Jerry West pretty much destroys JJ Redick

[SelfishPlayer]

JJ wouldn't last in the 'Plumber and fireman' era.

He was a scrub in the 00's and only found relevance in the league as the it transitioned to the 3 ball and defensive rules changed. Even then, JJ was only a role player. He made that comment as if he could survive in an earlier era. If someone else said it, like a Lebron, sure. But JJ Reddick needs to learn his place when taking shots at older eras.

JJ was a scrub

lmao

Mans virtually created the on the move three

What?

[Purch]

JJ wouldn't last in the 'Plumber and fireman' era.

He was a scrub in the 00's and only found relevance in the league as the it transitioned to the 3 ball and defensive rules changed. Even then, JJ was only a role player. He made that comment as if he could survive in an earlier era. If someone else said it, like a Lebron, sure. But JJ Reddick needs to learn his place when taking shots at older eras.

JJ was a scrub

lmao

Mans virtually created the on the move three

What?

Sir I'm gonna need to introduce you to some Reggie Miller highlights

[CIN-C-STAR]

It's really not clear at all that JJ is even qualified to discuss the league from 50 or 60 years ago.
Is he actually studying the history of the game? Does he really think those players wouldn't be automatically better with the same luxuries modern players have, like dedicated shooting coaches, dietitians, daily massages, access to modern medical care, and fundamentally changed rules that allow things like traveling and launching yourself into defenders for gift-wrapped FTs?
"They were a bunch of firemen and plumbers" is a ridiculously lazy take of the sort that we make fun of around here, and we just discuss this stuff for fun. He should be embarrassed that he offered that as his "analysis" of a previous era.
That guys like West were as good as they were WITHOUT being able to dedicate themselves to the sport full time tells you they would absolutely wipe the floor with a later-era scrub like Reddick if they somehow matched up in the same era.
I'd take the word of someone like 70s Fan wayyyy before I would care what JJ Redick thought of the league from 60 years ago when he wasn't even alive. Playing the sport recently doesn't make you an historical expert on the sport.

[azcatz11]

JJ wouldn't last in the 'Plumber and fireman' era.

He was a scrub in the 00's and only found relevance in the league as the it transitioned to the 3 ball and defensive rules changed. Even then, JJ was only a role player. He made that comment as if he could survive in an earlier era. If someone else said it, like a Lebron, sure. But JJ Reddick needs to learn his place when taking shots at older eras.

Unfortunately his podcast and credibility has taken a huge hit since he left the ringer. He had Jalen Brunson on and the questions were all softball and all about money like anyone cares. I’ve lost a ton of respect for him

[LAL1947]

You tell him, Jerry!

[Purch]

JJ wouldn't last in the 'Plumber and fireman' era.

He was a scrub in the 00's and only found relevance in the league as the it transitioned to the 3 ball and defensive rules changed. Even then, JJ was only a role player. He made that comment as if he could survive in an earlier era. If someone else said it, like a Lebron, sure. But JJ Reddick needs to learn his place when taking shots at older eras.

Unfortunately his podcast and credibility has taken a huge hit since he left the ringer. He had Jalen Brunson on and the questions were all softball and all about money like anyone cares. I’ve lost a ton of respect for him

I think that's generally an issue I have with the whole "new media" thing. A lot of them never push back against things that players say, and never challenge them. If that's where new media is headed, I prefer the old media

[Ice Trae]

jj averaged 12 a game against social media influencers

[dockingsched]

It's really not clear at all that JJ is even qualified to discuss the league from 50 or 60 years ago.
Is he actually studying the history of the game? Does he really think those players wouldn't be autmotically better with the same luxuries modern players have, like dedicated shooting coaches, dietitians, daily massages, access to modern medical care, and fundamentally changed rules that allow things like traveling and launching yourself into defenders for gift wrapped FTs?

This is exactly JJs point though, that you can’t compare players from different eras cause of all the modern advancements. Bob Cousy and the players he competed against didn’t have any of the luxuries you list, so to try to directly compare him to someone like CP3 is unfair. CP3 is going up against modern athletes with every modern advancement available to improve their skills and body. He’d tear those 1950s players to shreds by comparison.

[SunsLyf3]

Yawn.

The best NBA minds are role players cause stars are too full of themselves. You need both for a great product but Jerry West is just acting like a boomer. You can be a role player in the NBA but at the end of the day you're still one of the best 500 basketball players in the entire world.

[whitehops]

like some have said both sides are right. west was obviously defending his generation but i found it funny that he was irked by the plumber comment and then pretty much said yeah, that guys had to be plumbers during the summer to support their families.

just because they're not really comparable due to changes in the game and advances in medicine, training and player development, it doesn't mean that the players back then weren't still the best basketball players in the world at that time.

[Lockdown504090]

like some have said both sides are right. west was obviously defending his generation but i found it funny that he was irked by the plumber comment and then pretty much said yeah, that guys had to be plumbers during the summer to support their families.

just because they're not really comparable due to changes in the game and advances in medicine, training and player development, it doesn't mean that the players back then weren't still the best basketball players in the world at that time.

thats also not really as much of a feat though. there were maybe 10 percent of the basketball players there are now in terms of competition to make it, we train infinitely more and at a younger age, and they really just started being okay with black people playing maybe a decade prior. unless white americans have just devolved as athletes, I think the international competition is a very valid point based on the number of them in the league now.these guys did help grow the game and nobody should take that away from them.

[nikster]

Damn, some well made points in there.

- players didnt have access to training centers like today, we had to work all summer to support our families

- JJ still isnt guarding any of the elite players from that time

I thought that's what the whole plumbers argument encapsulates. Players didn't have the facilities, access to information, coaching and most importantly time that players today. Today A minimum contract is easily enough to devote your entire life to this, Even a fringe guy in a 2 way contract is making relatively big money

[theforumblue]

"Somewhere along the way numbers count" is just cold man. damn. fair play though.

10 years from now JJ is more likely to be known more for his post-NBA work than for anything he did in his playing days, yet he made close to 120million in his career. Just out of respect he should never drag down players from early eras, let alone greats, who paved the way while having to be a plumber and firemen in the offseason.

[TheBobster]

Yawn.

The best NBA minds are role players cause stars are too full of themselves. You need both for a great product but Jerry West is just acting like a boomer. You can be a role player in the NBA but at the end of the day you're still one of the best 500 basketball players in the entire world.

When Redick has a track record of judging talent like Jerry West has an NBA GM, then we can talk.

And West didn't have the luxury of playing in a league where you barely touch an offensive player and get called for a foul or a three-point shot or get to enjoy first class travel and accommodations his accomplishments would be even more impressive.

[HiDef]

Welcome to ESPN. you say disrespectful **** on First Take, people hear you.

JJ is a respected analyst but he should try not to get turned into another talking head circus clown if he wants to stay that way

[GSWFan1994]

Will anyone remember JJ Redick when he's 84 years old?

[CS707]

I understand his point, but Jerry is basically saying only the greats can competently talk basketball. That’s just not true. If you make it to the league, your opinion on ball should be revered. But that’s just me. Keep doing your thing JJ!

I didn’t really take it that way. I think Jerry was just highlighting the point that it’s still an accomplishment to dominate your era regardless of how much the game has changed and that JJ shouldn’t be dragging down other guys to prop his own career up.

[DelAbbot]

reading the title I had expected a tirade by this guy

[DonaldSanders]

like some have said both sides are right. west was obviously defending his generation but i found it funny that he was irked by the plumber comment and then pretty much said yeah, that guys had to be plumbers during the summer to support their families.

just because they're not really comparable due to changes in the game and advances in medicine, training and player development, it doesn't mean that the players back then weren't still the best basketball players in the world at that time.

The way JJ put it made it sound like guys were full time plumbers and part-time basketball players, Jerry said they worked other jobs in the off season. Definitely not the same thing. What are a lot of NBA guys doing in the off season now? Some like Curry are working all the time, most aren't. Anthony Davis didn't even touch a ball for like 6+ weeks.

There is room for nuance here. The average player was worse back then, but the stand-out greats would still be greats now who would look even better given modern science/training.

I wish Jerry had gone there and said "If JJ Reddick had guarded me, I'd have been licking my chops and lit him up for 40 points easily"

[Sark]

Plumbers and firemen >>> Twitch streamers and young socialites.