MJ's record is not 6-0, its 6-15

[soxfan2003]

He won playoff series with Scottie Pippen coming off the bench averaging a whopping 7ppg.

He also won a championship with no other all nba or all star on his team (1991).

Bulls still had Grant/Oakley/even Paxon. And Pippen still averaged over 26 MPG. Bulls were higher seed just playing Cavs....

As for the championship year, Pippen did make an all defense team that year and more importantly he had won of the best post seasons of his HOF career if not the best.

He really based upon his post season should easily be considered as someone that moved into the top 10 among all NBA players. Sometimes all-star/all NBA recognition comes after you have arrived on the court. It did with Steph Curry so Pippen isn't the only one.

[AussieCeltic]

He won playoff series with Scottie Pippen coming off the bench averaging a whopping 7ppg.

He also won a championship with no other all nba or all star on his team (1991).

Not sure how the first thing is an achievement? He is the goat, making it to the 2nd round with a mediocre team should be easy.

2nd claim doesn't mean anything Pippen averaged 21.6/9/6 along with elite defense in that playoffs.

The first few seasons MJ played some of the greatest teams of all time at age 22 and 23 in those Celtic teams.

I would bet my life Lebron or any other player wouldn't get by them.

[AussieCeltic]

He won playoff series with Scottie Pippen coming off the bench averaging a whopping 7ppg.

He also won a championship with no other all nba or all star on his team (1991).

Bulls still had Grant/Oakley/even Paxon. And Pippen still averaged over 26 MPG. Bulls were higher seed just playing Cavs....

As for the championship year, Pippen did make an all defense team that year and more importantly he had won of the best post seasons of his HOF career if not the best.

He really based upon his post season should easily be considered as someone that moved into the top 10 among all NBA players. Sometimes all-star/all NBA recognition comes after you have arrived on the court. It did with Steph Curry so Pippen isn't the only one.

But the narrative he couldn't win a playoff series without Scottie is ludicrous. His rookie season he had perhaps the worst supporting cast ever. The next 2 seasons he played a top 3 team of all time in the Bird Celtics (one season he just came back from injury before the playoffs to push them to 8th seed after he missed the entire year).

The 4th season was Scotties rookie year and he just did not contribute to the teams success. They were winning that first round with or without Scottie.

[Fencer reregistered]

As a Celtics fan, I laugh.

[Heat3]

Glad I was around to see MJ play and have some the all time greats play for my favorite team in this era. To me MJ is the best. 6-0 or 6-15. He is the goat in my book…..and I was an MJ hater too lol.

[Lockdown504090]

hey, mjs finals record isnt that impressive, he only won a championship in 40 percent of the seasons he played despite playing 2 at 40 years old and missing most of another season with a broken foot. If anythinig you just made him look better.

[Kent]

Watch on YouTube

[dhsilv2]

6-9 and 11-2?

[RafStone]

Can we clear this up. I don't want to hear about MJ's perfect 6-0 record ever again. You have to include the 5 seasons of his career that he played without Scottie Pippen and never won a playoff series. You have to include all of the 1st round losses he had. The end result is that his record 6-15. Still good, but not perfect like Bill Russell's 11-13.

Yep, I have no idea why they don't want to count the other playoff series.
This doesn't take away from his greatness, this is just the TMZ/ESPN, soap opera side of basketball knowing that this debate is nuanced, on going, and apples to oranges= Great entertainment , sensation, and discussion for people and clicks.

The players all know this and from MJ, kobe, lebron all talk about comparing eras, different positions, roles is a tough thing to do.
If you believed ESPN, you'd think basketball is played and won 1-1. It emphasizes the entertainment part of the NBA and obviously theres a huge market for it, but boy I would tell anyone who wants to learn about the game, history of the game, to love the game to stay away from them.

[Winsome Gerbil]

Ah, the natural result of teaching kids today the "new math", although apparently now we aren't going to teach them math at all because some of them struggle with it, therefore its discriminatory. Humanity's tenure is going to be a nice parabola. From stone age to modern age and right back down again.

[Spens1]

Watch on YouTube

The one true GOAT.

[soxfan2003]

He won playoff series with Scottie Pippen coming off the bench averaging a whopping 7ppg.

He also won a championship with no other all nba or all star on his team (1991).

Bulls still had Grant/Oakley/even Paxon. And Pippen still averaged over 26 MPG. Bulls were higher seed just playing Cavs....

As for the championship year, Pippen did make an all defense team that year and more importantly he had won of the best post seasons of his HOF career if not the best.

He really based upon his post season should easily be considered as someone that moved into the top 10 among all NBA players. Sometimes all-star/all NBA recognition comes after you have arrived on the court. It did with Steph Curry so Pippen isn't the only one.

But the narrative he couldn't win a playoff series without Scottie is ludicrous. His rookie season he had perhaps the worst supporting cast ever. The next 2 seasons he played a top 3 team of all time in the Bird Celtics (one season he just came back from injury before the playoffs to push them to 8th seed after he missed the entire year).

The 4th season was Scotties rookie year and he just did not contribute to the teams success. They were winning that first round with or without Scottie.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/198805080CHI.html

Pippen started the game that decided a 2-2 series and played great(24/6/5) in 39 minutes of action so very good case can be made that they lose that series without Scottie Pippen.

In fact, Pippen started the entire next series vs Detroit so Collins had to be pleased with his play vs the Cavs relative to the other choices....

Despite not matching each other in minutes in the series, both Pippen and Jordan were +8 in that Cavs series.... Both similar bad +- in Detroit series as well.

It wasn't that Pippen was super valuable that Cavs series like he was later on but the series was close enough that any good to very good bench player/emerging starter playing lots of minutes could swing the series. Pippen probably did. I am not trying to say he was 2nd best Bulls player in that series...just saying when a defender/ball handler scores 24 points in the pivotal due or die game and its a close game, can't take it for granted they win series without him.

Even as a rookie, by playoff time Pippen wasn't just a JAG off the bench. He was a very good bench player when you factor in his defense and ability to handle the ball. It was obviously his developing offense/inexperience that had him have to earn the starting position which he did that playoffs. And he was obviously played many more minutes towards the end of that series and averaged 32 MPG vs Detroit.

I fully accept with the right players surrounding him that Jordan could win a playoff series or championship without Pippen but the converse is clearly true if we are being objective. Pippen over a 4-5 year window could have won a championship as a teams best player. Pippen obviously past his prime and with back woes did win a playoff series without Jordan when Pippen was still a key contributor.

[BostonCouchGM]

Nah...it’s 6-0

[CobraCommander]

What an L

Delete this thread op

Because you could say Luka is 0-3, Zion is 0-2, and on and on

[Dominator83]

Are we counting the last 2 Wizards years where he did a reverse-Lebron, and joined an awful Lottery team?

[Duke4life831]

Like others have said but I’d like to repeat it.

When people see 6-15, they think 6 winning seasons and 15 losing seasons. 6/15 is the proper way to put it.

But if we are just talking about random narratives, how about this one. MJ has 11 seasons with the Bulls when he played at least 20 games. So that means MJ healthy with the Bulls had a 6-5 record. That is a 54% championship winning percentage.

[Dominator83]

Like others have said but I’d like to repeat it.

When people see 6-15, they think 6 winning seasons and 15 losing seasons. 6/15 is the proper way to put it.

But if we are just talking about random narratives, how about this one. MJ has 11 seasons with the Bulls when he played at least 20 games. So that means MJ healthy with the Bulls had a 6-5 record. That is a 54% championship winning percentage.

He didn't play 21 seasons

[art_tatum]

Whyyyyyy
Let it go

[Liam_Gallagher]

What I find amusing is that if LeBron ends his career 6-9 in the Finals people will think 6-0 is more impressive.

[Duke4life831]

Like others have said but I’d like to repeat it.

When people see 6-15, they think 6 winning seasons and 15 losing seasons. 6/15 is the proper way to put it.

But if we are just talking about random narratives, how about this one. MJ has 11 seasons with the Bulls when he played at least 20 games. So that means MJ healthy with the Bulls had a 6-5 record. That is a 54% championship winning percentage.

He didn't play 21 seasons

Ya I know. That is why 6-15 isn’t correct, 6/15 is the correct way to put it.

6-15 would be 6 winning seasons and 15 losing seasons (21 seasons).
6/15 is 6 winning seasons out of 15 seasons.