NBA MVP Discussion Thread 2023-24 (Part 3: Son of Daughter of MVP thread)

[Wolfgang630]

Top 5 is probably joker, SGA, Greek, Kawhi then Brunson or Donovan? Luka at the 8th seed. 2 games behind 7 and one game away from 9th seed.

[Crunch 99]

I agree there is the Jokic and Shai tier, and then the rest.

It feels like the Cavs and Knicks are going to pass the Bucks in the standings, which would hurt Giannis' chances. The Bucks only have the 19th ranked defense this season. The Cavs have the #2 ranked defense, while the Knicks have the #6 ranked defense, as well as have OG the rest of the way. I think that D will help these teams get past the Bucks.

I give Mitchell a slight nod over Brunson for performance so far, but Brunson beat Mitchell the last two years in the playoffs and Brunson has New York media behind him, so Mitchell is unlikely to climb as high as Brunson in this race.

Kawhi is making a big charge for serious consideration, but yes, he could suffer a bit in the MVP race like Tatum/Giannis from having other stars on his team.

[CharityStripe34]

Think he’s won his last MVP already but Giannis is still that **** dude in case anyone forgot.

I wouldn't stick a fork in him yet. Plenty of season left and he looks as dominant as ever. Now that the Bucks have some normal/adult coaching I can see them rattling off some nice wins with him putting up his usual big numbers. The Dame thing will detract from him with many voters, especially since he was named an All-Star starter, even though he wasn't deserving.

[ScotlandRed]

Top 5 is probably joker, SGA, Greek, Kawhi then Brunson or Donovan? Luka at the 8th seed. 2 games behind 7 and one game away from 9th seed.

Kawhi?

[cupcakesnake]

My ballot if the season ended today (assuming Embiid is not going to play 65)

1. Shai (my pick all season)
2. Jokic
3. Giannis
4. Kawhi
5. Donovan Mitchell

Fighting for that 5th spot is Luka if the Mavs can go on a run, or Brunson/Tatum if anyone else slips.
I think there's a significant drop off after that.

[Wolfgang630]

Top 5 is probably joker, SGA, Greek, Kawhi then Brunson or Donovan? Luka at the 8th seed. 2 games behind 7 and one game away from 9th seed.

Kawhi?

Who would you put ahead of him? Tatum?

[Chessboxer]

Think he’s won his last MVP already but Giannis is still that **** dude in case anyone forgot.

I've come to that conclusion just recently, he's been blackballed from any serious MVP consideration moving forward. The first clue was when he lead the Bucks to the best record in the league last year without Middleton and finished a distant 3rd. Only way I can see him winning another one is if he wins a title and follows it up with another great season. Then they'll probably think about it
Its unfortunate because I really think he's playing the best basketball of his career. Trending to be the only player ever to average 30ppg on 60% shooting.

[Wolfgang630]

Think he’s won his last MVP already but Giannis is still that **** dude in case anyone forgot.

I've come to that conclusion just recently, he's been blackballed from any serious MVP consideration moving forward. The first clue was when he lead the Bucks to the best record in the league last year without Middleton and finished a distant 3rd. Only way I can see him winning another one is if he wins a title and follows it up with another great season. Then they'll probably think about it
Its unfortunate because I really think he's playing the best basketball of his career. Trending to be the only player ever to average 30ppg on 60% shooting.

Yeah the media ain’t giving Giannis anymore MVP’s. Maybe in 3-4 years they’ll give him the “older MVP”

[Chessboxer]

Think he’s won his last MVP already but Giannis is still that **** dude in case anyone forgot.

I've come to that conclusion just recently, he's been blackballed from any serious MVP consideration moving forward. The first clue was when he lead the Bucks to the best record in the league last year without Middleton and finished a distant 3rd. Only way I can see him winning another one is if he wins a title and follows it up with another great season. Then they'll probably think about it
Its unfortunate because I really think he's playing the best basketball of his career. Trending to be the only player ever to average 30ppg on 60% shooting.

Yeah the media ain’t giving Giannis anymore MVP’s. Maybe in 3-4 years they’ll give him the “older MVP”

Yeah I can see that, that's the more likely scenario right now.

[DrModesty]

I suspect Jokic would have hit the same point too if he had been given the MVP last year. Instead the remorse that many feel about last years decision has quelled it.

[Exp0sed]

I suspect Jokic would have hit the same point too if he had been given the MVP last year. Instead the remorse that many feel about last years decision has quelled it.

exactly
I don't know what these guys above us are talking about..
blackballed? wth..but yes, there's def some "voter's fatigue" in regards to Giannis, losing in the first round to the 8th seed surely didn't help preceptions either

but voter fatigue is very different from being "blackballed", that's ludicrous Giannis is a big marketing draw, both in the states and overseas. a very marketable superstar.

[ChartFiction]

Would be crazy if SGA gets regular season MVP and finals MVP this year.

Young age to accomplish those things and OKC is only getting better with their young core getting another year of experience and all their picks. This season is arguably the worst OKC will look for the next few. Sets him up for a run to propel him in the all-time list very fast.

[Duke4life831]

I dont think guys get blackballed from the MVP race, I just think players priorities change later on. Like dont get me wrong, Giannis is still clearly a top 5 player. And his stats are still crazy elite. And Im not the biggest when it comes to BBRef advanced stats, but you look at his "advanced stats" the last couple years and his MVP years there is a difference.

I think we saw this with LeBron after Miami. Its not that LeBron wasnt capable of winning MVPs, I just dont think that was the focus anymore for him. He took his foot off the gas some in the regular season (again still crazy great stats) and was more focused with playoff stuff. I think Giannis is in the same boat right now.

I wont be shocked to see Jokic in that same boat next year. The one thing that could prevent Jokic from doing that is the lack of star power around him. He really cant afford to take his foot off the gas during the regular season because Denver needs Jokic to be Jokic basically every night, until they get a legit #2 or Murray steps up his game in the regular season.

[Andri]

One thing is eliminating Doncic from contending the MVP due to team record. Other dismissing historic personal production due to the same reason.

It makes no sense going from being considered 6th to top 3 just based on teammates health. How many different starting lineups have that thrown already?

[mediocrityrules]

One thing is eliminating Doncic from contending the MVP due to team record. Other dismissing historic personal production due to the same reason.

It makes no sense going from being considered 6th to top 3 just based on teammates health. How many different starting lineups have that thrown already?

It also makes a difference what he does when up against other MVP contenders. Giannis and Luka went head-to-head last night and both had big games, but obviously Giannis came out on top. Voters tend to remember the head-to-heads as well (like the 'Embiid in Denver' scenario).

[Archx]

So to answer "What about On/Off" impact? Well it's easy, just score over 40pts each game and Mavs will be ok

Read on Twitter

[Packbuckman]

I dont think guys get blackballed from the MVP race, I just think players priorities change later on. Like dont get me wrong, Giannis is still clearly a top 5 player. And his stats are still crazy elite. And Im not the biggest when it comes to BBRef advanced stats, but you look at his "advanced stats" the last couple years and his MVP years there is a difference.

I think we saw this with LeBron after Miami. Its not that LeBron wasnt capable of winning MVPs, I just dont think that was the focus anymore for him. He took his foot off the gas some in the regular season (again still crazy great stats) and was more focused with playoff stuff. I think Giannis is in the same boat right now.

I wont be shocked to see Jokic in that same boat next year. The one thing that could prevent Jokic from doing that is the lack of star power around him. He really cant afford to take his foot off the gas during the regular season because Denver needs Jokic to be Jokic basically every night, until they get a legit #2 or Murray steps up his game in the regular season.

I don’t know about the advance stuff don’t really pay attention to it been watching Giannis since he became a buck and he is a better player then his mvp seasons. He’s putting up over 30 pts a game on over 60% fg 11.5 rebounds and over 6 assists which no one has ever done like ever! His slow start from the free throw line is only thing from him being right there leading the league in scoring. Dame has been very inconsistent since he came here last nite was his best shooting nite so far but still barely 40% fg. Middleton same very inconsistent coming back from an injury then you add in the coaching debacle with Griffen the only consistent play has been from Giannis to be 2nd in East.

[CobraCommander]

One thing is eliminating Doncic from contending the MVP due to team record. Other dismissing historic personal production due to the same reason.

It makes no sense going from being considered 6th to top 3 just based on teammates health. How many different starting lineups have that thrown already?

It also makes a difference what he does when up against other MVP contenders. Giannis and Luka went head-to-head last night and both had big games, but obviously Giannis came out on top. Voters tend to remember the head-to-heads as well (like the 'Embiid in Denver' scenario).

Honestly Luka not in running cause Giannis playing better right now he lost to Giannis and Giannis played as well or better -

And Giannis not in running cause Jokic just better right now -

It’s Jokic or SGA-

It’s hard to imagine SGA beating out Jokic but that narrative is building

[CobraCommander]

So to answer "What about On/Off" impact? Well it's easy, just score over 40pts each game and Mavs will be ok

Read on Twitter

But that’s a horrible thought - no one has ever needed to score that much just to win lol - it’s insane that that is even a stat lol

If Luka keeps doing this this way he is never going to get a ring-

They need to get rid of Kidd so that Luka can learn to play team ball.

Like Shaq and Kobe and MJ would say- the others need to give up something and as Phill Jackson would say- you gotta get the stars to trust the process -

Kidd doesn’t know the process and it sucks watching Luka waste his career - cause there is no guarantee that Luka gonna be this good 8 more years

[Doctor MJ]

I agree there is the Jokic and Shai tier, and then the rest.

It feels like the Cavs and Knicks are going to pass the Bucks in the standings, which would hurt Giannis' chances. The Bucks only have the 19th ranked defense this season. The Cavs have the #2 ranked defense, while the Knicks have the #6 ranked defense, as well as have OG the rest of the way. I think that D will help these teams get past the Bucks.

I give Mitchell a slight nod over Brunson for performance so far, but Brunson beat Mitchell the last two years in the playoffs and Brunson has New York media behind him, so Mitchell is unlikely to climb as high as Brunson in this race.

Kawhi is making a big charge for serious consideration, but yes, he could suffer a bit in the MVP race like Tatum/Giannis from having other stars on his team.

Seeing pretty good analysis here from Crunch and others.

At the moment, Jokic & Shai have the clear advantage in my book, while I see Giannis & Kawhi having lanes where I could see them getting a lot of buzz if their team simply emerges from the pack they're in. The connection between Kawhi & Tatum is a good one, but I think voters are more likely to fully buy in to Kawhi than Tatum.

I still feel it's unlikely that Cleveland & New York end up with elite seedings, but if they do, yeah, Mitchell & Brunson are the guys poised to crash the party.