHJ
http://www.draftexpress.com

This sounds remarkably like him today. I just don't see him becoming passable. He's a bench big to me but on a 17 mil contract is nuts.

jazzed77 · Post #162 » by **jazzed77** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:30 am

I don't hate Kanter nearly as much as most Jazz fans and while he is no defensive stopper the team's defensive resurgence had more to do with the emergence of Gobert and to some extent Exum then simply removing Kanter. A lot of fans forget that Kanter was still on the Jazz when they started to turn their season around.

HeartBreakKid · Post #163 » by **HeartBreakKid** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:36 am

Effigy wrote:
bondom34 wrote:
Effigy wrote:
Lol @ the warriors 'broke up their team'. That is certainly a creative interpretation of events.

I pretty clearly said it was different.

And they got back Gerald Wallace for an actual useful player.

And to boot, OKC is screwed in the gen board mass populus' mind either way, they match and lol OVERPAY, they don't and lol CHEAP. So its a lose lose, whatever, I get it people hate them.

I don't think there will be much 'lol overpay' if they match, since it was Portland, not okc who offered the deal. However you can bet we will see charts comparing Harden's salary and production with Kanter's. It sucks but those are the breaks of making a bad trade for the wrong reasons.

And is it just me or is every fan base convinced that realgm hates their team?

Pretty much how it goes. If you talk to someone about their team they will either claim that you hate their team or you did not watch their team, even though this is a message board for basketball fanatics. :crazy:

Shem · Post #164 » by **Shem** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:43 am

bondom34 wrote:OKC was the second highest payroll last year using hoopshype or bbi. And the team that literally just won the title broke up their team because of the tax. I know Lee wasn't as important, but they still did and took back Wallace.

So a player who barely played on a championship team getting traded is breaking up a team now? Unless Curry, Thompson, Bogut, Barnes, or Iggy... basically an important rotational play is traded, especially Thompson or Curry, that's not a breakup.

Post #165 » by **bondom34** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:55 am

Shem wrote:
bondom34 wrote:OKC was the second highest payroll last year using hoopshype or bbi. And the team that literally just won the title broke up their team because of the tax. I know Lee wasn't as important, but they still did and took back Wallace.

So a player who barely played on a championship team getting traded is breaking up a team now? Unless Curry, Thompson, Bogut, Barnes, or Iggy... basically an important rotational play is traded, especially Thompson or Curry, that's not a breakup.

I said in the previous post to that iit was different.

oldschooled · Post #166 » by **oldschooled** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:56 am

Slava wrote:How many centers do Blazers have on their roster now? 6?

Kaman
Leonard
Ed Davis
Plumlee
Joel Freeland
Enes Kanter

I would love a Blazers v Sixers finals

Blazers going toe to toe with Embiid, Noel, Okafor, Landry, Thompson

improper · Post #167 » by **improper** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:59 am

bondom34 wrote:Well that's just wrong.

OKC was the second highest payroll last year using hoopshype or bbi. And the team that literally just won the title broke up their team because of the tax. I know Lee wasn't as important, but they still did and took back Wallace.

David Lee played eight minutes per game in the playoffs and was making fifteen million. Are you really saying that Golden State broke up their team by jettisoning a guy who didn't even make it into several games in their playoff run? Please. Lee wasn't important at all, and getting rid of your ninth best guy doesn't count as breaking up a team. The fact that you even compared Golden State getting rid of Lee to OKC trading Harden is both laughable and horribly, horribly naive.

Do you know who played more minutes per game than David Lee in the playoffs? James Jones. As a Cavs fan, will I care at all if James Jones is back next year? No, and I certainly wouldn't say that Gilbert was breaking up a potential title team. He wasn't a key component of the team. That's David Lee, except David Lee is making fourteen million more per year than James Jones.

Black Jack · Post #168 » by **Black Jack** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 2:14 am

Lee gave us some good minutes when needed. He will be missed as a skilled big who can stabilize things when Bogut is too slow and the other smallball "bigs" are getting schooled.

DreDay · Post #169 » by **DreDay** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 2:17 am

Not to mention we did it for Lee as well, we allowed him to choose where he wanted to go and work out a deal from there. It was part cap but part making it better for Lee in addition to that.

Reckless · Post #170 » by **Reckless** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 2:27 am

The way Kanter acted on his way back to Utah said a lot, I say good riddance and OKC should do the same.

BudTugly · Post #171 » by **BudTugly** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 2:53 am

If only he could clone himself and be maxed on both teams...

Post #172 » by **bondom34** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 3:53 am

improper wrote:
bondom34 wrote:Well that's just wrong.

OKC was the second highest payroll last year using hoopshype or bbi. And the team that literally just won the title broke up their team because of the tax. I know Lee wasn't as important, but they still did and took back Wallace.

David Lee played eight minutes per game in the playoffs and was making fifteen million. Are you really saying that Golden State broke up their team by jettisoning a guy who didn't even make it into several games in their playoff run? Please. Lee wasn't important at all, and getting rid of your ninth best guy doesn't count as breaking up a team. The fact that you even compared Golden State getting rid of Lee to OKC trading Harden is both laughable and horribly, horribly naive.

Do you know who played more minutes per game than David Lee in the playoffs? James Jones. As a Cavs fan, will I care at all if James Jones is back next year? No, and I certainly wouldn't say that Gilbert was breaking up a potential title team. He wasn't a key component of the team. That's David Lee, except David Lee is making fourteen million more per year than James Jones.

Except Lee was actually good, Jones wasn't. And Wallace is 10 million of nothing.

Wonderllama · Post #173 » by **Wonderllama** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 4:34 am

Kanter should give half of that to Westbrook

They_Them_Hatin · Post #174 » by **They_Them_Hatin** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 5:40 am

improper wrote:
ntsap wrote:Lol. Why do teams want this to happen is more interesting then OKC not wanting to pay the tax.

It's pretty simple...there are plenty of teams out there that want a shot at Durant, and any indication of OKC being cheap and getting rid of players to save their owner from paying the luxury tax is a point in their favor when they meet with him next summer. I mean, just imagine you're Durant and you see Dan Gilbert paying out the ass for a title contender while your own team trades away three players to save some cash just a few years after trading away the guy who just became the runner up in the MVP race over a couple million dollars a year. It's not a good look.

Imo I think Durant will be ok with OKC not paying 40 million in luxury tax for Enes Kanter. However I think he's still pissed about Harden .

joeyAdaMan · Post #175 » by **joeyAdaMan** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:17 am

ntsap wrote:
improper wrote:
ntsap wrote:Lol. Why do teams want this to happen is more interesting then OKC not wanting to pay the tax.

It's pretty simple...there are plenty of teams out there that want a shot at Durant, and any indication of OKC being cheap and getting rid of players to save their owner from paying the luxury tax is a point in their favor when they meet with him next summer. I mean, just imagine you're Durant and you see Dan Gilbert paying out the ass for a title contender while your own team trades away three players to save some cash just a few years after trading away the guy who just became the runner up in the MVP race over a couple million dollars a year. It's not a good look.

Imo I think Durant will be ok with OKC not paying 40 million in luxury tax for Enes Kanter. However I think he's still pissed about Harden .

as he should be....i still can't believe they let him go

TaylorMonkey · Post #176 » by **TaylorMonkey** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:10 am

bondom34 wrote:
Shem wrote:
bondom34 wrote:OKC was the second highest payroll last year using hoopshype or bbi. And the team that literally just won the title broke up their team because of the tax. I know Lee wasn't as important, but they still did and took back Wallace.

So a player who barely played on a championship team getting traded is breaking up a team now? Unless Curry, Thompson, Bogut, Barnes, or Iggy... basically an important rotational play is traded, especially Thompson or Curry, that's not a breakup.

I said in the previous post to that iit was different.

Bondom, that's not "breaking up a team" at all. Lee was getting DNP's during the end of the season and most of playoffs. And Lee wanted to go to a place where he would actually get minutes after being a good soldier which coincided with Lacob saving tax. If Lee wanted to stay and was getting a 20+ minute rotation, he might have been kept.

This is sort of the equivalent of saying OKC broke up their team had they had won it all and traded Collison's declining backup or Jeremy Lamb on their last year when they wanted to go. Maybe the equivalent of trading Perkins. Lee was eventually the 9th or 10th man on the depth chart. It's certainly much less of a breakup than trading Harden after reaching the finals. Lee would be a 1 and Harden would be a 10 as far as squad breakups go. Not meaning to delabor that trade, but putting things in perspective by comparison.

Post #177 » by **TASTIC** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:17 am

Dr Aki · Post #178 » by **Dr Aki** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:17 am

portland trollblazers

TeamTragic · Post #179 » by **TeamTragic** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:19 am

If OKC does not resign Kanter then I expect them to be the next Portland when KD bails next year :noway:

Jables · Post #180 » by **Jables** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:54 am

At least Boozer and Lee tried, they had their deficiencies but they were good teammates and didn't quit mid game. And would pass the ball, quite well sometimes. Kanter is, no question, consistently the worst passer in the NBA. And statistically the worst big man defender in the NBA. All the while showing some worrying personality issues during his Jazz exit. If you think that's worth all that money go for it.