I'm done with Masai

[realball]

Spoiler:

I think the best trade Masai has ever done (Kawhi) setup an unrealistic expectation that he could just build a decent team and get another trade like that to put the Raptors over the top. The Raptors front office is believing their own hype and haven’t adjusted to the new NBA where draft picks and flexibility are more valuable than actual players. You see how the Spurs were able to get a player like D’Aaron Fox without giving up a single good player and also maintaining their picks and it gets frustrating that Masai doesn’t seem to value picks, despite the fact that the front office is amazing at drafting!

Spurs traded away their '27 pick to get Fox. Raptors traded away the Pacers' '26 pick. Just stop it dude, you keep making a fool of yourself.

Hey dumbass the Spurs traded their 27 pick, Minnesota’s 31 pick (acquired from the lottery pick the Raptors gave them in the Poeltl trade) and the Bulls 25 pick and a bunch of seconds (Charlotte pick was a fake first rounder) to get Fox. They didn’t move their best player, second best player, third best player or even 9th best player in the transaction to bring in an allstar. The Spurs still 2 picks from Atlanta, a pick from Dallas or Minnesota, a pick from Boston and 6 of their own picks over the next 7 years plus tons of young talent if they want to bring in a superstar to pair with Wemby, Fox and Castle.

The Raptors meanwhile only have their own picks moving forward and will have to either trade RJ or IQ just to avoid the luxury tax and will have to mortgage their future to trade for a superstar. Two teams two different approaches to team building but one has an obvious advantage.

I know you Masai glazers act like he can do no wrong but pointing out objective missteps doesn’t mean he’s not a good GM.

Hey dumbass, read the bolded parts above, and then slap yourself for being such a dumbass.

Which of the Raptors' best players were traded for Ingram? Raptors brought in a former All-Star and didn't trade one starting level player, or even one of their young players. WTF are you crying over in this deal?

And Raptors have room below the tax to re-sign Ingram and keep RJ and IQ, they have like $50 million to re-sign Ingram, keep all their players from this season for next season, and add their draft pick.

Just stop posting, every post makes you look dumber.

Personal attacks are not allowed. Debate the post or ignore it, don't insult the poster himself.

Both of you please drop this argument or we'll have to issue a strike/ban. Thx. -b

[Pointgod]

I’m happy to continue this conversation if realball can talk without name calling. He called me a fool and I responded simple as that. I’ll gladly talk to other posters I disagree with in this thread because they can at least debate without making it personal

[realball]

I’m happy to continue this conversation if realball can talk without name calling. He called me a fool and I responded simple as that. I’ll gladly talk to other posters I disagree with in this thread because they can at least debate without making it personal

Okay, then answer the question. What assets did Masai give up for Ingram that were so much better than what the Spurs gave up for Fox?

[Pointgod]

I’m happy to continue this conversation if realball can talk without name calling. He called me a fool and I responded simple as that. I’ll gladly talk to other posters I disagree with in this thread because they can at least debate without making it personal

Okay, then answer the question. What assets did Masai give up for Ingram that were so much better than what the Spurs gave up for Fox?

That’s not the point. I made the point when I responded to you.

[realball]

I’m happy to continue this conversation if realball can talk without name calling. He called me a fool and I responded simple as that. I’ll gladly talk to other posters I disagree with in this thread because they can at least debate without making it personal

Okay, then answer the question. What assets did Masai give up for Ingram that were so much better than what the Spurs gave up for Fox?

That’s not the point. I made the point when I responded to you.

I don't see a point. You said we needed trade IQ or RJ to avoid the luxury tax... not true. You said Spurs didn't trade any good players for Fox, what good players did we trade for Ingram? What is your point exactly?

[Green Backpack]

He got us Kawhi and a championship. For that, I will be forever grateful.

[Duffman100]

Okay, then answer the question. What assets did Masai give up for Ingram that were so much better than what the Spurs gave up for Fox?

That’s not the point. I made the point when I responded to you.

I don't see a point. You said we needed trade IQ or RJ to avoid the luxury tax... not true. You said Spurs didn't trade any good players for Fox, what good players did we trade for Ingram? What is your point exactly?

In the end, the move didn't fit a tanking strategy so...

I mean, if we're being honest, that's the real answer.

[Shock Defeat]

He got us Kawhi and a championship. For that, I will be forever grateful.

Masai has been checked out since then. HE cares more about being a diplomat and African Ambassador than being a basketball GM nowadays

[tsherkin]

That’s not the point. I made the point when I responded to you.

I don't see a point. You said we needed trade IQ or RJ to avoid the luxury tax... not true. You said Spurs didn't trade any good players for Fox, what good players did we trade for Ingram? What is your point exactly?

In the end, the move didn't fit a tanking strategy so...

I mean, if we're being honest, that's the real answer.

That in mind, I think it clear that we were never going to catch the bottom 3... and we seem in reasonable position the immediately following slots. So without tossing away assets for nothing, as long as BI doesn't dramatically change our winning percentage...

[Duffman100]

I don't see a point. You said we needed trade IQ or RJ to avoid the luxury tax... not true. You said Spurs didn't trade any good players for Fox, what good players did we trade for Ingram? What is your point exactly?

In the end, the move didn't fit a tanking strategy so...

I mean, if we're being honest, that's the real answer.

That in mind, I think it clear that we were never going to catch the bottom 3... and we seem in reasonable position the immediately following slots. So without tossing away assets for nothing, as long as BI doesn't dramatically change our winning percentage...

They pretty much said he won't really play. I bet he comes in for 15 games at like 20 mpg just to see how he looks (tops) and that's it.

[tsherkin]

They pretty much said he won't really play. I bet he comes in for 15 games at like 20 mpg just to see how he looks (tops) and that's it.

That's fine by me. Get him a little time to get familiar with some of his teammates, feel the vibe on the court, not impact winning too much. That feels like a sound plan.

[Pointgod]

That’s not the point. I made the point when I responded to you.

I don't see a point. You said we needed trade IQ or RJ to avoid the luxury tax... not true. You said Spurs didn't trade any good players for Fox, what good players did we trade for Ingram? What is your point exactly?

In the end, the move didn't fit a tanking strategy so...

I mean, if we're being honest, that's the real answer.

In a vacuum the value was fair for an often injured player on an expiring contract. Not the direction I would have gone in but in abstract it was a fine move

[SFour]

I don't see a point. You said we needed trade IQ or RJ to avoid the luxury tax... not true. You said Spurs didn't trade any good players for Fox, what good players did we trade for Ingram? What is your point exactly?

In the end, the move didn't fit a tanking strategy so...

I mean, if we're being honest, that's the real answer.

In a vacuum the value was fair for an often injured player on an expiring contract. Not the direction I would have gone in but in abstract it was a fine move

It was a cheap trade like the Pacers did for Siakam....I don't think the Pacers regret the Siakam trade at all. The Pacers just like the Raptors don't really attract free agents, so it's better just to trade for them because it's likely the player re-signs.

You could argue it's a treadmill move, but Raptors are still in the battle for a top 5 pick....if they were gunning for the play-in then I would understand people being confused at the direction.

[Knicks218]

One thing I will admit about Masai is he finds great unknown talent.

[phanman]

They pretty much said he won't really play. I bet he comes in for 15 games at like 20 mpg just to see how he looks (tops) and that's it.

That's fine by me. Get him a little time to get familiar with some of his teammates, feel the vibe on the court, not impact winning too much. That feels like a sound plan.

Fortunately for us we are still 6GB Chicago for the 10th seed with only 29 games left in the season. Any potential playoff scenarios should be gone by now. Hopefully we get to actually see our potential starting unit play together vs the 6 games we've had of BBQ.

I think that ultimately the final grade of the deal will come down to what type of contract Ingram gets this off season. Ideally you'd like it to start in the low 40s but given he's already making 36m with predicted 10% cap increases, I don't think we'll be that fortunate. Given his injury concerns, I think both sides will eventually agree on the 3year 144m extension that is still on the table.

With what Bobby and Masai have said post-trade, it does seem like he was a off season target for the organization and they jumped on getting an early look of him with the core and most importantly his bird rights to build around the edges after signing the rest of the roster.

[tsherkin]

Fortunately for us we are still 6GB Chicago for the 10th seed with only 29 games left in the season. Any potential playoff scenarios should be gone by now. Hopefully we get to actually see our potential starting unit play together vs the 6 games we've had of BBQ.

Maybe a little, like Duff was talking about. Not too much.

I think that ultimately the final grade of the deal will come down to what type of contract Ingram gets this off season. Ideally you'd like it to start in the low 40s but given he's already making 36m with predicted 10% cap increases, I don't think we'll be that fortunate. Given his injury concerns, I think both sides will eventually agree on the 3year 144m extension that is still on the table.

We'll see. And with Scottie's extension kicking in, that's not amazing.

With what Bobby and Masai have said post-trade, it does seem like he was a off season target for the organization and they jumped on getting an early look of him with the core and most importantly his bird rights to build around the edges after signing the rest of the roster.

Yeah, I suppose this gives us (and him) more time to warm to a pairing and what that might look like for the next few years.

[realball]

I don't see a point. You said we needed trade IQ or RJ to avoid the luxury tax... not true. You said Spurs didn't trade any good players for Fox, what good players did we trade for Ingram? What is your point exactly?

In the end, the move didn't fit a tanking strategy so...

I mean, if we're being honest, that's the real answer.

In a vacuum the value was fair for an often injured player on an expiring contract. Not the direction I would have gone in but in abstract it was a fine move

Except you've been calling everyone Masai bots for saying it's a good trade, and kept rattling on about how Masai keep giving away significant assets, unlike the Spurs. Now it's suddenly a "fine move"?

[tsherkin]

In the end, the move didn't fit a tanking strategy so...

I mean, if we're being honest, that's the real answer.

In a vacuum the value was fair for an often injured player on an expiring contract. Not the direction I would have gone in but in abstract it was a fine move

Except you've been calling everyone Masai bots for saying it's a good trade, and kept rattling on about how Masai keep giving away significant assets, unlike the Spurs. Now it's suddenly a "fine move"?

Let's maybe take the foot off the throttle for a second. The more you keep making this an aggressive stance, the less he's actually going to articulate his position, right?

Point, you don't love the trade, right? The value actually given up wasn't so bad, so your issue is more with the vision and intention it implies, would that be fair to say?

EDIT: you're tWo, yes?

[Got Nuffin]

If the Raptors sit Ingram for most of the rest of the season and maintain their top 4-5 pick status in this draft, they will be in a fantastic position, especially considering how good they’ve been at player development.

Bringing in VJ Edgecombe (for example) and Brandon Ingram to a team which already includes Barnes, Quickley, Barrett, Dick, Agbaji, Walter, Poeltl would be a surreal turnaround.

And if we get lucky and draft Dylan Harper, sorry but it’s over

The problems with that lineup starts at the top. Masai is building around Barnes. He can’t shoot. 0-8 last night from three and now going through his 2nd full season at 28%. Then you’ve also got Poetl who can’t shoot. Then you’ve added a bunch of guys that drive to the hoop. End result is no spacing.
This is exactly the opposite of how today’s NBA is trending. Winning teams like the Celtics have at least 4 or 5 three point shooters on the court at all times.

Terribly constructed roster going nowhere.

Gradey Dick, Quickley and Walter are all shooters, and that's mostly what they are out on the floor to do. Agbaji has shown remarkable improvement this season as well. Barrett is actually not as bad a shooter as you might think. Also, this doesn't have to be our final lineup - no doubt a consolidation trade will probably need to made down the line.

Point is if things go according to plan, Toronto will be loaded with young assets as a baseline to do something. A lot the next steps depends on who we draft of course.

[Kurtz]

He got us Kawhi and a championship. For that, I will be forever grateful.

Masai has been checked out since then. HE cares more about being a diplomat and African Ambassador than being a basketball GM nowadays

If you made this post a year or two ago, I may be inclined to agree, but his moves this summer on have been vintage Masai.