Eastern Conference | Round 1 | (4) Philadelphia 76ers vs. (5) Toronto Raptors

[SelfishPlayer]

Funny this is such a hard concept for people to grasp. Literally no one in all the sports media outlets picked this team to make the playoffs. You explained in detail while you were given a one line narrow minded answer. Better to not waste you time discussing things that can get difficult for some people to understand. Let's hope Embiid and Harden don't flop on their most likely last chance to win a chip. Maybe another 6 years of tanking will humble them a bit.

Rebuild? Toronto never built a champion. They received a disgruntled superstar in return for the star they built.

Haha Toronto absolutely built a champion. They had a 59 win team and replaced Derozan with Kawhi. Building can be through trades and draft.

Greg Popovich handed the Raptors a title by refusing to trade Kawhi where he wanted to go. Kawhi left, went where he really wanted to play and now the Raptors are on the treadmill with two 28 year olds instead of competing for a title with those same 28 year olds plus DeRozan and Lowry.

[SelfishPlayer]

3 starters are under 25 years old. The main bench piece is a second year player.

Those rebuilding Phoenix Suns also have three starters 25 and under. The Raptors may be a young and upcoming team as opposed to on the decline but the idea that this is a rebuilding year is ridiculous.

1. Suns have CP who just set a record of the oldest player to get 30 - 10. He's the MVP of that team.

2. This is from the guy who built this team.

This, of course, begins with the new era of basketball that starts in the 2021-22 season, to which Ujiri said "we're going to rebuild as a team. We're a young team but there's no deficit in leadership. You know, Fred [VanVleet] is an unbelievable leader. This is what everybody is going to see now, you know, the kind of leader he is.

"We are not a team of 'now,'" Ujiri added. "There are going to be growing pains, trust me, you know like, sometimes it's gonna be tough to watch but we know what's coming, we know we're excited about the young talent. They are excited to play – to see how, OG [Anunoby], Pascal [Siakam], Fred, are going to evolve as leaders – as elite players.

"And then the young guys, [Scottie] Barnes, Malachi [Flynn], Dalano [Banton]. In sports, people think 'now,' you know? And this is where we have to be patient and let it grow."

I am not gonna argue what sixers fans believe is built considering we were never the team that bought. Other dude brought up disgruntled stars when sixers had Ben Simmons and now Harden.

LOL at the idea of any one of those guys being an elite player.

[Courtside]

What exactly makes this a rebuilding year for the Raptors?

3 starters are under 25 years old. The main bench piece is a second year player.

Those rebuilding Phoenix Suns also have three starters 25 and under. The Raptors may be a young and upcoming team as opposed to on the decline but the idea that this is a rebuilding year is ridiculous.

I love the condescension that posts like these are laced with. It's like "Are you SURE the sky is blue?" at this point.

It was never intended as a long multi-year tear it down rebuild Philly style, or being stuck in lottery wasteland like Chicago, so maybe instead of trying to convince us that things are not as they are, perhaps you can understand what a rebuild on the fly looks like.

In the span of 2 years, the Raptors replaced a very old roster with a very young one. Yeah, they kept a few pieces in their late 20s to keep froms bottoming right out, but bottoming out is not necessary for a rebuild. Replacing old with young and not expecting immediate results is generally understood to be rebuilding. Letting the new guys get acclimated to the NBA and develop their skills so that in future years as everyone gets better and/or more talent ins added, *then* you can win.

I mean, Ujiri came out at the beginning of the season and said we have lots of young guys and there will be growing pains, but with hopes of being competitive. Everyone was on board with a low expectations season to see what we've got, but with the hopes of being competitive... and here we are in the playoffs.

But no, the expert fans from other teams know better than the entire Raptor fanbase, media and management, and are here to inform us about what has truly been going on this season. I would chalk it up as arrogance, but what I really think it is, is that people in many markets have been sold a bill of goods about tanking and building through multiple years in the lotto - even though in most cases that is just a cover for bad management, scouting and development - and are pissed that a team that didn't follow that same plan and is being more successful in the short term. It's like "The Raptors won, so get out of our way and take your turn sucking again so we can win", as if fans or other franchises get to have any say in the matter.

It was a rebuilding year, and it went really well. It's that simple.

[binjumper]

Rebuild? Toronto never built a champion. They received a disgruntled superstar in return for the star they built.

Haha Toronto absolutely built a champion. They had a 59 win team and replaced Derozan with Kawhi. Building can be through trades and draft.

Greg Popovich handed the Raptors a title by refusing to trade Kawhi where he wanted to go. Kawhi left, went where he really wanted to play and now the Raptors are on the treadmill with two 28 year olds instead of competing for a title with those same 28 year olds plus DeRozan and Lowry.

By that logic weren't you handed James Harden? and if you don't understand yet there is this thing called salary cap... and I bet any franchise would trade Demar for 1 championship. Keep beating the same horse dude you sound very cringe at the moment. Enjoy your game 1 win. You still need 15 more to win a chip. Not that you would understand 1983 was a long time ago.

LOL at the idea of any one of those guys being an elite player.

Reading comprehension Go read what Masai said.

[srhcan]

Raptors in a real danger of sweep which will be a big let down if it happen. I was expecting this series to be 2nd most exciting series in East after Celtics-Nets.

[BullyKing]

3 starters are under 25 years old. The main bench piece is a second year player.

Those rebuilding Phoenix Suns also have three starters 25 and under. The Raptors may be a young and upcoming team as opposed to on the decline but the idea that this is a rebuilding year is ridiculous.

Almost the entire roster was overhauled with players in their early 20s a few months after Toronto finished with 27 wins and was in the deep lottery last season. No one expected Toronto to be a +.500 team (or even comfortably make the playoffs) in the offseason. At various points, Toronto has played 6 rookies or sophomores meaningful minutes while half of their top minute getters are players under 25 that they acquired in the past year; Barnes (1st in total minutes) started every game he was available, GTJ started every game he was available after the season opener and Achiuwa started ~30 games while averaging 24 MPG on the season.

In the past ~12 months, Toronto traded two long-term vets in Lowry (36) and Powell (28) for Achiuwa (22) and Trent Jr. (23) plus they traded a couple bench players in Davis (24) and Thomas (27) for 2nd round picks that turned into Johnson (21) and Banton (22). They let Baynes (35), Hood (29), Bembry (27), Watson (27) and Johnson (25) walk then re-signed Birch (29) before adding Champagnie (20), Bonga (22) and Svi (24) in FA and Barnes (20) with the 4th pick. As the season progressed, they traded Dragic (35, not playing for Toronto for months) for Thad (33, would play for Toronto immediately) and picked up Brooks (23).

So yes, this absolutely was a rebuilding year. Heck, Masai did a sideline interview during the first game of the season and said something along the lines of "this is a development year with a very young team that will have growing pains."

Swapping out the 11-15th players on your roster for equally terrible but younger players is not a rebuild. The core of the team remains the same except for Achiuwa in place of Lowry and Trent in place of Powell.

[Woodsanity]

Its a serious problem when Embiid can be the 4th leading scoring on his team and still win by 20. Not sure what the Raptors can do.

[SelfishPlayer]

Haha Toronto absolutely built a champion. They had a 59 win team and replaced Derozan with Kawhi. Building can be through trades and draft.

Greg Popovich handed the Raptors a title by refusing to trade Kawhi where he wanted to go. Kawhi left, went where he really wanted to play and now the Raptors are on the treadmill with two 28 year olds instead of competing for a title with those same 28 year olds plus DeRozan and Lowry.

By that logic weren't you handed James Harden? and if you don't understand yet there is this thing called salary cap... and I bet any franchise would trade Demar for 1 championship. Keep beating the same horse dude you sound very cringe at the moment. Enjoy your game 1 win. You still need 15 more to win a chip. Not that you would understand 1983 was a long time ago.

LOL at the idea of any one of those guys being an elite player.

Reading comprehension Go read what Masai said.

James Harden wants to play for the Sixers. He wasn't sent to the Sixers as a spiteful move by the GM. Just watch how he resigns with Philadelphia unlike Kawhi did in Toronto. Everyone knew that Kawhi would never resign in Canada.

[SelfishPlayer]

Its a serious problem when Embiid can be the 4th leading scoring on his team and still win by 20. Not sure what the Raptors can do.

Keep on treadmilling is what the Raptors will do while calling it "rebuilding/developing."

[durka]

Maybe because Vegas had us at 36 wins, most of the Raptors board thought we were a play-in team at best, and our GM came out and said this season is a rebuild and developmental year?

Funny this is such a hard concept for people to grasp. Literally no one in all the sports media outlets picked this team to make the playoffs. You explained in detail while you were given a one line narrow minded answer. Better to not waste you time discussing things that can get difficult for some people to understand. Let's hope Embiid and Harden don't flop on their most likely last chance to win a chip. Maybe another 6 years of tanking will humble them a bit.

Rebuild? Toronto never built a champion. They received a disgruntled superstar in return for the star they built.

If the Sixers win a title with Harden instead of Simmons wouldn't it be the exact same situation?

Teams build through trades, thats how the league works. Not sure why sixers fans and players are always literally crying about the Raptors (see photo of Embiid above)

[durka]

Its a serious problem when Embiid can be the 4th leading scoring on his team and still win by 20. Not sure what the Raptors can do.

Keep on treadmilling is what the Raptors will do while calling it "rebuilding/developing."

So what's it called when the Sixers haven't made it out of the 2nd round after 4 years in the playoffs?

[bebopdeluxe]

So basically because Lowry walked and you used a draft pick, it's a rebuilding year. Got it.

Seriously. Unless I am missing something, the only "rebuilding" was Lowry for Barnes/Precious. Still had FVV, Siakam, OG, Trent Jr., Boucher, Birch all back from last year's team. What is the "rebuild" here?

Look at the post a few above this one and the moves that were made in the last 12 or so months. Whatever you wanna call it, this team is far and beyond from a finished product.

When I think of a "rebuilding" team, I think of teams that still have major assets that can be either moved in a trade, material draft picks over and above their own, or major cap space to sign free agents. Assuming the Raptors let Thad walk, and assuming they keep Boucher (whose current cap hold is over $13m), they only possibly have the MLE and a pick in the early 20's to use this summer.

Unless I am missing something, what you see is pretty much what you get here.

[bebopdeluxe]

Its a serious problem when Embiid can be the 4th leading scoring on his team and still win by 20. Not sure what the Raptors can do.

Keep on treadmilling is what the Raptors will do while calling it "rebuilding/developing."

So what's it called when the Sixers haven't made it out of the 2nd round after 4 years in the playoffs?

It is called an underachieving team that needs to start winning playoff games. Isn't that obvious?

What would you call it?

[durka]

Greg Popovich handed the Raptors a title by refusing to trade Kawhi where he wanted to go. Kawhi left, went where he really wanted to play and now the Raptors are on the treadmill with two 28 year olds instead of competing for a title with those same 28 year olds plus DeRozan and Lowry.

By that logic weren't you handed James Harden? and if you don't understand yet there is this thing called salary cap... and I bet any franchise would trade Demar for 1 championship. Keep beating the same horse dude you sound very cringe at the moment. Enjoy your game 1 win. You still need 15 more to win a chip. Not that you would understand 1983 was a long time ago.

LOL at the idea of any one of those guys being an elite player.

Reading comprehension Go read what Masai said.

James Harden wants to play for the Sixers. He wasn't sent to the Sixers as a spiteful move by the GM. Just watch how he resigns with Philadelphia unlike Kawhi did in Toronto. Everyone knew that Kawhi would never resign in Canada.

I'd rather not have Kawhi than pay a washed up Harden 50 mill for 5 years. The 1 year we had him was well worth it just for the shot that made Embiid cry alone, not even mentioning the championship he helped bring us.

[aj174]

Rebuild? Toronto never built a champion. They received a disgruntled superstar in return for the star they built.

Haha Toronto absolutely built a champion. They had a 59 win team and replaced Derozan with Kawhi. Building can be through trades and draft.

Greg Popovich handed the Raptors a title by refusing to trade Kawhi where he wanted to go. Kawhi left, went where he really wanted to play and now the Raptors are on the treadmill with two 28 year olds instead of competing for a title with those same 28 year olds plus DeRozan and Lowry.

This is such a ridiculous take. Man why am I wasting my time arguing here, this is my last post in this thread for a while:

1) No one wanted to trade for Kawhi, Raps did, took on a big risk, signed a rookie head coach. Established perennial playoff team, culture, Kawhi was a plug and play. Worked to perfection. Traded for Gasol, had our defensive anchor. The rest is history.
2) Did Pop coach the team? Or play the games? What an absurd statement that he handed us a title LOL. He also then in that case handed us a victory in the 2nd round over the sixers, and handed us one of the best game winning shots of all time.

3) A team with Lowry and Derozan isn't going to win a title. I'd much rather take the title with a 1 year kawhi, draft Barnes at 4 who's going to be a STUD, and work from there with one of the best coaches and FOs in the league. All while still being competitive at 48 wins. Rebuilding on the fly baby.

I don't understand why you want to put the Raps down so much? Your team is good man, just enjoy it and stop wasting your energy on stuff like this. This is the Sixers time to make it happen, with Maxey, that time window possibly got even longer. No need to argue with every Raptors fan about whether we're rebuilding, so and so handed you a title etc.

[durka]

Keep on treadmilling is what the Raptors will do while calling it "rebuilding/developing."

So what's it called when the Sixers haven't made it out of the 2nd round after 4 years in the playoffs?

It is called an underachieving team that needs to start winning playoff games. Isn't that obvious?

What would you call it?

I'd call that more of a treadmill than the Raptors who are 3 years removed from a championship with a ROY-candidate who looks like he could very well turn into a superstar.

[aj174]

Seriously. Unless I am missing something, the only "rebuilding" was Lowry for Barnes/Precious. Still had FVV, Siakam, OG, Trent Jr., Boucher, Birch all back from last year's team. What is the "rebuild" here?

Look at the post a few above this one and the moves that were made in the last 12 or so months. Whatever you wanna call it, this team is far and beyond from a finished product.

When I think of a "rebuilding" team, I think of teams that still have major assets that can be either moved in a trade, material draft picks over and above their own, or major cap space to sign free agents. Assuming the Raptors let Thad walk, and assuming they keep Boucher (whose current cap hold is over $13m), they only possibly have the MLE and a pick in the early 20's to use this summer.

Unless I am missing something, what you see is pretty much what you get here.

Well that depends on if you think Barnes is going to be a superstar or not. And if Trent, Achiuwa can improve. Barnes is 20, Trent is 23, Achiuwa is 22. If those things happen, then FVV/Siakam (most likely FVV) can be traded around the league for another star or some more young talent to grow with the trajectory of Barnes. It honestly all depends on Barnes. Lol. So what you see is definitely not what you get. The trajectory is likely up.

[SelfishPlayer]

Funny this is such a hard concept for people to grasp. Literally no one in all the sports media outlets picked this team to make the playoffs. You explained in detail while you were given a one line narrow minded answer. Better to not waste you time discussing things that can get difficult for some people to understand. Let's hope Embiid and Harden don't flop on their most likely last chance to win a chip. Maybe another 6 years of tanking will humble them a bit.

Rebuild? Toronto never built a champion. They received a disgruntled superstar in return for the star they built.

If the Sixers win a title with Harden instead of Simmons wouldn't it be the exact same situation?

Teams build through trades, thats how the league works. Not sure why sixers fans and players are always literally crying about the Raptors (see photo of Embiid above)

James Harden and Ben Simmons were traded to teams they wanted to play for, Kawhi was traded to team he didn't want to play for and took the first thing smoking out of town.

[durka]

Rebuild? Toronto never built a champion. They received a disgruntled superstar in return for the star they built.

If the Sixers win a title with Harden instead of Simmons wouldn't it be the exact same situation?

Teams build through trades, thats how the league works. Not sure why sixers fans and players are always literally crying about the Raptors (see photo of Embiid above)

James Harden and Ben Simmons were traded to teams they wanted to play for, Kawhi was traded to team he didn't want to play for and took the first thing smoking out of town.

Who cares where he wanted to play. He won a championship for us(something Embiid, Harden or Simmons have never done) and made all of Philadelphia cry along the way.

[SelfishPlayer]

Its a serious problem when Embiid can be the 4th leading scoring on his team and still win by 20. Not sure what the Raptors can do.

Keep on treadmilling is what the Raptors will do while calling it "rebuilding/developing."

So what's it called when the Sixers haven't made it out of the 2nd round after 4 years in the playoffs?

Hope.


Which the Raptors do not have... Embiid alone = Hope. Embiid + Harden = championship contender.