Why has the *asterisk narrative changed?

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

It's an asterisk in my books.

There is a plethora of reasons to support this position, from no fans to no home games. It's not NBA, it's had some good games but you can't argue with the results... it's the 3rd and 11th overall teams in the finals. This doesn't happen outside the bubble.

[Big Lob]

For some reason, I remember Phil Jackson being behind the talk against the 99 Spurs. Maybe I am misremembering?

Personally, unless it comes out there was a betting scandal that impacted the officials, coaches or players in a series, I don't take asterisk talk seriously.

[Adamski23]

Asterisks are dumb as teams cannot control certain circumstances (e.g., pandemic). However, championships can be TAINTED and should be given asterisks if the winning team is caught cheating ala Houston Astros.

[Anticon]

Asterisks are dumb as teams cannot control certain circumstances (e.g., pandemic). However, championships can be TAINTED and should be given asterisks if the winning team is caught cheating ala Houston Astros.

Yup. Only cheating teams get an Asterix as we don't take away titles like at the Olympics.

People seem to think winning in close games deserves an Asterix at this point to (eg 2013 finals). It's incredibly dumb.

[Myth]

There is merit in discussing how good a champion is and how good their competition was, but they are champions either way and putting an asterisk simply because you think the competition or situation made it easier on those champions is dumb.

[GhosDini]

Lebron fans, thats why.

[ropjhk]

Anyone who called a previous season an asterisk season has to call 2020 an asterisk season. Otherwise they're just being hypocrites.

[Duffman100]

No asterisk. Easy path? Sure. But no asterisk.

[otwok]

This isn't that complicated. Anytime there is an abnormality to a season there needs to be an asterisk. It doesn't mean that the championship has any less value, it just means that there was an abnormality. Shortened seasons, large gaps in a middle of a season, first or only year in a change of format. It is really so when people look back 10-15 years from now they know why there was a 3 month gap in the season, or why some teams played 70 games while others played 61. It can also provide further analysis as to why some players performed really well in the playoffs this year but lets say in the future with fans their performance drops dramatically and vice versa.

People think that asterik means it doesn't count, that's not the deal. The deal is that there were something abnormal that went on (shortened season, gaps, no fans, etc...) and we need to account for that when looking back.

[RIP Kobe]

There's no asterisk to winning. If there is one where do you draw the line? Shortened season? Injuries? Lockdown? Postponed season? No crowds? Other outside factors that can influence players?

let's not forget about arbitrary ESPN stats, such as whether or not you won on a sunday when there was a mix of sun and cloud, with a 10% chance of rain. we all know that's also the holy day and if you win on that day, then automatic *****************************************

[Cavsfansince84]

This isn't that complicated. Anytime there is an abnormality to a season there needs to be an asterisk. It doesn't mean that the championship has any less value, it just means that there was an abnormality. Shortened seasons, large gaps in a middle of a season, first or only year in a change of format. It is really so when people look back 10-15 years from now they know why there was a 3 month gap in the season, or why some teams played 70 games while others played 61. It can also provide further analysis as to why some players performed really well in the playoffs this year but lets say in the future with fans their performance drops dramatically and vice versa.

People think that asterik means it doesn't count, that's not the deal. The deal is that there were something abnormal that went on (shortened season, gaps, no fans, etc...) and we need to account for that when looking back.

I would agree in a historical sense that an asterisk or other symbols could be used to mention the bubble and the break which preceded it but as we all know on message boards the most common way that an asterisk is interpreted is that it somehow signifies that a title won is somehow not equal to titles without an asterisk due to questionable officiating or w/e other reason people want to use. So there's sort of a double meaning intended when people mention asterisks as they relate to titles and I think we all know this. In one sense an asterisk could be used to make a note of the bubble but on the other which is how the term is more often used on message boards it is silly.

[otwok]

This isn't that complicated. Anytime there is an abnormality to a season there needs to be an asterisk. It doesn't mean that the championship has any less value, it just means that there was an abnormality. Shortened seasons, large gaps in a middle of a season, first or only year in a change of format. It is really so when people look back 10-15 years from now they know why there was a 3 month gap in the season, or why some teams played 70 games while others played 61. It can also provide further analysis as to why some players performed really well in the playoffs this year but lets say in the future with fans their performance drops dramatically and vice versa.

People think that asterik means it doesn't count, that's not the deal. The deal is that there were something abnormal that went on (shortened season, gaps, no fans, etc...) and we need to account for that when looking back.

I would agree in a historical sense that an asterisk or other symbols could be used to mention the bubble and the break which preceded it but as we all know on message boards the most common way that an asterisk is interpreted is that it somehow signifies that a title won is somehow not equal to titles without an asterisk due to questionable officiating or w/e other reason people want to use. So there's sort of a double meaning intended when people mention asterisks as they relate to titles and I think we all know this. In one sense an asterisk could be used to make a note of the bubble but on the other which is how the term is more often used on message boards it is silly.

Yea but the idiocy on message boards and reddit shouldn't dictate how we evaluate on a historical sense. 99% of people on the internet are idiots. 30 years from now there may not even be message boards. And I say asterisk is not limited to the bubble but any kind of major abnormalities in a season like a shortened season, first year in a major change of format, anything that wouldn't be obvious to some who did not live in the time.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

[Cavsfansince84]

Yea but the idiocy on message boards and reddit shouldn't dictate how we evaluate on a historical sense. 99% of people on the internet are idiots. 30 years from now there may not even be message boards. And I say asterisk is not limited to the bubble but any kind of major abnormalities in a season like a shortened season, first year in a major change of format, anything that wouldn't be obvious to some who did not live in the time.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

People who are honestly trying to summarize or record such things will use them if they are required regardless. For the purposes of this thread and the message board it has almost entirely to do with the validity of the title itself. That's what's really being discussed.

[otwok]

Yea but the idiocy on message boards and reddit shouldn't dictate how we evaluate on a historical sense. 99% of people on the internet are idiots. 30 years from now there may not even be message boards. And I say asterisk is not limited to the bubble but any kind of major abnormalities in a season like a shortened season, first year in a major change of format, anything that wouldn't be obvious to some who did not live in the time.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

People who are honestly trying to summarize or record such things will use them if they are required regardless. For the purposes of this thread and the message board it has almost entirely to do with the validity of the title itself. That's what's really being discussed.

Well then, yes, the question should be how we view the asterik and in relation to this season how we view this season. That's a valid conversation. This is a season that was unlike any season in history. Some people think it was difficult because no fans, stuck in hotel room, playing every other day, while others think it was easier, no travel, no fans, had 3 month gap in between. Both are valid arguments.

My personal opinion, I said this before the bubble even started - it should be viewed differently and not in a harder way. Playing in an empty gym is different than playing in an arena full of fans that hate you. Especially in playoff basketball. Travel is also one of the things that take the biggest toll on athletes. But it still counts as a championship nonetheless.

[Joao Saraiva]

Champions are champions. Everyone has the same seasonn shortened or in the bubble or whatever.

You don't have to be a genius to understand no team is taking an advantage.

This year you can say teams with HCA had less of a benefit, but the team with HCA in every round is still gonna win it all... so why the asterisk?

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

Asterisks should only be applied for cheating or number based records* with weird factors that mathematically impacted the record.

Aaron Rodgers threw the most TDs in postseason history*

*In 2021 the NFL allowed all teams in the playoffs due to COVID-19. Rodgers appeared in 7 post season games that year.

ETA: I'm totally ok with a 'foot note'. Like some of this stuff is interesting and makes it special. Like who wouldn't want to know looking at past champions 20 years from now and being reminded - "hey remember that crazy year where they locked all the players in disney world and no one was allowed in and out until either you lost or a champion was determined. it was a crazy environment where teams had to adjust their play to fan-less arenas and no post game strip club visits."