Is Pau Gasol a top 50 player all-time?

[Stalwart]

There really isn't a case for top 50. I think borderline top 75 is reasonable. Pau has become one of those perpetually overrated players.

As far as top 10 PF I don't think so either.

Duncan, Dirk, KG, Pettit, Malone, Barkley, Giannis, Hayes, McHale, Schayes is 10 right there. Then you got names like Rodman, Heinsohn, Bosh, Draymond, AD, Rasheed, CWebb, and others to consider.

[gorz]

1. Duncan
2. Malone
3. Giannis
4. Dirk
5. Garnett
6. Barkley


AD is also much better than Pau..Pau never came close to AD in peak nor did he sustain a longer/higher prime.

Pau is prob between 125-150.

[An Unbiased Fan]

Oh, I'm completely comfortable saying that the folks who voted for the Top 75 weren't nearly good enough at this sort of task to have any credibility compared to RealGM.

Probably so, but hard to see how a guy who never made All-NBA 1st team or Top 8 in MVP voting is Top 75

Gasol played his prime as a forward in the league that had Duncan, Garnett, Dirk, LeBron & KD, so there should have been no expectation that a Top 50-level forward would make the 1st team.

Re: MVP. MVP is a 5-man ballot where teams rarely get 2 guys on the ballot. This isn't a place where we should have expected a Top 50 level guy to necessarily be noticed.

ftr, Gasol made my Top 5 in 2009. I think his role in making those Lakers champions is not to be dismissed lightly.

A guy who was Top 5 once in his career isn't Top 50 ever caliber though, right? Your point about TD, LG, Lebron, KD echoes mine, which is there have been lots of great players.

Pau was never elite. What makes him Top 50?

[Primedeion]

Dude made four All-NBA teams and literally never received a single MVP vote and people think he's top 50 all-time?

I cannot emphasize enough that if you're trying to figure this stuff out by simply looking at accolades, then you aren't getting anywhere real.

Evaluate the years for yourself, or at the very least admire those who have done what you have not taken the time to do.

Yeah, I'm not going to take advice from a guy who thinks 09 Pau was a top five player in the world, but thanks.

[Johnny Tomala]

I don't have him in my top 100. There is no way he's top 50 of all-time.

[UcanUwill]

Pau didn't even make the NBA Top 75

Great player but not Top 50

Lets be real, Pau is better than half the players from original top 50, and NBA is not the only thing of Basketball, or is OP asking is he top 50 NBA player. Top 50 NBA player? Maybe not, top 50 player in basketball history - hell yes. Prime Spain's Pau makes Montenegro's Nikola Vucevic or Lithuania's Domantas Sabonis look like absolute scrubs, and those arent bad NBA players.

[iserp]

Pau Gasol is 30th all-time in value over replacement player. I know is stats dont tell the whole story, and is a completely cherry-picked one, but it is always the same story: if you are quiet and nice, the media does not take you into account. You have to be a ruff rider, or a clown, or controversial or funny. If not, people forget about you.

You have Tim Duncan, one of the greatest players ever, and he always seems like an afterthought when talking about all-time greats. People completely forget about Ginobili, too.

However, you are a clown like Dwight Howard, a severely flawed player that was eaten alive in the finals by Pau, and people argue for him over Pau.

He was worthy of the FMVP on both finals the Lakers won, and Kobe and him should have splitted the awards (one for each).

[The Rebel]

Pau didn't even make the NBA Top 75

Great player but not Top 50

Lets be real, Pau is better than half the players from original top 50, and NBA is not the only thing of Basketball, or is OP asking is he top 50 NBA player. Top 50 NBA player? Maybe not, top 50 player in basketball history - hell yes. Prime Spain's Pau makes Montenegro's Nikola Vucevic or Lithuania's Domantas Sabonis look like absolute scrubs, and those arent bad NBA players.

Considering you think that humans evolve over the span of a couple of years I am not surprised. For those of use who have watched the NBA for decades, Pau isn't close to top 50.

[Deivork]

I had him at 49th as of January 3rd, 2020, the last time I updated my list, so... maybe not? Maybe? But if so, then not for much longer.

Kawhi (54th), AD (84th), and Giannis (161st) were behind him. I don't know where they'd be now. Jokic is also a lock to pass him if he stays healthy - though Jokic was at 238th at the time! (I use a formula, and there's no projecting forward in it.) Other players will inevitably pass him as well. Luka, for one.

When you have a player this close to the line, it's kind of meaningless to set such an arbitrary cutoff, because there will be no consensus. Like Guille_4 said, he belongs between 45 and 75. He was the second-worst omission behind Dwight Howard in the Top 75 list, in my opinion.

Good post. This pretty much sums up this kind of questions. Agree on the Top-75 omissions and hell yeah, he's definitely more accomplished than AD up to this point.

[UcanUwill]

Considering you think that humans evolve over the span of a couple of years I am not surprised.

Where you got this from? But sports players evolve quikcly, they get more and more moves and playstyles to emulate, its like chess play. Yeah, put prime Pau in the 50s and 60s, you dont think he makes original top 50? Give me a break.

[Doctor MJ]

Probably so, but hard to see how a guy who never made All-NBA 1st team or Top 8 in MVP voting is Top 75

Gasol played his prime as a forward in the league that had Duncan, Garnett, Dirk, LeBron & KD, so there should have been no expectation that a Top 50-level forward would make the 1st team.

Re: MVP. MVP is a 5-man ballot where teams rarely get 2 guys on the ballot. This isn't a place where we should have expected a Top 50 level guy to necessarily be noticed.

ftr, Gasol made my Top 5 in 2009. I think his role in making those Lakers champions is not to be dismissed lightly.

A guy who was Top 5 once in his career isn't Top 50 ever caliber though, right? Your point about TD, LG, Lebron, KD echoes mine, which is there have been lots of great players.

Pau was never elite. What makes him Top 50?

A player capable of being Top 5 who has excellent longevity thriving in many contexts (all-star on 3 NBA teams, top player on best non-US team for a long time) just might be.

Re: other power forwards. Everyone I mentioned is a clear cut Top 30 guy so it doesn’t make sense to hold them against players in conversation for lesser ranks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Doctor MJ]

Dude made four All-NBA teams and literally never received a single MVP vote and people think he's top 50 all-time?

I cannot emphasize enough that if you're trying to figure this stuff out by simply looking at accolades, then you aren't getting anywhere real.

Evaluate the years for yourself, or at the very least admire those who have done what you have not taken the time to do.

Yeah, I'm not going to take advice from a guy who thinks 09 Pau was a top five player in the world, but thanks.

You’re starting with conclusions and only using logic to work backwards to dismiss that which disagrees with what you think you know.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sp6r=underrated]

Pau didn't even make the NBA Top 75

Oh, I'm completely comfortable saying that the folks who voted for the Top 75 weren't nearly good enough at this sort of task to have any credibility compared to RealGM.

In their defense, they were working with the unofficial rule that no one could be kicked off the list. That makes it much harder for them

[Primedeion]

I cannot emphasize enough that if you're trying to figure this stuff out by simply looking at accolades, then you aren't getting anywhere real.

Evaluate the years for yourself, or at the very least admire those who have done what you have not taken the time to do.

Yeah, I'm not going to take advice from a guy who thinks 09 Pau was a top five player in the world, but thanks.

You’re starting with conclusions and only using logic to work backwards to dismiss that which disagrees with what you think you know.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You don't seem to understand how many great players have been around. I'd encourage you to brush up on NBA history and it'll quickly become obvious (even to you) that he's not close to the top fifty.

[Tim Kempton]

Loved him when he played but top 50 is ambitious. He's somewhere between 60-85ish. Great career, though.

[An Unbiased Fan]

Pau didn't even make the NBA Top 75

Great player but not Top 50

Lets be real, Pau is better than half the players from original top 50, and NBA is not the only thing of Basketball, or is OP asking is he top 50 NBA player. Top 50 NBA player? Maybe not, top 50 player in basketball history - hell yes. Prime Spain's Pau makes Montenegro's Nikola Vucevic or Lithuania's Domantas Sabonis look like absolute scrubs, and those arent bad NBA players.

Well no, being real Pau isn't better than half the player from the Top 50, and even missed the Top 75 list that just came out.

But I'll post 50 players off the top of my head better than Pau all-time to prove my point.

In no order:
MJ
Kareem
Kobe
Shaq
Lebron
Magic
Bird
Duncan
KG
Dirk
Russell
Wilt
Dr J
West
Wade
CP3
Curry
Kidd
Pippen
Kawhi
Giannis
The Glove
Moses
Oscar
Barry
Mailman
Ewing
DRob
Dwight
Tmac
Barkley
Isiah
Hakeem
Harden
Durant
Petit
Nash
Elgin
Drexler
AD
Webber
Tiny
McHale
Liliard
AI
Gervin
Thurmond
Pierce
Stockton
The Pearl
Reed

[ceiling raiser]

How many championship squads in the 3pt era were led by a big man?

80 Lakers (arguably)
82 Lakers (arguably)
83 Sixers
85 Lakers (arguably)
94 Rockets
95 Rockets
99 Spurs
00 Lakers
01 Lakers
02 Lakers
03 Spurs
04 Pistons (arguably)
05 Spurs
07 Spurs
08 Celtics
09 Lakers (arguably)
10 Lakers (arguably)
11 Mavericks
14 Spurs (arguably)
20 Lakers (arguably)
21 Bucks

I think if you slot Pau in on the majority of these teams they still win a title.

[UcanUwill]

Pau didn't even make the NBA Top 75

Great player but not Top 50

Lets be real, Pau is better than half the players from original top 50, and NBA is not the only thing of Basketball, or is OP asking is he top 50 NBA player. Top 50 NBA player? Maybe not, top 50 player in basketball history - hell yes. Prime Spain's Pau makes Montenegro's Nikola Vucevic or Lithuania's Domantas Sabonis look like absolute scrubs, and those arent bad NBA players.

Well no, being real Pau isn't better than half the player from the Top 50, and even missed the Top 75 list that just came out.

But I'll post 50 players off the top of my head better than Pau all-time to prove my point.

In no order:
MJ
Kareem
Kobe
Shaq
Lebron
Magic
Bird
Duncan
KG
Dirk
Russell
Wilt
Dr J
West
Wade
CP3
Curry
Kidd
Pippen
Kawhi
Giannis
The Glove
Moses
Oscar
Barry
Mailman
Ewing
DRob
Dwight
Tmac
Barkley
Isiah
Hakeem
Harden
Durant
Petit
Nash
Elgin
Drexler
AD
Webber
Tiny
McHale
Liliard
AI
Gervin
Thurmond
Pierce
Stockton
The Pearl
Reed

Do you think Arvydas Sabonis a top 75 player all time, cause hes not on NBA top 75 for good reason. I just want to see what we debating, a basketball player or simply NBA league player? And I know Pau spend his entire prime in the NBA, so its easy to compare him to most greats from NBA perspective, but ball varies from NBA to FIBA to Euro, and as a fan of all 3, I take into account everything. And I am not Mirotic12, I do care about NBA the most, cause its by far the most talented place of basketball, but ball still vary and Pau wasn't the best in the NBA, it wasnt ideal fit for him and that said, he was still a big star and very underrated IMO. ANd its not like any NBA player is given to just be better in FIBA cause its less talented, look at Tony Parker or Domas Sabonis, these guys were much better in the NBA than what they were in FIBA.

To me, even though NBA matters the most for sure, it is still not the only thing that matter to determine who were best players. For example center Adonal Foyle was NBA rotation player for years, meanwhile, center Brandon Davies couldnt last a 2 years as bench warmer, but Brandon Davies is better player than Foyle ever was. Guard Marko Jaric was in the NBA for years while guard Arvydas Macijauskas lasted one year, but Macijauskas was easily better.

[LakersLegacy]

Being zero for 12 in the play-offs before joining Kobe hurts him

He is in the top 10 in terms of being an amazing human being though

[Archerbro]

i think i have him in the 60 to 70 range. he absolutely deserved the 2010 finals MVP IMO.