Would James Harden and Blake Griffin for Lonzo Ball and Nikola Vucevic trade be upgrade for the Nets ?

[WindyCityBorn]

You guys keep talking as if the Bulls are even in the Championship conversation.

Yes they have a nice little team. And a good record. They are currently a second round exit.

Cannot beat the Bucks, Nets and probably the Heat.

Who cares if it messes up the chemistry. Just last year Harden was playing like a top 5 player in the NBA. A stretch of bad games is not going to change that.

I would not trade Harden for Ball and Vucevic. Nor would I trade Harden for Derozan and Lavine. He is a huge step from those guys. And always will be.

Lavine has never even come close to playing at an MVP level. And is in his prime.

The last time Derozan was in the playoff conversation he was so horrific his own coach benched him. And then sent him on the next plane to San Antonio.

Yes Harden has had some struggles in the clutch. But hes also consistently put up 30+ and nearly beat the 2017 Ws, which many consider the greatest team of all time.

The fact that this thread exists to me is funny. But the fact that Bulls fans agree has me floored. You people have lost your mind.

I would hang up in the face Nets idiot GM’s face if he asked for LaVine OR DeRozan for Harden. Both are significantly better than him now. No one cares what he did 3 years ago. Passing is literally the only thing Harden does better than LaVine at this point. DeRozan poops on him from a severe height too. KD is carrying him hard.

I would hang up if the Bulls offered anything for Harden.

Not for Derozan, Ball and Lavine combined.

None of those guys are Superstars. Not even close. They don't grow on trees. 4 quarters don't equal a dollar when it comes to talent.

Harden just last year was a top 5 player. And a 30 game stretch coming off injury doesn't change that.

Look at the game tonight if you need further proof.

I will take that 1000x over a #2 pick bust role player, a habitual playoff choker, and a guy who hasn't been on a winning team in his life until age 26.

Harden is no superstar anymore and a both LaVine and DeRozan are better right now. That is a FACT backed objective statistics and also the eye test.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Lavine and DeRozan have both been better than Harden this season.

Bulls don't need him.

I literally would not trade Harden for both of them straight up. Even if you added a FRP.

Cool. You keep your washed up superstar that has never won anything. I’ll take the guy that is 5 years younger and significantly better. LaVine. DeRozan is better Harden too. I know it must hurt to acknowledge. Without KD the Nets would be entering rebuilding. Have fun paying him $50 million a year to play like a fringe all-star.

Harden has made the WCF several times. And nearly beat the 2017 Warriors.

Imagine calling Harden washed up when Derozan was left for dead and wasn't even making the playoffs.

His last meaningful playoffs he put up 16 points and literally got benched for the entire 4th Q. Lavine couldn't even get the Bulls to the play in last hear in the horrific East.

Totally better than Harden

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=Johnjhen

[WindyCityBorn]

I literally would not trade Harden for both of them straight up. Even if you added a FRP.

Cool. You keep your washed up superstar that has never won anything. I’ll take the guy that is 5 years younger and significantly better. LaVine. DeRozan is better Harden too. I know it must hurt to acknowledge. Without KD the Nets would be entering rebuilding. Have fun paying him $50 million a year to play like a fringe all-star.

Harden has made the WCF several times. And nearly beat the 2017 Warriors.

Imagine calling Harden washed up when Derozan was left for dead and wasn't even making the playoffs.

His last meaningful playoffs he put up 16 points and literally got benched for the entire 4th Q. Lavine couldn't even get the Bulls to the play in last hear in the horrific East.

Totally better than Harden

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=Johnjhen

Keep living in the past. You got Harden after his best days are long gone. DeRozan actually became a better, smarter playing while playing in obscurity under Popovich. Now he is playing the best he ever has. Definitely cannot say the same for Harden.

[Hello Brooklyn]

I would hang up in the face Nets idiot GM’s face if he asked for LaVine OR DeRozan for Harden. Both are significantly better than him now. No one cares what he did 3 years ago. Passing is literally the only thing Harden does better than LaVine at this point. DeRozan poops on him from a severe height too. KD is carrying him hard.

I would hang up if the Bulls offered anything for Harden.

Not for Derozan, Ball and Lavine combined.

None of those guys are Superstars. Not even close. They don't grow on trees. 4 quarters don't equal a dollar when it comes to talent.

Harden just last year was a top 5 player. And a 30 game stretch coming off injury doesn't change that.

Look at the game tonight if you need further proof.

I will take that 1000x over a #2 pick bust role player, a habitual playoff choker, and a guy who hasn't been on a winning team in his life until age 26.

Harden is no superstar anymore and a both LaVine and DeRozan are better right now. That is a FACT backed objective statistics and also the eye test.

Theyre better for a 30 game sample when Harden is coming off an injury with a shortened off season.

He is a Superstar.

Derozan has never been a superstar in his career. Hes a habitual playoff choker. Lavine is a career loser.

They will never be on the same planet as Harden. Who is a top 30 guy of all time easily.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Cool. You keep your washed up superstar that has never won anything. I’ll take the guy that is 5 years younger and significantly better. LaVine. DeRozan is better Harden too. I know it must hurt to acknowledge. Without KD the Nets would be entering rebuilding. Have fun paying him $50 million a year to play like a fringe all-star.

Harden has made the WCF several times. And nearly beat the 2017 Warriors.

Imagine calling Harden washed up when Derozan was left for dead and wasn't even making the playoffs.

His last meaningful playoffs he put up 16 points and literally got benched for the entire 4th Q. Lavine couldn't even get the Bulls to the play in last hear in the horrific East.

Totally better than Harden

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=Johnjhen

Keep living in the past. You got Harden after his best days are long gone. DeRozan actually became a better, smarter playing while playing in obscurity under Popovich. Now he is playing the best he ever has. Definitely cannot say the same for Harden.

I forgot the part where Derozan overcame his playoff demons and didn't choke.

Keep living off your 30 game sample though. It will look foolish come June.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Imagine thinking Ball and Vucevic are better than a former MVP.

He hasn't been great this year. But hes still WAY better than those guys. Bulls would take that deal in 5 seconds.

Bulls would say no and wouldn't hesitate at all.

You are overrating Harden

They have Lavine and DeRozan why would they give up a top 10 center and a top 5 defensive pg for someone whose value comes entirely from scoring ?

People thinking the Bulls would even consider this deal this dont understand the way the they have constructed the team.

Ball is basically the key to how the Bulls want to play which is to disrupt the pick and chuck every time down the floor and Harden is basically the opposite of that

No you are overrating Ball and Vucevic.

Ball is a role player. Nothing more.

Vucevic has been FAR worse than Harden. And its not close. The Bulls have won in spite of him. .48 TS and bad defense.

Hes nothing more than a bad contract. A negative asset at this point.

So yeah Ball for Harden is not a trade the Nets would ever consider. And the Bulls would accept in 3 seconds.

[WindyCityBorn]

I would hang up if the Bulls offered anything for Harden.

Not for Derozan, Ball and Lavine combined.

None of those guys are Superstars. Not even close. They don't grow on trees. 4 quarters don't equal a dollar when it comes to talent.

Harden just last year was a top 5 player. And a 30 game stretch coming off injury doesn't change that.

Look at the game tonight if you need further proof.

I will take that 1000x over a #2 pick bust role player, a habitual playoff choker, and a guy who hasn't been on a winning team in his life until age 26.

Harden is no superstar anymore and a both LaVine and DeRozan are better right now. That is a FACT backed objective statistics and also the eye test.

Theyre better for a 30 game sample when Harden is coming off an injury with a shortened off season.

He is a Superstar.

Derozan has never been a superstar in his career. Hes a habitual playoff choker. Lavine is a career loser.

They will never be on the same planet as Harden. Who is a top 30 guy of all time easily.

Last season LaVine put up 27 ppg on 50/40/85 shooting splits and ridiculous efficiency for perimeter player only rivaled by Curry. He didn’t just suddenly become a great offensive player. He just finally has a good supporting cast.

[Papi_swav]

Nets say no.

Bulls say no first.

Nets don't even pick up the phone. This is James Harden we're talking about.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Harden is no superstar anymore and a both LaVine and DeRozan are better right now. That is a FACT backed objective statistics and also the eye test.

Theyre better for a 30 game sample when Harden is coming off an injury with a shortened off season.

He is a Superstar.

Derozan has never been a superstar in his career. Hes a habitual playoff choker. Lavine is a career loser.

They will never be on the same planet as Harden. Who is a top 30 guy of all time easily.

Last season LaVine put up 27 ppg on 50/40/85 shooting splits and ridiculous efficiency for perimeter player only rivaled by Curry. He didn’t just suddenly become a great offensive player. He just finally has a good supporting cast.

Last year Lavine was stat padding on a horrific below .500 team in the East.

Still he was less efficient than Harden on the Nets. Congrats.

[WindyCityBorn]

Imagine thinking Ball and Vucevic are better than a former MVP.

He hasn't been great this year. But hes still WAY better than those guys. Bulls would take that deal in 5 seconds.

Bulls would say no and wouldn't hesitate at all.

You are overrating Harden

They have Lavine and DeRozan why would they give up a top 10 center and a top 5 defensive pg for someone whose value comes entirely from scoring ?

People thinking the Bulls would even consider this deal this dont understand the way the they have constructed the team.

Ball is basically the key to how the Bulls want to play which is to disrupt the pick and chuck every time down the floor and Harden is basically the opposite of that

No you are overrating Ball and Vucevic.

Ball is a role player. Nothing more.

Vucevic has been FAR worse than Harden. And its not close. The Bulls have won in spite of him. .48 TS and bad defense.

Hes nothing more than a bad contract. A negative asset at this point.

So yeah Ball for Harden is not a trade the Nets would ever consider. And the Bulls would accept in 3 seconds.

Vuc’s last 4 games he is averaging 19/11 on good efficiency. Pretty damn good for a third option. So I guess Harden’s bad start is just a fluke, but another player that has consistently performed than he has so far this season sucks. Yeah you are biased at all.

Tonight had 24 points, 15 rebs, and something like 4 assists, 2 blocks and 2 steal. He also hit 3 threes. But yeah he sucks and it cannot be possible he just had start to season unlike God Harden.

[WindyCityBorn]

Theyre better for a 30 game sample when Harden is coming off an injury with a shortened off season.

He is a Superstar.

Derozan has never been a superstar in his career. Hes a habitual playoff choker. Lavine is a career loser.

They will never be on the same planet as Harden. Who is a top 30 guy of all time easily.

Last season LaVine put up 27 ppg on 50/40/85 shooting splits and ridiculous efficiency for perimeter player only rivaled by Curry. He didn’t just suddenly become a great offensive player. He just finally has a good supporting cast.

Last year Lavine was stat padding on a horrific below .500 team in the East.

Still he was less efficient than Harden on the Nets. Congrats.

How do you stat pad with elite efficiency? He is putting up similar numbers on much better team with another guy averaging 25+ next time him so obviously he is just great scorer no matter what is around him. But nice spin you tried to put on it.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Bulls would say no and wouldn't hesitate at all.

You are overrating Harden

They have Lavine and DeRozan why would they give up a top 10 center and a top 5 defensive pg for someone whose value comes entirely from scoring ?

People thinking the Bulls would even consider this deal this dont understand the way the they have constructed the team.

Ball is basically the key to how the Bulls want to play which is to disrupt the pick and chuck every time down the floor and Harden is basically the opposite of that

No you are overrating Ball and Vucevic.

Ball is a role player. Nothing more.

Vucevic has been FAR worse than Harden. And its not close. The Bulls have won in spite of him. .48 TS and bad defense.

Hes nothing more than a bad contract. A negative asset at this point.

So yeah Ball for Harden is not a trade the Nets would ever consider. And the Bulls would accept in 3 seconds.

Vuc’s last 4 games he is averaging 19/11 on good efficiency. Pretty damn good for a third option. So I guess Harden’s bad start is just a fluke, but another player that has consistently performed than he has so far this season sucks. Yeah you are biased at all.

Tonight had 24 points, 15 rebs, and something like 4 assists, 2 blocks and 2 steal. He also hit 3 threes. But yeah he sucks and it cannot be possible he just had start to season unlike God Harden.

Vucevic has never been a Superstar. Hes not worth being paid 25 million even at his best.

Especially as a Center that can likely be played off the floor in the playoffs. Theres a reason his Magic teams were usually trash.

I don't think he sucks. But I wouldn't want him for that money.

Harden had a game tonight that Lavine/Derozan could only dream of. 39/15/8.

This with half his team out with COVID.

[WindyCityBorn]

No you are overrating Ball and Vucevic.

Ball is a role player. Nothing more.

Vucevic has been FAR worse than Harden. And its not close. The Bulls have won in spite of him. .48 TS and bad defense.

Hes nothing more than a bad contract. A negative asset at this point.

So yeah Ball for Harden is not a trade the Nets would ever consider. And the Bulls would accept in 3 seconds.

Vuc’s last 4 games he is averaging 19/11 on good efficiency. Pretty damn good for a third option. So I guess Harden’s bad start is just a fluke, but another player that has consistently performed than he has so far this season sucks. Yeah you are biased at all.

Tonight had 24 points, 15 rebs, and something like 4 assists, 2 blocks and 2 steal. He also hit 3 threes. But yeah he sucks and it cannot be possible he just had start to season unlike God Harden.

Vucevic has never been a Superstar. Hes not worth being paid 25 million even at his best.

Especially as a Center that can likely be played off the floor in the playoffs. Theres a reason his Magic teams were usually trash.

I don't think he sucks. But I wouldn't want him for that money.

Harden had a game tonight that Lavine/Derozan could only dream of. 39/15/8.

This with half his team out with COVID.

Who said Vuc was ever a superstar? He is fringe all-star and is being paid like one. Calling it a bad contract bad is silly. Westbrick is a bad contract. Tobias Harris is a bad contract. Andrew Wiggins is bad contract. You are trying too hard.

Harden recent performance may also exactly how he cannot play his best without dominating the ball. He certainly would be allowed to do that in Chicago.

[Hello Brooklyn]

WASHED

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[Raps in 4]

Or downgrade ? I mean James harden is generally regarded as better player but this year with the new rules Lonzo is better offensively and was always better at defense. James Harden is only better free throw shooter. If Brooklyn nets were to offer this trade, would Chicago bulls accept ?

Harden
TS%: 58% on a 28% usage rate
OEPM: +3.7 (ranked 15th)
DEPM: +0.4
Overall EPM: +4.1 (ranked 24th)

Lonzo:
TS%: 56% on an 18% usage rate
OEPM: +0.5 (ranked 118th)
DEPM: +1.6
Overall EPM: +2.1 (ranked 62nd)

Their impact isn't even remotely close.

[Ballerhogger]

After tonight showing, is all star center this deal is beyond horrible . 4-8 from 3 24 pts 17 rebounds…
9-19.

[Karate Diop]

Nets would laugh at this and quickly say no before Bulls could accept.

Vucevic is the type of guy who other teams routinely exploit come playoff time, he'll be run off the court when it matters, and while Lonzo is good he's no Harden... Harden chilling and in cruise control has been a much better player than Lonzo this year, when Scary Hours is activated the comparison between the two becomes even more laughable.

[Ballerhogger]

Nets would laugh at this and quickly say no before Bulls could accept.

Vucevic is the type of guy who other teams routinely exploit come playoff time, he'll be run off the court when it matters, and while Lonzo is good he's no Harden... Harden chilling and in cruise control has been a much better player than Lonzo this year, when Scary Hours is activated the comparison between the two becomes even more laughable.

So harden is worth 2 all stars blake grfffin is bench player .. how is this good idea for the bulls

[AussieBuck]

Harden's a fat superstar, not a washed one. He's post peak Shaq stage. Hell use the regular season to get into shape then be a handful or he'll stay fat and get injured again. His upside is worth way more than a trade like this.

[Karate Diop]

Nets would laugh at this and quickly say no before Bulls could accept.

Vucevic is the type of guy who other teams routinely exploit come playoff time, he'll be run off the court when it matters, and while Lonzo is good he's no Harden... Harden chilling and in cruise control has been a much better player than Lonzo this year, when Scary Hours is activated the comparison between the two becomes even more laughable.

So harden is worth 2 all stars blake grfffin is bench player .. how is this good idea for the bulls

Lol.. Nobody values Vucevic and his pity all-star selections as a true all-star, but if you want to play that game - the Bulls in this hypothetical would be trading 2 all-stars (technically Lonzo has never been an all-star, but I'll let you have this one as well) for a perennial MVP candidate... So yeah the Bulls would definitely be coming out better from a talent standpoint.

Maybe you don't like the fit and have concerns about the defensive impact of the trade, but talent wise? Come on. Put some RESPEK on Harden.