JJ Redick: “Players from the 50s, 60s, 70s could not play in today’s NBA”

[Biff]

No duh. The pool of athletes the NBA is drawing from is significantly larger than it was back then, thus the quality/quantity of talent is greater.

[SOA]

The bottom line is:

which rules are they playing by? Because if you told guys like Bob Cousy that he could dribble like the players nowadays.... he would be look like the white Curly Neal. Pistol Pete would have most of these guys shook with his ballhandling and passing skills.

[KnIcKsYaNkSmEtS1127]

This is such a lazy take on both sides. Given time to adjust I'm sure players would adjust to any era.

Imo it would be a much more difficult adjustment for current guys to play in the early era with no three point shot, no superstar ref BS, carry and traveling actually being called, etc.

100% agree, If those players had the weight training, supplements, etc they would be just fine. They were top athletes for their time so why wouldn’t they be even better with the advancements in sports medicine.

[Edrees]

The answer to this is always so.simple. If you had a time and space teleporter no player can play in a other era. Different rules different game . They'd get wrecked.

However, if you took the baby right when they were born and transported them to a different era and they grew up playing THAT NBA game their skills and emphasis would develop differently and they'd be just as good.

and1'd your post but im assuming youd agree modern players could go back in time and wreck the old way right?

Yeah I would agree but I'd also agree if past players were sent forward in time as a baby, trained in today's age , and sent back in time at age 19 they'd wreck much more than they did before.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

This is such a lazy take on both sides. Given time to adjust I'm sure players would adjust to any era.

Imo it would be a much more difficult adjustment for current guys to play in the early era with no three point shot, no superstar ref BS, carry and traveling actually being called, etc.

100% agree, If those players had the weight training, supplements, etc they would be just fine. They were top athletes for their time so why wouldn’t they be even better with the advancements in sports medicine.

it would be more important what their habits were in puberty than as professionals. people are evolving getting bigger and stronger and faster and smarter.....it would be very difficult for previous generations to just "practice and train" a different way and still expect the same results. jesse owens vs usain bolt would be a good example

[Backcountry]

Of course Reddick is right. I mean, Chamberlain is 85 now. He'd suck. Even Jordan is almost 60...

[ChettheJet]

My response to Reddick and his backers would be that today if you sneeze on a shooter, it's a foul. In the 50's-70's the arm or hand in the back wasn't a foul, the forearm or a punch was what you got and it wasn't always a foul. There were no flagrant fouls, a guy came after you and when you got knocked into bench they stood over you daring you to get up and do something about it. I don't think Reddick could have played 2 years in the 70's being guarded by Walt Frazier, Jerry Sloan or Rickey Sobers.


I can think of guys from the 70's and 80's who weren't as good then as they would be now. Paul Westphal, Reggie Theus were good ball handlers who could cut though the lane, with the clear path they'd have now they would be even better than they were. Brad Sellers was 7 feet tall and weighed about 175 pounds so he was no match for the PFs of the 80's but today he'd be an incredible stretch 4. Coby Dietrich was a solid PF who today would be an all star stretch 4. David Greenwood never lived up to expectations but today he'd be the 4-5 everybody dreams of.

I think about Dave Cowens a Hall of Famer and say imagine Kevin Love with grit, desire and heart.

[ty 4191]

He’s 100% correct but he should’ve added the 80s and 90s to the list.

JJ Redick is an idiot.

Watch on YouTube

[amcoolio]

I think some could, the league would just be full of Demar DeRozans

[ty 4191]

No duh. The pool of athletes the NBA is drawing from is significantly larger than it was back then, thus the quality/quantity of talent is greater.

There are also 4x+ the number of roster spots and 3x+ as many teams as their were in the 60's and early 70's.

Wilt Chamberlain played 69% of his total career games (828 of 1205) against 13 Hall of Fame Centers.

Bill Russell played 46% of his total games (517 of 1118) against 12 Hall of Fame Centers.

Kareem played 37% of his total games (659 of 1797) against 18 Hall of Fame Centers.

Shaq and Hakeem? Less than 15%.

[ty 4191]

JJ Redick is an idiot.

Watch on YouTube

[DCasey91]

I thought people knew athletes don’t equal great sportsmen.

See how young it is today? Drexler for example would eat Cole Anthony alive.

Porter was a dog and was filthy early 1990’s

Schrempf is tall asf. And AK would be a gangsta today or any point in time.

JJ was one of the yeetiest shooters I’ve ever seen but thats literally all that he can do lol.

Have a look at the guards today their dads could score on them.

I’d rather see both older/younger gens call out names picking a whole era is way too general.

DROB, Magic Shaq, Hakeem? My goodness they would run riot right now.

[DCasey91]

I mean, I've always had thoughts about this.

I rolled my eyes a little, for instance, when Walt Frazier made the assertion that he "could shut Steph Curry down".

It always kind of felt to me like these older guys are using the reverence people have for them as cover to make very conveniently unprovable claims.

Is it fair to hold athletes from earlier eras to modern standards when they didn't have modern resources, training methods, and coaching? Generally speaking I'd say that no it isn't, but speculating on how well guys from those eras would translate is a largely fruitless exercise. It depends on the assumptions you are making, and even then it's dubious.

But yes, taken at face value, looking exclusively at the exact physical build and skills cultivated, he's PROBABLY right at least for a significant portion of NBA players.

Actually Walt Frazier is one of the few that matches up extremely well with Curry. Part of a heavy Knicks team (maybe the best player too btw) and their most successful era in history. He’s a 7 time All NBA 1st team defender for a guard (14 total). Sound argument to be the most underrated PG of all time.

Sports are talent dependent it goes in ebbs and flows each decade there’s peaks and troughs, some years better some worse all in the same decade.

[Wallace_Wallace]

He’s 100% correct but he should’ve added the 80s and 90s to the list.

JJ Redick is an idiot.

Watch on YouTube

You can name that TedTalk all you want.

Shooting, ball handling, coaches strategies/adjustments are something that will improve inevitably. Same way how someone thinks of a topic will improve as well (advancements in medicine, technologies).

Speaking of single skill (like the TedTalk), the one single shot that has never changed is a free throw shot:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/ft_pct_career.html

This is not a pretty chart for players in the past; it's mostly consists of players in the 90-present.

[ty 4191]

Speaking of single skill (like the TedTalk), the one single shot that has never changed is a free throw shot:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/ft_pct_career.html

Try giving 60's-70's players breakaway rims (1981) and DOUBLE breakaway rims (2010) and see how they shoot from the line....

Did you play basketball competitively for many years?

How'd you find/how do you find your shooting against outdoor garbage zero breakaway rims vs. single and double breakaway rims?

[ty 4191]

You can name that TedTalk all you want.

PS: Fairly certain you didn't watch that Ted Talk, or- if you did- process it and its historical implications.

[Wallace_Wallace]

Speaking of single skill (like the TedTalk), the one single shot that has never changed is a free throw shot:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/ft_pct_career.html

Try giving 60's-70's players breakaway rims (1981) and DOUBLE breakaway rims (2010) and see how they shoot from the line....

Did you play basketball competitively for many years?

How'd you find/how do you find your shooting against outdoor garbage zero breakaway rims vs. single and double breakaway rims?

Just searched a game in the early 60s (pause at 1:13)

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

That looks very much like a single rim to me. And yes, those garbage rims on "assfaults" aren't ideal conditions for shooting. Maybe you could show me a picture on the players in the past playing with the rims you were referring to.

Also about the conclusion of the TedTalk:

Spoiler:

Changing technology, changing genes, and a changing mindset. Innovation in sports, whether that's new track surfaces or new swimming techniques, the democratization of sport, the spread to new bodies and to new populations around the world, and imagination in sport, an understanding of what the human body is truly capable of, have conspired to make athletes stronger, faster, bolder, and better than ever.

A changed mindset is very likely an improved mindset, that is one advantage present players have over players in the past.

[tdot_steel]

My response to Reddick and his backers would be that today if you sneeze on a shooter, it's a foul. In the 50's-70's the arm or hand in the back wasn't a foul, the forearm or a punch was what you got and it wasn't always a foul. There were no flagrant fouls, a guy came after you and when you got knocked into bench they stood over you daring you to get up and do something about it. I don't think Reddick could have played 2 years in the 70's being guarded by Walt Frazier, Jerry Sloan or Rickey Sobers.


I can think of guys from the 70's and 80's who weren't as good then as they would be now. Paul Westphal, Reggie Theus were good ball handlers who could cut though the lane, with the clear path they'd have now they would be even better than they were. Brad Sellers was 7 feet tall and weighed about 175 pounds so he was no match for the PFs of the 80's but today he'd be an incredible stretch 4. Coby Dietrich was a solid PF who today would be an all star stretch 4. David Greenwood never lived up to expectations but today he'd be the 4-5 everybody dreams of.

I think about Dave Cowens a Hall of Famer and say imagine Kevin Love with grit, desire and heart.

Finally someone who has watched basketball.

Dale Ellis, Mark Price, Paul Pressey, Walter Davis, Clifford Robinson, Michael Ray Richardson (drugs), World B. Free, Eddie Johnson, Reggie Lewis all would have excelled in today's NBA.

David Greenwood and David Thompson. Blasts from the past.

[KnIcKsYaNkSmEtS1127]

This is such a lazy take on both sides. Given time to adjust I'm sure players would adjust to any era.

Imo it would be a much more difficult adjustment for current guys to play in the early era with no three point shot, no superstar ref BS, carry and traveling actually being called, etc.

100% agree, If those players had the weight training, supplements, etc they would be just fine. They were top athletes for their time so why wouldn’t they be even better with the advancements in sports medicine.

it would be more important what their habits were in puberty than as professionals. people are evolving getting bigger and stronger and faster and smarter.....it would be very difficult for previous generations to just "practice and train" a different way and still expect the same results. jesse owens vs usain bolt would be a good example

I think that’s a great point, it’s a generational difference. Ironically I would say the opposite for baseball as the more youth pitching has led to more significant pitcher injuries. Muscle memory developed in basketball is more beneficial than baseball which has unnatural elbow strain.

[Liam_Gallagher]

I hate when people compare anything from different eras, whether it's sports, music, or technology.

You have to take everything with context. Without players from the 50s, 60s, and 70s, the league would not be where it is today. One generation influences the next.

It's lazy, ignorant, and uneducated.