Pippen's cry for attention is getting worse

[Joshyjess]

I don't care about Pippen's opinion on the NFL but I do care that you're calling Pippen a mediocre player. Being second best to arguably the greatest of all-time doesn't make you mediocre. Pippen was the second-best wing of an entire era, full stop.

He does come across bitter and unhappy though. But takes like yours make his bitterness a tiny bit more justified. Brutal, clueless assessment of Pippen as a basketball player. Pippen has bad takes but I guess he isn't alone in that.

That's funny. I grew up watching Pippen, and I never thought much about him. Sure he was a great side-kick to Jordan, but by himself - never really saw anything special. I have no doubt that you could have plugged in a ton of other players in his spot, and they would have done just as well as he did.
My opinion of Pippen is based on watching him for pretty much his whole career. Oh, I'm sure that you can probably find lots of stats and numbers justifying the esteem that many give him, but I think that most of his numbers came from his situation, and that were it not for Jordan, his numbers wouldn't be any higher than the average player in the NBA back then. Again, no Jordan - pretty much nobody would have heard of Pippen.
Again, that's just my opinion of watching him play for all those years, and others are welcome to their opinion of him.

You watched him and didn't think he was good. I think I got that part. It's fine that you don't like him.
- What players do you think you could have plugged in and have done just as well?
- what do you mean: "by himself"? when you say "never saw anything special"? This isn't tennis. No one plays by themselves.
- You do know that Jordan retired to play baseball, and in that season Pippen's numbers went up rather than down, right? The Bulls won 55 games and Scottie averaged 22-8-5, finished top 3 in MVP voting.
- Do you think Scottie was special as a defensive player?

Again I'm fine with you not liking Pippen. But your assertion that he was an average NBA player, single-handedly boosted to stardom by the presence of MJ... I don't think it's a theory you can back up with anything. MJ and Pippen played together for almost their entire careers so it can be difficult to pull them apart, I get that. But in general there aren't too many stories in the history of basketball where a player was a big star next to another player, and wasn't an above-average player in every other context.

Tell you what - I'll go ahead and rescind my statement about Pippen beind mediocre or average. I'll give him props for being a good (possibly even a really good) player. But to be honest, I really don't have the desire to go into the why I think he wasn't the great player many think he was, or who was better, etc... (too easily turns into a long, drawn out argument that has no winners / losers, and is based a lot on opinions)
I'll simply refer back to my statement that my opinion of him was based on watching him for pretty much his entire career. Again, I know that there are stats and numbers that back up the argument of him being great and all that, but I think the eye-test of having watched him for all those years is a better judge than numbers that can be manipulated by circumstances.
I've watched so many of the great players of the past 4 decades, and you can always tell which players have that special "thing" about them that seperates them from the rest, and which players just don't. Pippen never had that. I never watched Pippen and thought "Wow, there's something extra special about him". Now, many years later people try to use data and stats to elevate him to a level that I just never saw while watching him live.
Again, this is simply my opinion based on what I saw during a lont time period of watching him play.

[cupcakesnake]

That's funny. I grew up watching Pippen, and I never thought much about him. Sure he was a great side-kick to Jordan, but by himself - never really saw anything special. I have no doubt that you could have plugged in a ton of other players in his spot, and they would have done just as well as he did.
My opinion of Pippen is based on watching him for pretty much his whole career. Oh, I'm sure that you can probably find lots of stats and numbers justifying the esteem that many give him, but I think that most of his numbers came from his situation, and that were it not for Jordan, his numbers wouldn't be any higher than the average player in the NBA back then. Again, no Jordan - pretty much nobody would have heard of Pippen.
Again, that's just my opinion of watching him play for all those years, and others are welcome to their opinion of him.

You watched him and didn't think he was good. I think I got that part. It's fine that you don't like him.
- What players do you think you could have plugged in and have done just as well?
- what do you mean: "by himself"? when you say "never saw anything special"? This isn't tennis. No one plays by themselves.
- You do know that Jordan retired to play baseball, and in that season Pippen's numbers went up rather than down, right? The Bulls won 55 games and Scottie averaged 22-8-5, finished top 3 in MVP voting.
- Do you think Scottie was special as a defensive player?

Again I'm fine with you not liking Pippen. But your assertion that he was an average NBA player, single-handedly boosted to stardom by the presence of MJ... I don't think it's a theory you can back up with anything. MJ and Pippen played together for almost their entire careers so it can be difficult to pull them apart, I get that. But in general there aren't too many stories in the history of basketball where a player was a big star next to another player, and wasn't an above-average player in every other context.

Tell you what - I'll go ahead and rescind my statement about Pippen beind mediocre or average. I'll give him props for being a good (possibly even a really good) player. But to be honest, I really don't have the desire to go into the why I think he wasn't the great player many think he was, or who was better, etc... (too easily turns into a long, drawn out argument that has no winners / losers, and is based a lot on opinions)
I'll simply refer back to my statement that my opinion of him was based on watching him for pretty much his entire career. Again, I know that there are stats and numbers that back up the argument of him being great and all that, but I think the eye-test of having watched him for all those years is a better judge than numbers that can be manipulated by circumstances.
I've watched so many of the great players of the past 4 decades, and you can always tell which players have that special "thing" about them that seperates them from the rest, and which players just don't. Pippen never had that. I never watched Pippen and thought "Wow, there's something extra special about him". Now, many years later people try to use data and stats to elevate him to a level that I just never saw while watching him live.
Again, this is simply my opinion based on what I saw during a lont time period of watching him play.

I'm not sure who you think Pippen is better or worse than, so I don't know if I legit agree or disagree about how you view Pippen. For all I know, "that special "thing"" might be something you've only personally awarded to 10 players and then I'd not disagree with your view on him. Many of us have watched most or all of Pippen's career, so "the eye test" is a still a subjective battle of viewpoints where it's my eye vs. yours vs. every other eye. We all look at/for different things and from different conclusions from watching the same games.

Curious about what that special thing is that Pippen doesn't have in your eye. He wasn't an all-time great scorer. Pretty limited in his pure bucket getting ability. He was an average shooter in his day. He was a mean attacker and distributor in transition and had great passing ability for someone his size. For me what made him special was his athletic gifts and defensive tenacity. He was a wing version of Kevin Garnett to me. There were definitely things he was "extra special" at, but if scoring is your thing, Pippen leaves a lot to be desired.

[Franco]

him getting cucked by his wife really did a number on him

If I had to guess, his son dying probably has more to do with it. I honestly feel bad for Pippen, this downward spiral doesn't seem natural nor healthy.

[coldfish]

Just because you are good at sports, it doesn't make you an intelligent or particularly good person. Frequently, there is a negative correlation.

The 90's Bulls were a bunch of dicks. I say that as a huge fan of them at the time. Phil, Krause, MJ, Pip, etc. all had egos the size of small states. Its a lot of the reason why they were successful . . . and broke up . . . twice.

[Pythagoras]

I don't care about Pippen's opinion on the NFL but I do care that you're calling Pippen a mediocre player. Being second best to arguably the greatest of all-time doesn't make you mediocre. Pippen was the second-best wing of an entire era, full stop.

He does come across bitter and unhappy though. But takes like yours make his bitterness a tiny bit more justified. Brutal, clueless assessment of Pippen as a basketball player. Pippen has bad takes but I guess he isn't alone in that.

He wasn’t the second best wing of his era. He just wasn’t.

So who was?

Drexler was definitely better. I see a lot of people put Pippen over Clyde and Idk why. I think Wilkins was definitely better as well, but people might not consider them the same era. Grant Hill has a really solid argument over him as well, but I’d acknowledge that one is debatable.

[TJ_Ford_11]

Pip has always been a tool. No surprise on his current actions.

[cupcakesnake]

He wasn’t the second best wing of his era. He just wasn’t.

So who was?

Drexler was definitely better. I see a lot of people put Pippen over Clyde and Idk why. I think Wilkins was definitely better as well, but people might not consider them the same era. Grant Hill has a really solid argument over him as well, but I’d acknowledge that one is debatable.

Drexler was great and obviously in contention for the #2 wing of the 90s. But you'd need to say something to back up that he's "definitely better". Our own PC board top 100 ranked Pippen at #32, and Drexler at Drexler at #38. That's obviously pretty close so obviously there are some smart people who'd still rank Drexler over Pippen. BackPicks top 40 project had Pippen at #25 and Drexler at #39. These are both heavily researched projects rather than hot take rankings. You get to read people's reasoning and how they're measuring success (whereas something like ESPN or Slam or Hoopshype just kinda votes and/or lists them and includes a cute blurb). Im not sure what makes people particularly high on Drexler. Loved the midrange scoring and all-around athleticism, but he wasn't a big impact guy on his teams, and was a bit disappointing defensively. He was more polished in his pullup game than Pippen was, but I have Pippen as being better at every other aspect of the game. I think Drexler gets a lot of credit for being the leading scorer on a deep, interesting team like the Blazers.

Wilkins and Pippen have some overlap but Wilkins straddles the 80s and 90s where Pippen's prime in squarely in the mid 90s. Even if they played at the same time, I'm not high on Wilkins at all and view him as overrated due to his volume scoring. He wasn't a good defender or passer, and his scoring doesn't quite hold up to the all-time great scorers, efficiency wise).

I love Grant Hill and think he could have eclipsed Pippen if healthy, but c'mon, Hill played 5 years as a star in the league and injuries stopped him from having a prime.

[art_tatum]

I mean Brady probably is goat but the NFL is way more team oriented than the NBA. Brady is def not the best QB ever or most skilled. But he is great enough and lucky enough to be in the situations with the teammates he's had to become the Greatest. A distinction from best/most talented.

[Joshyjess]

I mean Brady probably is goat but the NFL is way more team oriented than the NBA. Brady is def not the best QB ever or most skilled. But he is great enough and lucky enough to be in the situations with the teammates he's had to become the Greatest. A distinction from best/most talented.

I really don't mind if someone says that Montanna was the GOAT, or Jerry Rice or someone else. What I find amusing is that Pippen is saying that Brady isn't the GOAT because he only plays one position. Montanna only played one position. Rice only played one position. Every great player pretty much only played one position. In the NFL guys only play one position (for the most part). So how would you determine the GOAT if you say only playing one position keeps you out of the running?
I couldn't care less if Pippen thinks another player was better than Brady, but the way he says it just comes across as rather foolish, and it just piles onto the bitterness that he is portraying in his book. A better title for his book might be "Lashing out at the World - a look through Pippens' eyes"

[GreatWhiteStiff]

"Pippen, just accept the fact that you were at best a mediocre player who got some fame being a side-kick to a much better player, and you will probably be a much happier person. Because right now you are coming across as a bitter, unhappy little troll who is desperately crying out for attention that frankly you never really deserved."

Freud is sitting up in his grave.

[Karate Diop]

I've actually found his Jordan truths to be refreshing.

[hauntedcomputer]

I hadn't thought of Scottie Pippen since I was dealing cards in the 90s but the dude has managed to spark continuous hate-click RealGM threads and I imagine chatter on every sports board everywhere while pimping out a crybaby hate-click book, so...mission accomplished.

He's pretty much on the GOAT list of whiny little bitches at this point.

[druggas]

Pippen lost any respect when he refused to go back into the game. There is no excuse that he can give to erase that black mark off of his resume.

[Pythagoras]

So who was?

Drexler was definitely better. I see a lot of people put Pippen over Clyde and Idk why. I think Wilkins was definitely better as well, but people might not consider them the same era. Grant Hill has a really solid argument over him as well, but I’d acknowledge that one is debatable.

Drexler was great and obviously in contention for the #2 wing of the 90s. But you'd need to say something to back up that he's "definitely better". Our own PC board top 100 ranked Pippen at #32, and Drexler at Drexler at #38. That's obviously pretty close so obviously there are some smart people who'd still rank Drexler over Pippen. BackPicks top 40 project had Pippen at #25 and Drexler at #39. These are both heavily researched projects rather than hot take rankings. You get to read people's reasoning and how they're measuring success (whereas something like ESPN or Slam or Hoopshype just kinda votes and/or lists them and includes a cute blurb). Im not sure what makes people particularly high on Drexler. Loved the midrange scoring and all-around athleticism, but he wasn't a big impact guy on his teams, and was a bit disappointing defensively. He was more polished in his pullup game than Pippen was, but I have Pippen as being better at every other aspect of the game. I think Drexler gets a lot of credit for being the leading scorer on a deep, interesting team like the Blazers.

Wilkins and Pippen have some overlap but Wilkins straddles the 80s and 90s where Pippen's prime in squarely in the mid 90s. Even if they played at the same time, I'm not high on Wilkins at all and view him as overrated due to his volume scoring. He wasn't a good defender or passer, and his scoring doesn't quite hold up to the all-time great scorers, efficiency wise).

I love Grant Hill and think he could have eclipsed Pippen if healthy, but c'mon, Hill played 5 years as a star in the league and injuries stopped him from having a prime.

Funny, the same way you think Drexler gets credit for being the leading scorer on deep Trailblazers teams, I think Pippen gets a lot of credit for his defense despite playing on Bulls and Blazers teams that were loaded with talent on the defensive side of the ball outside of him. Drexler was a lot more than just the leading scorer on those Blazer’s teams, he was unquestionably their best player. There’s nothing that Pippen did during his career that would lead me to believe those Blazers teams of the late 80s early 90s would have had just as much success with Pippen leading them over Clyde.

As for Wilkins, he’s one of the most underrated players in NBA history IMO. Posts like yours about him reinforce that. If you don’t view them as the same era I’m fine with that, and I won’t press the point though.

As far the difference in longevity between Grant Hill and Pippen, it’s not as great as you might think. It only comes out to about one and a half extra seasons of elite play. Not insignificant, but also not overwhelming. I think I probably lean towards Pippen over Hill, but it’s one I definitely have to think about.

[Winsome Gerbil]

Pippen was a great player, but even back during his own time he was known as malcontent who nobody particularly liked. He was actually pretty unreliable himself, yet was always grumping and complaining about something, whether it be money, recognition etc.. That a self serving and unpleasant young man should one day grow up to be a self serving and unpleasant old man is probably less shocking to people old enough to see his act back during the day.

When this generation gets older and Kyrie eventually writes a book about being abducted by aliens and anally probed, today's fans will probably take it in more stride than younger future fans will. Some people just who they are. Jordan's still the alpha ahole who would ****talk people right on into his HOF ceremony. Phil was still the smug and arrogant manipulator right on through his GM farce. And Pippen is still the eternal me me me wannabe upset that he didn't get his.

[TravisScott55]

Lmao at calling Pippen a mediocre player.


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[Kurt Heimlich]

The irony of a thread criticizing one persons lame, off base hot takes with their own lame, off base hot take isnt lost here.

Pippen is just trying to stay relevant and make some money. That riles some people up and gets us talking about him, which is his intention in the first place so, mission accomplished pip.

[seren]

Pippen is one of the greatest. He was also really bad with money and life choices. Dude is just trying to sell a book and make a buck. Don’t read too much into it

[ItsDanger]

Divorce/money. Don't overcomplicate things.

[ellobo]

Pippen's GOAT:

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Ranked the 35th greatest player in NFL history by NFL Films (in 2010):

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