2016-17 MVP Discussion Thread Pt 3 (season finale)

[bwgood77]

It's hard for me to lean one way or the other, so I'll just stick with my local star player. Westbrook is having a fantastic March & April, but I'm not letting recent results cloud the judgement of an entire season. Harden has put up the same crazy numbers beside chasing the triple double record, and has lead his team to almost 10 more wins. Two seasons ago, I was all-in on giving the MVP to the player putting up crazy stats on a bad team while leading them to the playoffs, but that player won 56 games compared to what Westbrook will probably finish with (which is 47 wins).

32/10/10 with 47 wins vs. 29/11/8 with 57 wins

I can't believe we have two players in the same season putting up those numbers.

Just curious. How is a team that wins 56 games a bad team?

[ThePersianFreak]

Westbrook will get it, and i think he actually deserves it.

[gmoney411]

Robbery if Westbrook don't win it

It'd be a disgrace for a team with the 10th best record in the NBA to have the MVP.

It'll be a disgrace if Westbrook doesn't win it just because his team is trash around him

The players around Westbrook aren't trash. But the whole team depends on Westbrook to be great to win. I'd bet a lot of money that the Thunder would have a better record if you switched out Harden for Westbrook. Harden won 56 games with DMo as the second best scorer on the team. People like to point to the roster being built for Harden but Harden had just as much success with a roster that wasn't built perfectly for him. The only thing that has slowed him down in the past 3 years was Howard ruining the offense.

[ocelot17]

It's hard for me to lean one way or the other, so I'll just stick with my local star player. Westbrook is having a fantastic March & April, but I'm not letting recent results cloud the judgement of an entire season. Harden has put up the same crazy numbers beside chasing the triple double record, and has lead his team to almost 10 more wins. Two seasons ago, I was all-in on giving the MVP to the player putting up crazy stats on a bad team while leading them to the playoffs, but that player won 56 games compared to what Westbrook will probably finish with (which is 47 wins).

32/10/10 with 47 wins vs. 29/11/8 with 57 wins

I can't believe we have two players in the same season putting up those numbers.

Just curious. How is a team that wins 56 games a bad team?

Howard missed half the season.

Not one player outside of harden that can create his own shot.

Roster of players that are no longer in the NBA or are the end of the bench.

And mcfail as their head coach.



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[Edrees]

Team record only players a large part when the best player this season has the best team record. When that player isn't a candidate you are kind of already overlooking team success in a large part, so I don't see how it's a stretch to give it to westbrook. IF you are that passionate about team record why isn't curry or durant your top choice? If you say it's because they had better teammates, isn't that also true for harden vs westbrook?

both harden or westbrook would deserve it, I would be fine with either one

[BeatDaCavs420]

A look at the seeding of past MVPs.

2016- MVP -curry. Seeding- 1st

2015- MVP- curry. Seeding- 1st

Westbrook - 45-33.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/2j2oen/a_look_at_the_seeding_of_past_mvps/

Says another Rockets fan

Sorry but its just a trend I am seeing here

Please try and add something to the discussion instead of this. Personally I don't think the MVP always should HAVE to come from a top seed, but perhaps you can add more to the discussion than just make comments about people being Rockets fans.

Sorry but just was stating the obvious and there was really no discussion. Besides them saying OKC was trash and MVPs should have better records......My apologies though and Ill stay away from it

[bwgood77]

Says another Rockets fan

Sorry but its just a trend I am seeing here

Please try and add something to the discussion instead of this. Personally I don't think the MVP always should HAVE to come from a top seed, but perhaps you can add more to the discussion than just make comments about people being Rockets fans.

Sorry but just was stating the obvious and there was really no discussion. Besides them saying OKC was trash and MVPs should have better records......My apologies though and Ill stay away from it

Yes, it may be some Houston fans saying this but many have stated in the past, before the season and in previous seasons, that most MVPs are from top seeds. Even sixth men award winners usually come from some of the top seeds. These threads are contentious enough to begin with so I'd rather people not make comments about what fans people are teams of, particularly when they are just stating facts about past MVP winners.

[StepBackCrack]

Read on Twitter

Nothing but truth. Would feel really bad for Harden if he does not win and I don't think he will now. The narrative is too strong on Russ' side this season.

[ken6199]

Read on Twitter

Nothing put truth. Would feel really bad for Harden if he does not win and I don't think he will now. The narrative is too strong on Russ' side this season.

I don't blame the fans, or the voters. They are all humans after all, nobody is born a hater.

I blame the bad public perception, the youtube videos, the shaqtin fool, 'oh that eye defense', 'oh that lazy swipe', 'oh he doesnt' run back on transitions', 'oh he just ISO after ISO', 'so many turnovers'. The same reason they don't give a 29/7.5/6.1/1.7 guy (the other 3 being LBJ, Oscar, MJ) a 3rd team all nba selection. If they are playing the stats game on 17 Westbrook, what were they doing on 16 Harden?

Same as JaVale, who career is probably half ruined by Shaq.

Like I said, they both deserved it. If I have to feel sad for Harden, I gotta feel happy for Westbrook.

[ken6199]

1. James Harden is on pace to surpass 2,400 points and 900 assists.
Nobody has done that in the last 40 years. Only Michael Jordan, LeBron, and Westbrook have even had seasons topping 2,100 points and 600 assists in that span.

2. Russell Westbrook has 22 30-point triple-doubles this season.
In the last 35 years, only Harden and Michael Jordan have put together a season with more than five such games.

3. Kawhi Leonard had a six-game stretch in mid-January where he scored at least 30 points and made at least half his shots in each contest.
In the last 30 years, LeBron James, Kevin Durant, and Michael Jordan are the only other wings that have done that.

4. LeBron James is averaging 26.3 points, 8.5 rebounds, and 8.7 assists with a 59 effective field goal percentage.
No one has ever averaged at least 25 points, eight rebounds, and eight assists with an effective field goal percentage topping 55.

5. James Harden has put together three different four-game streaks of at least 30 points and 10 assists.
In the last 40 years, the entire rest of the NBA has combined for one such streak. That was Michael Jordan in April 1989.

[RightToCensor]

If we were giving out MVP for the month of March and it could only go to the four players in contention for this season's MVP award then I'd give it to Westbrook.

[Arman_tanzarian]

Great race all season. Looks like its all but done.




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Where are these odds from?

[88' Draft Pick]

Russel Westbrook just this past week single handedly engineered 2 straight double digit 4th QTR comeback victories on the road.

Then last night in Memphis comes from behind in the 4th and seals the game with a cold blooded 3 pointer to put OKC up 4 with 20 seconds left. Then he stole the ball from Marc Gasol to end it.

The first two games, he straight up SAVED the Thunder. Those Ws in OKC's record belong solely to him for rescuing the team. (I don't have the stats in front of me, but he scored all but a few of the points in the comebacks and made several huge turnover enducing defensive plays in crunch time) Is there some kind of stat for this sort of late game heroics? To me, these are 3 Wins that the Thunder wouldn't have just this past WEEK if Westbrook hadn't gone supernova. People love advanced stats, but is there any stat for this? Not just clutch % or whatever. Curious if this is quantifiable or you just have to rely on your eyes.

[JordansBulls]

Robbery if Westbrook don't win it

It'd be a disgrace for a team with the 10th best record in the NBA to have the MVP.

It was a disgrace a guy won it one year without even making the playoffs and below .500 at that and they had already won MVP's already.

[HotTubMike]

Westbrook has had the recent momentum for sure

[Pillendreher]

Russel Westbrook just this past week single handedly engineered 2 straight double digit 4th QTR comeback victories on the road.

Then last night in Memphis comes from behind in the 4th and seals the game with a cold blooded 3 pointer to put OKC up 4 with 20 seconds left. Then he stole the ball from Marc Gasol to end it.

The first two games, he straight up SAVED the Thunder. Those Ws in OKC's record belong solely to him for rescuing the team. (I don't have the stats in front of me, but he scored all but a few of the points in the comebacks and made several huge turnover enducing defensive plays in crunch time) Is there some kind of stat for this sort of late game heroics? To me, these are 3 Wins that the Thunder wouldn't have just this past WEEK if Westbrook hadn't gone supernova. People love advanced stats, but is there any stat for this? Not just clutch % or whatever. Curious if this is quantifiable or you just have to rely on your eyes.

Win shares? Tho I doubt he got a full 2 winshares for those 2 games versus Orlando and Dallas...

[-Sammy-]

FUN FACT: Westbrook needs to record six total assists for the rest of the season to get the trip-dub average. He doesn't need to score another point or get another rebound.

It seems doable.

[bwgood77]

Another fun fact that maybe someone has posted...

In the year Robertson averaged a triple-double, the average game featured 126.2 possessions in 48 minutes. The average game in today’s NBA features 96.4 possessions in 48 minutes. There were about 30 more plays per game on which players could get stats. Westbrook’s 31.6 points per game leads the NBA by over two points per game; Robertson’s 30.8 points in 1961–62 was tied for fifth — and almost 20 points behind Wilt Chamberlain’s lead.

From Rodger Sherman

https://theringer.com/nba-oscar-robertson-triple-double-record-russell-westbrook-8cea2f883240

[RightToCensor]

Here's my half-serious, half-biased request: Can I suggest that people reevaluate the season, month-by-month, to formulate who the MVP truly is. Let's try to avoid letting recent success cloud what has happened for an entire season. If Westbrook is still your MVP then that's fine​, but Westbrook's March shouldn't be the be-all end-all for the MVP race. There's much more basketball that has been played than just in the month of March.

[bwgood77]

Here's my half-serious, half-biased request: Can I suggest that people reevaluate the season, month-by-month, to formulate who the MVP truly is. Let's try to avoid letting recent success cloud what has happened for an entire season. If Westbrook is still your MVP then that's fine​, but Westbrook's March shouldn't be the be-all end-all for the MVP race. There's much more basketball that has been played than just in the month of March.

Personally I think it could go to either and both are worthy, and if there was a year where it would make sense to have co mvps, this would be the year. I know the vast majority wouldn't like that, and it's a near impossibility for that to happen, but if it was me, that's probably what I'd choose. They are both having unbelievable seasons.