German Newspaper: Dirk defeats ghetto basketball

[realfung]

Well racism happens all the time and I am sure the way Dirk played basketball is funny to a lot of people.

It's always like this.

[Bobbcats]

This thread is based on one article. People who jump to so many conclusions based on the tone of one article from one newspaper aren't much better than whoever wrote the article.

Having travelled all over, Europe is much more racist towards immigrants and black people. Atleast in the US its somewhat hidden. In Europe people say things openly that would get them fired here. You also have right wing anti immigration parties that would never pass muster here. And before people start posting articles, its one man's opinion. Racism exists here too but its worse in Europe IMO.

I will speak for France only, I think overall they are more integrated (except for the very poorly planned immigrant neighborhoods around Paris and Marseille) but their racists are less PC. In the US, we get along ok but we go to our own schools, churches, and neighborhoods. The most telling thing for me is how much more common and normal interracial marriages seem in France.

The difference is it's hidden in the USA but I think overall France is more integrated . It always amuses me when American media are shocked that FN gets 15% of the vote. They are practically no different platform-wise than the Republican Party, they just don't code their message because it's a multi-party system so they don't need to appeal to moderates.

[droponov]

Personally, I think hip-hop is great because it comes from real life experiences.

As opposed to other musical genres that come from artificial life ones?

context is key if you are going to jump in.

What is the context?

[droponov]

It always amuses me when American media are shocked that FN gets 15% of the vote. They are practically no different platform-wise than the Republican Party, they just don't code their message because it's a multi-party system so they don't need to appeal to moderates.

Just because 80% of the black voters will always vote for the democrats even if they're electing an uber-corrupt politician or a merely incompetent one it doesn't imply the other guys are racists. Expressing the idea that the party you don't like must be racist makes you look childish.

The FN is actually a lot closer to the Democratic party. They're a big government party, that favours economic interventionism and protectionism. The biggest difference is the views on immigration and cultural integration. But they aren't very far from many southern democrats, some blue dogs in Texas, Arizona, etc.

[irie]

Sad people feel that way, but not a surprise. White people are the vast minority where I live, but going to school in the US it's a whole different story, and they let us know.

Also, those damn kids and their schlabberige pants.

[Sabas11]

It always amuses me when American media are shocked that FN gets 15% of the vote. They are practically no different platform-wise than the Republican Party, they just don't code their message because it's a multi-party system so they don't need to appeal to moderates.

Just because 80% of the black voters will always vote for the democrats even if they're electing an uber-corrupt politician or a merely incompetent one it doesn't imply the other guys are racists. Expressing the idea that the party you don't like must be racist makes you look childish.

The FN is actually a lot closer to the Democratic party. They're a big government party, that favours economic interventionism and protectionism. The biggest difference is the views on immigration and cultural integration. But they aren't very far from many southern democrats, some blue dogs in Texas, Arizona, etc.

Dont want to derail this thread completely off-topic, but the bolded statement is quite incorrect. Historically the FN is one of the only party in France that advocated Milton Friedman-inspired economic policies: drastic reduction of civil servants, flat income tax (their first platform actually proposed to get rid of the income tax altogether), privatisation of social security, among others. Actually the historic leader of the FN party Jean-Marie Le Pen presented himself in the early 80's as the French Ronald Reagan

[Bobbcats]

Just because 80% of the black voters will always vote for the democrats even if they're electing an uber-corrupt politician or a merely incompetent one it doesn't imply the other guys are racists. Expressing the idea that the party you don't like must be racist makes you look childish.

I should rephrase that I didn't mean Republicans are racist. BTW I don't mind the republican party I vote republican fairly often. There are however many republicans particularly in the south and southwest that basically make the same statements as Le Pen only slightly dressed up. I think they would easily do just as well here if we had a multiparty system. Most of the FN doesn't think it's racist either and they might be right.

and you're wrong. racism and social issues aside, the FN platforms are the same as our conservatives. Democrats and republicans are not monolithic on free trade. there is just as much criticism of "sending our jobs overseas" rhetoric from the tea party as from liberals. But insistence lower taxes/social programs is right now the defining identifier of republican/democrat right now and FN falls squarely with the republicans on that one. I have no idea where you get the idea they are a big government party when the entire party was created for and based on smaller government


Read this and tell me which part of this platform a Tea Partier would disagree with: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Front_(France)#Political_profile

The difference between America's conservatives and the FN is the acceptance of this platform (which is considered "American" here and "extreme" in France) , and a racist label that has stuck on the FN because Le Pen is slightly less filtered than our conservative leaders about immigration.

[KV20]

So now you know why LeBron said after the decision it ws also a question of racism. Not only in Germany...

[pwrshft99]

Funny cuz its true

[Joel Embust]

I don't really see how this is racist at all there are people of many different races / ethnicity / skin colors in "da ghetto".

To insinuate otherwise is being racist IMO.

This is Europe we're talking about, the same continent where fans make monkey noises, throw bananas at opposing black players. If i'm generalizing the whole continent and if this makes me racist, i guess i am one but that doesn't change the facts.

lol what? Ever been to England, France, the Netherlands or Portugal?

[KV20]

Stevenson, Terry, Chandler, Haywood, Kidd, etc, they are not ghetto?

[Kumar]

DIRK!! That freakin' nazi..

[rottenzombie]

Is that literal translation from the original words?

I find it hard to believe that a German newspaper, in particular, would use the word "ghetto".

[freshtrinity46]

I'm surprised it took this long, to be honest.

They're just saying what parts of white america is thinking.

They? One person is now they? Also I think you should replace 'white america' with Stern. Writer brings up the dress code and it's a good point, he's just bringing up the things Stern wanted to tone down in terms of image and whatnot.

Not that it makes it right, but honestly some of the stuff is not much worse than the image of European players in the US, so if you're outraged, at least don't be a hypocrite and not have it both ways. I read so many things here that make me cringe about soft Euros or just other comments that group every European person into one general term of _____ Euro. Many things which Dirk was criticized for a long time and very recently as well.

[droponov]

Just because 80% of the black voters will always vote for the democrats even if they're electing an uber-corrupt politician or a merely incompetent one it doesn't imply the other guys are racists. Expressing the idea that the party you don't like must be racist makes you look childish.

I should rephrase that I didn't mean Republicans are racist. BTW I don't mind the republican party I vote republican fairly often. There are however many republicans particularly in the south and southwest that basically make the same statements as Le Pen only slightly dressed up

And democrats too. I don't think they dress up anything. Larger chance you're just being paranoid.

I think they would easily do just as well here if we had a multiparty system. Most of the FN doesn't think it's racist either and they might be right.

I know plenty of FN voters who aren't racist. The FN platform isn't exactly racist either. A bit xenophobic.

and you're wrong. racism and social issues aside, the FN platforms are the same as our conservatives. Democrats and republicans are not monolithic on free trade. there is just as much criticism of "sending our jobs overseas" rhetoric from the tea party as from liberals. But insistence lower taxes/social programs is right now the defining identifier of republican/democrat right now and FN falls squarely with the republicans on that one. I have no idea where you get the idea they are a big government party when the entire party was created for and based on smaller government


Read this and tell me which part of this platform a Tea Partier would disagree with: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Front_(France)#Political_profile

That's a really poor article. To the writers credit, they still state that:

The party's economic policy shifted from the 1980s to the 1990s from neoliberalism to protectionism.[120] As the party gained growing support from the economically vulnerable, it converted towards politics of social welfare and economic protectionism.

Which American party would you identify with protectionism and economic welfare? The FN stopped insisting in lower taxes 15 years ago, you have no idea what you're talking about.

I get the idea from the fact that I've followed several of their campaigns, I watch them on tv, I read newspapers, etc.

Or read their program on public services:
http://www.frontnational.com/pdf/201101 ... ublics.pdf

They're against privatizations, against deficit reduction, in favour of more social welfare, preservation of national health care and social security, etc. Tea Party? They're actually to the left of most democrats. In fact, they claim to be to the left of the French socialist party in these issues.

The difference between America's conservatives and the FN is the acceptance of this platform (which is considered "American" here and "extreme" in France) , and a racist label that has stuck on the FN because Le Pen is slightly less filtered than our conservative leaders about immigration.

You have no idea what you're talking about. There's a fundamental difference about the role of the government as anyone who knows more about this than what's available in the wikipedia entry knows. Not to mention how much FN hates American interventionism in terms of foreign policy - most FN members I know identify themselves much more with US democrats than with republicans because of that.

FN is a socialist party (like most other fair-right and nationalist european parties) + "tough on crime" + an anti-immigration stance + isolationist in foreign policy. Imagine a member of the progressive caucus (say, Bernie Sanders) with Sheriff Arpaio's views on crime, immigration and cultural issues like marriage and you have the FN of today.

You just wanted to take a cheap shot and accuse republicans of being racists in disguise. In the process, you revealed yourself as an ignoramus.

[DEEP3CL]

I hope this doesn't make people think badly of Dirk, because that's racist as heck, and Dirk's a swell guy.

That's what I got from that.......but I won't say what I really want to say about the whole thing. It's best to just brush this off.

[droponov]

As many people have who have read and even translated the original article said, there's nothing racist about it.

Anyone who claims the article is racist is coming across as extremely ignorant and prejudiced. Just saying.

[Mef]

Is that literal translation from the original words?

I find it hard to believe that a German newspaper, in particular, would use the word "ghetto".

Why? 'Ghetto' is a common word in Germany, many young Germans who come from poor neighborhoods say they come from the ghetto.
Maybe that's the main reason for the wrong interpretation of the German article? I think Americans say 'hood' instead of 'ghetto'.

[Whateva]

I don't see anything racist at all. What is racist in saying Dirk is the first white player winning Finals MVP since Larry Bird ? Isn't that true ? In a sport were 80% are black, being Finals MVP and White is a curiosity, let's face it.

[RichardsRival3]

Yes, of course and Jason Terry,Kidd, Marion, Chandler and other Mavs who played their role to a tee are lily white guys...please, i can't believe some are trying to defend that article..thats about as racist as u can get..

+1

I am fan of the Bulls who were unceremoniously defeated 4-1 by the heat and I like Dirk but this article is ridiculous.

LBJ and Wade in the grand scheme of things are good guys. Never been in trouble with the law/drugs/guns etc...

I don't know how people can go on defending this type of position.