This CBA sucks

[Backcountry]

So what exactly are you calling the "right thing"?

they want you to cut salary by design but they don’t give you any way to actually do it

The CBA is supposed to deter overspending in the first place, that's why it's punitive. There are penalties to overspending, and being stuck with payroll is one of them. The way to do it is to think ahead, not just keep signing blank cheques.

[ropjhk]

The second apron penalties are meant to discourage teams from even going there in the first place. Teams that go above the second apron are meant to be punished. The NBA wanted to end the practice of running up salaries to contend and then dumping those salaries for a rebuild. They hope that the second apron penalties will discourage teams from running up those salaries in the first place.

[lethalizer]

"People being have to be good at their job instead of paying their way out of their mistakes is a very bad thing"

is basically what you guys are saying.

Also it's hilarious that this thread has already backing from Phoenix and Denver fans.

Sure, your GM paying Saric and Zeke Nnaji a combined 14 million$ in the year of 2025 is not the problem, the CBA is the problem.

Same goes for Phoenix and their brilliant owner thinking Bradley Beal would be a great fit with Kevin Durant and Devin Booker, and CHOOSING to trade for a contract that ends in 2027 while him making 50 milion+ in each season.

would it really be a crime if we could trade jrue for fvv and then get to waive him? I don’t think it’s necessary for matching rules to be this crazy.



We’re not asking for like an amnesty clause, asking for ways so you can actually make trades and cut salary if you need to and send picks if necessary but they made that extremely hard to do.

I mean, this is the gamble your management has taken, knowing fully aware what it meant in the summer of 2025 prior to the team being sold.

They banked on having another title this season and were willing to eat up the tax that came with it. You could have shaved salary last season and chose not to.

I just don't think this is a genuine attempt at fixing anything. Celtics fans were happy throughout the season when they thought they were about to repeat. One mystery illness and one season ending injury later, you don't get to do a do-over.

[shrink]

The CBA is made by owners that tend to over-react to potential problems that reach the media.

If you think all the apron rules are too stringent, blame owners worried about owners worried about a few super-rich owners that weren’t dissuaded by the luxury tax,

If you think DAL getting Cooper Flagg is unfair, blame owners that thought tanking was a bigger problem than using the draft to get the best prospects to the failing franchises that needed them most.

[Raps in 4]

I love it. It's basically a hard cap, which I've always wanted for the NBA. Building a dynasty in the NFL and NHL requires shrewd management. NBA GMs are going to have to get smarter.

[JayMKE]

"People being have to be good at their job instead of paying their way out of their mistakes is a very bad thing"

is basically what you guys are saying.

Also it's hilarious that this thread has already backing from Phoenix and Denver fans.

Sure, your GM paying Saric and Zeke Nnaji a combined 14 million$ in the year of 2025 is not the problem, the CBA is the problem.

Same goes for Phoenix and their brilliant owner thinking Bradley Beal would be a great fit with Kevin Durant and Devin Booker, and CHOOSING to trade for a contract that ends in 2027 while him making 50 milion+ in each season.

How is paying your own players a fair amount paying their way out of a mistake? It’s insane the NBA is literally kneecapping teams from trying to keep their teams together and stay competitive.

[seren]

It is beyond stupid. It penalizes teams for having great players. Needs to be tweaked immensely. Look at the situation Cleveland ended up in. They signed Mobley to a rookie max that he definitely deserved but the contract now turned into a cap killer because he got the DPOY. DPOY is great achievement but it doesn’t make you a player that can carry a team. They need to fix how max contracts count against the cap and the tax. These contracts should never count more than 30 percent. That way teams won’t second guess themselves extending their best players without making it impossible to build around these players.

[Raps in 4]

Yeah I know obviously a celtics fan,

but why is it so hard to cut money even when you're trying to do the "right" thing? They should just make the second apron essentially a hard cap and you can spend up to it how you wish. From what I read, they even made it so you can't trade a guaranteed contract for a non guaranteed contract over the apron, why are they trying to lock you into the apron?

Honestly don't know anyone who enjoy this CBA. It kind of took a lot of fun out of trades and even killed the buy out market which was 99% hype and 1% production (almost always somebody washed up who makes zero impact).

NBA punishing teams that want to field the best team while providing benefits for teams fielding an non-competitive team is going to slowly kill the league.

Just like it killed the NFL and NHL?

[Godymas]

eventually a GM will prove they are really good and build a dynasty under the current CBA

I'd say Brad Stevens was making it a case, however his team suffered injuries and underperformed which lost their window.

However, I can see a team that has three championship level second options, a generational first overall pick, and incredibly smartly traded vets as well as good pieces on rookie deals being able to potentially have a dynasty.

[Raps in 4]

eventually a GM will prove they are really good and build a dynasty under the current CBA

I'd say Brad Stevens was making it a case, however his team suffered injuries and underperformed which lost their window.

However, I can see a team that has three championship level second options, a generational first overall pick, and incredibly smartly traded vets as well as good pieces on rookie deals being able to potentially have a dynasty.

We've seen dynasties in the NFL and NHL. It's hard, but it's possible. It requires a smart GM who identifies the core players that should be extended and replaces the others continually through good drafting.

Most NBA GMs have never had to use their brains, so this new reality is difficult for them to navigate.

[G R E Y]

I actually believe Silver and the owners set the CBA up intentionally to make a hard cap a more palatable choice in the future. Obviously the second apron penalties are too punitive, they cannot be overcome even with excellent management. It's designed to be a cautionary tale starring the first few victims and little else.

(tinfoil off)

Bingo.

Partially. I think a hard cap is what they wanted, but the union refused. So this was the compromise. But why would the players ever want to change it? Look what it's done for salaries. There will always be owners with pockets so deep they'll be more interested in buying a championship than fiscal responsibility. And it will continue to hurt the smaller market teams. I'm glad this year's final four is mainly the "little guys", but I'm interested to see how well the eventual winner can keep it together.

There have to be tweaks. Else no one will have dynasties unless players take less. And there's the rub: The opposing trajectories of player salaries rising while teams are handcuffed in building sustainable winners. Not every player will be willing to go the Brunson route of taking far less than eligible.

OKC is, for now, an example of a well built team with lots of in house drafted talent and smart trades around the edges. They have yet to hit three players on a max territory. And then the margins are paper thin even for them.

Not every draft has a generational, franchise changing talent. Although this CBA makes teams put together higher quality FOs, there's going to be pressure from both teams and players as each has to make sacrifices they may not want to have to keep making. Either players will keep getting traded far more or enough players pressured into taking less will become an issue.

Expect tweaks to this iteration of too punitive CBA.

[lethalizer]

"People being have to be good at their job instead of paying their way out of their mistakes is a very bad thing"

is basically what you guys are saying.

Also it's hilarious that this thread has already backing from Phoenix and Denver fans.

Sure, your GM paying Saric and Zeke Nnaji a combined 14 million$ in the year of 2025 is not the problem, the CBA is the problem.

Same goes for Phoenix and their brilliant owner thinking Bradley Beal would be a great fit with Kevin Durant and Devin Booker, and CHOOSING to trade for a contract that ends in 2027 while him making 50 milion+ in each season.

How is paying your own players a fair amount paying their way out of a mistake? It’s insane the NBA is literally kneecapping teams from trying to keep their teams together and stay competitive.

The NBA doesn't do that. The teams choose to overpay some players and just do a terrible job at managing their teams. Suns are basically the posterchild for this.

With regards to Denver, they chose to commit 25 percent of their whole cap to a 3 point specialist with injury problems, hoping he'd develop into being an all star level talent. I think they should have sold high on him after the 2023 title, but they stuck with him, and now this is where they are.

When you do stuff like that, the only things you can do are finding good talent on the margins and ride with those players for a few years before they come expensive.

This was bound to happen. Everybody in the NBA knew this would happen. Some teams positioned themselves to take advantage of it, some teams just said "f*ck it" and went for it. Well, if you ignore the actual rules and try to go for it, you'll obviously face consequences if you fail.

[Deathray]

This CBA increases importance of having good GMs who can find value in margins. Another change I am expecting is that teams will be extremely hesitant giving supermax contract unless someone is close to a top10 player.

Not just supermax but any extension has to be weighed carefully to make sure that you're paying the player based on what you expect him to do for the franchise in the future and not what he's done in the past.

[Johnny Fontane]

For the overall health of the league and parity, it’s a great thing. This current iteration of the league no longer feels like a 2-3 contending team version. Any team can win now seemingly

[Chuck Everett]

Can't keep overpaying guys into infinity. Jrue should be an unrestricted FA now, but the Celtics gave him a 3-year extension with no discount. Gotta take that L. The only person who wins in this scenario is Jrue with his declining performance.

[CharityStripe34]

The parity is intriguing, though a lot of people I've talked to think it's bad for the NBA.

[Johnny Bball]

Yeah I know obviously a celtics fan,

but why is it so hard to cut money even when you're trying to do the "right" thing? They should just make the second apron essentially a hard cap and you can spend up to it how you wish. From what I read, they even made it so you can't trade a guaranteed contract for a non guaranteed contract over the apron, why are they trying to lock you into the apron?

Honestly don't know anyone who enjoy this CBA. It kind of took a lot of fun out of trades and even killed the buy out market which was 99% hype and 1% production (almost always somebody washed up who makes zero impact).

Love the new CBA. Too long in getting it done.

You don't get to buy your way to titles every year.

Blame Ainge for sitting on his heels all those years instead of putting the pedal down and trading an occasional pick.

[LethalRangee]

You dug your grave, now you have to lay in it. Boo hoo.

[Myth]

The dumbest rule IMO is the fact that you can't combine salaries when you're a second apron team. The CBA literally makes it extra difficult for teams to get out of apron hell by not allowing them to attach a good contract to a bad one to move, or combining salaries to make the numbers work.

This is maybe one of the few rules of the CBA I don't like. Overall, I like that it forces teams to make financial choices rather than just stacking the deck, but they should have more means of getting back under.

[itrsteve]

The tricky part because the big designated/max/whatever contracts that give a single team an advantage to retain one that type of player then penalizes their flexibility for doing so. We're ultimately going to get hesitant franchises prematurely moving players to avoid it (Luka) and disgruntled stars feeling disgruntled because franchises don't give them the maximum amount capable.

My opinion has always been that ownership shouldn't be cap penalized for the full amount so they can still reward the player but don't completely hinder roster flexibility. Maybe they put a .75x lever on them to turn an owner paying a player $50m that season to only having a $37.5m cap hit.... Illustrative numbers, but you get the idea